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To graduate or not to graduate... is there an option?

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posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:06 PM
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Hopefully no one will mind my starting up a new thread on this topic. Doing a search, the closest I could come up with was in 2009 and it really doesn't address my situation.

So my 17 year old comes to me and tells me he'll be looking for a job this summer. If he can find anything reasonable that he likes, he does not want to return to school in the fall, but would rather take his GED.

His points are pretty valid.

He has no intention of being any kind of professional that college would be required.
He is better use to the family if he's bringing money into the house - even at minimum wage
He told me that he needed to take summer school to make up 2 credits he lost (for absenses) and that would cost $185 per class (which no one has), and if he doesn't take these classes he'll be held back as a sophmore... and he "really can't take 3 more years"
If and when he decides he wants to go into a specific field, there's always time (maybe? he doesn't read ATS)

The mother side of me started screaming (inside my head), "YOU HAVE TO GO, YOU HAVE NO CHOICE!!" but I stopped myself before I actually said it cause its not true - he has a choice. And if the words did come out of my mouth, I'd be lying, I don't agree with them. So I told him to go back to his room. For now he's grounded until I figure out how to deal with it.

I quit highschool when I was 17, also facing a 2nd attempt at sophmore year - both my son and I failed for the same reason - missed too many days... neither of us wanted to be there, in that environment with those people for no logical reason.

I immediately got my GED and set about raising my first child (born when I was 18, who actually did graduate this year but has no desire to continue education). While starting the family, I went on to take medical transcription courses - which I graduated from, and NEVER worked as a transcriptionist... though learning to touch type and reaching the 100+ wpm was totally worth it, "talk to type" be damned

For the majority of my working life, I ended up in administrative type positions (including but not limited to Medical, HVAC, Auto Body, Repossession, and various aspects of Wholesale and Retail), until I started my own wholesale business - that went well for several years, but then I decided I didnt feel like stressing all the time and working 15 hour days - so I decided to close the business and go back to work, specifically in search for the job that would produce the least amount of responsibility for the maximum amount of pay (that was the walmart years LOL and yes I made good money at walmart - I don't care what people tell you)

Due to declining health and some other stressful factors, I left that position

Now, had I finished high school and went to college and got all caught up in a career - I would not be any better off today - I'd still be in constant pain - I'd still be out of work - and I'd still be proud of what I accomplished

I know that NOT going to school makes me less "knowledgable" on some subjects, but thankfully I live in the age of the internet - I can study what I want - for fun - I don't need to profit financially to be happy - in my entire work history and experience I learned that only other people are made happy by my so-called financial stability - only OTHER people are impressed with letters like MD and PHD and WTF

My best friend did the same thing I did at the same time I did it, except she actually did graduate from high school - with her diploma and my GED we both got the same degree in medical terminology/transcription - we both took a job right out of that school and SHE has been with the same company now for 17 years - since I never been fired - I could easily have stayed with the same company for 17 years also - and most importantly..
SHE'S NO HAPPIER THAN I AM

And straight up, my mother is working on her 3rd career - She graduated high school and went first into the military - she left the military to have me and took nursing classes and became a psychiatric nurse - she was forced into early retirement in her mid 40's when the state hospital was closed, and then SHE went to the same school my best friend and I went to for medical transcription and has been been running pawn shops for like the last 15 years or something - so its not like there isn't time to do something else - she's living proof you can change your career at any age - AND SHE'S NO HAPPIER THAN I AM EITHER

What was my point again?

Oh yeah - How can I convince my 17 year old to stay in school when I don't believe its the best thing for everyone?

On ATS people often argue about things we've been "brainwashed" to do since birth, conform to society standards, isn't it at all possible that 12 years of school is one of those things they POUNDED into our brains that WE HAVE TO do - but in reality .....I keep remembering the scene from Dangerous Minds when Michelle Pfeiffer went to see the mom to find out why her kids didnt come to school and the mom says "I ain't raising no doctors and lawyers here. They got bills to pay." Is it possible that 12 years is just too many for your average, everyday ordinary Joe? Its not like he's the only one, I wasn't the only one

Anyway, thoughts on this issue are much appreciated. Its really hard for me to have an unbias discussion on this matter.... I would've LOVED to raise career minded children - but its just not going to happen. They are who they are, just like I am who I am....

As I previously mentioned, my 19 year old did graduate this year, and is not even interested in it - totally refused to walk - didn't want any parts of the ceremony - why? "cause its boring"....
edit on 21-6-2011 by Forevever because: I could not possibly type all that without finding at least one mistake!!




posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...


Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick.
edit on 21-6-2011 by Jepic because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:19 PM
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Im 25 years old and am done with the college thing. it was a waste of time and money. I started working in a warehouse from loading trucks for $10 an hour to five years later making a good wage and owning a home. If your kid is a hard worker then there is nothing to worry about.

Being in managment now i hire over hard workers and experiance over college grads any day. Plus the fact that he will now be bringing money into the house is a plus. Times are going to get alot harder then they are now! people are "bunking up" and consolidating two familys into one house. Its what has to be done to get by.

In this day in age. College is going to be usless. there is to large of a surplus of grads to jobs. People with special trade skills are in higher demand. I hope this helps.
edit on 21-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:21 PM
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reply to post by Forevever
 


Take the job if available. I have an advanced degree and no job. Money is for real. There are always jobs in retail and sales that require no degree. Be a used car salesman!

Work in a grocery store as a stocker. They like young workers. Sure, get a job and don't worry about it.

For self help, learn about auto repair on your own time. This is a valuable skill for your own use.



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:24 PM
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Originally posted by Jepic
Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...


Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick.
edit on 21-6-2011 by Jepic because: (no reason given)


WTF is wrong with being a plumber? they make GREAT money and its a dieing trade. dieing trade equels higher demand. you do the math.

A marine biologist. lol dont make me laugh. the world and markets are in big trouble. What jobs do you think the goverment is going de fund first? Ill tell you, marine biologists
edit on 21-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:24 PM
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I always feel that kids are missing out by not doing the whole high school experience.
Everyone i know that gets their good enough diploma always feel regret at dropping out.

School and education in general opens up doors to opportunities later in life.
You shouldn't pass up on this opportunity.



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:24 PM
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Originally posted by yourmamaknows
reply to post by Forevever
 


Take the job if available. I have an advanced degree and no job. Money is for real. There are always jobs in retail and sales that require no degree. Be a used car salesman!

Work in a grocery store as a stocker. They like young workers. Sure, get a job and don't worry about it.

For self help, learn about auto repair on your own time. This is a valuable skill for your own use.



You have an advanced degree and no job? Sounds to me like you might not be looking hard enough...



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:25 PM
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I'm a college graduate. Yet i have never completed my grade 12, or my GED. I would look into the requirements for secondary school, we have what is called being a "Mature Student", and the age requirement for it was 21 years of age. I didn't like highschool either, the reason i was so messed up throughout my life was because of the public school system.



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by yourmamaknows
reply to post by Forevever
 


Take the job if available. I have an advanced degree and no job. Money is for real. There are always jobs in retail and sales that require no degree. Be a used car salesman!

Work in a grocery store as a stocker. They like young workers. Sure, get a job and don't worry about it.

For self help, learn about auto repair on your own time. This is a valuable skill for your own use.



You have an advanced degree and no job? Sounds to me like you might not be looking hard enough...


It sounds to me you are ignorant of the situation and job markets



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:27 PM
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Originally posted by Jepic
Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...

Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick

Just wondering, how many marine biologists do you know?
How many plumbers?
Who is happier? Why?
How many plumbers do you know wanted to be a marine biologist (if only they finished high school)?

In my experience, plumbers enjoy their work - are actually quite happy - and live at higher standards than I am happy with.


Originally posted by camaro68ss
In this day in age. College is going to be usless. there is to large of a surplus of grads to jobs. People with special trade skills are in higher demand. I hope this helps.

This does help - did you ever want to be a marine biologist?



Originally posted by yourmamaknows
Take the job if available. I have an advanced degree and no job. Money is for real. There are always jobs in retail and sales that require no degree. Be a used car salesman!

Work in a grocery store as a stocker. They like young workers. Sure, get a job and don't worry about it.

For self help, learn about auto repair on your own time. This is a valuable skill for your own use.

Much appreciated - will pass along the info
its not me - its my son



Originally posted by grey580
I always feel that kids are missing out by not doing the whole high school experience.
Everyone i know that gets their good enough diploma always feel regret at dropping out.

School and education in general opens up doors to opportunities later in life.
You shouldn't pass up on this opportunity.


I wonder though, does it take 12 years to figure out the experience?
I'm also wondering how many people read the OP
We're talking about my son - I already did the drop out thing and I have no regrets
 

Please continue arguing over the Plumber VS Marine Biologist thing - I'd love to see how that turns out



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by Jepic
Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...


Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick.
edit on 21-6-2011 by Jepic because: (no reason given)


WTF is wrong with being a plumber? they make GREAT money and its a dieing trade. dieing trade equels higher demand. you do the math.

A marine biologist. lol dont make me laugh. the world and markets are in big trouble. What jobs do you think the goverment is going de fund first? Ill tell you, marine biologists
edit on 21-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


The government? Man screw the government. There are countless of bodies and companies working inside and outside of government that could use a marine biologist in their let's say research.

But yeah... Make him to the plumbing. I'm sure he'll enjoy that...



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:32 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by yourmamaknows
reply to post by Forevever
 


Take the job if available. I have an advanced degree and no job. Money is for real. There are always jobs in retail and sales that require no degree. Be a used car salesman!

Work in a grocery store as a stocker. They like young workers. Sure, get a job and don't worry about it.

For self help, learn about auto repair on your own time. This is a valuable skill for your own use.



You have an advanced degree and no job? Sounds to me like you might not be looking hard enough...


It sounds to me you are ignorant of the situation and job markets


But of course! I'm the one that is recommending being a plumber instead of getting a degree in aerospace engineering. I mean, they just get so much more money than the latter. Yea right...



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:33 PM
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I think there are a number of issues being conflated, primarily whether someone should just get a GED and start working, versus how this will affect future job or education prospects. You are certainly correct that many people can make a living just having a GED and be happy. There are some practical issues you may want to consider.

First, whether we like it or not, GED's are not given the same weight as a high school diploma. Getting into the military is a good example of this. Unless the situation has changed, you cannot join the military with just a GED anymore. A person needs a GED plus 15 hours of college classes. On the other hand, a person with just a high school diploma can join the military.

I'm not sure how your son's current high school is set up, but most have some option to get some sort of trade training, such as in carpentry, mechanics, etc. My high school was a comprehensive program where these skills were taught right in the high school. True, a person with just a GED could learn these skills on the job, but a person with a diploma, plus this training, is going to be more marketable.

I guess you need to ask yourself why would a person with just a GED be a better candidate for a future employer than someone with a diploma? You'll need to ask yourself how can a GED holder outshine someone with a diploma? Let's say there are twenty applicants for a job. Let's say all have the same basic experience and aptitude, but ten have a GED and ten have a diploma. Why would the employer waste their time with the GED holders? They can immediately chuck those applications and concentrate on those who earned diplomas.

It might not seem fair, but that's how brutal the job market is now.



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by Jepic
Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...


Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick.
edit on 21-6-2011 by Jepic because: (no reason given)


WTF is wrong with being a plumber? they make GREAT money and its a dieing trade. dieing trade equels higher demand. you do the math.

A marine biologist. lol dont make me laugh. the world and markets are in big trouble. What jobs do you think the goverment is going de fund first? Ill tell you, marine biologists
edit on 21-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


The government? Man screw the government. There are countless of bodies and companies working inside and outside of government that could use a marine biologist in their let's say research.

But yeah... Make him to the plumbing. I'm sure he'll enjoy that...


There are countless people looking for marine biologists? Who? What research would a privet company need on the ocean so you can "tour the world" how old are you kid? Sounds like a silly dream



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by AzureSky
I'm a college graduate. Yet i have never completed my grade 12, or my GED. I would look into the requirements for secondary school, we have what is called being a "Mature Student", and the age requirement for it was 21 years of age. I didn't like highschool either, the reason i was so messed up throughout my life was because of the public school system.

the Mature Student thing is interesting - I was unaware of it
but no matter - I have no doubt he can pass the GED - and also want to mention for the record that when I passed the GED they gave me a DIPLOMA - it does not say GED on it anywhere

I never liked school at any age. It took me years to figure out that it was the people I disliked though, not the education itself. But like I said, I got internet, I can study nearly anything I want now - why do we still need a piece of paper from an institution to prove we know it? can't we just take a test?
 

the marine biologist is bugging me...

what if I read every single available article and research paper available for free online about Marine Biology - wouldn't that get me into at least an entry level position in some kind of Marine Biologist type of field?

Like seriously, if I know that much about it, I bet I could get a job on presentation alone - no degree required.

I have no business degree
but I managed to put to use
all that I learned
through jobs that had nothing to do with
what any of my pieces of paper say I can do
(wasn't sure how to punctuate that)



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:38 PM
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reply to post by Jepic
 


Jepic, Strait up there is NO demand for these fantisy jobs your listing! yes it might pay better if you can get the job after searching for 10 years



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by Forevever

Originally posted by Jepic
Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...

Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick

Just wondering, how many marine biologists do you know?
How many plumbers?
Who is happier? Why?
How many plumbers do you know wanted to be a marine biologist (if only they finished high school)?

In my experience, plumbers enjoy their work - are actually quite happy - and live at higher standards than I am happy with.


Originally posted by camaro68ss
In this day in age. College is going to be usless. there is to large of a surplus of grads to jobs. People with special trade skills are in higher demand. I hope this helps.

This does help - did you ever want to be a marine biologist?



Originally posted by yourmamaknows
Take the job if available. I have an advanced degree and no job. Money is for real. There are always jobs in retail and sales that require no degree. Be a used car salesman!

Work in a grocery store as a stocker. They like young workers. Sure, get a job and don't worry about it.

For self help, learn about auto repair on your own time. This is a valuable skill for your own use.

Much appreciated - will pass along the info
its not me - its my son



Originally posted by grey580
I always feel that kids are missing out by not doing the whole high school experience.
Everyone i know that gets their good enough diploma always feel regret at dropping out.

School and education in general opens up doors to opportunities later in life.
You shouldn't pass up on this opportunity.


I wonder though, does it take 12 years to figure out the experience?
I'm also wondering how many people read the OP
We're talking about my son - I already did the drop out thing and I have no regrets
 

Please continue arguing over the Plumber VS Marine Biologist thing - I'd love to see how that turns out


Marine biologists? FEW.
Plumbers? FILLED.
Now tell me. Based on that, who do you think will have more opportunities?
Who is happier? Well, I bet the marine biologist is... Since plumbers are usually people who have had no perseverance nor the will to get through high school...



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:42 PM
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reply to post by Jepic
 


seriously, when was the last time you hired a plumber? (and what did it cost you...)
when was the last time you hired a marine biologist?

what do you do by the way?



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:43 PM
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Originally posted by Forevever

Originally posted by AzureSky
I'm a college graduate. Yet i have never completed my grade 12, or my GED. I would look into the requirements for secondary school, we have what is called being a "Mature Student", and the age requirement for it was 21 years of age. I didn't like highschool either, the reason i was so messed up throughout my life was because of the public school system.

the Mature Student thing is interesting - I was unaware of it
but no matter - I have no doubt he can pass the GED - and also want to mention for the record that when I passed the GED they gave me a DIPLOMA - it does not say GED on it anywhere

I never liked school at any age. It took me years to figure out that it was the people I disliked though, not the education itself. But like I said, I got internet, I can study nearly anything I want now - why do we still need a piece of paper from an institution to prove we know it? can't we just take a test?
 



I agree with you there. They never catered to my learning style that well, and i enjoyed certain subjects way more than others (Physics and Computers). But what i hated most of all. Was the people there. I could not stand being around most of the people there, during my 11th year, i just got up in class one day. I'de had enough, something clicked in my mind and was like "eff this" and i left. never went back. You can get into private colleges with a GED as well ( i think )



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by Jepic

Originally posted by camaro68ss

Originally posted by Jepic
Seriously? Is this even a question? To graduate or not to graduate? The answer should be obvious...


Plumber or a world traveling marine biologist? Pick.
edit on 21-6-2011 by Jepic because: (no reason given)


WTF is wrong with being a plumber? they make GREAT money and its a dieing trade. dieing trade equels higher demand. you do the math.

A marine biologist. lol dont make me laugh. the world and markets are in big trouble. What jobs do you think the goverment is going de fund first? Ill tell you, marine biologists
edit on 21-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


The government? Man screw the government. There are countless of bodies and companies working inside and outside of government that could use a marine biologist in their let's say research.

But yeah... Make him to the plumbing. I'm sure he'll enjoy that...


There are countless people looking for marine biologists? Who? What research would a privet company need on the ocean so you can "tour the world" how old are you kid? Sounds like a silly dream


A silly dream? You sound like the parents that say it is a silly dream to be an astronaut... Of course that is until the kid actually graduates from University with a PhD in astrobiology or whatever else, contacts NASA gains a spot in the company and is accepted. At which point your faces will have melted from all the determination your kid has shown. Now he is living the dream.

Anyway, there is lots of Jobs out there for a Marine biologist both in the public and especially in the private sector. I don't need to list them since I'm not after it at the moment.

edit on 21-6-2011 by Jepic because: (no reason given)



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