Some questions from a Skeptic about Area 51

reply to post by Imtor


You should go easy on people who are new to Ufology, there's a lot to look at and it's hard for many to understand the key ideas. I just try and nudge people in the right direction, there's no need to fight each other about it.

reply to post by SaturnFX


There are no "holes" in the timeline of the invention of the transistor.

There is a real problem claiming our technology came from Roswell. The really useful transistor technology is the mosfet. All the technology prior to the mosfet wouldn't be useful in interstellar transit. So we are to assume the space aliens used crappy germanium bipolar in their advanced spaceship? Not likely.

Compound this with knowledge that much of the solid state physics theory predates the Roswell crash.

reply to post by gariac


Sure...kill Santa Claus!



Your right though, from a gradual improvement perspective, things do flow together, but stepping back a minute, you see a sharp incline in sudden information explosion over a short time...and although it does appear natural, a endless time of stagnation and a sudden spike in all things right after a controversial event..coincidently...seems a bit odd.

just speculation.

Originally posted by A51Watcher
Slight problem with your fairytale. There was an entire fleet of craft buzzing the US for the whole summer, not just one craft.
And they were clocked and recorded doing 15,000 mph and cutting corners on a dime without slowing down.

Those were the Nazi craft, obviously.

All with vaccum tube technology in 1947?

Yeah right.

For the simpler decoupling tech, it was almost all you needed. I did mentioned it crashed, right? BTW, the same tech was used during the Philadelphia Experiment - decoupling changes the local values for permittivity and permeability - you can engineer the values so that they're the same as free space, and the radar slides right around. Only there's those little drawbacks, sort of like what happened at Roswell. It took time for them to get it right.

But I'm sure after learning these new (to you) facts, you and Gary will adjust your fairytale accordingly.

It's obvious to me that you are one of the sheeple, unless you are a disinformation agent. Baaa.

Originally posted by Imtor
This just proves how little you know about the UFO cases thus any claims by you 'there are no aliens, wouldnt Obama tell the world' shows your claims are not to be taken into account.' Maybe make your own research through like the REAL cases.

Obviously the cover-up works well with you.

We didn't "suddenly leap forward 200 years". Einstein and von Neumann got a unified field theory out of the same development. Physics (at the govt level) jumped forward as fast as it did in the early 1900s when quantum theory popped up - only at the sheeple level, you got it doled out to you. That's why it looks so artificial - it is. No aliens involved. Just a big coverup.

By saying so you ignore all the cases and descriptions of humanoids, unknown chemical elements, then maybe people disable their own nuclear weapons according to you, all people are liers when describing or claiming they see something diffent from any military aircraft. Then again you know more than physicists, professors, researches, military, geologists, and all the mentioned are liers, all .. Ja ja have seen such ignorance many times only thing, it fails big time.

reply to post by Imtor


Whet does Geology have to do with ufos?

Originally posted by Imtor
By saying so you ignore all the cases and descriptions of humanoids..

Take that for instance. Why would an alien be humanoid? Most life on Earth isn't - life evolved elsewhere isn't likely to resemble Earth life, much less would the top of the food chain just somehow happen to look like people.

Unless, of course, it's a coverup by the government, in which case people would BE what the 'aliens' looked like, no?

Nope, if you'd wanted something convincing, EeepOrk, the radially symmetric starfish being from Zeta Reticuli that used levorotatory proteins would be more convincing by far than something that looked like a midget in neoprene. But that's really tough to manage using 1940's special effects.

reply to post by gariac

There are no "holes" in the timeline of the invention of the transistor.

I heard Japan did some early semiconductor research during the war but why would you need all the private open space of the desert around area 51 to develop semiconductors? I'm pretty sure it was mostly the "Nazi Bell" technology that was brought over after the division of Berlin. There was the Von Braun rocket works, the Horton brothers flying wing, The ceramic bearing jet engines, probably some advanced SIGINT equipment Fu fighters etc. and of course the scientists that developed the bomb. Wander around in the area 51 lore long enough and you can get it to fit most anything.

reply to post by Bordon81


If I interpret your post correctly, the idea is if there was alien technology that lead to the transistor, you wouldn't need the space of Area 51 to investigate/exploit it. The UFOers would clain they needed the space for security purposes. However, you don't need space for security, you need walls and guards. Plenty of places in the US existed at the time that could serve as the lab.

Those darn aliens didn't teach us well. The early transistors were used to drive magnetic core memory. Later somebody figured out you could use the transistors itself as the storage element. This was very clumsy in the bipolar days, easier when the MOSFET was invented. Oh, and what spacecraft crashed to aid that invention?

The "Day After Roswell" is a work of fiction.

Originally posted by gariac
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

There are no "holes" in the timeline of the invention of the transistor.

There is a real problem claiming our technology came from Roswell. The really useful transistor technology is the mosfet. All the technology prior to the mosfet wouldn't be useful in interstellar transit. So we are to assume the space aliens used crappy germanium bipolar in their advanced spaceship? Not likely.

Compound this with knowledge that much of the solid state physics theory predates the Roswell crash.

They use MOSFETs? How primitive.

I thought they'd at least be using spintronics or some similar quantum process.

i personally believe that:
1. as a race we would rather euthanize a luving creature and study it than watch and learn from it, as proven many times by pinnig butterflies to boards and the bikini atol incident "wonder what would hapen to pigs if we nuke them ? "

2. who knows if we aren't ? the american government would keep them cards close to their chest, theres nothing like having a "one up" advantage on your rivals they dont even know about

3. doubt its treated like a pirated copy of a film, if something like that DID happen im pretty sure the american government, who protect area 51 with a " deadly force authority" wouldn't let that go far.
for that very same reason lazar is still alive and roswell still to this day is labeled as a weather baloon.

if it poses a REAL\ threat then remove the threat, disclosure isnt coming so our own conclusions weigh heavy

Originally posted by myinfinity
i personally believe that:
1. as a race we would rather euthanize a luving creature and study it than watch and learn from it, as proven many times by pinnig butterflies to boards and the bikini atol incident "wonder what would hapen to pigs if we nuke them ? "

That's different, Pigs and butterflies are easy to come by, so they are expendable, Even if the alien weren't a sentient being (Giving it entitlement to LLAPOH ) it's still more useful while alive.

Originally posted by myinfinity

2. who knows if we aren't ? the american government would keep them cards close to their chest, theres nothing like having a "one up" advantage on your rivals they dont even know about

Can you provide any evidence that we are?

Originally posted by myinfinity

3. doubt its treated like a pirated copy of a film, if something like that DID happen im pretty sure the american government, who protect area 51 with a " deadly force authority" wouldn't let that go far.
for that very same reason lazar is still alive and roswell still to this day is labeled as a weather balloon.

(Fixed spelling for you) It's my understanding that they have now admitted it was a secret spy balloon.

Originally posted by myinfinity
if it poses a REAL\ threat then remove the threat, disclosure isnt coming so our own conclusions weigh heavy

No they don't, our subjective conclusions mean as much as the word "ehllejrfh". Only things we can logically demonstrate or objectively verify matter. I will accept the concept of alien visitation once sufficient evidence is presented, this will almost certainly require the integration of aliens into our society, of an official publicly announced war or alliance. I'd even allow for the simple capturing of an alien who's examination is published in peer reviewed journals.

Hi
Thanks for correcting my spelling, my mac is ment to but does a bad job at it,

The first point i tried to make is that as a government america haven't made the wisest decisions in the past and we all hear stories of mylabs and german scientists (who were treated surprisingly well ) and the likes, which does contradict my beliefs on the matter but i do genuinely believe that they would rather it be dead on a slab than sit and talk.
as for the second point as i said they would keep them cards close to their chest, at the end of the area 51 book annie jacobsen even states (not in the exact words) that america use technology that we wont find out about anytime soon, america are great at hiding things well. No government wants the opposition to know what they have or are developing which to be honest is understandable, but "supposed "pulse engines, night vision, laser guidence were all massive leaps in technology in 50 or so years, from vinyl to mp3, from post to e-mail ect will always make us scratch heads.

as for roswell, admitting something was a balloon is fair enough, but why all the secrecy and if it is all true why were people told to be quiet about a balloon.

To to conclude, i have agree with you about our subjective conclusions meaning little but i have to also believe that since the birth of the internet and the development of forums, chat, youtube, pocasts ect a massive community has been born and intergrated, our voice is louder than ever.

It's nice to meet you by the way

i think this is worth 500 millions....lot lot of money

Originally posted by myinfinity
Hi

The first point i tried to make is that as a government america haven't made the wisest decisions in the past and we all hear stories of mylabs and german scientists (who were treated surprisingly well ) and the likes, which does contradict my beliefs on the matter but i do genuinely believe that they would rather it be dead on a slab than sit and talk.

Why? Why would they rather kill it then keep it alive? Let me try to demonstrate with lists

Things you can do with a live alien that you can't do with a dead one: Interrogation, Behavioral study, REPEATED MRI and similar scans, Psychological study, Learn its language.

Things you can do with a dead alien that you can't do with a live one: I uh, ummm, er, (Crickets chirp)

Originally posted by myinfinity
as for the second point as i said they would keep them cards close to their chest, at the end of the area 51 book annie jacobsen even states (not in the exact words) that america use technology that we wont find out about anytime soon, america are great at hiding things well. No government wants the opposition to know what they have or are developing which to be honest is understandable, but "supposed "pulse engines, night vision, laser guidence were all massive leaps in technology in 50 or so years, from vinyl to mp3, from post to e-mail ect will always make us scratch heads.

What are they using it for now then? (And I'm still waiting for evidence)

Originally posted by myinfinity
as for roswell, admitting something was a balloon is fair enough, but why all the secrecy and if it is all true why were people told to be quiet about a balloon.

It was a SECRET balloon But really, it was a test for a secret spy balloon

Originally posted by myinfinity
To to conclude, i have agree with you about our subjective conclusions meaning little but i have to also believe that since the birth of the internet and the development of forums, chat, youtube, pocasts ect a massive community has been born and intergrated, our voice is louder than ever.

It's nice to meet you by the way

The popularity of an idea is meaningless also.

reply to post by Bedlam


Because you can't call everyone a lier and many people report the same.. Im not saying we have to believe these are 100% greys, Im saying there are likely ETs controling these UFOs because their movements are not anything even a Stealth or Aurora can do...

How they look no one can tell. But all is cover up.. cover up for what, for NWO? This doesn't fall under the many unexplainable crafts seen over the world and just like humans dont evolve suddenly from MONKEYS you are very wrong if you call this natural, the same way HUMAN technology doesnt JUMP FROM TODAYS TECHNOLOGY into LIGHT TRAVEL... for just few decades.

Oh I cant wait the truth comes out that these are not from Human origin, that the Ancient aliens turn true as this is the only option the Bible to be true stories, I cant wait until this happens, Skeptics will be shizzing their pants

Originally posted by Imtor
reply to post by Bedlam

 

Oh I cant wait the truth comes out that these are not from Human origin, that the Ancient aliens turn true as this is the only option the Bible to be true stories, I cant wait until this happens, Skeptics will be shizzing their pants

edit on 1-7-2011 by Imtor because: (no reason given)

Actually, we won't, because, unlike you, we're not afraid to admit that we're wrong when we are proven wrong. I'm not infallible, and I could be wrong. In the event of disclosure, I will show no hesitation or shame in my statement that, "I was wrong". If you will expect anguish you will be disappointed.

I think that area 51 is used for testing of secret aircraft and other machinery. I don't think they would be keeping aliens there. Area 51 is far too well known for them to be keeping anything of real value there now adays anyway.

reply to post by chancemusky


If he did tell you anything, He would be in Jail now, for releasing top secret information.