A possible solution to the U.S. debt to China...

Morning, gang. Here in the land of the ...um...free, we all know that this weekend is a biggie. Every six weeks (sometimes more often) we have holidays here, but this one is renowned for its excessive use of a product solely manufactured in China.

Yesterday my husband and I went to a fireworks stand - a rather large one - and it occurred to me as we were waiting in line with our modest selection of ground bloom flowers and lady fingers....(we get them for the dogs - it's their fave holiday)...

Nation, suppose we tell China, "You know what? We have decided and hereby declare that the one, indeed the only thing we want to import from you is FIREWORKS. Nothing else. Zip.

And each year, ALL of the proceeds from fireworks sales will go DIRECTLY to our debt with you. Deal? Cool. Good. We'll start right now."

Seriously, how many bazillions of bucks do we-the-people spend on these dangerous, noisy, trash-depositing explosives? I'm not saying I don't enjoy watching my dog bark under water when we toss an H-Bomb into the tub out back, nor that I refuse to watch the huge displays that my neighbors from time to time put on...

although I could certainly live without "aerial bombs" and "firecrackers." (BTW, What's the big fascination with NOISE, fellas?? Sheesh.)

But, fireworks are used at LOTS of venues aside from this major holiday. Ball parks, concerts, you name it...

So. What do you think Team ATS?
Should we-the-peeps encourage Congress to tell China "Okay, we owe you too much already. Stop sending us your crap, everything except the fireworks. And we'll collect all the money from their sale and send it to you. We estimate the debt will be settled in about five years."


--WT
(And yes, this was an original idea. But I won't be surprised if it has been thunk up by someone else somewhere. Heh.)

reply to post by wildtimes


It would never work. Besides the cost of fireworks going through the roof, you have to think about all the fires that would and are started every year by fireworks. That alone would negate the cost.

Nice thinking outside the box, though.

Well....good point. BUT -- if we had a price-freeze on them - same cheapo stuff as now, AND the fires and injuries provide WORK for people right here....we don't set the proceeds from fireworks aside earmarked for damage control, do we?

heh. oh well. If it was my household budget I was trying to balance, that's how I'd go about it....one item at a time.
But thanks for helping think it through!

Cheers! (Careful out there, btw)
BANG BANG! Ratatattat!!

your econonmy can no longer support itself. If you restricted cheap goods coming into your country your standard of living would drop a lot....

Humankind was bread to make war on each other, and the flashes and explosions are reminiscent of battles past. Plus, American celebrate the Day of Freedom from the British Empire by blowing up a small part of America. We like things that go "boom."

It is great to see people actually starting to think about these problems and put up solutions. Ok, tell China enough with the crap (except fireworks), you stop sending money over there for goods and Wallmart falls over as it runs out of stock. You can then either find some other third world nation with workers for a dollar a day or reinvest in your own manufacturing. With automation and robotic technology reaching maturity and as a big driver in the workforce, ongoing costs would be very low. Not sure if it is commercially viable enough yet, but price point between machine and man should be breaking sometime soon. With a manufacturing base re-established you can start sending out your crap again to the rest of the world, make some more bucks and get back in the black

Realistically I do not see any sudden changes to trade between the US and China. Maybe if the US defaults then China may say no more crap for you.

Op, you are obviously ignorant to the fact that everything you buy is imported. Only buying fireworks will not solve anythiing. Do yourself a favor and next time you shop check your labels and see if anything beyond food is made in the U.S. The only way you can solve the debt is by placing an import tax on all companies in the U.S. that choose to sell imports instead of products made in the us. This in turn will either cut the profit margin on those products or the idiot americans who still aren't awake will be forced to pay higher prices for their imported goods. Those idiot americans will not be able to afford their chinese products anymore and the corporations will start to suffer. Soon enough all those american outsource companies will come back and manufacture here. The gov't. has to do two things: Lower the corporate tax rate, and place a substantial import tax on goods. The corporate tax rate should be significantly less than the import tax rate. My idea.

reply to post by wildtimes


Most fireworks in the US consumed by consumers (those stands) are made in the USA. You can check the packages, but the most used brands like TNT, Blackcat etc are all manufactured by Americans in America.

Most of the Chinese fireworks won't just say "made in China" they'll often have Chinese writing on them.

www.stltoday.com...

This article talks about the percentage of 4th of July items we consume that are made in the USA or over seas.

Most surprising to me is flags, 90% still made in the USA.

If you want to be extra-patriotic then check the package you're purchasing and make sure it's American. Odds are you won't have to forgo the biggest best fireworks, because those will be made in America. Another interesting tidbit is that firework displays put on by cities are almost all American made fireworks.

reply to post by kwakakev


Ahh, but you see....I've been thinking on these problems for a LLLlllooonnnng time.

As for Walmart - well, I don't shop there anyway. In fact I "shop" for very, very little. I make do with what I have. My trash pickup volume on a weekly basis is about 1/5 of what each of my neighbors puts out on the curb. I recycle. I cook at home.

If, when occasionally I need a piece of clothing that has not been given to me by someone who previously used it, I generally go to a thrift shop. If I need "new" items at whatever discount store, I always buy the stuff made in USA.

My vehicles are ALL paid for in full. I walk to the bank. Yes, I pay for internet connection and a cell phone, and I have pets, for whom I provide food and veterinary care. That is about the extent of my "luxury" spending. Am I content with that lifestyle? Exceptionally. I visit libraries for movies and books. I spend most of my time outdoors at home, reading or writing, or walking or gardening.I do my own housekeeping. I don't use an automatic dishwasher.

It has long (for years) been my opinion that the USA needs to STOP behaving as though every freaking thing we acquire is expendable. It is a throw-away society. It is shameful, wasteful, ignorant, and lazy.

I believe there should be a complete moratorium on new construction of buildings of any kind until EVERY STANDING BUILDING, whether high-rise or lowly farm shack - is rehabilitated and occupied, or deconstructed and its materials reused.

I live in an established area that was annexed into a metropolitan area. I don't live in the shiny burbs. My house is over 70 years old. I use reclaimed materials to repair and maintain it whenever possible. I look for "freebies" and "yard sale" items whenever possible.
Furthermore, I eat in general ONE balanced meal a day. Perhaps 2 days in 7 I eat a second, earlier meal. I am not obese. I don't pay for lawn service or car washes or lessons or vacations. If I can't afford something, I save up for it. The only debt I have is a student loan and a very modest mortgage. I have never been late on the mortgage. My student loan is in hardship deferment at the moment.


To purplemur ---------------

Our standard of living NEEDS to be adjusted for reality.

To all who have responded, thanks for paying the thread a moment's time. It was actually a sort of comedic whim...but I thought I'd throw the idea out there. I've never really been an inside-the-box thinker, and I'm notorious for opening my mouth when others would not....anyhow, I do what I can to sustain my lifestyle on a very small budget. And I think about this stuff ALL THE TIME.

Cheers!
-WT

reply to post by BigJoninTexas


Ignorant, am I? See my post above. I buy exclusively things made in USA when available. I read ALL labels before I purchase. At the local fireworks stand yesterday I read the packages on every one of the items I looked at. EVERY ONE said "Made In China", even the ones with so-called American brand names. (I didn't look at Black Cat because I detest fireCRACKERS in general.)

Kindly refrain from labeling me! ... you don't know anything about my background or shopping habits. But thanks for posting.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Cool, I'll check into it. Thanks for the heads up.

Peeps, please remember the OP was meant rather tongue-in-cheek. I guess we're not in the mood for comic relief today.

sigh.

reply to post by autowrench


"we" being ... uh... guys?
thanks for the comment though!
any little bit of insight into the male psyche helps.

reply to post by Rockpuck

Most fireworks in the US consumed by consumers (those stands) are made in the USA. You can check the packages, but the most used brands like TNT, Blackcat etc are all manufactured by Americans in America.

I just found this on the Black Cat website:

The manufacture and distribution of the Product Line is being managed by Shiu Fung Fireworks, a division on Li & Fung, who is now a $6 billion publicly traded company in Hong Kong. Over the past couple of years, Shiu Fung has invested heavily in its infrastructure and now oversees the operations of its certified factories from its state-of-the art facilities in Liuyang, China.

www.blackcatfireworks.com...

EDIT TO ADD THIS FROM THE SITE AS WELL:

A division of the multi-billion dollar Li & Fung Corporation, Shiu Fung Fireworks, Ltd. manages the production of the Black Cat® brand of Fireworks in dozens of factories throughout China. The Supply Chain Management techniques developed and perfected by Li & Fung are uniquely used by Shiu Fung in the Fireworks industry.

How does that add up then if it's a Hong Kong enormous global scale company?
Not trying to be a smarta$$....can you explain it more? (I'm feeling lazy today - but I DID go and look at EVERY package we bought, and every one says Made In China. The ONLY exception is that my husband disposed of the Black Cat wrapper yesterday, hence I went to their site.) I'm confused. Not "ignorant", confused.

Does that mean the Chinese are paying Americans a living wage right here when they have all these factories all over China and cheaper labor there?
Publicly traded...so, anyone who buys stock gets a chunk, I get that part. But I don't play the stock market either.

Okay, final remark.
I dug the Black Cat wrapper out of the rubbish, uncrumpled it and smoothed it out.
MADE IN CHINA

reply to post by autowrench


Sorry, America never gained its freedom. It's all an illusion.

two

reply to post by wildtimes


Black-cat produces fireworks in the USA, the UK and China. The company that owns them also owns several manufacturers that produce and ship all over the world.

In 2010, the U.S. imported $190.7 million in fireworks from China. That represents the bulk of all U.S. fireworks imports and puts China close to U.S. fireworks production, valued at $231 million in 2007. U.S. makers exported $37.0 million worth of fireworks in 2010.
Also in 2010, the U.S. imported $3.2 million of American flags. Most, $2.8 million worth, came from China, a first toehold in the $150 million domestic market for the Stars and Stripes, which American makers still command. U.S. exports were far lower, with the nation exporting only $486,026 in U.S. flags in 2010, a majority of which were purchased in Mexico.

If you're at a fireworks stand and you see made in china and made in USA -- buy USA. At the very least, if not just to spite the Chinese, people should picture the children handling black powder all day, loosing limbs in explosions and so forth.

A friend of mine who's a nerd in trivia info tells me a lot of the big US production is used in shows, not over the counter.

That's especially worrying since, according the American Pyrotechnic Association, 98 percent of fireworks used in backyards and front lawns across America are manufactured in China.

www.newsweek.com...

Well that's just sad We are still technically the largest producer of fireworks, but apparently nothing you and I can use.

reply to post by wildtimes

Should we-the-peeps encourage Congress to tell China "Okay, we owe you too much already. Stop sending us your crap, everything except the fireworks. And we'll collect all the money from their sale and send it to you. We estimate the debt will be settled in about five years."

When Chinese goods don't cross our borders, their soldiers will.

the way you are putting it is like the USA seizing the profits of fireworks sellers , but only the sales of made-in-China products...
sounds right up the Obama line of thought


i think you might mean the levy of a Tariff--- a tax paid on imported goods., in this case: Chinese pyrotechnics

Carter tried wage & price controls way back when... seizing the sales of Chinese fireworks would be a more severe level of this same type of market control

China almost went to war with us when we forced them to revalue their currency from 8 Yuan to 1 dollar, to 6 Yuan to 1 dollar.

The Trillion we owe them immediately lost a good chunk of what we have to pay them back.

Hence why their submarine launched a ballistic missile 30 miles off the coast of California. They're mad.

reply to post by St Udio


I'm not a fan of Obama, or ANYONE in Congress, to tell you honestly. I am worried about the enormous debt hanging over every one of our heads. If China is the big deal -- i.e. our indebtedness to them -- why do we not come up with a way to pay off that particular debt?

Are you implying that if we stop superfluous trade with China (the stuff we could make here, but don't) that we will be attacked? That brings up some very scary stuff indeed. It was just recently - yesterday? - I saw a MSM headline saying there is talk of revitalizing American manufacturing. I think that would help. But, I'm no economist or political scientist. I'm just worried about my kids' future quality of life. And my hypothetical grandkids.

I dunno. I was just thinking of ways to settle our debts. I do that at home too...."what can I sell?" "what services can I offer in exchange for goods I need?" ....ya know, that kind of thinking.

EDIT to add extra thoughts and correct punctuation.