Some Changes To The Flagging System Today

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


and I just flagged this LOL .. thx you SO~!

2nd to be sure

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by FlyInTheOintment

 

Wouldn't it be simpler to just write a well thought out intelligent rebuttal in opposition? Then your counter argument would [if it were truly a well supported counter-view] should in theory receive "stars" from those whom you believe [Supposedly Silent opposition] supported your views and stance which would demonstrate the same thing...

No?

Comes as no surprise that SLAYER69 gets it. I can't star a post in this forum, but I can give you two We're first and foremost a discussion site. The goal is to promote discussion, which to be interesting involves point/counterpoint. I, for one, would be just as happy if all the flag and star stuff went away. From my point of view, I don't really care who, or how many, likes or dislikes what. What I want to know is, why.

Originally posted by yeahright

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by FlyInTheOintment

 

Wouldn't it be simpler to just write a well thought out intelligent rebuttal in opposition? Then your counter argument would [if it were truly a well supported counter-view] should in theory receive "stars" from those whom you believe [Supposedly Silent opposition] supported your views and stance which would demonstrate the same thing...

No?

Comes as no surprise that SLAYER69 gets it. I can't star a post in this forum, but I can give you two

We're first and foremost a discussion site. The goal is to promote discussion, which to be interesting involves point/counterpoint. I, for one, would be just as happy if all the flag and star stuff went away. From my point of view, I don't really care who, or how many, likes or dislikes what. What I want to know is, why.

I am on the same page. I italicized the most important point (in my opinion). I could not agree more! I would love to see points, stars & flags trashed all together. What are they good for anyway? They are opinions...and we all know all the worthwhile virtues of opinions.

I can not express how many times I have checked out a thread (one that I have avoided intentionally for "x" amount of time; yet inevitably do so) because it has been flagged so much that it warrants a look; only to discover that I wished I could be compensated for my time. Nonetheless, I understand it's purpose; yet deplore those that mistake a "flag" for a "subscribe". If I see a thread of interest, then I subscribe...and only flag after having completely grasped the intent, direction and purpose of the thread.

As italicized above, what is important is the 5 W's of agreement/disagreement. No praise necessary.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord
Nice touch, ATS Powers-that-be! Only once or twice have I had regretted flagging a thread, but it's nice to know I can act on that gut feeling in the future.

If you don't mind, since we're on the topic of feedback towards an ATS member, may I ask if something like the 'ignore' feature is thinkable for the future? I only ask this because in a couple of threads recently, a really bothersome poster continually posted the same argument over and over again with nary a grain of proof, and it got really annoying sifting thru to find the meat of the discussion. It was really nothing worthy of bothering a Mod ('cause it's not against T & C to be stupid and annoying far as I can tell-LoL) But it would have done a heap of good to my time frame (not to mention sanity) to be able to personally weed out the posts made by that person who I felt was impeding progress.

What are your thoughts on that, ATS Staff?

I promise solemly not to deflag anyone if they promise not to deflag me, but seriously does this rule have a time lapse limit?

It seems to invite rivals to derail a member if they are that vindictive?

Ie how many flags per member can a person lose by one persons deflagging?

Say a person has authored 1000 threads , can he lose 1000 flags all from the same person?

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


These are some very good changes. Change we can believe in.

reply to post by SLAYER69


ETA - everything below I still hold to, but I realised that in a very real sense there is potential for abuse of the 'disagree button' (which is NOT a 'dislike' button, as so frequently messed around with on Youtube and the like...)

How about this as a compromise - ONLY Silver/Gold - level contributers can 'disagree'.. What if their disagreement launched an optional survey window asking their opinion on the OP, in no more than 50 words? That might help the mods to garner data on the trending opinions of quality members, without the danger of star/flag manipulation by sock puppets.

That way, it's a perk, and when we see that a number of people have disagreed, we KNOW that their opinion is likely to be one of some general merit, so we can read it with a contextual backdrop, knowing that a proportion of the 'cream of the crop' of ATS members find this OP disagreeable enough to sacrifice posting rights in order to let us know.


*********

Original comments:

Well, I was just throwing ideas out there.

And come on - Slayer, AggieMan, YeahRight. Are you suggesting that the circular argumentalism and cronysim witnessed in certain forums, which has literally put several members off from posting in those forums for life, can always be countered by a well-thought-out argument? Utter nonsense.

Now in the main, I'm not one to shy away from an 'argument', and I've often spent a good deal of my valuable time (some would say wasted my valuable time) typing out replies to counter what I consider to be tightly-managed agendas from cronyistic disinfo types.

All I'm saying is, when you know full well what to expect from a poster (suspected sock-puppet disinfo shill) and you want to make a point without wasting your time and getting into circular arguments/ being goaded into breaching t's and c's (they're crafty), then yeah - I stand by my point. It wouldn't even happen very often, because those types don't actually author many threads, do they?!

They're just ever-present, ready to leap all over any threads which might expose info on particular conspiracies which fall within their remit

PS - don't for a moment think I'm accusing any of you three of being the 'type' I mention here. I'm pointedly NOT. I respect your comments and thoughts in general, and have often enjoyed reading your work. I'm not a crowd-pleaser though, and you'll know that some of my work is 'off-the-wall' and deals with unprovables/ faith-based topics.

So basically I don't care twopence about scoring popularity points by retracting my thoughts or trying to pat y'all on the back for 'proving me wrong'...

Love you guys though. Slayer in particular, your threads are epic...

I'll just end with a note to say that I haven't ever really subscribed to the die-hard ATS-as-cointelpro conspiracy, so please don't anyone suggest I'm being over-sensitive to the rules. I was just agreeing with what I felt was a nice way to avoid getting embroiled in the nonsense. And then I expanded on it a bit.

Best to all of you.

Fly.

the irony of this...

vow

i got banned just before this for talking about sock puppets on ats and how the flag system was biased lol

(& for asking why a certain thread was moved from introduction to a place where it'd get more attention - without ever getting an answer so let's just assume it was "just" a human mistake and that since most human have problem to admitting their own mistakes... that'd explained much of it anyway)

my denunciation thread made it to homepage in no-time... (to be removed even quicker... but not for no effect it seems now)

whatever, just saying me and all the (real) people that flagged that thread of mine on my banned account should get some credit for those changes... should not we?

you're welcome.

I just flagged this, but I cannot un-flag...

Can someone tell me why?

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


I don't seem to be able to unflag this thread. IS it time dependent?

Since I've never paid much attention to the 'star and flag' business, this change doesn't really affect me one way or another. However, the sock puppets, (or as I call them, 'the boys') will have to work even harder to spread their manure. Thanks for all you do. Peace, out.

I flagged this thread but am unable to un-flag it. Has this feature been disabled already?

ha ha! I came late to this thread and of course had to try it, but the unflag is not there for me either.
....... ohhhhh welllll ...

I don’t like this idea, it does not address this issue of not having a “negative flag”. All it is going to mean is that when a user with lots of threads has a disagreement with another user that user is then going to “unflag” any flags given to said user. In the end we are going to have people who will flag a thread for the normal reason and then once they see the OP say something they disagree with unflag it, based on a post rather than a specific post.

Out of interest why is ATS so again the idea of a negative flag alongside the normal flagging system.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


All ratings systems are open to abuse I guess but as web 2.0 grows it's becoming a problem that people are looking into solving more and more and a few good papers have been written on it.
Peoples rating of a post seems to be related to many things and it's a complex issue. One thing that does seem to be true though is that people who actually have to comment to rate / star something will put more thought into their rating and thus that rating will be more reliable.

So on ATS for example this could mean that you are only allowed to flag a thread, or star a post once you have commented on it, some kind of accountability i.e. some kind of list of users who have starred or flagged a thread might also cut down on people just flagging their friends.

Theres a nice page about it here, but there are much more technical ones around if you google link

Maybe we cannot unflag because it is board business.

I flagged a very old thread earlier, and there is no option to deflag.

But I flagged a thread from yesterday today and got the option to unflag.

People really care about this stuff?

I come here to read and discuss. Not to have my e-peen stroked.

Meh...whatever.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
I don’t like this idea, it does not address this issue of not having a “negative flag”. All it is going to mean is that when a user with lots of threads has a disagreement with another user that user is then going to “unflag” any flags given to said user. In the end we are going to have people who will flag a thread for the normal reason and then once they see the OP say something they disagree with unflag it, based on a post rather than a specific post.

Out of interest why is ATS so again the idea of a negative flag alongside the normal flagging system.

At the best, it doesn't even really matter. At worst, it provides negative feedback in a site where positive civility is mandated.

I think all the "downflag" proponents should start a site that allows that option. Maybe not call it ATS, but something different. Like "TSA". Yeah, that sounds like a swell name.

I tried to give you a flag then remove it, but it didn't work how sad..

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Maybe we cannot unflag because it is board business.

I flagged a very old thread earlier, and there is no option to deflag.

But I flagged a thread from yesterday today and got the option to unflag.

That's weird, I flagged and un-flagged this thread 100 times before today but, when I tested it today, it wouldn't work.

I checked a few other threads, and found one had the un-flag option and another didn't even though they were posted at about the same time.

According to SO, the un-flag option is supposed to expire after 30 days. Maybe its like the 4 hours they give us to edit our posts; just another fiction here on ATS.

My guess is that they still have some bugs to work out in the system and it probably won't get fixed until SO gets back from his 4th of July picnic.