A one-world government is inevitable, so why oppose it?

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by megabytz

 

What you do is ignore the point! Pointing to meaner nastier tyrants than American's have ever faced does not justify the tyranny that exists in the U.S. today.

The express prohibitions that have been placed upon government in the U.S. is roundly ignored, and even worse, "Constitutional experts" lecture American's on what the Founders "really meant", never able to use any standard authorities such as The Federalist Papers, or case law, and instead tend to argue in the same manner the O.P.
does.

It is always clear when the heartless and cruel make themselves known. They are the ones who show total disregard for the rule of law, and for the unalienable rights of all people, in favor of special privileges and entitlements that they hope will give them some form of authority so that when they say "American's get over it", people will actually take heed.

Typical libertarian rubbish.

You actually think that the the tax rate, which is the lowest in decades, is evidential of tyranny in America. We are living in a different world than the founders, what about that do you not get?

Also what you point to as tyranny, centralized government power, taxes, various federal agencies is not tyranny.
These things exist for a reason. There were plenty of founders that felt very strongly about a strong centralized national government. Admittedly there have been violations of the Constitution, as there always will be, but we are in no way living in a tyrannical dictatorship. Your idea of freedom is more than likely similar to Ayn Rand's dystopian nightmare.

I would love to see where all the conservatives/libertarians would be should we get rid of all taxes, regulation, and give states all the power they want.

Maybe you all, as well as Atlas, should just shrug and get out of town.

Texas maybe?

Mod note: Welcome to ATS, but PLEASE read these carefully and work with me here.

-- Majic

"A one-world government is inevitable, so why oppose it?"

I have no problem living under one world government if we were some other species .. but were humans . Which is a big mistake.

We didn't get to the top of the food chain by being considerate and compassionate =)

why don't i want a world government.....?


incase one of these pricks ideologies comes back into play
i enjoy other nations being there to be able to drop kick them back outta power

hitler..stalin ...mao ... pol pot....


+

"Unlimited power is apt to corrupt the minds of those who possess it"

"Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely"



Germany will either be a world power or will not be at all.
Adolf Hitler


We can barley get stable governments right now ... let alone merging them all together into a super power



no thanks kind sir .. you can take your world government and ........

Mod note: Please use the ALERT feature to report problem posts and leave the modding to us.

Thanks. -- Majic

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
I do agree a one world govenment is to be expected.
I can even see many pro's on that side of the ergument one world sociol security & one world health care would remove most of our eligal imagrent proplems.
BUT what I do not want is the people in power to be the ones who are pushing for it now. before we have a one world govenment the secrecy and false flags have to stop. I do not want these people controling my life.
They lie, cheat, murder & think the population are nothing more then cattle.
There are many other was to move to a one world globel aconamy without 300 familys getting to control the hole system.
So I will continue to fight for freedom & say no to these phycotic murders untill I see some honesty and we the populations of the world get to have a say on what the future holds for our kids.
Sorry about the spelling to much fluride & public schooling :-)

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


As quantum mechanics makes abundantly clear ... absolutely NOTHING is inevitable. Everything is simply varying levels of probable.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


I cant agree with you. govt needs to be as close to the indicidual as possible.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist

The founders also believed that certain people were sub-human and should be enslaved.

You quite obviously believe the same thing yourself, but that ignores the point. I did not bring up the Founders to praise them, but to make clear that the tyranny they believed they lived under was marshmallows and pussy cats compared to the tyranny American's face today.

The founding fathers were revolutionary people, but we have come a long way since their times. The founding fathers were also notoriously isolationists. See how well that worked out for us when pearl Harbor happened?

A long way, in many ways, in the wrong direction. Your nonsensical historical reference is absurd. Pearl Harbor happened at at time when the U.S. was not, by any stretch of the imagination, isolationists, and Pearl Harbor was during World War II, but America has all ready fought a World War (that would be WWI to clear up the confusion for you), and had engaged in several military excursions before WWI. The empire building by the U.S. had begun long before Pearl Harbor.

So if all tax were to be abolished...

There you go again, relying on straw man arguments. Doing away with income taxation is not the same as abolishing taxation. You frame it this way because you have no valid argument to defend the perpetual income tax in the U.S. that has funded the military industrial complex you have all ready lamented.

who would maintain the infrastructure of the country and the roads?

Are you for real?

Who would conduct government research for pure science?

The Wright Brothers were not funded by government, nor was Henry Ford, and Jonas Salk wasn't a government scientist either. If you were a scientist of his caliber maybe you wouldn't be so concerned about government funding and expect people to pay taxes so you can have a pay check to do God knows what.

Obviously not the private industry, as anything that does not have any immediate returns on profit will simply be scrapped.

Ironically you called me a communist! The Wright Brothers were in private industry. Henry Ford private sector. Jonas Salk private sector. At some point the ugly beast of corporatism reared its ugly head and private industry became something else all together. Many people in this thread get that you have no faith in any individual other than yourself, but you have shown little reason to give any of us to share your faith, and of course, you have dismissed many a member in this thread who have earned far more respect than you have. This is a sign of elitism.

If it wasn't for the research of NASA that had no practical applications at the time, we would pretty much still be back in the 1950's in terms of technology and development.

Your grasp of history and what really happened is shamefully inexcusable. Before NASA existed there were test pilots flying Bell X class series jets, (Bell being a part of "private industry"), that led to the breaking of the sound barrier and were geared, by the time X-15 was developed, to fly straight into space:

When it began in the early Fifties, the X-15 program was going to lead America into outer space. The pilots at Edwards Air Force would fly ever more powerful rocket planes faster and higher until, inevitably, they went into orbit. The X-15, an audacious airplane designed to fly at Mach 7, at a time when engineers were still struggling to make the X-planes behave at Mach 2, was going to be a big step toward space.

But...

The last X-15 flew in 1968, when the much-heralded Apollo program was taking America to the Moon. What happened? Why did the logical, cost-effective, and far-sighted X-15 not take America into the Space Age? Two things happened to the X-15: Sputnik and John Kennedy's commitment to put a man on the Moon by 1970.

acepilots.com...

A highly entertaining and edifying book on that Bell X series contrasted with NASA's tin cans atop rockets is told in Tom Wolfe's The Right Stuff, but do not despair about any reading, it was also made into a movie that remained fairly faithful to the book, and both illustrate how the politics of the space race tragically killed great technology.

Which privately funded agency would have conducted pure research of the dangers of smoking cigarettes?

Are you serious? Any smoker of length needs no government study to know how dangerous to their health these cigarettes are. Of course, sugar, and particularly high fructose sweetener's are dangerous too, and if people are listening to their bodies they don't need any research studies, privately funded or government funded, to tell them this.

Interesting. You have no form of evidence to support your argument that there is an elitist agenda to institute a world government, and yet you call our observations fairy tales and delusional fantasies?

I am currently debating an elitist whose agenda is undeniably to advocate one world government, and whose fairy tales and delusional fantasies are clearly on display.

What I will never understand with you libertarians is this: Once you overthrow the government and scrap all regulations on corporations and taxation

I have never claimed to be a libertarian, this is a label you and the other guy are using, obviously as a pejorative, to describe me, while then both of you rely upon strawman arguments to misrepresent what I have argued. You must necessarily lie in order to "refute" my arguments. This is more than telling.

I am not the one advocating any overthrow of government, you are. A one world government will never come into existence as long as The Constitution for the United States of America stands in its way. Further, your lie that I advocate scrapping regulations for corporations is telling as well. Corporations are charted fictions that exist solely by permission of the state that chartered them. In the United States, that means these corporations exist by the grace of the people, and because of their artificial and granted existence, they are undeniably subject to regulation.

However, an unincorporated sole proprietor is not subject to these same regulations, and yet, somehow government seems to think they are. How so? Why the combination of the Equal Protection Clause of the 14th Amendment and the fact that Congress has statutorily defined corporations as "person" has led to the misguided notion that now everyone has to be regulated in order to give Equal "Protection" to the corporations.

Corporatism is not capitalism, and corporatists hate capitalism and free and unregulated markets. Ironically, you seem to hate the free and unregulated market - as nonexistent as it is - too.

do you not realize the people who control the corporations are the so-called elite who will monopolize the world and force children into manual labor, since most poor won't be able to afford education and children will obviously have to go back to working for a living?

I have just explained to you the facts about corporations. Because they exist by grant of charter, they are ultimately controlled by the people of the state in which they were chartered. What can be chartered into existence can have that charter revoked. Of course, most people are woefully ignorant of such causative actions and would instead whine like you are about how they are powerless to end corporatism. Useful idiots, each and every one. Useful to corporatism.

Isn't that your ideal world rather than a government that is elected by the people to keep the order and justice? How would you plan to deal with rogue corporations without any form of regulations or taxation? Remember Enron?

I just explained how I would deal with rogue corporations, and have used this site specifically to advocate We the People using our inherent political power to revoke corporate charters of those corporations guilty of malfeasance. Of course, while many take your position and attempt to frame me as someone else, few even considered entering that thread called Killing Corporations. I used to, in responding to people like you who foolishly attempt to frame as something I am not, link that thread, but no one ever even bothers to read it. Why? I can only guess, but my best guess is that no one wants to kill a corporation, they instead want to empower even more the very government that charters the corporation and then refuses revoke the charter after their gross malfeasance.

People, much like you, seem content to blame and whine and cry and sob, and have absolutely no intention at all of actually solving the problems. Advocating an even bigger government certainly won't do this, and even so, you are clearly not in favor of killing a nasty corporation, just empowering government agencies tasked to prevent their malfeasance and perpetuate the moral hazard. Remember "too big to fail"?

reply to post by quedup


Exactly what I was thinking.

As much as it does sound perfect in theory, it will never work in real life.
Look at how the ideology of communism sounds perfect, everybody is equal and no one has more power than their next. We all have seen how communism took its turn for the worse, how an elite grew to immense amounts of wealth and how the working class had to wait in line for several hours, waiting for whatever everyday items they might be in need of.


Anything can seem convincingly appropriate in theory, however once it has to be executed in real life - it fails miserably, due to the selfish human traits we all posses to some extent (some more than others).

Peace

I have an idea...

How about a "No Government, World"

Sounds alot better to me than any of the other choices... Who are these people starring this guy

1 world govt = ripe for abuse... hell look at our current "democracy", closer to fascism and communism than anything...

I wanna see some proof of a DEMOCRACY!

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


Your assumption is that a one world government would be Democratic in its dealings and purposes.
That argument is Idealist and naive as history shows us clearly that is not the case. Why fight it?
Maybe for the same reason we fought the Nazi's.

Democratic, one world government. Is this a joke. Where did this come from. If this is to be a democratic system why doesn't someone of influence say so. Why not put the agenda on the table and state exactly what it is in big media. It is clear that we are moving towards a one world government but definitely not a democratic one. The UN is an instrument used bringing this to fruition.
There is no doubt that there is a powerful elite working in the background to bring this about. Why do they operate in secrecy. They consist largely of banksters who control big energy, healthcare, big pharma, military industrial complex and the fortune 100 and mainstream media. If this is to the benefit of mankind why operate in secrecy. Why shift policy making bodies unelected. For example, the UNESCO operates the educational system, UN treaties are implemented to supcede the constitution. Hillary Clinton's attempts to sign on to the UN small arms treaty is designed to supercede the second amendment. Obama uses the UN to run the war in Lybia.
Why is the US in 4 wars when the majority of people don't want war. Why do we have a healthcare plan that Nancy said, "let's vote for it so we can see what's in it". Obama's agenda is clearly not that of the American Public. Why are there secret agreements to merge Canada, the US and Mexico in a EU type of arrangement.
The media has become a propaganda tool. Bin Laden has been killed 9 times. Government is growing and growing. We are told that capitalism no longer functions. There are secret government operations to subvert the constitution. Operation Fast and Furious comes to mind. There are eerie parallels, that government is evolving into a totalitarian system. Homeland Security operates outside the Consititution and Bill of Rights. A parallel would be the Stazi in Germany. Amish farmers producing organic produce are swat teamed. Chemicals are sprayed in the air and we are not told what they are and for what purpose. GMO foods are plagued with problems that are not investigated.
Medicines contain mercury and other dangerous adjuvents. GMO corn is sold that makes men sterile. By Phenol A is in plastic drinking bottles and promotes sterility. It is also in printer ink and other products. The FDA discourages promising alternative cancer therapies. The financial system is fraught with fraud and corruption but nobody has been investigated, charged and incarcerated. Why? Even the head of the 9/11 Commission which was a precursor to the new anti-terrorist legislation which can be used to oppress Americans, stated he was impeded by the Pentagon. These are the same forces that want to bring about world government.
I agree world government is inevitable but it will be anything but democratic. It is inevitable because people won't wake up and take action. It scares the by Jesus out of me because of the secrecy and lies to cover up what it really is. The only people that will embrace it will be a very small elite.

I'm pretty sure most oppose the notion of Global Government because they have been fed a diet their entire lives of pro-Corporate propaganda that has lead them to believe limitations on Corporations "Freedoms" are akin to limits on their own, even though nothing could be further from the truth.

The typical ATS anti-NWO 'freedom fighter' appears to be made up of people who think Red Dawn was a documentary.

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
I'm pretty sure most oppose the notion of Global Government because they have been fed a diet their entire lives of pro-Corporate propaganda that has lead them to believe limitations on Corporations "Freedoms" are akin to limits on their own, even though nothing could be further from the truth.

The typical ATS anti-NWO 'freedom fighter' appears to be made up of people who think Red Dawn was a documentary.

I am pretty sure that you are pretty sure of what you are pretty sure of because you cannot be bothered to listen to those who are actually against the notion of a one world government. Sticking your fingers in your ears and screaming as loudly as you can la la la la la I can't hear you la la la la la is what makes you pretty sure instead of dead certain.

Man, as a species, is not ready for a single world government. It's really quite simple if you think it through. Islamists want all Western thought and people exterminated, those in the West can't understand the depth of certainty some hold in atheism and other beliefs, and on and on. Even in the US there is rampant corruption. Hell, our current president gave tens of billions of dollars in stimulus monies to huge banks that are the direct cause of our current economic and financial malaise and did it with the sole intent to save union jobs at the expense of private sector jobs.
The only way there can be a single world government is if the ideals espoused in the US Declaration of Independence, and a system of checks and balances deeply entrenched in a revision of the US constitution, with clear rights to every citizen able to own and bear arms, rights to freedom of speech, and more.
Right now, the differences, the divisions in religion and philosophies are so great we can't hope to achieve the ideal you speak of. Personally, I would like to think that there are those who, as a nation, can see themselves seeking the same ideals as we do as Americans. We are not, by any stretch of the imagination, perfect in our government or behavior; but, we do have a clear set of ideals and goals. The reality is that the American Revolution is still in process. I'd like to see other nations petition our congress for statehood.

You can't oppose something that does not yet exist, and nothing is inevitable except for death. I think the real question is, since a one world government is impossible, why try and work towards it?

The problem here is that a one world government is different from a one world law which is simply natural law which already exists and does a far better job than government could do.

You are exactly, 100% correct ....... it IS inevitable. It is mentioned in the Bible as one of the occurrences in the end times. It will happen, but at God's timing and choosing. He is giving ALL people every chance in the world to turn to Him and accept Jesus as their saviour.

Sure many of the things happening today have happened in the past, but NEVER all at once like they are happening now. The Bible has predicted all of this.

The world economic system is a house of cards and it is on the edge of being blown over. With all the massive debts out there, there is NO country that can pay them back.

What will happen is a worldwide reset of the economic system. There will be a worldwide default of debt.

Next will be the establishment of a one world currency and a one world governance.

Then a world leader who will astound the world with his recovery from a potentially fatal head wound, and his ability to "make everything all right".



Then ....... all hell breaks loose.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


I'm pretty sure you just provided nothing of substance to the discussion other than calling me names. Good job!

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux

 

I'm pretty sure you just provided nothing of substance to the discussion other than calling me names. Good job!

I am dead certain you haven't bothered to read any of my posts other than the one in response to yours, and it appears as if you didn't even read that one, since I did not call you any names.