Greeks stop Canadian ship bound for Gaza

Originally posted by hxc408
reply to post by Corruption Exposed

 

Good. They had no business going there anyway.

Yup. No right to help anyone unless of course it's an illegal 'Humanitarian' effort that kills innocent people first.

Yup, no right.

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


What was a canadian supply ship doing going to Gaza? There was justification to search

Originally posted by jude11

Originally posted by hxc408
reply to post by Corruption Exposed

 

Good. They had no business going there anyway.

Yup. No right to help anyone unless of course it's an illegal 'Humanitarian' effort that kills innocent people first.

Yup, no right.

Not sure if you are being sarcastic, but many of the so called "humanitarian" efforts there are disguised military assistance.

Originally posted by MrAtomicspace

Originally posted by Corruption Exposed
reply to post by MrAtomicspace

 

Canada is a very diverse country with a large multi-cultural population. The Jewish community in Canada is predominantly opposed to Israeli actions, especially of their treatment of Gazans. On the other hand, the Zionists in control of Israel, also have a very big influence on Canadian politics abroad, especially on concerns that might affect Israel. Let's not turn this into a religious thread and try to entice people into getting off topic. The Israeli influence in Canadian politics has been discussed many times on ATS. There is no way that Stephen Harper and his cabinet could have influenced the Greeks to do this. Israel has condemned this waive of aid ships since day one when it was announced. I find it funny that people are trying to shift the blame on the Canadian government. Don't get me wrong, I know they were against the ships leaving, but it was not Canada who called the shot to stop all these boats.

edit on 4-7-2011 by Corruption Exposed because: fixed a word

It is not about religion, I am saying that there are a few zionists with power in Canada who can make such decision. It seems to me that the Greek are small fish for such decisions. Our PM, Harper, gets a good chunk of funding from zionists, it is really a game of interests.

I think the influence of zionists is overblown. Sure, there is some influence, but much less than assumed

Originally posted by smuarb

Originally posted by jude11

Originally posted by hxc408
reply to post by Corruption Exposed

 

Good. They had no business going there anyway.

Yup. No right to help anyone unless of course it's an illegal 'Humanitarian' effort that kills innocent people first.

Yup, no right.

Not sure if you are being sarcastic, but many of the so called "humanitarian" efforts there are disguised military assistance.

Yes, sarcasm.

These people were not disguised military assistance.

My point is that NATO can go in anywhere they desire under the cloak of 'Humanitarian'. But when a few people just want to help out, they are met with 'Good! They had no right anyway.'

What right does anyone need to help others?

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


I respect the fact that you are open-minded and do not display the ignorance that many have displayed when arguing your chosen beliefs in this debate.

I am not claiming that Israel is an angel or purely innocent in such matters.

I am stating that most are quick to judge Israel without really appreciating the unique situation it finds itself a part of. How many Western countries are surrounded by it's enemies?

If Israel does not use a heavy hand approach to retaliation, then it shows weakness and invites more aggression and eventually invasion.

Think of a pack of Hyenas surrounding a solitary lion, they will keep mustering the courage to snap at it over and over due to it's position and their numbers. It is a pychological game, the only chance the lion has is to lash out at them and remind them of its power. If the lion's stamina diminshes, the hyenas will seize the opportunity to finish it.

The problem these days is that media are the vocal chords of the Hyenas and it is the Islamic Extremists that are doing all the 'laughing'.

I always think of the 'Six Day War' when I choose to defend Israel against the onslaught of opinion.

The likes of Hamas and other psuedo Iranian resistance groups, can never hope to defeat Israel in a direct confrontation, so, smartly, they resort to capatalising on international condemnation of Israel's track record of 'heavy handed' retaliation. Our own media has become their weapon of war against Israel and they do not miss an opportunity to make any military act of Israel out to be far worse than it was.

Here, in the United Kingdom, you can join the army at the age of 16. International Law views anyone person younger than 18 to be a child.

The image we have of a person that is a child, is that of a prepubescent.

So, with that in mind.

If you take 6 seventeen year old militants with AK-47 assault rifles shooting at an IDF patrol and they return fire, killing all six.

The headline for the story could then be described as 'IDF FORCES MURDER 6 INNOCENT CHILDREN'

This is why Hamas use youngsters as the antagonists.

It is a win-win scenario for Hamas; if the youngsters manage to kill some Israelis, then they will rejoice.

If the youngsters die in the process, they will rejoice louder behind closed doors, but cry OUTRAGE and WAR CRIME to the media.

Regards, Skellon.

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


Yes that was my point, Harper is either pressured, or those people directly might have ordered the ship to return.

I think the influence of zionists is overblown. Sure, there is some influence, but much less than assumed

Trust me when I say the influence could be much greater than we can both comprehend.

Originally posted by Skellon
If you change your approach and judge Israel by it's restraint, you will soon realise that the US Military is in a different league to Israel when it comes to killing innocent civilians.

If the United States was surrounded by enemy nations that had proven in recent history to desire it's destruction, I am quite sure, the US would have reached for the 'button' several times.

My point is; Israel has a proven defensive military stance.

In 1967, Israel could have claimed territory many times it's own size when it was attacked on all fronts and pushed the aggressors back. Yet, it did not.

Israel has the capability to wipe out the surrounding Arab countries. Yet, it does not.

Had, Israel kicked out the 'Palestinians' decades ago, when it had the opportunity to, had it even claimed new territory as a result of the major conflicts, today we would not be discussing this, as it would be 'accepted' as being resigned to the history books.

So, by showing it's restraint, proving that it is not out to take over the Middle East, it has put itself in endless state of conflict and because it has the superior military, is viewed as an oppressor and bully.

Ironically, the situation that so many like to poke Israel about today, is a result of Israel pandering to the opinion and judgement of the world outside it's borders or being soft.

To those of you in the West; Would you stand with or against Israel in the event of WW3?


Regards, Skellon.

edit on 4-7-2011 by Skellon because: (no reason given)

If you look at the 1948 borders and compare them to the 1967 borders you will see Israel took alot of land that didn't belong to them. It's illegal to take land by force which is exactly what they did. If Israel were to wipe out the Arabs then they could no longer play the perpetual victim this is how they beg billions of dollars from other countries every year. After seeing how Israel treats others after they cry about how they have been treated I would be against Israel in WW3. The bad thing about WW3 is how the Zionist would use the Jews as human shields.

Our own media has become their weapon of war against Israel and they do not miss an opportunity to make any military act of Israel out to be far worse than it was.

I really think zionists have a much bigger say in media than islamic extremists do... at least western media.

reply to post by OrganicAnagram33


Agreed. I have always said this. If the Israeli's are worried about arms being smuggled- why don't they just search the ship and once they realize nothing is on the ship but food and aid- they can guide the ship to the shore and help extract the goodies.
Oh wait- feeding palestinians isn't one of Israel's priorities.

reply to post by tribaltrip


That's true.
But some ships might smuggle, although majority goes through underground tunnels originating from Egypt!
Majority of the ships just contain aid for the people.

reply to post by MichiganSwampBuck


u sound like sara palin haha
second

reply to post by dontreally

Is the issue giving aid to Gazans (who recieve more humanitarian aid than any other people in human history - a fact)

that is a lie...

America’s $84.8 billion in aid to Israel from fiscal years 1949 through 1998, and the interest the U.S. paid to borrow this money, has cost U.S. taxpayers $134.8 billion, not adjusted for inflation. Or, put another way, the nearly $14,630 every one of 5.8 million Israelis received from the U.S. government by Oct. 31, 1997 has cost American taxpayers $23,240 per Israeli.

www.ifamericansknew.org...

From 1967 to 1989 the UN Security Council passed 131 resolutions directly addressing the Arab–Israeli conflict

en.wikipedia.org... _concerning_Israel

its about time the world puts a stop to this Israel nonsense..

you cannot claim harsh treatment by the Nazi's then..

steal someone else's land and bulldoze the homes.. kill them because you think Gods thinks your special..

Aid to Gaza should be sent under protection by the UN and if anyone interferes ..

shoot them.

its about time the world puts a stop to this Israel nonsense..

you cannot claim harsh treatment by the Nazi's then..

steal someone else's land and bulldoze the homes.. kill them because you think Gods thinks your special..

Aid to Gaza should be sent under protection by the UN and if anyone interferes ..

shoot them.

You are connecting two opposites sides. The Jewish people are innocent, at least most of them, it's the zionists with power and money who need to be stopped. They are interfering with the aid to Gaza.

On the other hand, "Islamic" extremists are also screwing things up for their people. If they would be more reasonable, Palestine would not be needing aid in the first place. At least this is my opinion.

My 2 cents is, I see it as no government can afford to have individuals trying to set foreign policy. While these activist may feel strongly they do not speak for a country. The people, at least in principle, through their elected representatives of the government, have the ability to effect change via the ballot box. IMO no sane country wants to provoke a confrontation with Israel. The US, NATO and their allies have their hands full trying to keep a lid on their messes in the ME without a bunch of activists trying to start a war because they don't want to work through channels. They have been offered various means to deliver goods but they want to provoke a confrontation so they can be martyred for another bunch of malcontent activists in Palestine. The people of Palestine have peaceful options too but they would rather provoke Israel and cry about it when Israel hands them their butt. Israel isn't going away and the quicker everyone realizes and accepts that the quicker we can start to move toward peace.

The people of Palestine have peaceful options too but they would rather provoke Israel and cry about it when Israel hands them their butt. Israel isn't going away and the quicker everyone realizes and accepts that the quicker we can start to move toward peace.

Honestly I think you are right. They are fighting over areas so small its ridiculous. They should just work together and reach a peaceful agreement, that way everyone can be free to move around the territory and live where they want.

But the people who are in charge are creating all the mess, they're fighting for power.

Originally posted by MrAtomicspace

The people of Palestine have peaceful options too but they would rather provoke Israel and cry about it when Israel hands them their butt. Israel isn't going away and the quicker everyone realizes and accepts that the quicker we can start to move toward peace.

Honestly I think you are right. They are fighting over areas so small its ridiculous. They should just work together and reach a peaceful agreement, that way everyone can be free to move around the territory and live where they want.

But the people who are in charge are creating all the mess, they're fighting for power.

If someone were to steal your land would you work with them to a peaceful agreement? It's time for nations of the world to boycott and place sanctions on Israel and cut off all foreign aid to that country.

Originally posted by MrAtomicspace

its about time the world puts a stop to this Israel nonsense..

you cannot claim harsh treatment by the Nazi's then..

steal someone else's land and bulldoze the homes.. kill them because you think Gods thinks your special..

Aid to Gaza should be sent under protection by the UN and if anyone interferes ..

shoot them.

You are connecting two opposites sides. The Jewish people are innocent, at least most of them, it's the zionists with power and money who need to be stopped.

What do Jews have to do with this? Israel is the problem. Just because someone is Israeli does not necessarily mean they are a Jew.

And personally, I will blame the Israeli people too. Why? Because what their government is doing is also beneficial to them, and they have no plans of keeping their government in check when it comes to assimilating Palestinian land and culture. They live in a country where they are all conscripted, and as such, indoctrinated into believing the vision of their zionist leadership. There might be a handful of dissidents, as it is so in all cases, but the situation itself is in the hands of the state and nobody there seems to be objecting.

Originally posted by hxc408
reply to post by Corruption Exposed

 

Good. They had no business going there anyway.

would you care to substantiate that.. Bit of an empty one liner. They have every right to transverse a ship through international waters................