Secret Societies, The All Seeing Eye, Freemasonry, Horus, The Illuminati and Satanism!

Originally posted by Schrödinger
Well I know I was stretching for it.....
Personally to chip in, I do not see the Supreme Being as a creator, but rather as a source. (And since I also believe that time, past, present and future, is something exclusive for our multiverse, I see the source as eternal aswell.

I see you and I are relatively on the same page. All I need to do now is upgrade your World Dominance skills and usher your into the Ruling Elite.

The pay is great and the Rothschilds always send you free hooch.

Originally posted by Schrödinger
First of all, there is something we conspiracy theorist call the Illuminati, and we are not referring to the Bavarian Illuminati, instead it is used as a name for the group suspected to control the current power and wealth of the world.
...
Thirdly, there is a clear connection between masonry and the Bavarian Illuminati, first; they are both secret societies, secondly the Bavarian Illuminati, supposedly infiltrated most secret societies, including your bellowed Freemasonry.

Well, if the Illuminati the conspiracy theorist is talking about isn't the Bavarian Illuminati, why even bring up a proto-anarchist group that hasn't even been around in 225 years? You say they don't matter then turn around and bring them back into the conversation. This doesn't make sense to me.

Freemasonry and secret societies goes hand in hand with the Bilderberg meetings, most already know each other from some secret society, even attendees have complained about the obvious nepotism and selection method behind the meetings.
Every chairman, including the founder have been connected to secret societies, powerful lobbies and nepotistic groups.

Again, from your own words you've shown this doesn't track. There's no need for Bildeberg members to be Freemasons if these powerful elite are meeting in lobbies and boardrooms.

And if you had read anything on this forum you would know that, second of all, There is a clear link between the Eye of Horus and The All Seeing Eye, it is the same eye, it represents the same symbol, that of a watcher, someone seeing everything.

Yes. That would be God. Often described as omniscient.

They are however very interested in enlightenment, and considers themselves, the bringers of enlightenment. They are also very interested in symbolism, and ancient esoteric knowledge. Many do not even believe their own legends and stories, and truly believes, that modern freemasonry, only goes back a couple of hundreds years, even though the evidence in their symbolism and history, tells us otherwise.

I know it probably sounds like splitting hairs, but I believe there is a difference between basing ones teachings on 2000+ year old philosophies and actually claiming that our school of teaching has been a continuous, unbroken chain stretching back to the time of Pythagoras.

Originally posted by JoshNorton

And if you had read anything on this forum you would know that, second of all, There is a clear link between the Eye of Horus and The All Seeing Eye, it is the same eye, it represents the same symbol, that of a watcher, someone seeing everything.

Yes. That would be God. Often described as omniscient.

Just continuing from the hair splitting, but that wouldn't actually be God, rather that Horus and the All Seeing Eye represent a shared perception of 'God'. Neither the Eye of Horus or the All Seeing Eye are God. Since not all belief systems share this perception, then it is a link between Freemasonry and Ancient Egyptian beliefs. However, since the former only adopted it once the fraternity became speculative does not indicate a direct, generation to generation link, more a recognition of one group of sun worshippers of another by adopting an older but still shared mythology.

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by Vanishr

I would recommend the book to you also, masons believe in a higher being, not necessarily 'god'

Masons believe in a "Supreme Being", which is God. The phrases "Supreme Being", "God", and "Great Architect of the Universe" are used interchangeably in Freemasonry.

A "Supreme Being" doesn't necessarily mean it is God in the traditional sense. The phrases "Supreme Being" "God" and "Great Architect of the Universe" could all be different entities as they are never clearly outlined. It could turn out that the "Supreme Being" had created both "God" and the "GAOTU", with "GAOTU" to create in essence all other life and "God" to rule as a spiritual leader for the "Supreme Being". Plus, since no specific denomination or faith is listed as the "correct" or "true" faith, how are we to know that the Masonic God is not the Christian devil or something along those lines? One mans angel and God are another mans demon and devil

I recently picked up an interesting tidbit concerning the seeing eye on the pyramid.

Seems that is was used on Mars as a symbol for the entrance into the between-lives area, which was controlled from Mars for a period of time.

There is so much more that could be learned about these symbols if we could overcome whole track amnesia and recover our own recall of how things used to work back in the "old days."

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by Schrödinger
First of all, there is something we conspiracy theorist call the Illuminati, and we are not referring to the Bavarian Illuminati, instead it is used as a name for the group suspected to control the current power and wealth of the world.
...
Thirdly, there is a clear connection between masonry and the Bavarian Illuminati, first; they are both secret societies, secondly the Bavarian Illuminati, supposedly infiltrated most secret societies, including your bellowed Freemasonry.

Well, if the Illuminati the conspiracy theorist is talking about isn't the Bavarian Illuminati, why even bring up a proto-anarchist group that hasn't even been around in 225 years? You say they don't matter then turn around and bring them back into the conversation. This doesn't make sense to me.

I believe the name 'Illuminati' is used because their beliefs & teachings are similar to that of the Bavarian Illuminati, & so it links together. Both believe in the destruction of organised religion, & so place their influence on the public through mainstream media.

Originally posted by samuraiaku
how are we to know that the Masonic God is not the Christian devil or something along those lines? One mans angel and God are another mans demon and devil

Simply because there is no such thing as "the Masonic God" in a universal, over-arching sense. A Mason's own understanding of the Almighty Being responsible for the creation of everything that was, is and will be defines the GAOTU and his relationship to that Being. As an Anglican, my understanding differs (slightly in any meaningful sense) from that of my fellow Christians and from the understanding of the Jewish, Sikh and Muslim brethren in my Lodge.

But we all agree on the essential nature of the GAOTU and apply the reference as fits our own dogmas.

And the Christian devil cannot by definition be the GAOTU because

a: he wasn't around at Creation

&

b: he was a creation of the GAOTU

Even a cursory Google and reading of "Duncan's Ritual" paying attention to how the GAOTU is described would put to rest the fevered postings of those who desperately want to believe that Masons worship the devil. However, it hasn't happened yet and I'm not hopeful that those with an axe to grind won't ignore what's in front of their face in favour of continued riding of a cherished hobby horse.

What i find interesting too are the words surrounding the pyramid with the 3rd eye rising on the back of the dollar bill...(U.S. currency)...


ANNUIT COEPTIS words above the pyramid: www.greatseal.com...


NOVUS ORDO SECLORUM words below the pyramid: www.greatseal.com...

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon

Originally posted by samuraiaku
how are we to know that the Masonic God is not the Christian devil or something along those lines? One mans angel and God are another mans demon and devil

Simply because there is no such thing as "the Masonic God" in a universal, over-arching sense. A Mason's own understanding of the Almighty Being responsible for the creation of everything that was, is and will be defines the GAOTU and his relationship to that Being. As an Anglican, my understanding differs (slightly in any meaningful sense) from that of my fellow Christians and from the understanding of the Jewish, Sikh and Muslim brethren in my Lodge.

But we all agree on the essential nature of the GAOTU and apply the reference as fits our own dogmas.

And the Christian devil cannot by definition be the GAOTU because

a: he wasn't around at Creation

&

b: he was a creation of the GAOTU

Even a cursory Google and reading of "Duncan's Ritual" paying attention to how the GAOTU is described would put to rest the fevered postings of those who desperately want to believe that Masons worship the devil. However, it hasn't happened yet and I'm not hopeful that those with an axe to grind won't ignore what's in front of their face in favour of continued riding of a cherished hobby horse.

edit on 24-7-2011 by Fitzgibbon because: (no reason given)

I'm not saying the Masons worship the devil, merely stating that since there is no specific religious belief one must adhere to in the Masonic Brotherhood and that you must simply profess a belief in a higher being how that higher being that the Masons refer to as the GAOTU could be interpreted as being the devil or other demonic icon from any religion. And my stating that the Supreme Being, God, and the GAOTU as being separate entities was just a thought that had crossed my mind that would provide a good discussion. After all, why is it that only fairly recently in human history, we assume that everything was created by only one all powerful being when before the rise of Christianity, the main belief was that there were many gods and goddesses whose supreme power was in a specialized area of nature and man had to rely on the worship of several deities to assure his survival?

This is not meant to attack Masons or those of faith in any way shape, or form. This is merely meant to get people thinking about questions no one has bothered to ask and seeing solutions that are so against the established norm, i.e. multiple gods who we've just assumed to be one being, that they deserve a second look, even if only to be proven wrong in their entirety. After all, aren't we all on this site to life the veil of shadow and secrecy from the world's eyes? Why not consider every possible avenue, including the most bizarre and outlandish ones, before settling on an answer?

Originally posted by samuraiaku
...that you must simply profess a belief in a higher being how that higher being that the Masons refer to as the GAOTU could be interpreted as being the devil or other demonic icon from any religion.

The requirement is a belief in a Supreme Being, not a 'higher being'. Big difference. One created the Universe and the others all came after.

After all, why is it that only fairly recently in human history, we assume that everything was created by only one all powerful being when before the rise of Christianity...

There is possible evidence of monthesim as far back as the late Bronze Age.

Originally posted by TellEmRye
I believe the name 'Illuminati' is used because their beliefs & teachings are similar to that of the Bavarian Illuminati, & so it links together. Both believe in the destruction of organised religion, & so place their influence on the public through mainstream media.

I think there is a slight difference with the Idea the Bavarian Illuminati had. They were against the idea of Organized Religious CONTROL, not necessarily the religious groups. The church was acting as the ultimate ruler of thought and called anything that wasn't strictly part of the doctrine, blasphemy. The Illuminati was against that and promoted free thought and speech. (IMHO)

Originally posted by network dude

Originally posted by TellEmRye
I believe the name 'Illuminati' is used because their beliefs & teachings are similar to that of the Bavarian Illuminati, & so it links together. Both believe in the destruction of organised religion, & so place their influence on the public through mainstream media.

I think there is a slight difference with the Idea the Bavarian Illuminati had. They were against the idea of Organized Religious CONTROL, not necessarily the religious groups. The church was acting as the ultimate ruler of thought and called anything that wasn't strictly part of the doctrine, blasphemy. The Illuminati was against that and promoted free thought and speech. (IMHO)

Indeed. Likewise, the Bavarian Illuminati fought for the abolition of a tyrannous monarchy or government, believing instead that man should be able to govern himself. Hardly sounds like what most conspiracy theorists today believe TPTB are up to.

reply to post by JoshNorton


I have said it many times. If the kids here would spend a few hours actually looking into this group the claim to hate so much, I think most of them would find that they agree with most of not all of the teachings. Freedom from oppression seems to be the soup-de-jor of this site. It's just a shame that people are inherently lazy. Is it hot like the pits of hell where you are?

Originally posted by network dude
Is it hot like the pits of hell where you are?

It was 109 here on Friday. It helped me prepare for the afterlife.

The pyramid with the Eye is far far older than the ancient Egyptians and their Horus, see this video at 7:10 for more information on such a find in Ecuador.

reply to post by Acharya


That pyramid is a hoax and there is no credible archeolgical evidence to support the alleged history of the piece.

what i find interesting is that when you super imposed the dollar bill symbol of the pyramid (just the pyramid) over the eagle it seems to match perfectly

but also what happens is that the phrase "e pluribus unum" (out of many, one) becomes "e pluri num" which translates to:

out of many, num

a quick search on wikipedia led me to this result

en.wikipedia.org...

hmmm very interesting, who does this god remind you of??? *****cough ***baphomet*** cough*****

Originally posted by samuraiaku
I'm not saying the Masons worship the devil, merely stating that since there is no specific religious belief one must adhere to in the Masonic Brotherhood and that you must simply profess a belief in a higher being.....

No. Not higher; Supreme. Higher ≠ Supreme. Supreme = Almighty = Original Creative Force. Full stop.

The rest of your post is a reiteration of a flawed assumption.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
reply to post by Acharya

 

That pyramid is a hoax and there is no credible archeolgical evidence to support the alleged history of the piece.

Of course it is rejected, this goes against mainstream archaeology. You should read a book called Forbidden Archaeology, it may enlighten you to another reality. What is so-called "credible" archaeology is imo far from the real history of human kind, and their so-called proof are often poor.

Originally posted by Acharya
...and their so-called proof are often poor.

Then this pyramid is even less than poor. Nothing about it can be proved by anyone. It is a forgery just like the other objects allegedly recovered from the same site.