It's Official: Experts says Barrack Obama's Birth Certificate is a Forged Document

Originally posted by spinalremain
reply to post by ontarff

 

That would be a souvenir, not a legal document.

Sorry Kitilani. You beat me to it. Footprints! haha
Obama had better get some footprints on the pdf before he's thrown in prison.

edit on 13-7-2011 by spinalremain because: (no reason given)

I answered your question, You asked if I had a hard copy birth certificate. My mother gave it to me. It is signed by my parents, doctor and medical staff that were present when I was born. It was issued by the hospital where I was born,has a hospital stamp embossed on the date it was signed by the hospital administrator and states it is an official record of live birth. And yes, I have used it to provide proof of live birth. It includes birth data missing on the Hawaiian long form issued by the Hawaii DoH. It is interesting that it is unacceptable for you. The State where I live accepted it when I got my driver's license. When I got my passport, it was accepted by a federal agency that issues passports. Who are you to question it's validity and call it a "souvenir" and then mock me? Typical of you anti-birthers. It is more than Obama has produced for proof.

Originally posted by ontarff
I answered your question, You asked if I had a hard copy birth certificate.

Your answer was apparently "No, all I have is this worthless souvenir that no government agency will accept as proof of anything."

My mother gave it to me. It is signed by my parents, doctor and medical staff that were present when I was born. It was issued by the hospital where I was born. It has an official seal, and yes, I have used it to provide proof of live birth.

You lie.

It includes birth data missing on the Hawaiian long form issued by the Hawaii DoH. It is interesting that it is unacceptable for you. The State where I live accepted it when I got my driver's license. When I got my passport, it was accepted by a federal agency that issues passports. Who are you to question it's validity and call it a "souvenir" and then mock me? Typical of you anti-birthers. It is more than Obama has produced for proof.

You lie.

Most hospitals in the U.S. issue a souvenir birth certificate which typically includes the footprints of the newborn. However, these birth certificates are not legally accepted as proof of age or citizenship, and are frequently rejected by the Bureau of Consular Affairs during passport applications. Many Americans believe the souvenir records to be their official birth certificates, when in reality they hold little legal value.[25]

source

Please do share with us which state this is that you are speaking of so your lie can be confirmed.

reply to post by Kitilani

Most hospitals in the U.S. issue a souvenir birth certificate which typically includes the footprints of the newborn. However, these birth certificates are not legally accepted as proof of age or citizenship, and are frequently rejected by the Bureau of Consular Affairs during passport applications. Many Americans believe the souvenir records to be their official birth certificates, when in reality they hold little legal value.[25]

source

does this also mean they are "infrequently accepted" ??

sounds inconclusive.

what is the criteria for "acceptance".

reply to post by ontarff


I apologize for mocking you. It just made me laugh. Hoenstly though; you're suggesting TPOTUS hasn't presented suffienct evidence of his citizenship after he's released not one, but two forms stating that he was born where he says he was. Yet you claim to have your original legal document of birth and it's a souvenir with the baby foot on it. I mean if you can't see the humor in that then there's no help for humanity.

What do you use that certificate for? What were you able to accomplish with it? I thought the baby footprint certificate was solely a souvenir for personal value.

I had trouble getting a new SS card and drivers license in NY with a raised seal original BC. Seems our states are vastly different if you can TCOB with the footprint one.

Originally posted by xuenchen
does this also mean they are "infrequently accepted" ??

sounds inconclusive.

what is the criteria for "acceptance".

Read the post above yours and tell me where it says hospital issued souvenirs will ever be accepted. Thanks.

reply to post by xuenchen


Need more?

•US Birth Certificate (certified copy from state or local vital statistics office)
•US Certificate of Birth Abroad or Report of Birth Abroad
•Federal Proof of Indian Blood Degree
•USCIS American Indian Card
•Birth Certificate or passport issued from a US Territory

•US Passport or US Passport Card
•US Military Identification Cards (Active or reserve duty, dependent of a military member, retired member, discharged from service, medical/religious personnel)
•Common Access Card (only if designated as Active military or Active Reserve or Active Selected Reserve)
•Certificate of Naturalization or Citizenship
•Northern Mariana Card
•USCIS US Citizen ID Card
•Permanent Resident Card
•Temporary Resident Identification Card
•Canadian Passport/Birth Certificate
•Non-resident Alien Canadian Border Crossing Card
•Valid foreign passport with a valid Record of Arrival/Departure (form I-94)
•"Processed for I-551" stamped in a valid foreign passport
•Permanent Resident Re-entry Permit
•Refugee travel document
•Certified court order or judgment issued from a court of competent jurisdiction. Must contain name, birth date, place of birth, legal presence status, and judge’s signature.
•Certification from California Department of Corrections or California Youth Authority
•Employment Authorization Card
•Valid I-94 stamped "Refugee," "Parole or Parolee," "Asylee," or Section 207, Section 208, Section 209, Section 212d(2), HP or PIP
•Valid I-94 with attached photo stamped "Processed for I-551 temporary evidence of lawful admission for permanent residence"
•Notice of Action (I-797 Approved Petition) – must indicate approved extension of stay or change in status that grants temporary or permanent residency, or indicates that an original, duplicate or renewal Resident Alien card is forthcoming.
•Immigration judge’s order granting asylum
•Mexican Border Crossing Card with valid I-94
•U.S. Border Crossing Identification card with valid I-94

California DMV

Must be issued by the state or local government office in order to get a driver's license in CA so Ontarff is either mistaken or you can show me where it says they would accept a hospital souvenir. I keep missing that.

reply to post by ontarff


You were issued a United States passport with the baby foot paper? That is correct?

reply to post by Kitilani


a long shot possibility for "infrequent acceptance" would be this.

Source
If you do not have a previous U.S. passport or a certified birth certificate, you will need:

1. Letter of "No Record" issued by the State with your name, date of birth, which years were searched for a birth record and that there is no birth certificate on file for you and
2.As many of the following as possible:

•baptismal certificate
•hospital birth certificate
•census record
•early school record
•family bible record
•doctor's record of post-natal care
Note: These documents must be early public records showing the date and place of birth, preferably created within the first five years of your life. You may also submit an Affidavit of Birth, form DS-10, from an older blood relative (i.e. parent, aunt, uncle, sibling) who has personal knowledge of your birth. It must be notarized or have the seal and signature of the acceptance agent.

Originally posted by xuenchen
reply to post by Kitilani

 

Most hospitals in the U.S. issue a souvenir birth certificate which typically includes the footprints of the newborn. However, these birth certificates are not legally accepted as proof of age or citizenship, and are frequently rejected by the Bureau of Consular Affairs during passport applications. Many Americans believe the souvenir records to be their official birth certificates, when in reality they hold little legal value.[25]

source

does this also mean they are "infrequently accepted" ??

sounds inconclusive.

what is the criteria for "acceptance".

Hi there everyone.. I would like to take a moment to introduce you all to my friend Dead Horse. Would you care to beat him for awhile?

Originally posted by ShogunAssassins
Hi there everyone.. I would like to take a moment to introduce you all to my friend Dead Horse. Would you care to beat him for awhile?

Is his cousin's name Mr Ed ?

Originally posted by xuenchen
reply to post by Kitilani

 

a long shot possibility for "infrequent acceptance" would be this.

Not if you actually read it.

First of all, what you posted was what to do if you do NOT have a birth certificate. Ontarff says he has one. He claims the souvenir one is his real one. So you post something that says what to do if you do NOT have one. See the problem?

Further reading will help a great deal.
From your own source.

f you do not have a previous U.S. passport or a certified birth certificate, you will need:

Letter of "No Record" issued by the State with your name, date of birth, which years were searched for a birth record and that there is no birth certificate on file for you and
As many of the following as possible:
baptismal certificate
hospital birth certificate
census record
early school record
family bible record
doctor's record of post-natal care

So no, that souvenir will not be accepted without a letter of "No Record."

Think about that for a bit. If Ontarff has his birth certificate, which is the hospital one listed above, then there would be no letter of "No Record." but since it is listed here as accepted once that step is exhausted, you just proved Ontarff is lying.

Thank you.

Originally posted by spinalremain
reply to post by ontarff

 

You were issued a United States passport with the baby foot paper? That is correct?

I may be mistaken which birth certificate was used for the passport. I am not intentionally lying as accused by another rude anti-birther on this site. A hospital birth certificate is not referred to as "baby foot paper". I probably used my certified copy for the passport. I took both. However, my intent was to simply answer your question as to original hard copy records. The hospital birth certificate was used when I obtained my driver's licence. Would you agree that State requirements may have changed since then? The document can be corroborated as factual. That is the point.

Originally posted by ontarff
I may be mistaken which birth certificate was used for the passport. I am not intentionally lying as accused by another rude anti-birther on this site.

You made factual statements with no "maybe it was this other thing." Those are lies or mistakes but when you write them out as if they are true facts, you are pushing something that is not true as if it were. What do you call that?

A hospital birth certificate is not referred to as "baby foot paper".

No, Danny. It is referred to as a souvenir and worthless.

I probably used my certified copy for the passport.

Yeah probably. So when you were asked if you had a hard copy, why did you even mention the one you maybe did not use because you know, no one would accept it.

I took both. However, my intent was to simply answer your question as to original hard copy records. The hospital birth certificate was used when I obtained my driver's licence. Would you agree that State requirements may have changed since then? The document can be corroborated as factual. That is the point.

Show that change. There is no way you used your fake birth certificate to get your driver's license in CA.The document cannot be corroborated as fact. Who would corroborate it? No state agency accepts them as legal birth certificates so it neither addresses your hard copy or your DL.

reply to post by ontarff


Fair enough, and yes of course legislature and regulations change all the time. That is why I was asking to be sure. I asked if you had your original hard copy birth certificate because you're adamant that Obama must get his to appease you. You responded that you did. You had the original with the footprints. In my mind that meant "No I don't. I only have the souvenir document."

reply to post by Kitilani

So no, that souvenir will not be accepted without a letter of "No Record."

Think about that for a bit. If Ontarff has his birth certificate, which is the hospital one listed above, then there would be no letter of "No Record." but since it is listed here as accepted once that step is exhausted, you just proved Ontarff is lying.

yes it seems the "letter of no record" is a key, and seems to create some conflicting scenarios.

and for the record, i was not addressing Ontarff directly,

i was addressing the wikipedia source quote .... nothing more !

wiki says

Most hospitals in the U.S. issue a souvenir birth certificate which typically includes the footprints of the newborn. However, these birth certificates are not legally accepted as proof of age or citizenship, and are [color=limegreen]frequently rejected by the Bureau of Consular Affairs during passport applications. Many Americans believe the souvenir records to be their official birth certificates, when in reality they hold little legal value.[25]

they say "frequently rejected" not "always" or "never accepted".....


YOU have been addressing Ontarff , however !

so i assume YOU are calling him a lier?

i am not.

please do not put words into your own mouth!
people might get the silly notion that YOU are insulting YOUR own intelligence !!!!
"~"

the 1000's of readers here will make up their own minds !

Mr. Ed trivia

www.imdb.com...

The character Mr. Ed originated in a series of magazine stories. Not only did the horse talk, he got drunk.

The original name of the horse that played Mr. Ed was Bamboo Harvester. (After the show began, it was legally changed to "Mister Ed.")

The horse that played Mr. Ed is said to have died in 1979 at the age of 30, 33 or 34 (depending on the source). Other, equally reputable, sources give the horse's date of death as 1968, 1973 and 1974.

Mr. Ed only talked to Wilbur because (in his judgment) he was the only person worth talking to.

I wonder if Mr Ed had a BC and a passport ??

Originally posted by xuenchen


yes it seems the "letter of no record" is a key, and seems to create some conflicting scenarios.

and for the record, i was not addressing Ontarff directly,

i was addressing the wikipedia source quote .... nothing more !

Yes and you know what that letter of "no record" means, right? It means a birth certificate was sought but none was held at the DOH. That is a pretty specific little detail. If you have one of those, then you do not have a birth certificate, do you?

YOU have been addressing Ontarff , however !

Yes I was. What gave it away? My posting to him or calling him by name?

so i assume YOU are calling him a lier?

i am not.

I know you did not call him a liar. What you did was confirm with your source that he was lying. That is why he quickly remembered that he did not mean to say all those things because maybe he was wrong.
The backpedaling is my favorite part of getting caught in a lie.

please do not put words into your own mouth!

people might get the silly notion that YOU are insulting YOUR own intelligence !!!!

"~"

That makes no sense at all.

the 1000's of readers here will make up their own minds !

edit on Jul-13-2011 by xuenchen because:

Speaking of the thousands of readers deciding. Scroll back through this thread and see who all those readers are giving stars to.

FOLKS!!!! EVERYONE!!!! Stop arguing with the birthers...

Unless you have a magic wand that will turn Barack Obama into a white democrat, your spinning your wheels.

No form of ANYTHING will ever be good enough. Look at where it has gone... "hospital souvenir" really? That hospital souvenir has gotten me through life so far...

No matter what is released, birthers will NEVER believe any document put in front of them.

Birthers would have you believe that the Birth Announcement was part of the conspiracy...