Finally. Someone with an answer. Thank you so much for providing this. I think that much of what you have said has been on my mind at one time or
another. The one thing we can know for sure about God is that He is making us figure Him out. We are here on faith and not fact. When the Bible
says, "Test all things", it is telling us our job. Sin and judgment are just as valuable as living a life of commitment to others.
Isn't this the point? Could God have killed Satan the moment He screwed up? Yes. Could He have killed us? Yes. In my view, God went one better.
He put us in a material reality where energy cannot be made or destroyed. In other worlds, we are here to work out our salvation until we come back
to truth. God says, "find it." Not only this, He gives us a book that must be examined on a spiritual level. Just like Confucius says, "I hear
and I forget. I see and I learn. I do and I understand."
Consider that we are all fallen from what God demands. Heaven is amazing and perfect. The Material world is not. It is a school. You quoted the
verse Matthew 16:19. What we bind on earth will be bound in heaven. What we bind in heaven will be bound on earth. Consider another meaning based
on the worldview of the day in which this was written.
Karma is similar to sin. It is a binding of actions to a person's soul. According to Karma and Dharma (law), we bind our actions according to how
these actions affect others. We must mind the Dharma (law and responsibility) and Karma is the process for releasing or binding these choices. The
Bible calls this sin and righteousness.
I am a believer in the fact that God gave truth to each continent. The idea of the Hindu avatar is our idea of body, soul and spirit. This is the
incarnation of a divine being (us) in a body (bio-mechanical suit). The Eastern religions and many others hold to reincarnation, as do I. In John 3,
Jesus tells Nicodemus that, "you must be born again." I take this literally. Baptism is a picture of our soul being baptized (cleansed) in the
water. The water is the material world. The other world is the spiritual world. Jesus told Nicodemus that, to enter heaven, you must be born of the
water and spirit. In other words, you must be baptized many times until you find the key to spirit. The key is love. If you bind sin on earth, you
are bound here. If you loose sin on earth, you are free to enter Heaven.
Go back a few posts and read my view on gaining union with the spirit. This is the simple idea that our mothers womb is only one womb we enter. The
earth is another. Since we fell in heaven, as did Satan, we must be born again and do it all over again. This ties your ideas together so they make
Let me know what you think of my perspective. What you have said so far has been very thought provoking.
Originally posted by wx4caster
reply to post by SuperiorEd
Hopefully the OP will read this and hear it through, you ask for a short answer to a long question, that is not likely going to produce decent
responses. Before i start, i am not here to be grammatically correct, i may mispell or choose not to capitolize things like i or god and such. be
i have done much research and thinking into god, the bible, what it says what it means. not just the holy bible as in KJV or NIV or such, but also
other books. pearl of great price and the book of mormon and so on. i feel that it is important to do so when trying to percieve the bible in an
analytical mannor, not on the basis of faith.
if you react on faith alone, then there is no argument. when it comes to faith, we are all independantly correct no matter what we believe in simply
because it is our faith. in mathews 16:19 we find
"and I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind
on earth shall be bound in heaven:"
the jewish equivalent or translation of the word bind was also found to be used in legal context to mean forbid. the next portion of this verse goes
on to say
and we also find the equivelant translation here of
loose to mean allow.
"and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven."
okay, so what does this mean? well it means that what we allow on earth will be allowed in heaven and visa versa. it is our faith, what we hold to be
morally correct and incorrect on earth will be used as the model for heaven. further more, the basis of good vs evil really falls apart here when you
individualize the reference of faith, and accept that each of us have our own beliefs.
so, how else can we think about this? well we can take the scriptures as evidence, and assume for a moment (if you arent already assuming this anyway)
that the bible is full of nothing but historical fact and it is accurate description of gods acts towards mankind. THEN, we can list those acts each
for morally acceptable or morrally inept and see which weighs more. hey! thats almost objective!
in an offhanded attempt to keep with the OP's request, lets leave the listings to you the reader and i would like to list a few obvious additions to
our proposed lists...
god obviously, according to the bible, did the ultimate favor to us all, by bringing us into existance. point one for god being a nice guy. on that
thought, make it 5 points, 1000, as many as you want, because other than destroying the universe there is no comparable act found in the bible that we
could use to meet this one pound for pound in the middle... or is there? when god created... everything, one part of this everything was (according to
the bible) (enter bad guy music) LUCIFER. who would through the entirety of the text plague mankind with deception and temptation, testing our faith
at every step... so god created everything, and it was good... mostly. the fact that all powerful god would allow such a creature to exist (he made
him) is definately points against. but it gets worse. when i try to bake (rarely) and i burn a cake, i get rid of it. (thats why i dont bake...) i
care about those who would eat my cake and i dont want them to get sick. god is definately aware of satan/lucifer/ w/e u wanna call him/it (or her?
jus sayin...) and continues, apparantly to today, to allow him to exist.
ok ok, we could tit for tat this all day long. god destroyed sodom and gomorrah, god helped joshua sack jericho, god flooded the world, BUUUT they
were gods enemys and they were sinful... so was it a good act or at least justifyable?
in the end, when one looks at the true nature of god, when you combine the events from the old and new testament, i personally have found the god
described there to be neither good nor evil. (oh no? what?!) its true.
god is wrathful towards the wicked. god has destroyed the whole lot of mankind to start fresh. he has started wars and ended civilizations over his
anger and jealousy, yet he has also made the ultimate sacrifice to save us all. and i think (or hope) that if you really study the acts of good vs
evil, there is no real good or evil act when it comes to the bible, just actions based on a condition. god is good or evil dependant on whose side you
now, if you want a real thinker, how about this.
What is the extent of gods knowledge and capability if there is one? and how would you support your assertion