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Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by HunkaHunka
If we destroy the world's economy through inaction, causing the greatest depression seen in history, extremists will rise to power around the world on a revolutionary wave of hate towards the US.
It wouldn't matter who was right or wrong from an ideological standpoint, e.g. Tea Party arguments, all that would matter is billions of pissed off and hate filled people that blamed the US for the collapse.
This is a clear case of perception is reality. You wouldn't be able to argue with them over taxes or the founding fathers, etc. They wouldn't give two craps about our grand history or philosophy and we could be totally right. Being right doesn't stop people with torches, rope, and pitchforks.
If we bring down the world economy this year, we need to be ready to fight and not just China or Russia, but the entire world. If we are not ready for essentially a barbarian horde in the event of a collapse, we will not survive.
On the other hand if we have been waiting on this moment the whole time to create Absolute Spectrum Dominance, the Third Reich may end up looking like Boy Scouts when its over with.edit on 16/7/11 by MikeboydUS because: ie
Originally posted by HunkaHunka
reply to post by Carseller4
unless of course, what the world thinks has an effect on the repubs constituents....
We do not live in a vacuum
Originally posted by Jenna
What sickens me most is how people on this site are still grasping at any reason to keep the democrat vs. republican fight going. Seriously, get over the finger pointing already and start coming up with solutions that don't involve insults and shifting blame. I know it's easier to just fling mud and point fingers, but it's not doing anything to resolve our issues as a country. I would think that people on this site of all places would understand that.
edit on 7/16/2011 by Jenna because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
of course Spiegel will blame Republicans, you think they would blame Obama and his administration the fact that they have "lost" more money than during ALL administrations of U.S. Presidents put together?... Of course not... they want to blame those who want the spending to stop...
Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
Really? This surprises you?
ATS is basically a hotbed for far right Republican(-in hiding, as they all claim to be Libertarians now) propaganda these days. This thread is just yet another of a long line of examples of this glaringly obvious tendency.
Originally posted by Jenna
It's ironic that you say that in a far-left thread posted with the intentions of blaming republicans for everything and filled with posts doing just that while painting democrats as blameless.
Both sides suck, we get it, can we move on to finding solutions now to our ever-increasing list of problems? Or is this the best that the minds of ATS can come up with now? It's rather disappointing and disheartening to take a 6-month hiatus only to come back and discover that the exact same people are saying the exact same things whilst trying to demonize the other side of the political aisle. You'd think people would get tired of repeating themselves eventually, but apparently not.edit on 7/16/2011 by Jenna because: Forgot to close the quote tags.edit on 7/16/2011 by Jenna because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by ispyed
reply to post by centurion1211
No but the whole world has lent you $14 Trillion and we want to be sure you are going to pay it back!! Squabbling over rich people paying more tax does not make you look very responsible.
Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
I'm not sure this could be considered 'far right', but you cant deny that ATS s, in general, VERY far to the right.
I am not defending the Democrats, and I grow weary of people who think criticism of the GOP equals being a Demeocrat.
So what are the real solutions, in your mind, that you would like to see discussed?
BOTH parties are a bunch of diabolical lying greedy possessed psychopaths. Lets throw ALL those BUMS out!!!
Dwayne Orville Andreas.... is one of the most prominent political campaign donors in the United States, having contributed millions of dollars to Democratic and Republican candidates alike.... he was in the leadership of Archer Daniels Midland (ADM), the largest processor of farm commodities in the United States, ....
In 1972 Andreas unlawfully contributed $25,000 to President Nixon's re-election campaign via Watergate burglar Bernard Barker. Other recipients of Andreas's "tithing" — as he puts it — have included George H. W. Bush, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Bob Dole, Michael Dukakis, Jesse Jackson, and Jack Kemp....
.....Based on the idea that the plant operator knows the plant better than the USDA, the responsibility for designing an inspection system was turned over to each individual plant.
.... USDA “officials initially described HACCP to the industry in the mid-90’s, the agency made the following enticing promises:
* “Under HACCP, the agency will no longer police the industry, but the industry will police itself.
* “Under HACCP, the agency will disband its previous command and control authority.
* “Under HACCP, each plant will write its own HACCP Plan, and the agency cannot tell plants what must be in their HACCP Plans.”
....As a result, the inspector was no longer responsible for what was happening on the plant floor: that was left to company personnel. The new role of the inspector was to make sure that plant personnel were carrying out their duties in a manner consistent with the HACCP plan. In many cases this amounted to making sure that all of the paper work was in the proper order....” www.agpolicy.org...
...Today three companies, Archer Daniels Midland, Cargill, and Bunge control the world’s grain trade. Chemical giant Monsanto controls three-fifths of seed production. Unsurprisingly, in the last quarter of 2007, even as the world food crisis was breaking, Archer Daniels Midland’s profits jumped 20%, Monsanto 45%, and Cargill 60%. Recent speculation with food commodities has created another dangerous “boom.” After buying up grains and grain futures, traders are hoarding, withholding stocks and further inflating prices.... www.globalissues.org...
2001 Issues for the Agricultural Talks and WTO Trade Round: “The un-scientific so-called “precautionary principle” is unfortunately being successfully and constantly misused as justification to immobilize science and its applications, as well as to confuse the public....
...The internationalization of the food chain demands that identification, registration, tracking and tracing systems also become internationalized. After 31 years with Monsanto, Mr. Auxenfans, retired from the Monsanto Corporation at the end of 1999 as the former Chief Operating Officer (COO) of the Agricultural Division, and its Chairman for the Europe-Africa operations. He is a member of the Board of Directors at both the IPC and the IAMA.” www.agbioworld.org...
If you think we can just keep spending ourselves out of this Depression/Recession then you are sadly mistaken. We just can't keep doing that and raising the debt ceiling to cover our addiction, soon our pushers will (China) will cut us off.
Those pretty green slips of paper in your wallet commonly known as U.S. dollars are Federal Reserve Notes. Bank scrip. The Fed can print as much of it as it wants or needs to. With this in mind, consider that fully eighty percent (80%) of U.S. Treasuries (U.S. government debt) sold in 2009 were bought by the Fed because there were no other willing buyers. factsnotfantasy.blogspot.com...
...a recent IMF report: “Who Will Pay and How?” determined that under a moderate growth “baseline scenario, a full elimination of the fiscal and generational imbalances would require all taxes to go up and all transfers to be cut immediately and permanently by 35 percent.”
...Moody’s credit rating agency’s announcement that the United States of America is under review for a solvency downgrade, our nation is headed for a crisis...
....The day of reckoning to address the United States’ out-of-control federal budget deficits has arrived. The alternative is to continue on our current path of deficit spending and eventually suffer chaos and financial collapse... biggovernment.com... [/url]
That makes sense. Instead of asking me to pay for my house all the time, why doesnt the bank just shut up and chip in?
First National Bank of Montgomery vs. Daly (1969)
Mr. Morgan, the bank's president, took the stand. To everyone's surprise, Morgan admitted that the bank routinely created money "out of thin air" for its loans, and that this was standard banking practice. "It sounds like fraud to me," intoned Presiding Justice Martin Mahoney amid nods from the jurors. In his court memorandum, Justice Mahoney stated:
Plaintiff admitted that it, in combination with the Federal Reserve Bank of Minneapolis, . . . did create the entire $14,000.00 in money and credit upon its own books by bookkeeping entry. That this was the consideration used to support the Note dated May 8, 1964 and the Mortgage of the same date. The money and credit first came into existence when they created it. Mr. Morgan admitted that no United States Law or Statute existed which gave him the right to do this. A lawful consideration must exist and be tendered to support the Note.
Appendix E – Money Is Created by Banks Evidence Given by Graham Towers
Some of the most frank evidence on banking practices was given by Graham F. Towers, Governor of the Central Bank of Canada (from 1934 to 1955), before the Canadian Government's Committee on Banking and Commerce, in 1939. Its proceedings cover 850 pages. (Standing Committee on Banking and Commerce, Minutes of Proceedings and Evidence Respecting the Bank of Canada, Ottawa, J.O. Patenaude, I.S.O., Printer to the King's Most Excellent Majesty, 1939.) Most of the evidence quoted was the result of interrogation by Mr. “Gerry” McGeer, K.C., a former mayor of Vancouver, who clearly understood the essentials of central banking. Here are a few excerpts:
Q. But there is no question about it that banks create the medium of exchange?
Mr. Towers: That is right. That is what they are for... That is the Banking business, just in the same way that a steel plant makes steel. (p. 287)
The manufacturing process consists of making a pen-and-ink or typewriter entry on a card in a book. That is all. (pp. 76 and 238)
Each and every time a bank makes a loan (or purchases securities), new bank credit is created — new deposits — brand new money. (pp. 113 and 238)
Broadly speaking, all new money comes out of a Bank in the form of loans.
As loans are debts, then under the present system all money is debt. (p. 459)
Q. When $1,000,000 worth of bonds is presented (by the government) to the bank, a million dollars of new money or the equivalent is created?
Mr. Towers: Yes.
Q. Is it a fact that a million dollars of new money is created?
Mr. Towers: That is right.
Q. Now, the same thing holds true when the municipality or the province goes to the bank?
Mr. Towers: Or an individual borrower.
Of all the contrivances for cheating the laboring classes of mankind, none is so effectual as that which deludes them with paper money. It is the most perfect expedient ever invented for fertilizing the rich man’s fields by the sweat of the poor man’s brow. Ordinary tyranny, oppression, excessive taxation, these bear lightly on the happiness of the community compared with fraudulent currencies and the robberies committed by depreciated paper. [inflation cv] Our own history has recorded enough, and more than enough, of the demoralizing tendency, the injustice and intolerable oppression on the virtuous and well disposed, of a degraded paper currency, authorized by law, or in any way countenanced by Government. ~Nelson W. Aldrich, United States Senator, at a New York City dinner speech on October 15, 1913 IV Proceedings of the Academy of Political Science #1, at 38 (Columbia University, New York (1914)). [He was quoting Andrew Jackson. cv] www.linuxtoday.com...
Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
Are you saying the Republicans want the 'spending to stop'?
This entire topic is a joke, because WE ALL KNOW the GOP will vote to raise the debt limit. They love their wars and subsidies as much as the democrats.
People on ATS who seem to think Republicans are actually interested in fiscal restraint are apparently afflicted by a VERY short memory.