It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by semperfortis
4. I worked Internal Affairs for years
It is appropriate that in conferring the police with powers, particularly the power to use lethal force, that civilians have a role in determining the standards by which they are policed. And an independent civilian review board affords citizens with an opportunity to engage in that role by providing a venue through which to air grievances, express concerns, and voice recommendations.
It is important to note that for a civilian review board to be truly effective, it must be independent. That is, it must conduct an independent investigation of complaints and not a civilian review of an investigation conducted by a police internal affairs bureau, which would result in the illusion of oversight without the reality. The integrity of the civilian review board will derive from direct civilian review of police conduct, not a civilian review of police review.
An effective civilian review board ("CRB") has complaints investigated and reported to its board members within 60 days of having received a signed complaint. Within 120 days of having received the complaint, a hearing is held (usually before three board members), a decision on the complaint is rendered, sanctions are determined, and both the complainant and respondent are informed as to the disposition of the complaint. Due to special circumstances, the entire process can be permitted to extend to 180 days.
Professional investigators, an integral part of the CRB and whom its board members choose, conduct the initial fact-finding in a complaint investigation and submit a report to the Board. In some models, the CRB's executive director conducts the investigation. The seven to nine CRB members are representatives of community organizations (ie - ACLU, NAACP, etc.) and serve in two years appointments, while the executive director is selected by the chief judge of the 11th judicial circuit and serves for six years. The CRB is empowered to vote to remove a board member, appoint new members through a simple majority vote when a vacancy occurs, and petition the chief judge to remove the executive director. The composition of the CRB should reflect the diversity of the city in terms of race, ethnicity, and gender.
The position of executive director is full-time, while the board members are volunteers. It is imperative that the director be a tenacious individual for the first few years of any civilian review board prove to be its most trying. All board members including the executive director should undergo a training regimen before participating in the complaint process. Having current or former police officers on the CRB can be controversial.
Originally posted by Skewed
I would honestly like to see a civilian sting operation setup
to investigate things like this,
All of the real life ones with more courage then just posting on a forum, inevitably, and I mean 100% of the time, are the first to cry "Where were the police when my brother was shot" or add your own statement they are all identical..
Originally posted by semperfortis
I remember when I first decided to pursue a career in law enforcement; it was almost as a last resort. I was not what you might call a prime candidate; at least I never thought so. I was something of a renegade, a “wild child” if you will and the people I grew up with in West Virginia will certainly attest to that. As a young man growing up in rural West Virginia I had several “scrapes” with the local police, ran from them on several occasions and was even escorted back to my Granny on one very embarrassing and eventually painful day.
Then after college came the Marine Corps where I thought fighting was mandatory and found myself in the hot seat several times. Yet I made it out and got my Honorable Discharge.
There I stood, outside the base, a free man and thought; now what? I can shoot and fight, I wonder if the Mafia is hiring.
I came home and got a call from the friend of a friend and next thing you know I was being handed a badge and a gun and told to go to work.
The point to all this wondering is that back “in the day” having served in the armed forces, specifically the Marines, was almost a free ticket into police work. The thought process was the man or woman would have good discipline, would be able to take orders and could handle themselves in a fight. They were not far off in point of fact; because back then we fought. A lot.
There were no Tasers, no fancy OC Spray, no ASP Batons, just a pr24 (if you were lucky, a night stick for most), a portable that looked like a loaf of bread, your hands and your wits. Most times there was little if any backup available, so the portables, while useless anyway, were never really relied upon. You needed to be able to handle yourself, or you did not last long. Many left early on as it was not the lifestyle they envisioned. We fought and we won
However unlike today, the people we fought never pulled a gun, or rarely I should say as I had some interesting encounters, they did not knife you, they were just old drunks that would fight you, you would kick their butts and put them in the holding cell for the night, take them to the Magistrate the next day where their wives would pay the small fine, they shook our hands and went home until next weekend. We fought. Matter of fact that is/was how respect was earned back then. As funny as it may sound, they respected us and in a strange way, we respected them as well.
We fought, earned respect, gained a reputation and did our jobs.
Now we have college boys and girls that stand 50 feet away from granny and taze her if she does not comply. Instead of just walking up and slapping the cuffs on her, they gas her. Now how is anyone supposed to respect that?
The gradual change I have referenced is of course the sue happy people of this once great nation. The police can't physically assert their authority, can never build a reputation because the moment they lay hands on any one of you, you will sue them; and the liberal courts, or liberal jurisdictions will award them money and at the very least they lose their jobs or even worse, their homes and other possessions.
Yet they are still required by YOU to enforce the laws of their particular jurisdiction or again lose their jobs. What a funny little society we have that requires miracles from our police.
I have investigated incidents where a shooting occurred when the officer on the scene may have hesitated in the face of an obvious shooting situation. Luckily they survived and when I talked to them and asked why they did not draw and fire, their answer was: “Man I have a family”. They could have died due to the fear of a lawsuit...
Originally posted by semperfortis
Thank you for your time and I will gladly try and answer any non-leading questions you may have.