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Do moral values survive after the SHTF?

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posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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Originally posted by jonnyb578
reply to post by Skewed
 


i understand what you mean but we are not just animals. we are very much different to animals as we are clearly more advanced than animals we should be able to tell the difference between right and wrong. i do agree with an above poster that i would kill to protect my family and loved ones if they are being threatened with murder.


The only thing that sets us apart from other animals, is our ability or curse, to be able to rationalize and able to act in accordance to instinct or out of a thoughtful process. Other animals mostly act in accordance to instinct alone while we can do both. That, and our opposable thumbs. However, define good and bad, in a lot of instances the definition is subjective.




posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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If you want the best chance of survival, then you need to kick morality into touch.

Even in normal times, people are constantly held back by burdening themselves with their self-imposed morality. It's just that we can afford to indulge ourselves with a strict set of ethics when our day-to-day survival is not in immediate danger.

The simple fact of the matter is - no matter how un-PC it may be - that personal morality is illogical; the most logical position to hold is an amoral one. Considering that logic would be advantageous in a hypothetical SHTF scenario, then I imagine that our survival instinct would kick in, and most people would adopt an amoral outlook in their endeavours to stay safe.

edit on 16-6-2011 by Sherlock Holmes because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 03:31 PM
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reply to post by Sherlock Holmes
 


Yeah, but you don't have to murder and rape in order to stay safe.

Morality IS important if the human race is to survive.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 03:41 PM
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In the long run the ones that have morals will band togeather and start over, slowly restarting commerce. The looters will be short lived. It will be a great cleansing.

by the post i can tell alot of peoples morals will be throw out the door the second the cops stop showing up



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 03:57 PM
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IMO the people who maintain moral values in a post apocalyptic scenario will be the first ones to perish unless they have supplies, weapons, and a good hiding place.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 04:34 PM
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Originally posted by projectvxn
Yeah, but you don't have to murder and rape in order to stay safe.

Morality IS important if the human race is to survive.


Rape and a lot of murders are sadistic crimes, so I would consider that behaviour to be psychopathic and overtly immoral.

I think that amorality, rather than immorality, would prevail for most people in the aftermath of a breakdown in society. Their moral compasses would be reset, but that wouldn't mean that they will needlessly sink into the depths of depravity ( unless they already have psychopathic tendencies ).

People's actions would largely be expedient, and geared towards survival of their group at all costs. If that means sneaking in and pilfering the food cupboard of someone else's house, then people will not think twice about doing so. Those who have strong pangs of conscience which prevents them from behaving this way will fall victims to natural selection.

When you say that you don't have to murder people to stay safe, then I'd agree with you in the sense of cold-blooded murder. However, I think that many non-psycho people will commit murder because ''it's better to be safe than sorry''; taking a risk in trusting someone or not reacting first could be the last mistake that that person makes. Every single stranger that someone comes across could pose a real and serious risk, so it would be easy to get itchy and nervous on that trigger finger. Giving someone the benefit of the doubt would not be prudent.

I agree that morality is important for the continuation of the human race, but that would be sorted out from the pieces of the ruins. In the immediate aftermath of a societal breakdown, anything other than protecting yourself and your family or group would not be given too much consideration.

edit on 16-6-2011 by Sherlock Holmes because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 04:40 PM
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For most today morals do not survive childhood.

The majority of people believe right and wrong is subjective, if everyone is stealing it is OK

.Does not work for me though.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 06:26 PM
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you gotta have morals before you ever loose them i think.

the way i live right now is the same way i will live during a shft scenario

if noone does then whats the point of anything.
edit on 16-6-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 06:37 PM
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i think people will naturally gravitate to each other for protection and help. good people suddenly don't turn evil because of a disaster.

9/11 is a good example. the whole city came together and helped each other out. they didn't start rioting, looting and killing each other while every police officer, firefighter and ambulance were busy.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 06:49 PM
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i love the bull# replies on this topic. our world is screwed and the people in charge are the ones stealing from us to feed THEIR families. so by your warped logic its ok that they kill unknown numbers of people and destroy our planet, all in the name of providing for themselves.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 06:55 PM
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At the rate this is going it looks like im going to have to protect myself from half the people in this thread from looting me.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 06:56 PM
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It has been said:
"Those that don't learn to live together will die together"



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 07:00 PM
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reply to post by randomname
 


that 9-11 feeling lasted about 5 minutes and then it was back to what yours is mine and forget what you think.

goes back to having morals in the first place if we did as a country that feeling never would have ended.

in the end there are too many selfish people in this country.

its all about me me me and what i want.

that is the sad reality of it all and not everyone is that way but unfortunatley there are not enough of people with morals.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 07:00 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss
Another good topic would be what to do with cannibals. Do you feel sorry for them? Would you be sickened by them? I for one would not tolerate cannibalism. I could never kill someone to eat them. I guess you would have to deal with them like looters
edit on 16-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)


I think this was over looked, I would have to treat them as looters as well



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 07:38 PM
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If the SHTF scenario is a Mad Max / The Road / The Postman type of setting, I will adopt a very special type of confrontation "standard operating procedure".

I will immediately, without warning or hesitation, shoot to kill ANYONE I see that looks even a little suspicious. Shaved head into a spiked mohawk? Dead. Bandana over your face with a skull printed on it? Dead. One of those "SHTF Warriors" with the full set of battle gear complete with a balaclava? Dead. Roving group of thuggish looking men? Dead.

I have a family and will not be one of those guys overpowered by a thug(s), only to be robbed, forced to watch my family violated, and killed.

If / when the SHTF, everyone that enters my sight better look like a cuddly bunny, or they will be dead. I will take no chances in a lawless, chaotic world.

This has long been what I THOUGHT I would do... Now, after reading some posts on here about "I'd rape pillage and kill rawwrrr I'm a tough guy", I now know I will take no chances.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 07:38 PM
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I don't think we can predict what we'll end up doing when shtf. I agree the majority of people will turn rabid fighting among themselves for supplies. The looting will probably bring the installation of martial law, supposedly and sadly factually for people's protection. At that point it will probably be protecting yourself from being rounded up by uniforms and assaulted by anyone else. I'm sure in a case like that though most people will be more thankful just to see someone who isn't government and won't immediately show aggression. Will people have morals? Maybe after a while when the majority realize it's easier and safer to survive as a group than as an individual, will they be the morals they have now, I doubt it.

Everyone has their plan on what they'd do when the time came but I'm sure most of us are at the point of realizing plans have a way of collapsing around you and there are no guarantees. A few ideas come to me to increase the ats community chances of remaining human. One was mentioned today actually in the survival forum, having a group of members with extra supplies to help fellow members, another is a possible ats militia (i know it sounds extreme and really is not the proper term for it), groups of members from any given area with set meet points to provide safety and assistance to those in the area.

In my opinion if you want some form of humanity around, that's the best bet, have the groundwork laid for a nation/worldwide network to at least discourage acts of violence against each other and instead work together to stay alive and free.

My 2 cents anyway.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 07:53 PM
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I will immediately, without warning or hesitation, shoot to kill ANYONE I see that looks even a little suspicious.


this is why i bought body armor for crying out loud i swear



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 08:19 PM
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Indeed for some it will not, just as it does not today. Most likely standards fro place to place will change, that being more harsh and less moral. Others, such as myself will still hold them to regard. Even being fair when in self defense as much as possible.



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 08:23 PM
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Originally posted by camaro68ss
Another good topic would be what to do with cannibals. Do you feel sorry for them? Would you be sickened by them? I for one would not tolerate cannibalism. I could never kill someone to eat them. I guess you would have to deal with them like looters


It would depend on the motives and circumstances which led to the cannibalism.

Most of us who have been brought up in and conditioned by Western society tend to be repulsed at the thought of eating another human.

Some ancestors of mine ( extremely distant ancestors, I might add
), apparently cannibalised their enemies for spiritual reasons... believing that the only way in which they could truly vanquish the souls of their foes was to consume their bodies after a victorious battle !

Survival, by definition, must depend upon hydration and gaining necessary nutrients through food. What could possibly be more nutritious than eating a human being ?


''Deal with them like looters'' ?!

LOL. As if you keyboard warriors would be anywhere near the ''action'' if all hell broke loose. You will be cowering away behind whatever cover you can find, making ''bold'' statements about this, that and t'other... just so long as you don't actually have to do anything serious, other than typing a few trite, hackneyed and sardonic phrases on an internet message board...

''All mouth and no trousers'', as they say in my part of the world.


edit on 16-6-2011 by Sherlock Holmes because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 16 2011 @ 08:28 PM
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Originally posted by neo96this is why i bought body armor for crying out loud i swear


I'm guessing you fall into the "SHTF Warrior" category, will a full set of battle gear. I bet you also have a Kevlar helmet, black SWAT style suit, balaclava, and a thigh rig for a hand gun. People like that are the same ones in the movies and books that go crazy and immediately go all warrior screaming "Gimme all ya womens!!".

I bet you also have a pair of football shoulder pads with spikes glued on...





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