You Want Proof, ELEnin <-- Extinction, I'll Give You Proof -- You Can't Handle!!!

Originally posted by letscit
does anyone know or can anyone even know if we are entering into a part of the universe or galaxy that has a higher than normal quantity of long count comets? ...
... would love some good answers . thanx.

I am not sure about the answers to THOSE questions, you might want to look at this ... ssd.jpl.nasa.gov...

I looked at them all the other day and many do a flyby the sun around 2008 which seems strangely improbable coming in from all different directions.

BUT YOUR QUESTIONS REMINDED ME OF ANOTHER PIECE OF EVIDENCE THAT I FORGOT ABOUT ...

MORE EVIDENCE OF PHOTON BELT: Astrophysicist Alexia Demetriev says our solar system is entering an interstellar energy cloud

I HATE that name the LIGHT Belt, how silly, it does not really fit. How about the, GAMMA QUADRANT, now that fits !!!

coupmedia.org...

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
reply to post by MACchine

 

So, since you're back in this thread again would you like to comment on the points I have been asking you about? The object in the 1983 article turned out to be either a distant ultra-luminous galaxy or an infrared cirrus. This has been proven by going to the primary sources.

It has NOT been proven AT ALL it has been inferred, just because you have an answer to a question does NOT mean that is what actually happened.

WHY DO YOU TRUST NASA IMPLICITLY ???

That data from IRAS was NOT immediately placed in the public domain, in realizing their need to change the story and cover it up what they previously said they could have simply from THIER POINT OF VIEW used other new discovered objects yet unannounced to say, OH IT WAS THIS, OPPS, but I would have thought the BEST OF YOU would NOT get into this kind of tit for tat, only your personal accepted conclusions debate, which ALWAYS VERY FRAGILE.

I would have thought there were few people here smart enough to debate the REAL ISSUES that I brought, and that was the timing of these events, ARE THEY REALLY CONNECTED, I purely inferred this, and the VERY UNUSUAL expressions of DISTRESS from the politicians in the videos.

ONE PERSON in all of ATS got it, JUST ONE.

But this IS something very COMMON, now days, but I think unusual to the human character, although Starwars predicted it, I don't know where they go it from. This malays of perception, a total inability to perceive subtleties or ANYTHING that requires a highly tuned attention span and concentration, the TRUE evidences of high intelligence.

Also I would have bought WISE which also ENDED in a BAZAR, ABOVE TOP SECRET way.

I could have brought up Tyche which is related to WISE and TOTALLY reek of political correctness and obfuscation of any Nibiru reality, very SMELLY CORRUPTION just like renaming APPOLO 3 to APPOLO 1, which a cowardly, STUPID, and HIGHLY DISRESPECTFUL for the 3 men that died trying to help NASA get to the Moon !!!

Do you know what WISE or Tyche IS ???

As for the government classifying NEO's it only applies to data gained from spy satellites that were used in the past to get data on bolides and meteors. These are objects that have already entered the atmosphere.

Ya so what, your statement is slightly INCORRECT tailored apparently to your hidden conclusions. NEOs are being searched for and relieved NOW with very current data, NOT JUST PAST DATA, as you very strongly suggest, the NEOs program is HUGE and many universities in the USA are involved, just click on the link tab of the NEOs page and it will take you to external shared data from small observatories and universities all over the country, and NEO info is there.

Very, very, few NEOs have EVER entered our atmosphere, PHO, potentially hazardous objects would come closer to that description but MOST of those have not either.

A scientist involved with using THAT DATA was perplexed over the SUDDEN CUT OFF of the data, YOU do NOT have any authoritative knowledge over that situation or even close to the understanding to evaluate it in anyway, the scientists response is all that is required in establishing that it was STRANGE !

reply to post by MACchine


It would seem like the IRAS data was released to the public rather quickly. It was launched in January 1983, ended in November 1983, and already by December Houck and his team had a paper submitted. I would also like to point out that Houck, his colleagues, and his grad students do not work for NASA. I would also like to point out the irony of how you claim you have empirical evidence for your claims, but are now resorting to speculation and opinion while my evidence are three scientific articles that require empirical evidence to get published.

I'm also glad you brought up WISE and Tyche as this once again shows you have not done any of the research you are claiming others are lacking. WISE was launched in December 2009, it had enough coolant to last ten months. The coolant then ran out in October 2010, ten months later. An IR satellite is useless without coolant as the heat emitted by the satellite itself will affect its readings. However, the Planetary Division at NASA gave the WISE team some money to keep it running for an extra month using the equipment that didn't require coolant. The mission was to now look for NEOs and the project was renamed NEOWISE. It was such a success that it was allowed to run for another two months. So, not only did WISE not end abruptly or bizarrely, but it actually lasted an extra three months.

As for Tyche, it is a hypothetical planet proposed by two professors at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. They are not affiliated with NASA. In order to understand the Tyche hypothesis one must first look at the Nemesis hypothesis, proposed by the same professors. In the early 80s, while the possibility of Planet X still existed, a paper was published that claimed there was a periodicity to mass extinctions. Matese and Whitmire (the professors) then proposed that this was due to a large object in the Oort Cloud that sent comets towards the Earth. Eventually it was shown that the paper discussing the periodicity of extinctions was wrong removing the need for Nemesis. Furthermore, there was no astronomical data that pointed to the existence of Nemesis. Fast forward a few years and Matese and Whitmire have now proposed Tyche. It is hypothetically a large gas giant 25,000 AU away that helps explain the orbits of comets from the Oort Cloud. It would never enter the inner solar system, or even leave the Oort Cloud. However, Matese and Whitmire are pretty much the only ones claiming that it exists. The rest of the astronomical community is highly dubious. What Matese and Whitmire have said is that if Tyche exists it may be found in the WISE data. However, from what has been released so far Tyche has been absent.

As to the NEOs. Yes they are being searched for. And yes there are many devices that are being used to look for them. However, the only thing that was classified was the data from these spy satellites. In the past scientists had been able to use this data to get specifics on objects entering the Earth's atmosphere. That is the only thing that is classified. Scientists still have access to all their other tools and the existence of NEOs is not classified. Only the data from these spy satellites.

reply to post by MACchine

MORE EVIDENCE OF PHOTON BELT: Astrophysicist Alexia Demetriev says our solar system is entering an interstellar energy cloud

There is no such person as Alexei N. Dmitriev. The entire "paper" is a badly written fraud. Even allowing for an idiosyncratically bad translation from Russian, do these phrases sound technically correct to you?

PlanetoPhysical alterations of the Earth...
highly charged material and energetic non-uniformity's in anisotropic interstellar space...
hybrid processes and excited energy states in all planets...
rapid temperature instability period...
achieve balance with the renewing flow of PlanetoPhysical states and processes...
a general reorganization of the electro-magnetosphere (the electromagnetic skeleton) of our planet, and of its climatic machinery....
these tendencies may be traced in the direction of planet energy capacity growth (capacitance), which is leading to a highly excited or charged state of some of Earth's systems.

www.tmgnow.com...

Dmitriev claims to be associated with the RAS. Here is a list of all the Dmitrievs at the Academy:

Дмитриев Павел А.
Дмитриев Иван Лаврентьевич
Дмитриева Галина Алексеевна
Дмитриева Лариса Михайловна
Дмитриев Виктор Михайлович
Дмитриев Олег Васильевич
Дмитриев Владимир Григорьевич
Дмитриев Владимир Владимирович
Дмитриев Александр Михайлович
Дмитриев Владимир Георгиевич
Дмитриева Татьяна Ивановна
Дмитриевский Анатолий Николаевич
Дмитриев Анатолий Васильевич
Дмитриев Лев Александрович
Дмитриев Николай Константинович
Дмитриевский Алексей Афанасьевич
Дмитриев Александр Капитонович
Дмитриев Виктор Сергеевич
Дмитриева Галина Ивановна
Дмитриев А.
Дмитриева Зоя Германовна
Дмитриев Максим Эдуардович
Дмитриева Руфина Петровна

www.ras.ru...

Let's "Google translate" this for those who cannot read the Cyrillic:

Pavel A. Dmitriev
Ivan Dmitriev Lavrent'evich
Galina Dmitrieva
Dmitrieva, Larisa Mikhailovna
Dmitriev, Victor M.
Oleg Dmitriev
Dmitriev, Vladimir G.
Vladimir Dmitriev
Dmitriev, Alexander
Dmitriev, Vladimir G.
Tatyana Dmitrieva
Anatoly Dmitriev
Dmitriev Anatoliy
Dmitriev, Lev
Dmitriev, Nikolai K.
Alexei Dmitriev Afanasievich
Alexander Dmitriev Kapitonovich
Dmitriev, Victor S.
Galina Dmitrieva
Dmitriev
Zoya Dmitrieva Germanovna
Maxim Dmitriev E.
Dmitriev Rufina P.

The article you have used as "evidence" is an extremely sloppy hoax.

Click here for more information.

Comet Elenin will sweep past Earth in late 2011. NASA’s Don Yeomans says its passage is nothing unusual and no dramatic events are expected.

It seems that the closest this will come to earth is 22 million miles.

For some reason astronomers don’t understand, this comet has been associated by doomsdayers with various prophecies (“Thirst and famine when the comet will pass.” – Nostradamus: Century 2, Quatrain 62). Yet it is only an ordinary comet after all. At its closest point, Elenin will pass 35 million kilometers (22 million miles) from us, or nearly 100 times the moon’s distance, according to Don Yeomans of NASA’s Near-Earth Object Program Office at NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory in Pasadena, California. He said:

This comet is also comparably smaller to other spotted, and it's mass make up is not dense enough to cause any effects here on earth.

Comet Elenin will not only be far away, it is also on the small side for comets. And comets are not the most densely-packed objects out there. They usually have the density of something akin to loosely packed icy dirt. So you’ve got a modest-sized icy dirtball that is getting no closer than 35 million kilometers. It will have an immeasurably miniscule influence on our planet. By comparison, my subcompact automobile exerts a greater influence on the ocean’s tides than comet Elenin ever will.

It appears that the comet will be at it's closest on October 16 at 22 million miles. So I am wondering if wild Elenin claims will taper off and die after the 16th of October? What do you think?


Don Yeomans with the truth about Comet Elenin

reply to post by Xcalibur254


Your so called facts are chosen HIGHLY selectively to support your conclusions argument, which means in-fact YOU EMBRACE IGNORANCE FOR THE SAKE YOU PERSONAL EGO

IRAS never placed the data in the public domain, IT WAS NOT DONE IN THOSE DAYS, bringing out 1 to 3 papers does NOT constitute an EXPOSÉ, your entire argument PROVES MY POINT, NOT YOURS !

WISE was reported to be going on with the NEOWISE mission for at least another 6 months and then 2 months later articles come out saying it was shutdown early in BAZAR circumstances to save money.

Tyche mythical, no more mythical then Nibiru, it is simply a name change, BUT NASA APPROVED OF IT, once again proving MY POINTS, NOT YOURS.

If a NEOs were to strike the Earth IT WOULD BE CLASSIFIED, unless for political purposes they choose to make it public, I AND FRIENDS HERE HAVE DONE AN AWESOME JOB OF PROVING THAT, case closed YOU LOOSE

AND this fact PROVES that the whistle blower might actually have some real data.

I could on and on but I won't because YOU have pulled your gas mask down soo tightly over your head you can not see anymore, BLINDERS ON TIGHT.

LET GO, the propaganda is like an old soap opera. It just lost the pizzazz. OK, nothing will happen.

reply to post by MACchine

The extended NEOWISE program was completed.
www.jpl.nasa.gov...

Click here for more information.

reply to post by MACchine


So are you are saying the survey is not finished and is still going on, despite NASA's announcement otherwise?

Edit to add: Wiki section on NEOWISE

Do you have any evidence to support such a statement, assuming that is what you are saying?

reply to post by MACchine

In early October 2010, after completing its prime science mission, the spacecraft ran out of the frozen coolant that keeps its instrumentation cold. However, two of its four infrared cameras remained operational. These two channels were still useful for asteroid hunting, so NASA extended the NEOWISE portion of the WISE mission by four months, with the primary purpose of hunting for more asteroids and comets, and to finish one complete scan of the main asteroid belt.

Unless more coolant was added, then yes the mission is over.
Are you suggesting that the mission is still going?
I'm really confused.
Many thanks.

reply to post by cluckerspud


Love the new icon.
Second line.
Third line: have you and Phage... nevermind.

reply to post by DJW001


Yes....yes.. we.... forget it.

Glad you like the new av.

reply to post by MACchine

I AM ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE THE INTELLIGENCE TO RELIABLY REACH THE CONCLUSION YOU HAVE GIVEN ME.

Goodbye.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by MACchine

 

I AM ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE THE INTELLIGENCE TO RELIABLY REACH THE CONCLUSION YOU HAVE GIVEN ME.

Goodbye.

Seriously. Dude is wack. Elenin broke up the Beatles. That's as far as I should have read. The 1983 article is a steaming pile of rubbish, refuted several times, and you've given him plenty of sources and examples. But that's what he's hitching his bandwagon of foolishness to.

You know, just once, it would be refreshing to see someone post something, be debunked, and say, "Oh, my bad! I never saw that info, guess it's back to the drawing board. Thanks for the new info, guys!" Instead, they make wild assumptions about people and act like children, because they're worred about their iEgo.

Y2K was only 11 years ago. So unless the OP assumes I'm the most well-spoked 10-year old on Earth, him saying "I WAS THERE, YOU WEREN'T" is possibly the most idiotic statement in the thread. I WAS THERE. Nothing happened. IT firms and software developers saw it coming a mile off, and a few stories about some possible glitches involving power grids and banking information caught mad traction, and then it was off to the races for the media, because guess whay? APOCALYPSE SELLS. People tune in to the 11 o'clock news when the tease is "Y2K coming up, could your bank account be wiped out? Maybe the lights won't work on January 1. Tune in at 11 for more information!"

OP, your entire thread has been debunked. Swallow your pride, and salvage some (if ANY) respect you may have earned.

I'm with MAC. Goodbye. Don't waste your time quoting me, I'm through with your fairy tale. I'll bet you're blaming all those 440+ foot bombs in tonight's all-star home-run derby on the balls being affected by ELEnin's gravity, right?

Again, Goodbye.

Very well put together, thanks for the time that you spent on this, seems no one cares, but the little people,

something is definetly going on, so much so a fifth grader could see the writing on the walls.

thanks op. nice to see some real research, and not the usual b-# msn and academia information throwing laughable information out, such as birds falling from the skies due to fireworks.

or everything is ok at the Japanese plants.


or sodium flouride not only kills rats,but whitens teeth,

etc,etc, etc, etc.
again thanks

reply to post by MACchine


So you want more papers? Would you rather have the 495 papers that cite the original IRAS paper or the 372 that cite the 1987 article. I am not cherry picking my facts. I am going to the original sources and reading what they have to say. If you're going to make a claim about what a source says it goes without saying that you should actually check the source instead of going with a secondary account. Houck, a researcher at Cornell University, not NASA, published the original paper that the Washington Post based their article on. Houck then went on to publish two more articles that state what was found were nine ultra-luminous galaxies and an infrared cirrus. In 30 years at least 372 scientific articles have agreed with this fact, while 0 have disagreed with it. All you have to support your claims is a newspaper article that is based on speculation. Last time I checked speculation is not empirical evidence like you claim.

As for WISE, as others have shown it ended on schedule and then proceeded for an extra four months. If Tyche exists it will be found in the WISE data, not the NEOWISE data, so I fail to see where the conspiracy is. Furthermore, show me evidence that NASA supports the Tyche hypothesis. The only paper I have seen regarding it is the original one by Matese and Whitmire. Other than that I have seen a lot of astronomers coming and and saying they don't support the hypothesis. Once again I would like to point out that Matese and Whitmire are from the University of Louisiana at LaFayette, not NASA. You seem to be under the impression that every astronomer in the country works for NASA.

Yes, if an NEO enters the atmosphere the data from the spy satellites would be classified. At least that is the stance of the US government. However, I am not sure what the policy is of other nations. So, the data could still be gained by other astronomers, which would in turn be passed on to the science community as a whole. Science is not restricted by national boundaries.

Originally posted by Laokin

Originally posted by Utopian
We have all seen the multitude of youtube vids plotting ELEnin's orbital path around the sun. Well i am confused as to how Nasa have been able to calculate the turning point if they still do not have any idea of the size and mass of the comet.

Maybe someone out there could enlighten me!

Phage are you around ?

You can't. You need to know the mass and speed of an object to determine projected paths of orbit. They do it with math... if you don't even have estimates you can't do the math.

edit on 9-7-2011 by Laokin because: (no reason given)

The mass of the comet is negligible, and so not factored in.

You see, orbital calculations involve a minimum of two bodies. Both affect the other, and so the interaction between the two has to be factored in. In the case of Elenin and the Sun, the mass differential is so great that the mass of Elenin is inconsequential in the calculations, and only the gravitational attraction of the Sun matters. the mass differential between those two is MUCH greater than the mass differential between a gnat and a Blue Whale.

The point around which both bodies orbit is called a "barycenter". In the case of the Earth and the Moon, the Moon is relatively MUCH larger compared to the Earth than Elenin is compared to the Sun, and still the Earth-Moon barycenter is inside the Earth, such that the Earth's orbit around it is negligible. In the case of Elenin and the Sun, the barycenter is so close to the center of the sun (likely no more than a couple of millimeters from it) as to be co-incidental with the center of the Sun for all practical purposes.

Elenin is comparatively TINY, y'all!

The orbit is easy to work out with a few observations to determine parameters and then applying Kepler's laws to them.

reply to post by DJW001


Anyone who has been around a few years HAS HEARD OF "Alexei N. Dmitriev", your behavior is SO SAD.

The REST of your post is ALL FABRICATED I never sent you an article like that.