Moral Absalutes COME ON!! try and tell me murder is wrong!

I am looking for a person to tell me Murder is ok. that if i came up to them and murdered their parents right in front of them that they would be ok with that.

I simply dont get it. there is clearly a right and wrong in our world. not just our world view but EVER world view.

Good Day.

reply to post by the illuminator


Is it ok if they are endangering you and or your family?

reply to post by the illuminator


It depends on who you ask. The murderer probably thought it was ok.[

edit: I would say it also depends on who you murder. Hypothetically speaking, if some small group of elites were manipulating whole countries and create mass debt and poverty for the entire human race, would it be wrong to assassinate them, given that was the only choice considering their power and wealth.

then you would need to ask the murderer if he would think killing his family or something he cares about is ok

Originally posted by the illuminator
I am looking for a person to tell me Murder is ok. that if i came up to them and murdered their parents right in front of them that they would be ok with that.

I simply dont get it. there is clearly a right and wrong in our world. not just our world view but EVER world view.

Good Day.

self defence

reply to post by davesmart


that wouldnt be murder then

What in the HELL is the point of this thread.

I'm trying to see if anyone would say it's ok to rape their child!!11ONE1

I really want to understand the point OP.

Originally posted by the illuminator
I am looking for a person to tell me Murder is ok. that if i came up to them and murdered their parents right in front of them that they would be ok with that.

I simply dont get it. there is clearly a right and wrong in our world. not just our world view but EVER world view.

Good Day.

If you murdered my parents in front of me... I would kill you in the spot, without hesitation..

Stupid question really.. I don't think one person here will say unprovoked murder is ok.. (unless they are mentally deranged or psychotic) Not sure what you expect from this thread?

reply to post by the illuminator


Define what you mean by murder.

If this is a clear cut person "A" killed person "B" due to (greed, lust, Psychopath etc etc) then no, it can never be justified.

However are you including things such as euthanasia, death sentences, self defense (etc)?

Question is, is there more to this thread then appears?!

Devil's advocate: you could take a strong Humean response and say there is nothing immoral in murder because you cannot show me exactly what part of the murder is immoral.

Ex) I murder my mother by stabbing her with a kitchen knife. Taken frame by frame, at what point is the immorality of the act shown? When the knife is in my hand at an 85 degree angle to her chest? Just as it touches her chest and breaks the skin? Presuming I stab her in the heart, is it immoral once it reaches the heart?

So yes, it is possible to rationally assert that murder is not immoral without being a 'psycho' or 'ignorant maniac.' A very well-respected and prominent philosopher David Hume claimed such a thing quite a while ago.

reply to post by the illuminator


what if the parents were psychotic sadists who tortured the child daily ?

or were about to sacrifice the child to thier invisible freind ?

how ever black or white you attempt to make a situation appear - someone will always throw a quantity of pigment in there to turn it grey

reply to post by the illuminator

Here's something you might find of interest:

PART ONE: THE MORAL SIDE OF MURDER
If you had to choose between (1) killing one person to save the lives of five others and (2) doing nothing even though you knew that five people would die right before your eyes if you did nothing—what would you do? What would be the right thing to do? Thats the hypothetical scenario Professor Michael Sandel uses to launch his course on moral reasoning. After the majority of students votes for killing the one person in order to save the lives of five others, Sandel presents three similar moral conundrums—each one artfully designed to make the decision more difficult. As students stand up to defend their conflicting choices, it becomes clear that the assumptions behind our moral reasoning are often contradictory, and the question of what is right and what is wrong is not always black and white.

PART TWO: THE CASE FOR CANNIBALISM

Sandel introduces the principles of utilitarian philosopher, Jeremy Bentham, with a famous nineteenth century legal case involving a shipwrecked crew of four. After nineteen days lost at sea, the captain decides to kill the weakest amongst them, the young cabin boy, so that the rest can feed on his blood and body to survive. The case sets up a classroom debate about the moral validity of utilitarianism—and its doctrine that the right thing to do is whatever produces "the greatest good for the greatest number."

It's not a five minute video, it's not a five minute topic (it's not a single video) but if you find the subject interesting the longer you watch the more rewarding I think you'll find it.

If your trying or you do kill someone i care about im going after you. If its basically in self defense its ok.

reply to post by the illuminator

Are you considering murdering somebody and want a reason why it is okay? There aren't many people who kill without thinking that it was the right thing to do at the time. That's called a justification.

Moral values are not rational. But they attempt to create a game in which everyone has a chance to participate. It's not "moral" to knock someone out of the game just for deciding to participate. That's the point of morals, to generally keep the lid on. They're just boundaries you aren't supposed to cross. Of course lots of people cross them anyway. It's gotten pretty rough in some places.

Ethics is the rational contemplation of survival factors to come to a decision about something. You might have a very ethical reason to stop (or kill) somebody. But morally, it takes the decision of a judge (or similar "wise" person) to get the social OK for such a plan. If people just went out and killed whoever they liked, we'd have a huge confusion and no one would feel safe (kind of like how it is in a lot of places these days). So a disregard for the law indicates moral degradation, even if the ethics behind the action seem sound.

Ethics are personal. Morals are social. You need them both in a society like ours for the average person to have enough courage to get up every day and get on with life. I urge you to respect the moral boundaries even if others aren't. Make a statement by setting a good example. Something as extreme as murder is hardly ever really necessary. There are usually much more ethical ways to make things go right.

Reply to post by the illuminator


Fine. Murder is o.k. There, happy now? Its a 100% natural form of entertainment. I think it is o.k. to murder someone if they threaten you or anyone you don't want them to threaten, if they have something you need in order to survive, if they steal from you, have sex with your wife.....or just plain look at you funny.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

We do have a lot of wars going on but while I do not say it is ok, our governments and others says it is. Some do apply the self defence argument to this, but the WMD debacle shows that this is not always the case. Resources and self fulfilment is a closer definition to the situation, like killing sheep and cows. It sustains us, but we would not die without it. As for the survivors being ok with this, many are not and just carry on as best they can.

This world is complex and while many of the worlds religions and laws do have common definitions of right and wrong, our free will and history has tried many different things for many different reasons. The core difference I see between right and wrong is if you can be honest about it. If you can stand in front of your peers and society and explain why there is blood on your hands then there is some self justification that others can recognise. If you have to lie and cover your tracks then you do not believe your actions are justified, and neither will others.

Murder is ok. If you came up and murdered my parents right in front of me, I would be ok with that.

Happy now?

/thread

reply to post by the illuminator


What the hell OP? your title says try and tell me murder is wrong! and then you state in the opening

Originally posted by the illuminator
I am looking for a person to tell me Murder is ok.

This is pointless and confusing. Morals are subjective. If I murder people because it is funny, then why would it be wrong to me? What if I'm afraid of humanity and killing them is the only way I can selfishly be happy? But since morals are derived from a general consensus or teaching, you will probably not come across another person in your life time who sincerely supports cold blooded murderers.

Originally posted by the illuminator
then you would need to ask the murderer if he would think killing his family or something he cares about is ok

Cows care about cows, but we kill them all the time.

I don't believe in that moral relatavism BS being preached everywhere.