Why you SHOULD NOT support LulzSec

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posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 09:59 AM
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There are several reasons none of us should show support for LulzSec:

1) They do not actually care who they hack or who has the deal with the consequences of their actions. They do not actually operate like a normal hacking group. They operate on a public level, announcing their hacks and getting community involvement. They are what I would call "show hackers", and they are the worste kind of show hackers. Their attacks have no clear motivation or intention half of the time, it's all just for the "lulz". You may think LulzSec is fighting for your freedoms by targeting the real bad guys, but they are not targeting the real guys, let alone doing it for the right reasons. One of their latest projects is to hack government agencies and release damaging classified files. That is clearly their way of putting a little sugar icing on the charcoal cake.

2) Everything they do gives the Government more and more reason to crack-down on the internet, and it also gives them the proof and public support they need to do it. We don't often see hacking groups like this because most of them know to stay in the shadows, and they don't target massive entities for no clear reason, while in the process creating problems for thousands of innocent people; real hackers have more decency and wisdom than that. Furthermore, LulzSec has been connected to Project Honey Pot by members such as Boondock-Saint. If you really care at all for the internet and creating good change, instead of the change we don't want, then you will demand this group show some real initiative instead of senseless hacking; otherwise don't support them.

3) They are already using this recent series if massive profile hacks to cast an insidiously negative light upon hackers, meanwhile promoting more internet regulation laws. I am already seeing extended news stories in the Australian mainstream media that are doing exactly what I am describing here. They are playing it for everything it's worth and if so many people continue to show support for this group it will give us a bad image. We need to show some common sense, and beat them at their own game. You need to see past the disinformation, deconstruct it, analyze it, and build your defenses to resist their infection. There's more going on than meets the eye here. This is the digital era, and the control over information, and the flow of information, is absolutely key.

Here's a little poem I wrote for the occasion:


The misinformation will astound you.
The disinformation will confound you.
Just look around, it's hard to find solid ground.
The truth is buried in a profound mound of inaudible white sound.


edit on 22-6-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)




posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:08 AM
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I only joined ATS today and I was going to write a thread about this tomorrow but now I don’t have to because you have said it all. I could not agree more with what you have wrote, this group are not hacking to expose truth or fight against government corruption they are doing it purely for the “lulz”. And your totally right this is just the excuse they need to enforce their laws unto the internet the whole idea of Lulzsec makes me angry it is entirely irresponsible



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:10 AM
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Them and Anonymous are both obvious stooges of the Government to end Internet Freedom. I am sure they and Julian Assange all party together with the money that we give them through the CIA.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:15 AM
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reply to post by Anonymous Avatar
 




Them and Anonymous are both obvious stooges of the Government to end Internet Freedom.
Anonymous is a little different, they seem to have some genuine ideals, real tactical strategies are often a part of their attacks. But they probably been infiltrated somewhere along the line recently. I do believe they started off as true freedom fighters though.



I am sure they and Julian Assange all party together with the money that we give them through the CIA.
Personally, I'm still very skeptical about the whole Wikileaks-CIA thing. I don't know honestly, but they have released a lot of good information worth my support.

edit on 22-6-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: woah, spelling



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:21 AM
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I am waiting to see what they produce before I make a judgement of them. We all can go back and forth on how they are or are not 'CIA". Even if they did it for show... they sure received a lot of attention.

::sitting back and waiting::

JT



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:24 AM
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reply to post by Greenblaz
 




We all can go back and forth on how they are or are not 'CIA"
It is really not relevant who they are. What is relevant, is their actions. And their actions should not be supported one way or another, CIA or not.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:27 AM
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reply to post by ChaoticOrder
 


This isn't called the net for nothing you know.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:31 AM
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I think LulzSec is a government hacker group to infiltrate anonymous.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by smithjustinb
I think LulzSec is a government hacker group to infiltrate anonymous.
If that is true, then I think they have already accomplished that.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:00 AM
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Did I catch that correctly? You say these hackers cast a bad light on other hackers? As if some hacking is above other hacking!

Hacking is hacking and it doesn't matter what kind it entails, it is criminal in the intent of "Breaking and Entering".

All Hacking is Bad Hacking!

To get to the truth of the matter we don't need hackers we need those who can see beyond the "self" and step-up and admit the wrong-doings that surrounds them!



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:07 AM
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reply to post by Greensage
 




All Hacking is Bad Hacking!
Incorrect. There is nothing immoral about hacking into a system to understand how it works, as long as you don't do any damage. There is also nothing immoral about hacking as a way of freedom fighting, a way to fight against the corrupt system when there are no other viable ways. It is also not immoral if you are just hacking in a sandbox type environment for educational purposes.

EDIT: And it also not immoral to hack with the intention of finding and exposing bugs/holes in a system.

edit on 22-6-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:13 AM
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Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
reply to post by Greensage
 




All Hacking is Bad Hacking!
Incorrect. There is nothing immoral about hacking into a system to understand how it works, as long as you don't do any damage. There is also nothing immoral about hacking as a way of freedom fighting, a way to fight against the corrupt system when there are no other viable ways. It is also not immoral if you are just hacking in a sandbox type environment for educational purposes.

EDIT: And it also not immoral to hack with the intention of finding and exposing bugs/holes in a system.

edit on 22-6-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)


Then ill just come over to your house and break in and have myself a look around just to see what kind of stuff you have.....

Youre basically saying thats ok........breaking into someones house just to see their wares.......

Whats wrong with people today?



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:21 AM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 




Then ill just come over to your house and break in and have myself a look around just to see what kind of stuff you have.....
That is a dreadful analogy. I'm talking about understanding how a system works, not looking to steal your TV and video console. If you are pick-locking my door to understand how my super advanced lock works, then I wouldn't get mad unless you damaged my lock. For all I know, you were never there. But if I do find out, I might have to change my lock in case you rigged it. That is why hacking to understand a system can be damaging, when the victims know they were hacked, but don't know what was done to their system. They have to clean it out and reinstall everything, which can cost big money for large businesses. But in the end, I really can't say it's immoral to want to understand how something works. If you do manage to hack into a system, it's best to leave a message telling them exactly how you did it. They will probably still clean out their systems though. However, you have done them a greater favor by pointing out a flaw which very well could have resulted in utter chaos, if it had of been exploited by a more malicious hacker.

edit on 22-6-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:36 AM
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reply to post by ChaoticOrder
 


but its not a dreadful analogy........as far as the internet goes its the exact same thing...

You bypass and/or force your way through securities to get to whats behind them......

Translate that to the real world, its breaking and entering, just like the poster above me stated......and its illegal...


You may think its dreadful because you dont want to see it for what it is..........but as they say........

It is, what it is



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:38 AM
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reply to post by ChaoticOrder
 



That is called Theft of Intellectual Property and is Illegal!

Sorry, but this is really a thread about Morals now!



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:39 AM
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reply to post by ManBehindTheMask
 




You bypass and/or force your way through securities to get to whats behind them......
Yeah, but a criminal breaks into your house to steal valuable items. Hackers who do that are criminals. But a hacker who breaks in for the sheer thrill and educational benefits might just look at some code, learn from it, and then leave the system alone, without stealing anything.

EDIT: They probably would copy the code, but only for personal use.

EDIT: I guess it's a bit like breaking into your house and reading your diary, and perhaps even making a copy of your diary. But a computer isn't a living space for people, and looking into a diary is only so immoral because it's the personal thoughts of another person. Code is just code. Even if it's classified/commercial code, it is good for educational purposes and other personal use, as long as it isn't released publicly or sold.

edit on 22-6-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:51 AM
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Originally posted by Greensage
reply to post by ChaoticOrder
 



Sorry, but this is really a thread about Morals now!
Yes, I agree. We should get back on topic. We have wandered a fair bit from the subject of concern.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:53 AM
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It's better to die on your feet, then to live on your knees. It is a movement to invoke people to question what they are doing with their lives: consuming or living. You just want to be left alone in your little box that is the internet, your last bastion of hope, and to not be taken away from it. But consumerism will eat everything, including the internet in time, so you should be rooting for the movement, but your own fear is blocking it, as it is most people on this forum even though they spew out 'stop fear!'

Cheerio. Next case.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 11:55 AM
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Yeah, but a criminal breaks into your house to steal valuable items. Hackers who do that are criminals. But a hacker who breaks in for the sheer thrill and educational benefits might just look at some code, learn from it, and then leave the system alone, without stealing anything.
reply to post by ChaoticOrder
 


Im sorry man, but you keep trying to rationalize this.......or make it more acceptable then what it is......

It doesnt matter if a criminal comes in and steals anything or not.......if they break in and steal NOTHING, the cops are still going to arrest the person for breaking and entering....

justify it as innocent all you want, its still illegal.......

And even if you say "they are just goign to copy the code for themselves"

Thats theft of property that wasnt given to them.......so yes.......breaking and entering, AND theft.....




EDIT: I guess it's a bit like breaking into your house and reading your diary, and perhaps even making a copy of your diary. But a computer isn't a living space for people,


Youre right, a computer isnt a living space for people, many times its much much worse, because there is bank account information, credit card information, social security information, and many times information thats much much more important then the big screen in the living room.......
edit on 22-6-2011 by ManBehindTheMask because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 12:02 PM
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reply to post by OneLife
 


I would be behind them if they weren't just reckless hackers actually achieving the opposite of what they claim. They sure have a funny way of making people question consumerism, because what they are actually doing is generating fear amongst the general populace, that hackers have a complete choke-hole on the internet, with the power to infiltrate massive entities which millions of people rely on. Then the Government starts up it's propaganda machines, as it is already doing, and the use that fear of evil hackers to create a backing for internet regulation laws. Then we'll see what all their so called efforts achieve.





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