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New York Atheists Angry Over 'Heaven' Street Sign Honoring Sept. 11 Victims

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posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:09 PM
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Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by TheOrangeBrood
 


The city isn't pushing official religion.


Then why not just remain religiously neutral?

Void the religious aspect entirely.

There's really no reason to mention Heaven...

...These people were real heroes, why not just call it "Fallen Hero Avenue"...?

I think "Religion Killed Our Heroes Ln" is a much more appropriate name... is that okay? Or does the former make more sense because it is neutral?




posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:11 PM
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Originally posted by randyvs
Drummer
So what do you think about The fact that the atheists, views on this street sign, might be seen as assuming.
Seeing that Heaven can be considered, a part of ancient history. Not just a religous reference. I believe this would be the finding in a court of law. They would uphold the sign.
edit on 22-6-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


In the context of this sign nobody would look at "heaven" as being of any other definition. By referring to the deceased as being "in heaven" you're describing conditions central to the beliefs of the Abrahamic religions and others. I don't see how it could be perceived as a secular phrase in this instance.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:12 PM
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Originally posted by TheOrangeBrood

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by TheOrangeBrood
 


The city isn't pushing official religion.


Then why not just remain religiously neutral?

Void the religious aspect entirely.

There's really no reason to mention Heaven...

...These people were real heroes, why not just call it "Fallen Hero Avenue"...?

I think "Religion Killed Our Heroes Ln" is a much more appropriate name... is that okay? Or does the former make more sense because it is neutral?


Yeah, or you could do Atheism is the indirect cause of 9-11. All you have to do is look at the Soviet Union beginning the war with Afghanistan which led to US involvement in the middle east which lead to Osama Bin Laden hating America which led to this.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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reply to post by TheOrangeBrood
 


Why can't it say heaven? There are streets named after saints.. there are streets named for the Roman gods.. Why do the roman gods get a street but heaven doesn't?

Isn't a sign with any kind of god on it a religious reference?



edit on 22-6-2011 by DaMod because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:13 PM
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Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by Turkenstein
 


I object to what you said about Traditional "Sir" I never met a more inline person of the Atheistic persuasion here with'in these boards. May I suggest you revise your critique or at least stick to the topic.

Drummer
So what do you think about The fact that the atheists, views on this street sign, might be seen as assuming.
Seeing that Heaven can be considered, a part of ancient history. Not just a religous reference. I believe this would be the finding in a court of law. They would uphold the sign.
edit on 22-6-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


Are you sure you have the right guy? I looked back and did not see anywhere that I typed "Traditional" "sir". Don't try to instigate me, "sir." I can not revise what I did not write.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by Turkenstein

It wasn't given to the church, or a religious belief, poppy. It was a memorial, decided upon by those directly affected and they should be the ones who get to decide. A godless uninvolved person has no right to step on this memorial. Yes, even though I would not like Islamic sentiments being funded in a country founded on Christian based principles, they are. I, unlike the athiest, understand that a certain tolerances have to be exercised between all of us Christian or Islam. I would love to see the courage of these athiest in a country like Afghanistan.....


Ahh I see.
To you, "a godless uninvolved person has no right[s]"

Our conversation is over. Have a nice day, sir.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:17 PM
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reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Why don't you have a street named "Godless road" and then we will be even?

How about that?



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:18 PM
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Originally posted by Ryanp5555
So, you are saying that you are equally opposed and equally as passionate about Zeus Court?


I couldn't give 2 flyin' craps about Zeus Court, 7 in Heaven, or Mohamed St. However, if someone is against the 7 in Heaven, they should certainly be against, Zeus, no?



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:19 PM
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Originally posted by DaMod
reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Why don't you have a street named "Godless road" and then we will be even?

How about that?


You didn't read the thread did you?

You just jumped in - right?



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:19 PM
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reply to post by navy_vet_stg3
 


I would say that's logical.

However people have a tendency to pick and choose and only target specific groups (namely Christians when it comes to the average Atheist....) I find that part pretty hypocritical.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by DaMod
reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Why don't you have a street named "Godless road" and then we will be even?

How about that?


I don't want that, nor would anyone else.

How about we keep all religious sentiment out of anything funded by the public ? As it should be.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:20 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


No it was simply a quip at the hypocrisy of caring about wtf a street sign is called especially when it is being used to honor the dead.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by navy_vet_stg3

Originally posted by Ryanp5555
So, you are saying that you are equally opposed and equally as passionate about Zeus Court?


I couldn't give 2 flyin' craps about Zeus Court, 7 in Heaven, or Mohamed St. However, if someone is against the 7 in Heaven, they should certainly be against, Zeus, no?


Yeah. Did I quote you on when I asked about the Zeus Court thing? I meant to quote Drummer because he says he has been consistent with his views but has refused to answer that question, trying to claim immunity because his answer was in his other response (however it seems more like a tactic to get around the question).



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:22 PM
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Originally posted by traditionaldrummer

Originally posted by DaMod
reply to post by traditionaldrummer
 


Why don't you have a street named "Godless road" and then we will be even?

How about that?


I don't want that, nor would anyone else.

How about we keep all religious sentiment out of anything funded by the public ? As it should be.


That would involve renaming a lot of streets wouldn't you say? People would be getting lost all over the place!

Why do you even care what the street is named anyway? Is it only because it says "Heaven"?

Do none of the already existing and plentiful street names with a religious reference also perturb you this much because there are a lot of them...



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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reply to post by TheOrangeBrood
 


reply to post by Ryanp5555
 



Is there anyway we can keep this from going into the realm of the absurd? Atheism didn't cause 9/11 anymore than than Islam or Christianity.

And we shouldn't be seeking more ways to insult each other over our PERSONAL beliefs. Over a freakin' street sign.

This is pathetic.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:24 PM
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Originally posted by DaMod
I would say that's logical.

However people have a tendency to pick and choose and only target specific groups (namely Christians when it comes to the average Atheist....) I find that part pretty hypocritical.

That was my point exactly. Go back and read my other posts. My point has been that I haven't seen them get upset over Zeus Ct., Athena Ct., or Mohamed St. Funny how the Christians are the "tolerant" ones when it comes to this. I haven't seen Christians protesting those street names as vigorously as the atheists are protesting something with the word "heaven" in it.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:24 PM
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Originally posted by Ryanp5555

Originally posted by navy_vet_stg3

Originally posted by Ryanp5555
So, you are saying that you are equally opposed and equally as passionate about Zeus Court?


I couldn't give 2 flyin' craps about Zeus Court, 7 in Heaven, or Mohamed St. However, if someone is against the 7 in Heaven, they should certainly be against, Zeus, no?


Yeah. Did I quote you on when I asked about the Zeus Court thing? I meant to quote Drummer because he says he has been consistent with his views but has refused to answer that question, trying to claim immunity because his answer was in his other response (however it seems more like a tactic to get around the question).


Which question? Am I against "Zeus Court"? Yes.
What other fantasy scenarios would you like me to entertain?



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:25 PM
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reply to post by Annee
 


The spanish language was here before the english one was?

Maybe south of the border but it certainly wasnt here before english, nor was it here before the french.

I was using it as an analogy



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:25 PM
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Originally posted by DaMod
That would involve renaming a lot of streets wouldn't you say? People would be getting lost all over the place!

Why do you even care what the street is named anyway? Is it only because it says "Heaven"?

Do none of the already existing and plentiful street names with a religious reference also perturb you this much because there are a lot of them...


I've explained my concerns several times to several people in this thread.
You may wish to review it if you're actually interested why I care.



posted on Jun, 22 2011 @ 03:26 PM
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Sounds like some atheists have the same level of intolerance for other's views just as some religious folk do.

For that matter, sounds like they also think their way is the only way to truth, just as some religous folks do.

So, how isn't atheism a religion?


EDIT: btw this is a reply to the OP... didn't realize I am 13 pages behind
edit on 22-6-2011 by EthanT because: (no reason given)



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