Unconstitutional for Obama to Raise Debt Ceiling Without Congress

The 14th amendment reads as thus:

The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

Obama...as all know who is a supposed "Constitutional Scholar" seems to think that if we as a country default on our debt, that it is unconstitutional...and that he can ignore the debt ceiling by continuing to borrow more money, without the approval of congress, to pay off past loans...

But what he doesn't seem to understand...is that the text only implicates that we should use priority in paying off debts and pensions already incurred and not to the preservation of the ability to keep borrowing more and more money...

Once this nation defaults...which it more or likely will...we can thank Obama, the GOP, and the dem's and rep's because I honestly think it is all their faults...they've been playing the blame game for how long now? And look where it's got us...in a pickle...and it's a pickle none of these squabblers are willing to choke down...sorry but my own opinion is that we are getting what has been a long time in the making so I'm not going to play the blame game and blame one person...I'm going to blame them all...

Get over the 2 party system everybody...it just separates us from solving real issues like this...

LINK

Corporations are not people and should not have the same rights as true flesh and blood human beings.

These Corporations built America after WWII with a tax of 80% or more and they didn't run offshore.

These Corporations were thinking of the country then. They still lived high on the hog. How much higher are they now on that Hog "We the Real People"

Very Un-American of them to leave the USA behind for more and more profits. Now we are lucky to have any taxes from them. 15% tax is still to high according to them.
When Boehner mentions the People of America don't want taxes raised he is in reality saying Corporations don't want higher taxes.
So, when you have a dumbed down "We the People" they truly believe that when the Republicans say People they mean them. That is so lame.

Back to the issue of a deficit.
Let's go back in time to Vietnam.
This so called War was not a War, but a Policing Action told to the public.
The money spent emptied our Silver from the Treasury. We went broke. No one then put it into a budget.
55,000 dead Boys and millions dead Vietnamese.
We Lost, so don't be fooled at who Won.
Who Won? Corporations that's who.
Have you been there since?
Pepsi and Coke billboards and tons of American Corporations using what would be catamount to slave labor.

Now to our present day Wars as called.
Nearing 10,000 dead and with millions dying from spent uranium in Iraq. And now same going on in Afganistan.
We didn't budget for the 4 trillion estimate so far for these conflicts.
We didn't win anything but going broke.
Who will Win in these also? Corporations so don't be fooled.

This Country was sold to the ones with the most clout and that being Money.

Take Money out of the picture (lobbyist) and "We the People" might have a fighting chance.
But, No, Obama promised that to and what did we get? Nothing but a right wing Supreme Court who is for the Corporation and work for the Corporation.

I am not afraid to say that "We the People" have given back this country to the Kings and Queens of this World (the Corporations)

They have had taxes cut since Bush and the only jobs we got are in the Death Industries called the Defense Industry and Military.

Yes I am a man of God and see War as an Evil and they who participate and condone it are not of the God I know.

Tax the Churches also I say, for they have far to much money and land. There is such a thing as Separation of Church and State and to not tax them is saying to me that they are being treated as a special case when they are not.

If you want revenue there it is. You want to stop huge spending then stop wholesale Murder.

Who is threatening our coast lines with invading armies? No One.

If America wanted to and since they like wholesale murder so much why not use the A-Bomb. Then the World would surely buckle under us as we wish for, we have the Balls to Nuke them like Truman did to the Japanese.

As far as a Murderous State goes, so goes the USA.

Better yet lets resurrect Ronald and sit Him up in the Oval Office and that will really scare the # out of the World.

reply to post by RevRay


of course the corporate world is to blame as well...but who do you think gives in to the demands of the corporate lobbyists?

Originally posted by here4awhile

Obama...as all know who is a supposed "Constitutional Scholar" seems to think that if we as a country default on our debt, that it is unconstitutional...and that he can ignore the debt ceiling by continuing to borrow more money, without the approval of congress, to pay off past loans...

Obama doesn't let a silly little thing like the constitution get in his way. Likewise it was unconstitutional for him to continue the conflict in Libya without congressional approval, but that small detail did not concern him.

I agree with you that our current economic disaster is a bipartisan issue. For too long we've been electing career politicians into both parties who are greedy and selfish. They are more interested in pointing fingers across the aisle than in solving the very real problems our country is facing. A debt default is inevitable at this point, and the fallout is going to be brutal. I think the vast majority of our population doesn't have a clue what is headed our way, we are going to fall and fall hard. All of the political issues that we bicker about today like whether or not social security benefits should be raised/ lowered will be immaterial because social programs will vanish. I've even read people say that a debt default would be a good thing for the country, LOL! It's time to wake up to reality, a debt default will be the beginning of a downward spiral and the America that emerges on the other side will be completely unfamiliar to us. There's nothing that can stop it at this point, all this talk about debt ceilings and bipartisan deals is just lip service, it's just postponing the inevitable.

you have a dictator in power, this is why he keeps having executive orders and created so many Czars to bypass congress. Appointed officials instead of elected officials

This is the road to serfdom, enjoy your stay

reply to post by SavedOne


it's sad huh? But maybe it's the wake up call many have needed for a long time...

If enough like minded people with good intentions can shape it to be a better place when it does happen though it could be for the better...it will be tough...but we can be strong...

reply to post by here4awhile


You don't have to worry. Obama doesn't have the guts to do anything like that. He is the kind of punk who if he were your friend as a kid, and a fight went down, he would run away like a chicken. Obama has no heart or spine.

reply to post by inforeal


you may be right...but he has the "I can do anything" mentality so i wouldn't put it past him to be honest...

Originally posted by here4awhile
Obama...as all know who is a supposed "Constitutional Scholar" seems to think that if we as a country default on our debt, that it is unconstitutional...and that he can ignore the debt ceiling by continuing to borrow more money, without the approval of congress, to pay off past loans...

Are you sure?

Still ‘Far Apart’ on Debt, 2 Sides Will Seek Broader Cuts

In addition to his warnings about the cost of a default, officials said, Mr. Geithner told the lawmakers the White House did not believe it had the authority, under the Constitution, to continue issuing debt if it reached the debt ceiling. Nobody in the room disputed Mr. Geithner’s bleak assessment, the officials said.

And this was July 7.

I have little doubt that Congress can set a debt ceiling and the President must obey it.

But Congress is to blame for this mess. It passed contradictory laws: it set a debt limit and it passes budgets and appropriation statutes that require the United States to go over that limit. If nothing is done to fix this the President would have, in essence, to choose which laws to break.

reply to post by aptness


i don't know...seems there are contradictory reports regarding this...i guess it's right about the time we just wait and see how this turns out...

Originally posted by here4awhile

But what he doesn't seem to understand...is that the text only implicates that we should use priority in paying off debts and pensions already incurred and not to the preservation of the ability to keep borrowing more and more money...

Mr. Obama understands it perfectly. He knows every word of the Constitution, and what each section, provision, and amendment means in relation to his position as leader of the U.S. The problem is he doesn't care and neither does Congress.

The unwashed masses don't know or care, either, what he does as long as their outstretched hand is filled with fairy dust. They have their Social Security, so they're OK. They have their welfare check, so they're OK. They have their Obamacare, so they're OK. Those other things, like the debt ceiling, don't matter to them. Those numbers are so big that they can't possibly mean anything to Uncle Charley. His life is lived in the thousands of dollars, not the trillions.

The only reason people here on ATS understands that the debt ceiling affects every penny you and I receive is because we aren't complacent. We have expended at least a joule trying to improve our quality of life by understanding the mechanics of the country we live in. Ignorance is bliss, they say. Well the American public must be pretty damned peaceful about now.

/TOA

And you think he cares? Or that congress will do anything about it if he does? Mwahahahaha.

Doesn't matter who does it or how they do it, they will raise the debt ceiling.

The story below seems to contradict the op.

gawker.com...


Doesn't matter. The debt ceiling is just a show to keep people's minds occupied.

Election is coming up and politicians need their donations. No way they can collect those donations if they let the economy collapse.