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I was born in America but English was not my first Language... English was forced upon me

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posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 05:10 PM
Okay, so we drift towards cases of abuse and forceful "adaptation".
You know, there's always a problem of the foreigners and their culture not being accepted or at least treated with dignity in a country where they immigrate to and try to raise their children in. Go figure.
Many Poles went through this ordeal during the entire 20th century when they tried to enter US and work there. The sad "Pollack jokes" and portraying Polish people as uneducated masses speaking some weirdo language was still alive and well in 70's and 80's, dunno how it looks like right now.The same happens to our people in the UK where Polish people are only recently recognized as impressively skilled professionals - they used to be treated like cattle there as well.
The point is, so what about the abuse? It happened, happens and will happen as there are more stupid people willing to hurt somebody because they're different from them than the good people, and that sadly includes governmental institutions. I say this not to promote ignorance, but to take the matter more cautiously and without that teenage "lets revolt!" notion. The abusive behavior towards foreign children is rather rare from what I've gathered from my pals who live almost all around the world, at least they say that it has dramatically improved compared to their times.
I come from a country that has a history of over 1000 years, half of which was being forcefully assimilated into German, Austro-Hungarian or Russian empires. So I know the true value of being mistreated for what nationality you are.

edit on 19-6-2011 by Jelonek because: whatever

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 05:18 PM
A few Ill Mannered posts occurred after my reminder. This is no longer a reminder...Keep discussion civil.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 05:53 PM
English seems to be taught in a lot of other countries as well, usually compulsory up until a certaing grade/age. I had to learn it in school (not that I ever paid much attention - I only learnt it properly when I decided to travel). I have friends in various European countries and I believe all of them were made to learn English. I think governments are trying to develop a kind of lingua franca due to globalisation, and it just so happens that English is very widely spoken language, and English speaking countries are generally very influential in global trade, best example of current times being, of course, the U.S.A.

I am glad that times have changed and now it is not so forced upon children to learn English - my fellow classmates all have crap/very basic English, at least the ones who didn't/don't care much about it, and teaching attempts were honestly quite half-arsed in our school. (Speaking of half-arse, what does that even mean?) Seems that now, most people who learn languages do so because of their parents, or because they really want to.

Are foreign languages taught firmly in English speaking countries? I know that here in Australia German and Japanese is taught in most schools, but like in Tierra, it's really not serious and I think the kids just enjoy it. If not, I would wonder why not. Is everyone else really expected to learn English for no particular reason other than to be useful to tourists?

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 05:56 PM

Originally posted by Jelonek
...The sad "Pollack jokes" and portraying Polish people as uneducated masses speaking some weirdo language was still alive and well in 70's and 80's, dunno how it looks like right now...
edit on 19-6-2011 by Jelonek because: whatever

Here here, have you heard this one:

An Irishman, an Italian, and a Polish guy are in a bar.
They are having a good time and all agree that the bar
is a nice place.

Then the Irishman says, "Aye, this is a nice bar, but
where I come from, back in Dublin, there's a better one.
At MacDougal's, you buy a drink, you buy another drink,
and MacDougal himself will buy your third drink!"

The others agree that sounds like a nice place.

Then the Italian says, "Yeah, that's a nice bar, but
where I come from, there's a better one. Over in Brooklyn,
there's this place, Vinny's. At Vinny's, you buy a drink,
Vinny buys you a drink. You buy anudda drink, Vinny buys
you anudda drink."

Everyone agrees that sounds like a great bar.

Then the Polish guy says, "You think that's great? Where
I come from, there's this place called Warshowski's. At
Warshowski's, they buy you your first drink, they buy you
your second drink, they buy you your third drink, and then,
they take you in the back and get you laid!"

"Wow!" say the other two. "That's fantastic! Did that
actually happen to you?"

"No," replies the Polish guy, "but it happened to my sister!"

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 06:59 PM
reply to post by DeepThoughtCriminal

English isn't even taught very well here in the States. I have been appalled by the faulty use of grammar and spelling on the Internet, and I don't mean typos. Somewhere along the way, American schools adopted the look-see method of teaching instead of the old phonics. Montessori schools still teach the phonics, fortunately. The Look-see method was developed by John Dewey for deaf-mutes and they just decided to use that across the board. Professor Antony Sutton explains the use of the Dewey system in his book, "America's Secret Establishment". It has been part of a deliberate dumbing down of education so that the masses are just cogs in the wheels of the State.
Perhaps losing individual dialects and languages is also part of the plan: that is everyone on the same page for easier control.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 07:12 PM

Originally posted by jimmyx
if anybody would care to read a little more history, you would find out that indian tribes and the larger nation tribes would war against each other long before the "white" man came over from europe. to say that all the native american indians were peaceful and full of harmonious spirit is a load of crap. they butchered and enslaved one another way before the evil white man came to america.

That is true, not to mention that a few white scalps were taken due to the feeling that they were on Indian territory trying to eke out a hard pioneer living on the land with no police and no nanny state.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 07:21 PM
reply to post by NoHierarchy

You sound like a No Borders kind of person. You say that nationalism is disgusting. Were you thinking of Nazi Germany? Or Russian communism? Maybe the Chinese military parades on May 1? I get so tired of hearing Progressives whine about how bad nationalism is, and then complain about the NAU or NAFTA, CAFTA, the trans-corridor cutting the country in half, or any other number of NWO traps. I don't want to hear people complaining about how they lost their language then say how bad nationalism is. Don't people see the hypocrisy? Preserving one's language is preserving a national identity, but because there are so many different languages within a given territory it tends to break down the sense of unity.
People who are into the whole No Borders thing are just begging for the One World Totalitarian govt.
edit on 19-6-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 07:33 PM
reply to post by DaddyBare

ive never been big on you must learn english. of course knowing it is useful but most people can function fine not knowing it. unless you are working as a contractor, or joining the military, or trying to teach, or working in public sector.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 07:41 PM
Never read all 10 pages, but here is my two cents anyway.

Live in a country with "x" language that the majority speak - better learn that language. Why is it that everyone wants to come to USA / Canada and expects us to learn their language. English is spoken here, don't like it - then leave. If I moved to a country where English wasn't the spoken language and I expected them to learn it for my benefit, I would expect to be told to pound sand rather quickly.

Call it racial, or discrimination - don't care......some of us are getting tired of the double standard. I see some want to play the Oh poor me card, we are being forced to adapt.....give it up. We have a national language, no one is asking you to forget the country/culture you come from - but in order to survive and thrive here, you at least have to learn our language and customs.

As to those who say you really don't need to learn English - how do you expect to function in a society that you are unable to communicate with. Oh wait, you don't - you want us to adapt to you.

edit on 19-6-2011 by MidnightTide because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 08:02 PM

edit on 19/6/11 by Niall197 because: Bad mood city

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 09:11 PM
It's sad...I'm an American-born caucasian but I live in a very diverse community that's predominantly Latino. On many occasions I see/hear poor English-speaking citizens being berated for not speaking fluent English. I often over-hear the phrase "learn to speak English." I mean come on...I was born here and grew up speaking English but my great grandparents came over here from Italy to also make better lives for themselves and they didn't speak English when they got here. What's the problem with people coming here now for better lives? I often stand up for people and throw my two cents in when I see or hear them being treated unfairly.

The funny part is...does anyone know what our national language is?

It's not English, it actually isn't anything. They left it blank and never declared an official language for our country because it was the "melting pot" and they knew people from all different countries and backgrounds would be coming here.

We also have the 5th largest Spanish-speaking population in the world, more than most Latin American countries. Yet Spanish is not acceptable according to particular individuals in our society.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 09:16 PM
I'm glad to see you have mastered the English language, despite the ridicule hurdles.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 09:49 PM
America revels in it's ignorance. Education is frowned upon and you are neigh unto a traitor for leaning, and using, more than one language. This is the land of Sarah Palin and a Creationist Museum.

The world is marginalizing America, and for good reason.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:07 PM
Since people seem to think of that Anyone coming to America should English.

How do you all feel about the US territories should they speak English or they didn't exactly ask to be in the USA; some want out and cant get out while others want statehood and cant get it.

The USA has no official language get over it; until there is only anyone should be free to speak whatever when one comes feel free to complain about it.

BTW many states have official languages and some have two such as New Mexico.

Many countries have more than only official language how do they function Switzerland comes to mind

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:09 PM
Now, kids are suspended for wearing a shirt with the U.S. flag on it. What's the point? The Constitution of the United States and the Declaration of Independence...what language are they written in? Just curious.

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:38 PM

Originally posted by Scytherius
America revels in it's ignorance. Education is frowned upon and you are neigh unto a traitor for leaning, and using, more than one language. This is the land of Sarah Palin and a Creationist Museum.

The world is marginalizing America, and for good reason.

Progressive liberals revel in trying to sound more intellectual and intelligent than the conservatives they hate so much. I've obserived so much obnoxious snobbery it's almost funny, if it wasn't rooted in the whole multiculturalism agenda.
So here is what I have to say about it. While I champion anyone's right to speak any language which appeals to them, there is an agenda to destroy Western culture. It's called Marxism. You, sir are a premium example of the hate-America crowd.
Here is an eloquent explanation for the message I have been trying to get across in this thread.

David Horowitz in Up from Multiculturalism (1998) calls multiculturalism, "two lies in one word, " its "agenda is the deconstruction of the idea of American nationality, in the service of the mindless, destructive, never-ending radical assault on the capital of the democratic world...Multiculturalism is the team banner of the hate-America Left."

As Horowitz properly concludes, "America has been the inclusive multi-national, multi-ethnic society, unparalleled in all human history in its success in integrating diverse communities on the basis of an ideal of equality. This success has been predicated on an American culture (not a multi-culture) that makes that integration possible and sustains that American idea. Multiculturalism is the "view that everyone (except white people), and every culture (except Western culture) is equal, and deserves equal respect. The culture arrogantly called Western Civilization is exclusionary and has to go."

Marxism was concerned with economic issues, not culture as such. Socialism was not invented by Marx. Quoting Lenin, "the three sources of Marxism are: British political economy, French Socialism and German idealist philosophy." ( In other words, Marxism, socialism, etc. in its various forms is the product of upper class intellectuals and academic elitists. Marxism was never widely accepted by the working class unless conditions were so desperate they had no choice.

Gramsci believed workers didn't know what was good for them. They were "blinded" by religion and western culture in general. Lukacs, said in 1919, "Who will save us from Western Civilization?" They theorized that the great obstacle to creating of the great Marxist paradise was the culture was Western civilization itself. The entire culture had to be destroyed, in particular Christianity.

Critical Theory calls for the most destructive criticism possible, on everything western, designed to bring the current order down. They don't bring Marxism up, just a constant drumbeat of anti-western hate under the guise of human rights, social progress, etc. This is always applied to western countries such as the US and Israel, but never to communist China in Tibet or to Arab terrorist states. Christianity and Judaism face endless attacks, radical fundamentalist Islam is protected.

Think about what's going on here. Multiculturalism discourages assimilation based on the irrational claims all cultures are equal. If that was true, why are million fleeing the advanced culture of tribalism, socialism, and general third-world failure to move to western nations?
Also, why create "balkanized" groups of often incompatible cultures in western nations? It will lead to their breakup, wreck their economies, etc. Marxism in its various forms is apocalyptic - awaiting the fall and ruin of western society to usher in the one-world socialist utopia. Political correctness assures the process goes unquestioned.

To this I will simply say that individuals can be used as unwitting tools for the Marxist agenda while believing they are merely preserving their indigenous culture. It was so easy to see the UN Agenda at the DNC in 08. I guarantee that this parade is an extension of UN Agenda 21, and the Millenium Declaration, which really seeks a One World Totalitarian Utopian govt.

Here's further explanation

The Telegraph article pulls no punches: “Sustainability” is not nearly as politically neutral as its cuddly, warm name sounds. A bit like “multiculturalism” or “diversity”, “sustainability” is one of those weasel concepts which has been foisted on our language and culture by the hard left, linguistically masquerading as something unimpeachably caring and reasonable while in fact advancing a policy agenda designed to increase state control, remove property rights and liberty, and brainwash the gullible into ceding more and more of their democratic rights to UN and EU bureaucrats.

Tom DeWeese of the American Policy Center, a leader in exposing the radical goals of “sustainable development,” has called Agenda 21 “the greatest threat ever perpetrated against the American ideal of liberty.”

ICLEI has succeeded in implementing the sustainability agenda through something called the Delphi Technique. All activists need to understand the Delphi Technique. Originally created by the Rand Corporation as a consensus building methodology for scientists, Delphi has morphed into a subversive tactic for imposing malevolent leftist agendas on an unsuspecting public who would never agree if they understood.

Here it is on the UNESCO website in bold, its Utopian and it's One World Totalitarianism masquerading as human rights, but the real goal is a One World Govt.

It's amazing to me that some people here think they are fighting the NWO when in actuality, they are helping it along fabulously.
edit on 19-6-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 10:52 PM
reply to post by MemoryShock

Just one question, are some of the users post here civil because a while ago there was one person here who even had the "F" word on his post and his post sounded very rude. but it seems he has been given the chance to edit his post a little, Im guessing so it can still sound rude but not violate the T&C.

Im just wondering if only some people here get warnings or is it the same for everyone?
And can i get a chance to edit an uncivil post before it gets removed just like this other person? thanks

but besides that I think this post went very well and i like that fact Daddybare mixes up his languages :lol
edit on 19-6-2011 by Whirpool because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 12:25 AM
Messed up my edit and lost my post
edit on 6/20/2011 by Drezden because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 07:55 AM
reply to post by Jelonek

Can I say that I love you? or rather, kocham cie
I was born in the UK but have a Polish background(half polish) I was bullied in school because of that but quite frankly, I don't care. I can't believe we even had a thread like this when it happens all over the world, everywhere you go. Not just there, time to grow up a little in my opinion.

Like I said earlier, learning a new language is a very useful tool so why do you care if it was forced upon you? You have gained something good. I wish I had Polish forced upon me or I wouldn't have this problem of learning it now.


posted on Jun, 20 2011 @ 09:14 AM
I must say I am amazed at the response to this personal story from my youth... gratified even...
I should also say while yes I am bitter over my treatment I am in no way sorry I did learn English... it empowered me... gave me the ability to speak up and out about injustices and injury...

Mine is more a history lesson of how things were... today things are very different... we, Native Americans still have to fight for our rights and freedoms, as Americans... but little by little things are turning.... let my lessons be a warning to all... that without vigilance things could easily go back to the bad old days...

I thank all who took the time to read and respond to my tale... seriously... thank you ...

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