reply to post by gunshooter
Not everybody uses forums like this to seek attention or any other form of personal self-gratification. Pouring your heart out to an
anonymous crowd is a lot easier and more constructive than talking to people whose reactions and personal opinions mean something to
you. Also, I see this medium as a perfectly viable method of honest collaboration among like minded, educated, experienced or otherwise intelligent
people.
While you alluded to the fact that the OP's situation can't be proven, it also, cannot be disproven or connected to a certain individual
specifically. With that said, there should be no harm in sharing personal issues with an online community, provided no personal details linking the
OP to the incident are given.
And THAT'S my opinion. As is the purpose of this forum: the sharing of opinions and insights.
I Shot Someone, page 11
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 10:44 AM by budski
reply to post by gunshooter
See my post just below yours.
I kept this private for years - not even my family knew about it.
Perhaps I am wrong, but I felt a unique ATS perspective could help the cathartic process, especially in light of the fact there are many combat vets on here.
It affected my whole philosophy of how I viewed life, and turned me into something of a pacifist and an anti-gun "nut"
It's completely up to you to think whatever you like about my motivations, but as I said previously, this is a cathartic process for me and I have not sought for anyones approval.
See my post just below yours.
I kept this private for years - not even my family knew about it.
Perhaps I am wrong, but I felt a unique ATS perspective could help the cathartic process, especially in light of the fact there are many combat vets on here.
It affected my whole philosophy of how I viewed life, and turned me into something of a pacifist and an anti-gun "nut"
It's completely up to you to think whatever you like about my motivations, but as I said previously, this is a cathartic process for me and I have not sought for anyones approval.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 10:44 AM by Shamatt
reply to post by budski
Mate, there is a formula. If you come under fire you return fire.
You hadn't chosen to be in that place at that time. You were put there. You reacted exactly as you should have done. Would feel any different if you had shot someone of 20 years? 40 years? 60 years? Why would you feel different? Your emotions led you to quit the forces after the event - why did you join? Did you love your job before this?
I think you need to look at any resentment you may have towards this event. What do you work as now? Has this left you feeling like you lost your job that you loved and now you are working a cr@p job for cr@p money.......
The guy you killed picked up his gun and took his chance. You played your part in his story just as he has played his part in your story. Perhaps it gives him, or his death some meaning if your story goes on to be a good one. Perhaps in time you will see him as the person who kickstarted your success?
Mate, there is a formula. If you come under fire you return fire.
You hadn't chosen to be in that place at that time. You were put there. You reacted exactly as you should have done. Would feel any different if you had shot someone of 20 years? 40 years? 60 years? Why would you feel different? Your emotions led you to quit the forces after the event - why did you join? Did you love your job before this?
I think you need to look at any resentment you may have towards this event. What do you work as now? Has this left you feeling like you lost your job that you loved and now you are working a cr@p job for cr@p money.......
The guy you killed picked up his gun and took his chance. You played your part in his story just as he has played his part in your story. Perhaps it gives him, or his death some meaning if your story goes on to be a good one. Perhaps in time you will see him as the person who kickstarted your success?
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 10:45 AM by Misterlondon
reply to post by budski
your comments on your thread concerning the royal wedding seem to suggest otherwise..
but im not looking for an argument, with you budski. its just something i noticed...
back on topic, when you join the army and are training, dont they prepare you for the eventuality, that you might have to kill someone? surely every soldier should be prepared for this outcome?
obviously i know thinking about something and doing it are 2 different things.. but it is a valid question..
do they prepare you for this? and do they provide some sort of counciling for those that find it difficult to come to terms with?
I have never said I hate the royal family.
I just think they are an anachronism, and an expensive one at that.
This also didn't happen yesterday - it happened a good few years ago, and only recently have I recognised and sought counselling for PTSD. Like I said before, it's a cathartic process, I neither want nor have asked for anyones approval.
your comments on your thread concerning the royal wedding seem to suggest otherwise..
but im not looking for an argument, with you budski. its just something i noticed...
back on topic, when you join the army and are training, dont they prepare you for the eventuality, that you might have to kill someone? surely every soldier should be prepared for this outcome?
obviously i know thinking about something and doing it are 2 different things.. but it is a valid question..
do they prepare you for this? and do they provide some sort of counciling for those that find it difficult to come to terms with?
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 10:55 AM by budski
reply to post by Misterlondon
Any form of emotional trauma is kind of swept under the carpet in the British armed forces for some strange reason.
It's getting better, but at the time there was very little in the way of counselling - which is probably why so many ex soldiers are complete nutters, and why so many end up taking their own lives.
I always found it odd that the services would spend so much time and money training someone, and then fail to spend an insignificant amount helping a soldier overcome emotional trauma.
Any form of emotional trauma is kind of swept under the carpet in the British armed forces for some strange reason.
It's getting better, but at the time there was very little in the way of counselling - which is probably why so many ex soldiers are complete nutters, and why so many end up taking their own lives.
I always found it odd that the services would spend so much time and money training someone, and then fail to spend an insignificant amount helping a soldier overcome emotional trauma.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 10:58 AM by deadeyedick
reply to post by Trueman
You chose to lay down your weapon and that is your path to salvation.when the feeling becomes too much too handle just think of all the souls will carry on because you chose not to keep killing.
You chose to lay down your weapon and that is your path to salvation.when the feeling becomes too much too handle just think of all the souls will carry on because you chose not to keep killing.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:10 AM by ofhumandescent
reply to post by Swanseadog
He went over there..............the kid did not come over here.
Self defense is when someone invades your country, your home with a weapon.
The kid was in his own country defending his country................bud went over there, like all the other drone pawn chess pieces we call soldiers.
Nobody should be killing anybody period.
Again I ask, when will humanity wake the frak up?
Murder, the taking of another human's life force is wrong.
He went over there..............the kid did not come over here.
Self defense is when someone invades your country, your home with a weapon.
The kid was in his own country defending his country................bud went over there, like all the other drone pawn chess pieces we call soldiers.
Nobody should be killing anybody period.
Again I ask, when will humanity wake the frak up?
Murder, the taking of another human's life force is wrong.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:15 AM by budski
reply to post by ofhumandescent
You see now, that's where you're wrong - the lad was from another country, and was across the (disputed) border running drugs.
I agree completely about the total wrongness of taking a life - that's why I left straight after, and why I am now extremely anti-gun and something of a pacifist.
I've stated this before - perhaps you should read the whole thread before judging me.
If you do that, and still feel as you do, then I can do or say no more.
You see now, that's where you're wrong - the lad was from another country, and was across the (disputed) border running drugs.
I agree completely about the total wrongness of taking a life - that's why I left straight after, and why I am now extremely anti-gun and something of a pacifist.
I've stated this before - perhaps you should read the whole thread before judging me.
If you do that, and still feel as you do, then I can do or say no more.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:15 AM by ofhumandescent
reply to post by budski
You are not alone.
Many of the ex Viet Nam Vets that saw actual combat and some of the Gulf War Vets are having a lot of emotional trauma right now.
For anyone out there that has never attended or been beside a gunshot victim - you are totally clueless.
And, I am partially clueless because the three I saw were, two had one shot each and one had two shots not a body racked full of shots.
The two shot victim proved fatal. The two victims that each had one shot will be handicapped for the rest of their lives. All were horrible to witness, absolutely horrible - one has no idea the trauma to the human body one small bullet can do to the human body much less a bunch of big ones.
Most people posting have no concept of being beside a fellow human as they bleed out and die..........no clue.
They're talking through their arse.
You cannot totally empathize because the movies don't even show how gruesome this type of death truly is.
The feeling of the soul leaving the body is also traumatic.
Most of you haven't a clue.
You people out there so gun ho to sign up................work a ER room in a inner city for just one year.
And that won't probably even prepare you for some of the stories I have heard from ex Vets and what they had to go through.
My husband tested real high in IQ so he never saw anyone hurt or killed, he was kept safe on a carrier.
The Vets we've talked to that saw action, one I was engaged to...........came back not totally himself.
On a inner soul level, taking the life force (murder) of another fellow human being scares your soul.
It takes a lot of courage, counseling and working through it.
I have found that giving some of your time over to doing random acts of kindness help lessen the pain..........become a big brother, donate time to a homeless shelter, something to better the planet and those less fortunate.
Love is the answer, everything else is an illusion.
You are not alone.
Many of the ex Viet Nam Vets that saw actual combat and some of the Gulf War Vets are having a lot of emotional trauma right now.
For anyone out there that has never attended or been beside a gunshot victim - you are totally clueless.
And, I am partially clueless because the three I saw were, two had one shot each and one had two shots not a body racked full of shots.
The two shot victim proved fatal. The two victims that each had one shot will be handicapped for the rest of their lives. All were horrible to witness, absolutely horrible - one has no idea the trauma to the human body one small bullet can do to the human body much less a bunch of big ones.
Most people posting have no concept of being beside a fellow human as they bleed out and die..........no clue.
They're talking through their arse.
You cannot totally empathize because the movies don't even show how gruesome this type of death truly is.
The feeling of the soul leaving the body is also traumatic.
Most of you haven't a clue.
You people out there so gun ho to sign up................work a ER room in a inner city for just one year.
And that won't probably even prepare you for some of the stories I have heard from ex Vets and what they had to go through.
My husband tested real high in IQ so he never saw anyone hurt or killed, he was kept safe on a carrier.
The Vets we've talked to that saw action, one I was engaged to...........came back not totally himself.
On a inner soul level, taking the life force (murder) of another fellow human being scares your soul.
It takes a lot of courage, counseling and working through it.
I have found that giving some of your time over to doing random acts of kindness help lessen the pain..........become a big brother, donate time to a homeless shelter, something to better the planet and those less fortunate.
Love is the answer, everything else is an illusion.
edit on 2-7-2011 by ofhumandescent because: grammar
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:17 AM by Shamatt
reply to post by BillyBoBBizWorth
You people are heartless.
The guy quit his job and changed his life because he was so upset about what he has done. Dos that not tell you something. If he was boasting abot it I would have said something very simmilar to what you said, but he wasn't. He is looking ofr peace - you are kicking a man while he is down and that is pathetic. You just want to carry on the hate while others are trying to get rid of it.
You people are heartless.
The guy quit his job and changed his life because he was so upset about what he has done. Dos that not tell you something. If he was boasting abot it I would have said something very simmilar to what you said, but he wasn't. He is looking ofr peace - you are kicking a man while he is down and that is pathetic. You just want to carry on the hate while others are trying to get rid of it.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:28 AM by Hawkwind.
reply to post by budski
The target may have been 15 but it was him who chose to fight and it was him who chose to pick up the gun. You may have saved 5 of your comrades lives by killing the guy for all you know. It was the right thing to do in the circumstances, if you would have allowed him to live it could have been you or your comrades lying on that floor. If there had to be blame then the blame would lie at the goverments feet, not yours.
You need to let it go.
The target may have been 15 but it was him who chose to fight and it was him who chose to pick up the gun. You may have saved 5 of your comrades lives by killing the guy for all you know. It was the right thing to do in the circumstances, if you would have allowed him to live it could have been you or your comrades lying on that floor. If there had to be blame then the blame would lie at the goverments feet, not yours.
You need to let it go.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:28 AM by NightGypsy
reply to post by budski
It's really not that odd, Budski. It has become quite clear in war after war that our governments view soldiers as collateral damage. They are a means to an end. Here in the states, that end is profit. Once you are of no use to them, they could care less what happens to you. I know that sounds cynical, but it appears to be the truth, just judging by how the U.S. govt. has treated our vets for decades.
The military is supposed to be used to defend a country...it's not supposed to be used to generate profit. I think many young people (at least in the U.S.) who join the military these days have failed to realize that most wars we've fought had suspicious beginnings or were initiated from outright lies; either that, or they enlist out of desperation for economic reasons.
I always found it odd that the services would spend so much time and money training someone, and then fail to spend an insignificant amount helping a soldier overcome emotional trauma.
It's really not that odd, Budski. It has become quite clear in war after war that our governments view soldiers as collateral damage. They are a means to an end. Here in the states, that end is profit. Once you are of no use to them, they could care less what happens to you. I know that sounds cynical, but it appears to be the truth, just judging by how the U.S. govt. has treated our vets for decades.
The military is supposed to be used to defend a country...it's not supposed to be used to generate profit. I think many young people (at least in the U.S.) who join the military these days have failed to realize that most wars we've fought had suspicious beginnings or were initiated from outright lies; either that, or they enlist out of desperation for economic reasons.
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:33 AM by budski
reply to post by NightGypsy
Fair points.
I also think there is a somewhat macho attitude involved, and there is a stigma attached to emotional turmoil - soldiers are supposed to be tough, and what kind of tough guy wants to admit to what others percieve as weakness...
Fair points.
I also think there is a somewhat macho attitude involved, and there is a stigma attached to emotional turmoil - soldiers are supposed to be tough, and what kind of tough guy wants to admit to what others percieve as weakness...
reply posted on 2-7-2011 @ 11:33 AM by clintdelicious
reply to post by budski
I've notcied you have some very mixed responses, but personaly I think it was very brave of you to admit how this incident effected you and resign the next day. Many people in the military who have the same experience fail to find the same courage and end up staying in their job where they struggle greatly with day to day aspects of the job due to psd. You defnately made the right choice for yourself. I hope that you dont blame yourself for the inccident and are making progress recovering from psd, admitting how you feel is a good help so I hope that you recover well..
I think its great that you shared the story and I have read all your responses unlike others who accuse you of not giving any info who dont seem to understand that its not the sort of thing that all people can just blurt out in detail all in one go.
I am not against people joining up at all by any means, but I do believe your story may help people consider the emotional dangers as well as the physical risks. I hope that upon your resignation you were treated with respect and dignity in particular for your honesty.
Get better soon mate Thank you for sharing the experience and your personal feelings as well.
I've notcied you have some very mixed responses, but personaly I think it was very brave of you to admit how this incident effected you and resign the next day. Many people in the military who have the same experience fail to find the same courage and end up staying in their job where they struggle greatly with day to day aspects of the job due to psd. You defnately made the right choice for yourself. I hope that you dont blame yourself for the inccident and are making progress recovering from psd, admitting how you feel is a good help so I hope that you recover well..
I think its great that you shared the story and I have read all your responses unlike others who accuse you of not giving any info who dont seem to understand that its not the sort of thing that all people can just blurt out in detail all in one go.
I am not against people joining up at all by any means, but I do believe your story may help people consider the emotional dangers as well as the physical risks. I hope that upon your resignation you were treated with respect and dignity in particular for your honesty.
Get better soon mate Thank you for sharing the experience and your personal feelings as well.
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