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Christians: You know who you are praying to? Not who you think

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posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:01 PM
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reply to post by Seektruthalways1
 


Where do I find that his name is what you say? I've never seen it in the Bible and everyone in it speaks of God, Lord, or Jesus Christ.




posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:19 PM
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reply to post by chrismicha77
 


It's Hebrew man.



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:38 PM
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First of all great post OP

Whilst I am just a humble member who joined up after 2 years reading what I thought were informative and cutting edge topics on this site, it is getting quite annoying of late to read good posts and have a swarm of folks feeling it is their duty to either go out of their way to post in contradiction or if they have nothing to contribute, simply slander the OP

this goes against what I believe are the T&C of being a member here

I have been researching this topic and other modern acceptable heresies in the church today since the early 90's, written some books on the deceptions running around, and will share with any who would listen, the truth of the power of the CORRECT name

its no good saying YHWH accepts any old name you wanna call him - lets see how long YOU will put up with everyone calling you whatever they wish, or applying the same ' whatever' nomenclature to your favourite band, car, etc - you would correct them I am sure

OP has ommitted probably the most powerful of scriptures in my mind:
Jhn 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, [even] to them that believe on his name:

also -
commencing with John 3 - 16 which we all know, check V 18 out!

Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Jhn 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

Jhn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

(excuse the names as I dont have the Hebrew keyboard)

so the 'church' has failed to educate the good folks who warm their pews - nothing new about that now is there? the word warns us against these teachers - we have to have right teaching and OP is correct by my understanding and 30 years of study (I hold 2 diplomas in ministry in case you need evidence of SME)

in answer to the works question - pistis (faith) without erga (work) is dead, being alone - the work is plain, "i was sick or in prison and you visited me, I was hungry and you gave me food, I was naked and you clothed me"

or to quote Yahuwshuah - "this is the work of YHWH, that you believe in Him who He has sent"

I encourage you to study this stuff further - it is important, very important, and should not be shrugged off or dismissed

here's another one - "and this Gospel of the KINGDOM will be preached to all nations, and then the end will come" - Matthew 24 something

guess what? Aint no Gospel of the Kingdom been preached in the enlightened western world - let alone "all nations"

why? Because it has not been taught to the churchians, and because the preachers dont even know it - of course they read it in the 4 gospels / parables but it goes right against the grain of religious thinking so it is like the seed which fell along the road, and the birds cam and ate it all up

be of good courage and keep digging brothers and sisters

cheers
edit on 19-6-2011 by Highlander64 because: spelling

edit on 19-6-2011 by Highlander64 because: spelling



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:50 PM
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reply to post by DerepentLEstranger
 


interesting thoughts on Saul/Paul infiltration concept - it certainly has some reasonable grounds
- Saul was a member/leader of the Jewish secret police, and very chummy with the High Priest and sanhedrin

I once read (and it was convincing) a theory that it was the Jerusalem Elders of "the Way" that actually turned Paul in to the Romans and wanted him executed (not sure if you can reference this on the net)

it can get quite confusing or unsettling for us as believeres since he wrote half the new testament, however for last few years I have survived quite well on the gospels,plus Hebrews, 1 Peter - Revelation, and the Old Testament.......



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 11:32 PM
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Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
reply to post by chrismicha77
 


< snip >


YAHUWAH = Means 'I am that I am', or 'I am He that exists' Exodus 3:13-16.

YAHU wshu WAH = means 'Yahuwah is Salvation'

< snip>


One thing I must interject here, the word the Scripture uses in Exodus 3:14 is not Yod-Hei-Vav-Hei but Alef-Hei-Yod-Hey Strongs H1961 according to the Interlinear Scripture Analyzer.


I am not going to say that I agree with quite everything you've said, but I have taken the warning to '...come out of her...' very seriously. I am a searcher of the True Names, a Sabbath-keeper, an observer of the Creator's Appointed Times and a lover of Torah. What a wonderful walk it has been and so many questions I've asked over the time of my faith have been answered so richly since I have.

A calling out of the Remnant is happening right now, and believers would do well to pray fervently for His truth and to hear His voice only. There are so many counterfeits in the world and just as most of us here have realized that we have been led astray about many things, so we must scrutinize what we've been taught by men about God's nature and the tenents of our faith.



edit on 6/19/2011 by czygyny because: clarification



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 01:00 AM
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I dunno. What's in a name? I was raised in the Church of God of Prophecy, and the slightest idea of a specific arrangement of symbols and pronunciation for what is really a magickal purpose just sounds like witchcraft, just being Devil's Advocate. What does it matter what you call your God? Is he that conceited? If you believe in the bible and are praying to God, I think he understands you're praying to him and not someone else. Is he smiting you to hell for not pronouncing his name correctly? Who cares?



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 01:41 AM
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If the name is what is important, then

I could be praying to Satan and actually have in mind YaHuWah but I will still go to hell right?
and
I could be praying to YaHuWaH and actually have Satan in my mind and I will be alright right?

Isn't it written in the Bible that God/YaHuWah or whatever name you wish to call Him, actually looks inside our heart? We can appear to be doing good and yet it doesn't matter if our intent is to harm. This disprove your belief OP as it is the "INTENT" of the person that matters to Him and not Names or semantics.



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 03:03 AM
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Originally posted by RightInTwo
reply to post by chrismicha77
 


It's Hebrew man.


Oh okay.



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 09:28 AM
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reply to post by network dude
 




God, or whatever you like to call him is already in your heart and he doesn't care in the least bit what you call him.


Right on network dude!

And most people I see posting in this thread seem to agree with us, it's common sense really.

Yet, a few more have arrived that seemingly agree with the OP, and his assertion that this magic word's pronunciation is paramount.

Let's take a step back, and really think about this notion.

Let's say that there is a Supreme Being, who has a "name", and also, one that "he" prefers to be called by.

Further, he really would like it that we take care to pronounce it properly as well, otherwise, we would show that we don't care. One member even posted that the "Divinity" communicates in "vibrations", underscoring the need for proper pronunciation, all the more so.

Of course, they have ancient scriptures that help make their case.

NOW, let's examine these notions in the light of some common sense.

We live in a world where an Englishman, is never going to be able to pronounce a Spanish word quite like the Spaniard would be able to. There are other even more dissimilar languages of course, Hebrew, Chinese.

Worse, some people suffer from an inability to speak at all. Of course, they might sufficiently "pronounce" the magic word in their heads perhaps.

Then there is the tragic fellow with the lisp, or other speech impediment. He has gone to speech therapy, but perhaps they didn't catch it early enough. He's a nice chap, but when he says Yehuwahwah, it sounds just awful!

And then, there are those who have not been given a very bright bulb upstairs, and who might simply stare as you explained to them the paramount importance of proper pronunciation of your favorite ancient foreign name.

This is sad of course. Perhaps the person in this example was born with Down's Syndrome. Yet, the retarded girl is still a lovely creature! Somehow, even with such diminished capacity, those of us who know her, come to understand that she is very capable of "love". In our more sober moments, we even dare to consider the possibility that this dim and pathetic creature might even love much more profoundly than many "intelligent" people we know.

What an absolute travesty that she will never be able to pronounce the Sacred Name! Ah well, at least we need not worry about tripping over the likes of her in the Afterlife.

Someone said that they were a bit offended at my posts, perhaps "slandering" Hebraic "christians", by perhaps not giving them a fair shake.

Actually, these daft Hebraic notions, of critical pronunciations, might be a bit offensive to some of our more sensitive members, who see what some of the implications of such absurdity might be.

NAMELY, the exclusion of your fellow human beings from your Paradise, only because they didn't agree with you.

Same song. So many religious people sing this one too.

For my part, I can't do it. As I think of the multitudes, over the ages, the ignorance, the general darkness if you will, my judgement can hardly be condemnation, if I was to consider "justice", at all.

Further, even those who might be "culpable", of things like negligence, "not caring" about the deity's name, etc., I couldn't bring myself to make too much of such infractions.

Why? Because you could call me this, and call me that, and like the old saying goes, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me." Such a thing would go "triple" (dare I say), for the Deity.

Well, that's long enough. COMMON SENSE PEOPLE. That's all we need to consign this nonsense to the rubbish bin, before people are actually physically hurt. Because that's where this could eventually lead.

JR



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 09:59 AM
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reply to post by RightInTwo
 


I believe that the Father's Name is Yahuwah or YHWH for your understanding. Jesus is not the son of Yahuwah, Jesus is a manmade name about 400 years old. Before that they called on Iesus, and before that Iesous in Greek. I don't believe we translate our Fathers' or Sons' name because that would mean we have authority to do so. Scripture says otherwise. I believe the Messiah is Yahuwshuwah, and that is the only Name we are saved by, read Acts 4:9-18. The Sanhedrin or the Religious leaders wanted that name Yahuwshuwah blotted out then! They didnt want the apostles preaching in that name and therefore today it has been fully removed.

And no I do not sacrifice animals or do anything like the old Sabbath day practices. That is what some cults do, or Torah followers are stuck in. They don't believe the Messiah done away with those things.

Watch all parts of Minister Bennetts teachings.







posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 10:03 AM
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reply to post by Highlander64
 


I see you understand what I am getting at. I couldnt post all the verses I would have liked, as you see the post is already to long. Thanks for the understanding.



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 11:23 AM
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reply to post by boniknik
 


So your saying you can call him Lucifer, Allah, Buddha, Muhammad, John Smith, Tom dick and Harry etc. Im not sure where you get these rules, because it boils down to this. Who are you following? The rules of Scripture or the rules of man? If you believe the Scriptures are inspired from Heaven, then why dont you do what it says?

Do what you want, I am only warning you, but if I called you any name im sure you wouldnt like it. If your real name was Tony, and you told me 'DONT EVER CALL ME TOM' and I did, wouldnt that make you mad?

Well the Scriptures say that you must call on the Creators Name properly and he does not hold the person guiltless who brings his name to worthlessness, nothingness or unimportance. Thats the 3rd commandment Exodus 20:7.

And Yahuwah told us what not to call Him, do not call Him Baal, or Lord, or whatever you want like God, but His only Name Yahuwah. That goes for His son also call Him by the name that was given Him. I don't use my rules, I go by the rules laid down by the Scriptures, if you havent already noticed.




Isaiah 52:5,6 KJV

5Now therefore, what have I here, saith the LORD(יהוה appears), that my people is taken away for nought? they that rule over them make them to howl, saith the LORD(יהוה appears); and my name continually every day is blasphemed.
6Therefore my people shall know my name: therefore they shall know in that day that I am he that doth speak: behold, it is I.



26How long shall this be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart;
27Which think to cause my people to forget my name by their dreams which they tell every man to his neighbour, as their fathers have forgotten my name for Baal ( Or the Lord Strongs #1168).


www.blueletterbible.org...

Go check for yourself. Baal means Lord. And if that verse says the fathers of old forgot the name of our Creator for Baal or Lord, that means the Christians are following their footsteps. And at the day of judgment you will know His Name.




16And it shall be at that day, saith the LORD(יהוה appears), that thou shalt call me Ishi; and shalt call me no more Baali.


Ishi means husband or Master, and Baali is a term for Baal's or names of Baal, its the same as calling Him 'My Lord'. And again Messiah is our Master and so is the Heavenly Father.

www.blueletterbible.org...

And the Messiah has only 1 Name exalted above every Name.




Phillipians 2:9-11 The Scriptures 2009

2:9 Elohim, therefore, has highly exalted Him and given Him the Name which is above every name,
2:10 that at the Name of יהושע (Yahuwshuwah) every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth,
2:11 and every tongue should confess that יהושע(Yahuwshuwah) Messiah is Master, to the esteem of Elohim the Father.



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 11:41 AM
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Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
reply to post by RightInTwo
 


And no I do not sacrifice animals or do anything like the old Sabbath day practices. That is what some cults do, or Torah followers are stuck in. They don't believe the Messiah done away with those things.


Well then, that depends on whether or not you are a part of Israel or still in the error of 'the church' being a separate entity from the Commonwealth of Israel---His chosen People.

Personally I'll stick with being member of Israel, Ammi, His People. Not a Jew, with all their Rabbinical Pharisaic traditions of men, an Israelite one who has been dispersed throughout the nations.

And while the Great Ten Words are still in effect for His People (Including the Sabbaths) the Levitical system of sacrifices are not, which Messiah has come and changed, but will be when Y'shua rules and reigns and the Temple stands once again in Yerushalayim. These things were never 'Jewish' Sabbaths or Laws, they were YHWH's, to be kept in perpetuity.

Exodus 31:13
“Speak also to the children of Israel, saying: ‘Surely My Sabbaths you shall keep, for it is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am YHWH who sanctifies you.”


Notice Who's Sabbaths they are...?

Now before you go quoting Hebrews 7 to me, understand that the 'law' that is being spoken of is the Levitical law of sacrifice and propitiation NOT the rest of the Mosaic commandments. As well, the statement in Colossians 2:14 is a certificate of debt, the handwriting of requirements, the sins you've committed written against you in heavenly books, that's what has been nailed to the stake, NOT Torah.

You've come a long way in seeking to discover His Name, and the name of His Son, all that call on 'That Name' will be saved. Truly as spoken in Joel 2:32 and echoed in Acts 2:21...“And it shall come to pass that whoever calls on the name of YHWH shall be saved.”

Take the next step and embrace His commandments.They are the true definition of what He expects from His People, and in the Appointed Times you will understand Messiah's plan of redemption in a deeper way and will unlock prophecy in a way that you did not know before. Camping didn't do it and look how he failed? Even Y'shua Himself declared that He did not come to do away with the Torah...and it has not been completely fulfilled as of yet.

He is calling to us today and the time is short!

Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven saying, “Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues.




edit on 6/20/2011 by czygyny because: punctuation



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 02:11 PM
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reply to post by czygyny
 


I have been down that road with the Torah followers. I don't want to explain myself, if you want to know, watch the videos I posted about the Sabbath, and look at the videos relating to Torah on Called2bholy's channel on youtube.

We are not under Levitical priesthood, and we cannot practice Sabbath day practices since it all has to be done with feasts and everything else, or you cant do it. We have no king ruling the people of Israel, because He hasn't come back yet. Do you not know only when the people were together, then they could practice Sabbath and feasts and tabernacles? We have no High Priest right now, or King, He will set up His Kingdom when Yahuwshuwah the Messiah comes back, then He will tell us what to keep or not.



Matthew 11:28-30 KJV

28Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.
29Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.


We rest in the Messiah, not on a specific day anymore, and you cannot keep all the Torah, since it has been broken. Do you not know that man broke the last covenant? The sabbath day practices are



Mark 2:27-28 The Scriptures 2009 ISR

Mar 2:27 And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.
Mar 2:28 “So the Son of Aḏam is also Master of the Sabbath.”



Galations 5:1-4 The Scriptures 2009 ISR

Gal 5:1 In the freedom with which Messiah has made us free, stand firm, then, and do not again be held with a yoke of slavery.
Gal 5:2 See, I, Sha’ul, say to you that if you become circumcised, Messiah shall be of no use to you.
Gal 5:3 And I witness again to every man being circumcised that he is a debtor to do the entire Torah.
Gal 5:4 You who are declared right by Torah have severed yourselves from Messiah, you have fallen from favour.


You are under bondage and a yoke of slavery to the Torah by trying to keep the Sabbath and feasts or whatever else have you. You cannot do it now, its impossible, and its a disgrace to the Messiah and the reason that He came. All those practices were pointing to the Messiah, He is the bread, the first fruits, our rest, our Sabbath.



Galations 5:16-18 The Scriptures 2009 ISR

Gal 5:16 And I say: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not accomplish the lust of the flesh.
Gal 5:17 For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh. And these are opposed to each other, so that you do not do what you desire to do.
Gal 5:18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under Torah.


I just pray you will see, we cant keep the Sabbath like you are saying. It is our New Covenant or Restored Covenant, because it was broken read the book Ezekiel.



Isaiah 24:3-5 The Scriptures 2009 ISR

Isa 24:3 the earth is completely emptied and utterly plundered, for יהוה has spoken this word.
Isa 24:4 The earth shall mourn and wither, the world shall languish and wither, the haughty people of the earth shall languish.
Isa 24:5 For the earth has been defiled under its inhabitants, because they have transgressed the Torot, changed the law, broken the everlasting covenant.



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 02:15 PM
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reply to post by chrismicha77
 


Computer isnt in the Bible but it does exist. Same with dinosaur you will not find it, but it was called before dragon before it was changed in the 1800's.

The Names have been changed is the whole point im getting across on here. You cannot change the Word of the Creator for it is Everlasting. He spoke His Name to Moses, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and the Prophets of old.

I just want you to be aware of that.



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by JR MacBeth
 


i said strangely offended, now i'm miffed
the OP is what is known as a naif in any case

i usually enjoy your posts but i guess we've got our signals crossed

everything you've been saying is quite true
but IMO should really be posted here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

i mean, this crypto-zionist is seriously muddying the waters and is acting as if he doesn't know The Gaon from Bar Kokba

i would appreciate your presence and assistance verily.

reply to post by Seektruthalways1
 



OP
i got confused and posted a video on the aforementioned thread

when it was actually meant for you re the importance of knowledge and understanding


edit on 20-6-2011 by DerepentLEstranger because: replying to OP as well



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 05:42 PM
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Originally posted by Seektruthalways1
reply to post by czygyny
 


I have been down that road with the Torah followers.


How sad that you took that step forward then turned away.


Originally posted by Seektruthalways1 We are not under Levitical priesthood, and we cannot practice Sabbath day practices since it all has to be done with feasts and everything else, or you cant do it. We have no king ruling the people of Israel, because He hasn't come back yet. Do you not know only when the people were together, then they could practice Sabbath and feasts and tabernacles? We have no High Priest right now, or King, He will set up His Kingdom when Yahuwshuwah the Messiah comes back, then He will tell us what to keep or not.


Yes, I already said that we are no longer under the Levitical priesthood. How that means that Sabbath is no longer valid is a conclusion beyond my understanding. It was implemented at the beginning of the whole of Scripture, and is separate from the system of offerings and sacrifices. It is extremely easy to keep (without rabbinical hedge laws) and is a blessing to do so. It was meant to be kept by His People in perpetuity.

Being still in the diaspora world wide is no reason to not honor the Appointed Times. Four have been fulfilled at the first coming, there are three left. One of them is the 'day no man knows the hour nor day'. Now, where have I heard that statement before? We have no Temple to come and sacrifice, true, but we can still honor the Moedim in our lives...and learn.

It sure beats keeping christmas and easter, which is mixing the holy with the profane...something Yah had told His People not to do, over and over and over, generation after generation...

We sure the heck DO have a High Priest, and He sits at the right hand of the Almighty right now.



Originally posted by Seektruthalways1 You are under bondage and a yoke of slavery to the Torah by trying to keep the Sabbath and feasts or whatever else have you. You cannot do it now, its impossible, and its a disgrace to the Messiah and the reason that He came. All those practices were pointing to the Messiah, He is the bread, the first fruits, our rest, our Sabbath.


Yet here is that pesky passage, by the Master Himself:

Matthew 5:19
“Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”


Now, I am not a terribly ambitious person, but I certainly do not wish to be the least, but be the best I can be in my eternal position.

Rev. 12:17...“he (the dragon) went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Y'shua.”

Something about the combination of keeping commandments of Yah and the testimony of Messiah certainly tweaks the tail of our 'adversary'. That in itself makes me want to do it even more, but then, I have a mischievous streak in me.

At any rate...carry on. I have said my peace. We do not have common ground in which to fellowship.



edit on 6/20/2011 by czygyny because: formatting errors



posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 09:22 PM
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reply to post by czygyny
 


Then I dont understand what you are saying? Why you calling him Yah? Why did you shorten the Son's name to Y'shua? I heard this before why you shortening the Name ? And Matthew you quoted is speaking of the new commandments, the new righteousness of the law.

You know every word that comes from the mouth of Yahuwah or His Son is a commandment? It is Law. That is speaking of the righteousness of the Law, not the 10 words or commandments.
edit on 20-6-2011 by Seektruthalways1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 03:51 PM
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reply to post by Soldier of God
 



nicely said i agree
edit on 21-6-2011 by o0pinMind0o because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 21 2011 @ 04:08 PM
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reply to post by smithjustinb
 


yes kinda you have a point there, for instance people say fudge instead of FU^&#%CK same thing but i would never say cow ofcourse. but i would call upon him in my prayers Jesus, son of god, THE Savior, the holy one, Teacher, Messiah, the one who died and resurrected on and on.

but if you believe in THE word of god exactly what it has to say the word of god says no one comes to but only through the name of Jesus.



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