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The ATS Missing Threads Conspiracy

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posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 05:56 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by jerryznv
I don't think you should comment on a thread that contains a conspiracy against you.


Why? It's a direct insult.


This nonsense has inspired a completely new indicator for removed topics: www.abovetopsecret.com...


Uhhhh....where is the female representation in that???





posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:10 PM
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Yes I recently posted a couple times on a particular thread and the coments were removed only because they were taken WAY out of context. I even edited the posts to clarify what it was that I was trying to say but it was too late and it was fairly obvious that some mod had it out for me. After that I opened my own thread about my point of view and made EXTRA sure that it did not violate T&C. The thread was up for about 5 min and then it just disapeared...with no notification of any kind. I should also note that this was my first post on ATS and after that experience i wont be posting again, i still stop by to check out topics but thats about it. Are there any other conspiracy websites out there that are worth a crap cuz this one plays favorites too much.
edit on 17-6-2011 by JBeezy because: ooops i said damn dont want my whole comment removed.....



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:11 PM
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reply to post by Resentedhalo08
 


I've heard that ATS mods are government agents. I don't know why. Maybe they feel if we share our ideas, they can trash them and forget them so we can't share them.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:15 PM
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reply to post by applesthateatpeople
 


well duh, i think that would make ATS censorship a fact and not an acusation anymore if this thread in particular got shut down.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by Warpthal
I've heard that ATS mods are government agents.

You heard wrong.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:25 PM
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Originally posted by Resentedhalo08
You can take al the security measure's that you like but in reality any high level govenment agency could get into whichever system they choose and leave no trace whatsoever, I am just highlighting a fact.

I have no idea where you're getting your information, or your level of computer expertise, but that statement is patently false.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:28 PM
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Let me say I have enjoyed this set of posts ! I probably am not wrong in assumeing that ATS is monitored if only to catch someone discussing something involving national security . Sadly this site has no credibility with the main stream media..They pay no attention to it as I was informed by our local media .Any discloser can be quickly discredited..I am greatful this site exists thank you owners an moderators



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:28 PM
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I doubt if they will shut this thread down, it is taking the focus off the things that should be discussed. Maybe people should start saving all of the posts they make to their hard drive, then if it is deleted, bring it back and see if it gets deleted again.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:29 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by Warpthal
I've heard that ATS mods are government agents.

You heard wrong.


Well....technically.....a couple of us do get paid by the government, while we are on ATS......but our bosses don't know that, so I don't think it counts!!



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:33 PM
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Originally posted by greeneyedleo
Uhhhh....where is the female representation in that???









posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:34 PM
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Originally posted by rogerramjett
I doubt if they will shut this thread down, it is taking the focus off the things that should be discussed. Maybe people should start saving all of the posts they make to their hard drive, then if it is deleted, bring it back and see if it gets deleted again.


There are already plenty of web apps that do exactly that. I have deleted my own posts (as a member) and had people go to the "wayback machine" or other websites and resurrect my original post and argue it.

The old saying is, "Nothing ever gets 'deleted' off the internet."



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:43 PM
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I have seen threads just dissappear as well. I have seen on ATS people complain about what is wrong with the world but do little to fix it. I came across a thread that talked about peaceful protests against the banks on June 14 ,2011. I was really excited because I could see people wanted to stand up against the tyranny. IT was 404ed while I was reading through.
I never took this thread as adovacating voilence and I took it as informational not as a recruitment strategy. Once it was gone it was like it never existed. I always thought ats was against the status quo and the tryanny around us but maybe it is slowly becoming part of it by closing down threads that are productive? Don't get me wrong I don't think ATS mods are doing this intentionally but this is an unitentional conquence of their actions. At least this how I see it and others may see it.
I do not believe in censorship in any form so it is hard for me to agree with the banning of any post or thread but if something is misleading or trying to scam people then it should be removed due to the nature of the harm it could cause others. I live by only one rule due no harm. I am all for any banning of any thread that causes harm to others. I read the T&C a long time a go; personally it seemed a little lengthy. Too many rules for me is very restrictive but I realize most people are not so liberal as me. I don't think ATS is part of a consipiracy but unintentionally leading people to beleive this at times. I really wish a great site existed that only had one rule but in this society everything is over the top and complicated.
I have been members of sites where they must preapprove your words before it is posted. I once had a thread not approved because it was not 100% on topic only 80%. Needless to say I am not active in that site. I respect others opinions as I hope they respect mine but I really hope to see the day of the truly free internet. It does get a little ridculous when a person censors a word upfront but then gets their post removed by censoring their own word. Sometimes no other word fits at that time. I think a person who questions authority is an asset to our world. Always question any type of authority when in doubt. I am glad this thread is continuing I hope ATS is ok when theirs members question things because it is nothing personal it is just people trying to understand something that does not make sense to them. In psychology we refer to it as rationalization and people often use generalization to understand as well.
edit on 17-6-2011 by dreamseeker because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:43 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord


If he has the evidence, he should provide it.


Very true, I agree with you 100% there. As I said I was playing devil's advocate, I don't personally feel ATS is a CIA front or anything as some have claimed.

The only reason I decided to post in this thread is because I have seen several threads disappear that I was very interested in, and the reasons given for some where due to T&C violations of the POSTERS in the thread, not the actual OP.

That just seems sketchy to me personally. As I said before, it would make more sense to delete the offending posts, and allow the topic to continue on.

Seeing as I used that Lulzsec thread as an example already, I will use it again. It was removed because people began discussing hacking, from what I understand. I'm just curious why the choice was made to remove the entire thread, which did contain some very interesting information, that AFAIK wasn't posted anywhere else on ATS at the time.

I'll repeat something else I said, in that even if there isn't any sort of censorship on behalf of the admin of this site, the standard practice of binning a thread simply because of what replies it gets seems dangerous. If I was a disinfo agent, something that the government has basically admitted to using, it would be VERY easy for me to kill a thread by simply stirring up trouble and T&C violations. This is not the fault of the OP, and this is out of the OP's control, yet the OP is punished for this, and the information is removed.

I would really like to know why entire threads are removed, when removal of just the offending posts, with a warning posted in the thread to stay in line (which, I will admit I HAVE seen before to the staff's credit) would accomplish the same thing, while still allowing the information of the OP to be presented. I know you are a busy man and I appreciate you addressing people's concerns.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:56 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by Resentedhalo08
You can take al the security measure's that you like but in reality any high level govenment agency could get into whichever system they choose and leave no trace whatsoever, I am just highlighting a fact.

I have no idea where you're getting your information, or your level of computer expertise, but that statement is patently false.


Well not "any" but certainly some "high level government agency" (as vague as that is) would be capable of it.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by dreamseeker
I have seen threads just dissappear as well. I have seen on ATS people complain about what is wrong with the world but do little to fix it. I came across a thread that talked about peaceful protests against the banks on June 14 ,2011. I was really excited because I could see people wanted to stand up against the tyranny. IT was 404ed while I was reading through.


See, this is one of the problems I am seeing here. People are failing to realize that ATS has Terms and Conditions of Use that everyone, including staff, agreed to abide by.

In the example you provided, the T&C are very very clear:


[15e.) Recruitment/Solicitation:

i) You will not use your membership in the Websites for any type of recruitment to any causes whatsoever. You will not Post, use the chat feature, use videos, or use the private message system to disseminate advertisements, chain letters, petitions, pyramid schemes, or any kind of solicitation for political action, social action, letter campaigns, or related online and/or offline coordinated actions of any kind.



Post and threads are only removed for violating the T&C that we all agreed to abide by when we registered




edit on June 17th 2011 by greeneyedleo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 07:17 PM
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reply to post by greeneyedleo
 


I really dont think the ops intentions were to recruit it was just about this important social issue. I did not see it as such since it was not the OPs of that particular threads web site.
It certainly was not solictation because the Op of the thread was not trying to get money or gain anything. I read it as to inform.
JUst in that one T&C rule that is already pretty lengthy. It is definitely much longer than do no harm. I know not everyone thinks like me which is fine but what harm could really come out of a post like that? I didn't read it as polictial either because it was not advocating a political group just standing up against "the man" so to speak.
Just imagine if the whole Hippie revolution would have been online? I think society would be quite different now. What about women's rights or african american if all of it had been online unforunatley women may have not had the right to vote. Blacks and whites would still be "seperate but equal."
By the way I have seen threads talk about videos like the Venus Project and Anonymous that talk about getting people to help out so I put that thread in the same catergory really. I did some searching on the site and that could really be inturupted in different ways to apply towards a few active posts on here.
edit on 17-6-2011 by dreamseeker because: (no reason given)

24 rules are really too many but at least fewer than some businesses or companies that I have seen; rather lengthy for a web site.
edit on 17-6-2011 by dreamseeker because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 07:44 PM
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I have gave you a star my friend as I enjoyed reading your post.


Originally posted by dreamseeker
I do not believe in censorship in any form so it is hard for me to agree with the banning of any post or thread but if something is misleading or trying to scam people then it should be removed due to the nature of the harm it could cause others.


Well I agree to a point, censorship has it's place to a point, I respect the right to have a T&C on a site such as this, as there are certain things that must not be said.

But having said that, censorship can go a few steps too far, it is always good to use one's discretion when moderating a subject and as I have seen in this thread there have been some very fair and just comments.

What I do not agree with is the censorship of certain subjects that may seem sensitive or a bit on the sidelines, there has to be boundaries... but there also has to be an acceptable level of discussion that pushes on those boundaries.




Too many rules for me is very restrictive


This is a point I can wholeheartedly agree on and the main word for me here is "too many", there has to be a basis of what can and cannot be said on a forum such as this, but also the guidlines set down cannot in themselves be so restrictive that they actually prevent what is trying to be said.



Always question any type of authority when in doubt. I am glad this thread is continuing I hope ATS is ok when theirs members question things because it is nothing personal it is just people trying to understand something that does not make sense to them. In psychology we refer to it as rationalization and people often use generalization to understand as well.


I completely agree, I am the type of person that will always question authority and I will always ask questions, to some they may seem to be awkward but to me it is probing towards a truth, I am a seeker of truth... as are everyone on this site, hence why they are here discussing such subjects.

My OP was nothing personal but a question, a theory and an idea on why some threads which do not breach the T&C and the 3 points that Skeptic Overlord made at the beginning of this thread are being deleted, I agree with him to a point, but there have been occasions when threads have been deleted when they do not fall into these 3 points made.

I have seen it happen personally, a few times... I have seen other people talk about it happening to them, when they have FULL understanding of the T&C and it not being some misunderstanding of the T&C, that is why I have created this thread.

There are some things that ring a few bells, not only to me but others who I have seen talk about such things.

To insult the owners of ATS or anyone else has not been my intention, only to ask a question that has been on the mind of myself and a few others.
edit on 17-6-2011 by Resentedhalo08 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 08:09 PM
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I don't think there's any conspiracy here at all to be honest........but, I think sometimes threads are taken down without an adequate explanation, and maybe, especially in large threads, that span 20-30 pages or so, members that have participated in said threads are left a little frustrated.

Take the recent Protoplasmic Traveller thread (I know we don't discuss banned members and all that shizzle!) it ran to a great many pages and had a lot of member participation, myself included, and as we as a collective forum slowly got to the bottom of the obvious (to some) hoax.......it was suddenly 404'd, with next to no explanation.

As I said I don't believe that the owners or any of the mods are MIB's ......I do think a little more transparency and explanation of why certain threads get 404'd wouldn't go amiss.


Just my tuppenth h'penny



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 08:18 PM
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I have my share of problems with ATS which is why I rarely post anything but I am on this site every day(not going to prove that, too personal.) I do not sign in too often just in case I am somehow being monitored or tracked on some basis(besides my ISP of course.) This is my favorite site on the Internet and I mean that.
The chances of something as useful as ATS not being monitored and infiltrated by the government is slim in my opinion. Since I believe that some ATS'ers may possibly be labeled radicals by some groups or agency's, it would only make sense to me that some groups or agency's may monitor this site for suspicious behavior. If a site is being monitored often and fished for information, it would seem to me that getting a mole(not the Talpidae) into a moderator position would be the best way to accomplish this task, though just a membership would likely be sufficient I would think.
Another possible option would be for the group or agency to fund a competing site if the group or agency had the financial capabilities to do so. In such a scenario as this, it could possibly be an effective strategy for the group or agency to first attempt to discredit ATS in order to increase the chances of conspiracy site defection. A post such as the one by the OP could be interpreted by some to be an act of discreditation of ATS by such a group or agency.
There are many possibilities for what the truth could be. I can imagine five different scenarios off the top of my head but I have no proof of any of the scenarios being true so all I can do is form and test a hypothesis. Honestly, I don't care either way so it would be a waste of my time.
Seems like a silly thread and a waste of time in the end. I only put in my two cents because I wanted to say how silly this all seems. Everybody seems to be running on emotion right now and it is kind of embarrassing to me to even read this thread as a member. If I recommended this sight to somebody and this was the first thread they read, I doubt they would read much further. Seems to me like a bunch of Mods getting butt-hurt and acting childish while ganging up on the OP because he opened what, in my opinion, is a worthless thread.

Cool....

If you want sources for anything stated I will provide them unless of course I stress that is in my opinion. If you would like a source on my opinion then it is me. I AM THE SOURCE OF MY OPINION! A lot of ATS'ers seem to want proof of people's opinions kind of like the beginning of this thread when Skeptic wanted proof of the OP's theory



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 08:19 PM
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Originally posted by Argyll
I think sometimes threads are taken down without an adequate explanation, and maybe, especially in large threads, that span 20-30 pages or so


That I can understand, as they have a tendancy to veer completely off topic with numerous T&C violations, bt my main annoyance is with threads that literally have 3,4,5 or 6 replies that do not breach T&C in any way and are still removed, these are often quite interesting threads that I follow and would like to see what develops, only to find a 404.

I agree with another point of yours though, a justified closure and a thorough warning would be good, I have seen threads closed down (some of which I have seen breach T&C) without the slightest hint from any moderators, so prehaps a warning proceedure would be much appreciated by myself and other members when the T&C is clearly breached.

But that still doesn't adress what the OP is about...

Many thanks for your reply



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