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Is the Statue of Liberty Masonic?

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posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:19 PM
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Originally posted by network dude
What do you think Intrepid?


I totally agree. My point is what's wrong if the Statue is of Masonic origin? It's a beautiful piece of work. Much better than the Eiffel Tower that was given in reciprocation. I'd embrace the work. If one is willing to accept contribution for other work, why not this one? I don't get it.




posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:26 PM
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Put another way, hypothetically if the Statue of Liberty was designed, funded, and built by Green Pay Packer fans, yet the statue itself didn't contain any particular cheeshead iconography, would (or should) the Statue of Liberty be considered a Packer's-fan monument?



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:26 PM
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reply to post by network dude
 

The statue of Liberty is Lucifer, more commonly known as Lucy as in I love Lucy...also known as the dreamgirl, the movie Dogma showed God as a comma patient but it was actually Lucifer aka Venus, Aphrodite, Mary ect.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by intrepid
 


I would love for it to be considered masonic. My goal for this thread was to find proof that it was. I would like to do a presentation on it for my lodge and a few others. I just didn't want to fly off half cocked and present incorrect information. If I was to assert that the Statue is masonic and given from the Grand Orient of France, to the US masons, as Pepsie claimed, I would be wrong, laughed at, and humiliated. Now I can explain that yes it was conceived, and built by masons, it was funded by the people of France and the pedestal was funded by the people of the US. It was however A gift from the People of France and not the Grand Orient alone.

I was looking for truth, not a fight, but I won't back down either.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:28 PM
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reply to post by JoshNorton
 


Sorry Josh, you used "if". That's obfuscation imo. I really would like an answer to my question.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:31 PM
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reply to post by illuminatiOpress
 


to quote a famous ATS poster, "I don't believe you."

No other argument needed. But you are welcome to your opinion.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by network dude
If I was to assert that the Statue is masonic and given from the Grand Orient of France, to the US masons, as Pepsie claimed, I would be wrong, laughed at, and humiliated.


That's because that would only be half right. It was given to the American people. Secondly I find it a little disturbing that you would be ridiculed by fellow Masons. Are you sure about that?


It was however A gift from the People of France and not the Grand Orient alone.


Pretty much how I'm seeing it.


I was looking for truth, not a fight, but I won't back down either.


Why? Sometimes one is wrong. That happened to me once back in 1978.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid
Sorry Josh, you used "if". That's obfuscation imo. I really would like an answer to my question.
But we're up against something we see here quite a bit: the inability to separate the actions of the individual from any or all groups that individual might belong to.

Guys who designed the statue happened to be Masons. That does not mean a Masonic lodge appointed a committee to design the statue and put those men on that committee. Hell, they might not have even been members of the same lodge for all we know. So we can agree that the men were Masons, but cannot assume that their actions were done on behalf of the fraternity.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid
what's wrong if the Statue is of Masonic origin? It's a beautiful piece of work. Much better than the Eiffel Tower that was given in reciprocation. I'd embrace the work. If one is willing to accept contribution for other work, why not this one? I don't get it.


Nothing is wrong with the Statue being Masonic. "Liberty" being the most used word of French Freemasons its entirely realistic to look into the possibility of the statue being masonic.

Neither is there anything wrong with the entirety of Washington D.C. being by masonic design. I never understood why people attach so much negativity to what is actually beautiful.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by network dude
If I was to assert that the Statue is masonic and given from the Grand Orient of France, to the US masons, as Pepsie claimed, I would be wrong, laughed at, and humiliated.


That's because that would only be half right. It was given to the American people. Secondly I find it a little disturbing that you would be ridiculed by fellow Masons. Are you sure about that?

no, nobody would ridicule me. that was actually a veiled poke at Pepsie.
But I would not feel right portraying factually incorrect history. As I said, I was hoping to come to the conclusion that it was masonic. I just took the side of it being not in order to bring all information forward.



It was however A gift from the People of France and not the Grand Orient alone.


Pretty much how I'm seeing it.


I was looking for truth, not a fight, but I won't back down either.


Why? Sometimes one is wrong. That happened to me once back in 1978.


Yea, I think it happened to me twice. But since my memory sucks so bad, I don't bring it up.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:39 PM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton
...but cannot assume that their actions were done on behalf of the fraternity.


I've seen this argument before and I discount it. What leads a person to Masonry? Ones ethics and morals. You don't need anything to be pointed to that has a memorandum to see that it's the done on the basis of ethics. That's universal despite what one could say. Thus something done by Masons ARE done in the name of the fraternity because if you weren't a man that can not stand for the fraternity, you wouldn't be a member.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:40 PM
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Since you and Skyfloating are here, and you are somewhat unbiased sources, what is you opinion on the content of this argument? Is the Statue masonic?

edit to add:

BTW, I am asking you as members, not as moderators. (wanted to make that clear before anyone gets their panties in a wad)
edit on 17-6-2011 by network dude because: Augustusmasonicus has too much beer and won't share



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:41 PM
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The stautue of Liberty is Lucifer....they LOVE LUCY heehee



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:42 PM
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Originally posted by network dude
Is the Statue masonic?


Maybe. Cant tell for sure. The thread is a good idea but I dont think the question will be resolved.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:44 PM
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Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by network dude
Is the Statue masonic?


Maybe. Cant tell for sure. The thread is a good idea but I dont think the question will be resolved.


well, that was.....very politically correct.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 04:46 PM
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FTR, I am not a Mason. I DO read a lot though.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 07:23 PM
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reply to post by pepsi78
 

That's awesome for the two Grand Orients, but alas those two Grand Orients are not recognized forms of Freemasonry nor did the Grand Orient of the US exist back in the 19th century.

reply to post by intrepid
 

Of course it is.



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 07:39 PM
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I don't understand what all the fuss is about? Whats wrong with the Statue Of Liberty being masonic? I thought it was a given that French masons had given the statue to the American people after the War Of Independence... I thought that Lady Liberty holding the torch aloft was some reference to the light bearer...!



posted on Jun, 17 2011 @ 09:14 PM
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reply to post by TheLordVeack
 


that was what I had heard too, then I looked into it and found that was all conspiracy talk. I don't know why, and I don't know why anyone would deny it either. But what I found is saying the French government gave the statue to the American government and people. Freemasons were involved, but they didn't do this on behalf of masonry.



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 04:25 AM
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That's awesome for the two Grand Orients, but alas those two Grand Orients are not recognized forms of Freemasonry nor did the Grand Orient of the US exist back in the 19th century.

Grand Orient de france did exist, they handed the statue to united states.

It even states. Bartholdi convened the Brethren of his mother lodge


When the statue was virtually complete, Bartholdi convened the Brethren of his mother lodge in order that they might review his work, even before it was shown to the United States committee



As for godf

It's the oldest in europe.


en.wikipedia.org...
e Grand Orient de France (GODF) is the largest of several Masonic organizations in France and the oldest in Continental Europe, founded in 1733.


What masonic policy is today that does not matter anyway, what matters is what it was back then.
edit on 18-6-2011 by pepsi78 because: (no reason given)




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