Canada Recognizes Libya's Rebel Council

Canada Recognizes Libya's Rebel Council

www.themarknews.com

The Canadian government has now recognized the Transitional National Council, the diplomatic arm of the Libyan rebel movement, as the “legitimate representative” of the citizens of the North African country. Foreign Affairs Minister John Baird announced the move as the House of Commons sat for a debate on whether to extend Canada's involvement in the NATO-led air campaign seeking to oust leader Moammar Gadhafi from power. While short of recognizing the TNC as the legitimate government of Libya, recognizing the Benghazi-based council as the representative gives it more diplomatic heft in i

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Well I think its all bunk
The rebels are nothing more than CIA sponsored Alqueda. there is no proof of those alleged attacks by Qaddafi and Canada's already 150 million in on bombs alone.

Speaking of which they arnt even pretending about the no fly zone anymore this is an all out attack on a sovereign country backed by lies.


www.themarknews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Originally posted by UcDat


Well I think its all bunk
The rebels are nothing more than CIA sponsored Alqueda. there is no proof of those alleged attacks by Qaddafi and Canada's already 150 million in on bombs alone.

Speaking of which they arnt even pretending about the no fly zone anymore this is an all out attack on a sovereign country backed by lies.


www.themarknews.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Herp and derp.

Do you seriously think that Libya, one of the most edcuated and developed Westernized Middle Eastern/African nations in the world is made up of mostly Al Qaeda rebels and that the Gaddafi forces (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) are innocent of any wrongdoing?

I know lending my time and brain power to this ignorant drivel is crazy, but it has to stop. The very fact that I have to think for you is bad enough, I mean actually look at the unbiased evidence, learn a bit of history, learn about Gaddafi and his sons, about Libya, about Western interventionism, about the background of this conflict and its escalation. It's much more complicated than "lulz oil," but I didn't expect much coming into this thread anyways...

Now I end this succinct post with a joke:

Gimme a "C" eh, "N" eh, "D" eh.

Originally posted by Evanescence
Herp and derp.

Do you seriously think that Libya, one of the most edcuated and developed Westernized Middle Eastern/African nations in the world is made up of mostly Al Qaeda rebels and that the Gaddafi forces (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) are innocent of any wrongdoing?

No, he doesn't think that most of the country is made up of rebels, that is why it has almost no support from the general population. How many rebels are there, really? Out of the millions that live in Libya, maybe a thousand?

Is it wrong for a country to defend it's cities agains "rebels"?

Because I can can state that it is wrong what NATO forces are doing to Libya.

I thought we were there to promote peace and democracy?

Instead, we just help prop up the next go round of dictator...

Originally posted by PplVSNWO

Originally posted by Evanescence
Herp and derp.

Do you seriously think that Libya, one of the most edcuated and developed Westernized Middle Eastern/African nations in the world is made up of mostly Al Qaeda rebels and that the Gaddafi forces (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) are innocent of any wrongdoing?

No, he doesn't think that most of the country is made up of rebels, that is why it has almost no support from the general population. How many rebels are there, really?

Is it wrong for a country to defend it's cities agains "rebels"?

Because I can can state that it is wrong what NATO forces are doing to Libya.

1.) 1,000? That indicates a profound lack of perspective. The entire eastern part of the country is pretty strongly behind the rebels despite Gaddafi's reassurance otherwise. The entire city of Benghazi alone (2nd largest in Libya) has hundreds of thousands supporting rebels. There were thousands of supporters in Benghazi the other day chanting alone. Misurata (the 3rd largest city) has shown to have enough people willing to fight the regime to stave off three-fold attacks by thousands of government troops and to outlast an intense and horrendous siege. That is not even counting civilian supporters. The entire Western Nafusa mountains is extremely anti-Gaddafi for the most part for Berber suppression. Even Sabha, a Gaddafi mercenary stronghold has firmly anti-Gaddafi clans that have started fighting in recent days.

2.) Who do you get your information from Gaddafi and Libyan state TV? That sounds a lot less credible than most media elsewhere and non lunatic leaders. Gaddafi is a dictator, even implying a dictator is a good role for a country's leader is aggravating at best. Do you think given this dictator's control of information and suppression of free speech that he'd let people in Tripoli speak their mind even if they didn't support him and weren't being brainwashed by his propaganda?

3.) Even if they were "defending cities against rebels" as you so ignorantly put it, did you forget that everything started peacefully and then Gaddafi went out chanting on state TV about massacring people in the streets, home by home, alley by alley and that opponents were all on hallucinogens? Would you sit there and take it if the American government (or any other Western power) was shooting at you? Would you go on some ridiculous forum and start saying, "it's okay for them to shoot at people and for those people to let themselves be massacred!"?

That proves my point that you have not enough perspective or knowledge or impartiality on this issue to engage in a logical debate on this extremely complex and multifaceted situation.

Originally posted by Evanescence
Herp and derp.

Do you seriously think that Libya. . .is made up of mostly Al Qaeda rebels and that the Gaddafi forces (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) are innocent of any wrongdoing?

Whether the Gaddafi forces are innocent or not is not for you or any non-Libyan to decide. It's for the people of Libya to decide. This is a civil war, not a world war.

It's a slippery slope that questions why this country, with equally horrific state-sponsored terrorism happening in many others'.

reply to post by Evanescence


You sound like you have it all figured out. How about some sources for your claims about numbers of rebel supporters. Every time I have seen media coverage of the rebels, it's always the same 10-15 guys over and over. I have found no real numbers on the size of the rebel forces, myself.

Originally posted by Evanescence


Herp and derp.

Do you seriously think that Libya, one of the most edcuated and developed Westernized Middle Eastern/African nations in the world is made up of mostly Al Qaeda rebels and that the Gaddafi forces (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) are innocent of any wrongdoing?

I know lending my time and brain power to this ignorant drivel is crazy, but it has to stop. The very fact that I have to think for you is bad enough, I mean actually look at the unbiased evidence, learn a bit of history, learn about Gaddafi and his sons, about Libya, about Western interventionism, about the background of this conflict and its escalation. It's much more complicated than "lulz oil," but I didn't expect much coming into this thread anyways...

Now I end this succinct post with a joke:

Gimme a "C" eh, "N" eh, "D" eh.

Brain power eh heres a lady with more smarts and brass tacks than me...


Now tell me you believe the lies that your a sheeple cause from where I sit the biggest liars and killers are the ones leading us. Obama Harper Cameron Sarkozy and the rest all need to go to jail for their lies the and the blood they've split.

Originally posted by imherejusttoread

Originally posted by Evanescence
Herp and derp.

Do you seriously think that Libya. . .is made up of mostly Al Qaeda rebels and that the Gaddafi forces (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) (run by someone almost everyone who meets describes as a lunatic) are innocent of any wrongdoing?

Whether the Gaddafi forces are innocent or not is not for you or any non-Libyan to decide. It's for the people of Libya to decide. This is a civil war, not a world war.

It's a slippery slope that questions why this country, with equally horrific state-sponsored terrorism happening in many others'.

That's ludicrous. Having an opinion on people being supposedly massacred and a dictator is a matter of concern for all human beings.

And "why" this country is absolutely clear to anyone who has followed the Arab Srping from its inception. I have posted a lot on it so I'm not going to go into many details, but suffice it to say: near universal support for intervention on humanitarian grounds + a madman chanting about murdering people and marching columns of tanks to do so = maybe this won't end like Egypt and we don't want it to end like Rwanda. An oversimplification, but I have written about it on here in far more detail so I'm not going to bother continuing on.

Originally posted by UcDat

Brain power eh heres a lady with more smarts and brass tacks than me...

Now tell me you believe the lies that your a sheeple cause from where I sit the biggest liars and killers are the ones leading us. Obama Harper Cameron Sarkozy and the rest all need to go to jail for their lies the and the blood they've split.

That former Congressman is an absolute idiot.

Every single point I said stands. She stands up there supporting a Libyan dictatorship bolstered by legions of people on ATS and other bastions of ignorance chanting "Gaddafi! Libya! Country!" and posting one-liners and YT videos to support their lack of arguments.

But you are right about one thing, she does seem to have more smarts than you.

Originally posted by PplVSNWO
reply to post by Evanescence

 

You sound like you have it all figured out. How about some sources for your claims about numbers of rebel supporters. Every time I have seen media coverage of the rebels, it's always the same 10-15 guys over and over. I have found no real numbers on the size of the rebel forces, myself.

Hundreds of articles I've read, YT videos I've watched, news programs I've viewed, what I know of Libyan history and studied, people I've talked to, my logical background, etc.

And you? A 1000 people? That alone is disproved by one video of protestors in Benghazi and knowledge of population statistics and some common sense. Gaddafi and Libyan TV is your only source.

I am still curious as to the whole Libya campaign's goals and reasons.

Was Ghadaffi an bad person? Don't know, never met him, but likely...trend for dictators.

Will the rebels be any better? Don't know, never met them (here is the concerning part), and I don't think our leaders know either.

I personally think that something is very amis about LIbya. How does the highest HDI rated African country suddenly become a hot spot, while much 'hotter' spots run free? Are we there to help the people? How are we helping them? Who are we protecting them from? etc, etc, etc.

There will be no win in Libya. We just stepped between two monkeys flinging poop and arbitrarily picked a side. For all we know, we are about to help usher in a new era of tyranny for the people of Libya.

reply to post by Evanescence


lol that lady was a senator went to libya saw this first hand and your who where now? ya another nobody crying ra ra ra war and towing the official line spare me your platitudes.

sorry fact is I'll take one of her over a thousand of you any day.

Originally posted by peck420
I am still curious as to the whole Libya campaign's goals and reasons.

Was Ghadaffi an bad person? Don't know, never met him, but likely...trend for dictators.

Will the rebels be any better? Don't know, never met them (here is the concerning part), and I don't think our leaders know either.

I personally think that something is very amis about LIbya. How does the highest HDI rated African country suddenly become a hot spot, while much 'hotter' spots run free? Are we there to help the people? How are we helping them? Who are we protecting them from? etc, etc, etc.

There will be no win in Libya. We just stepped between two monkeys flinging poop and arbitrarily picked a side. For all we know, we are about to help usher in a new era of tyranny for the people of Libya.

Finally some analysis and commentary that isn't "rebels=BAD, Gaddafi=HERO, Cynthia McKinney=SMART" now I'm a reasonable person I'll admit when I agree and when I'm wrong and the truth is:

Maybe Libya was better under Gaddafi.

But either way you slice it, people rose up, massacres were impending (the guy flat out promised it, you can't really deny it), the international community and Arab League was largely calling for limited intervention, and we all felt that after the Arab Spring in Egypt and Tunisia that a slight push was all that was needed to rid the world of this dangerous lunatic.

Sadly, we underestimated Gaddafi's resiliency, military capabilities, propaganda capabilities, and we overestimated the rebels' capabilities and leadership.

So now we're (the world) stuck trying to help a rebel force (not fledgling by any means, but given Gaddafi's African military is one of the best armed in Africa (and bolstered by other nations he has lent generously to) and has one of the largest nations there, it's not easy for the rebels to fight and win, though their win in a few months looks largely inevitable given the patterns that are emerging.

Gaddafi is bad. There's no question about it. The guy is classic crazy dictator and his actions support that. Libyan rebel "leaders" (how much influence they have is inconclusive) are largely from the Gaddafi regime so they are rather unappealing at the moment too.

I still maintain the vast majority of Libyan rebels are not Islamist militants. The world seems to think "Muslim fighter=Islamic militant" but that completely ignores Libyan political and economic development and the fact that Islamic militants are actually a huge minority in the Middle East, but we're scared of them nonetheless because we have been fed FUD. Yes, Islamist militants hate Gaddafi, but so do large swaths of his own countrymen for his suppression of political dissidents, their rights, their cultures, etc. It's a hugely complicated game with tribal factors as well.

Originally posted by UcDat
reply to post by Evanescence

 

lol that lady was a senator went to libya saw this first hand and your who where now? ya another nobody crying ra ra ra war and towing the official line spare me your platitudes.

sorry fact is I'll take one of her over a thousand of you any day.

If I could read that, I might be offended.

Originally posted by UcDat
reply to post by Evanescence

 

lol that lady was a senator went to libya saw this first hand and your who where now? ya another nobody crying ra ra ra war and towing the official line spare me your platitudes.

sorry fact is I'll take one of her over a thousand of you any day.

Why because she was a senator? Look at Anthony Wiener now, and multitudes of others that have been toppled in scandal. Just because she's a senator does not mean she is above reproach or should be 100% trusted. Gaddafi (or Quaddafi, or however you want to spell it) is not a nice person. He is self admittedly behind one of the worst terrorist acts of the 1980's and was not above murdering his own people to obtain his goals. He overthrew a legitimate government, and self proclaimed himself ruler. Now none of this may matter to you, but 99% of the world looks at this as just deserts.

Do not equate, however, my support of regime change in Libya to mean I support NATO's actions, I do not, as it looks now that it is swiftly becoming a ground war that we should not and cannot afford to get bogged down in. I do support , however the desire for the people of this country to get rid of this despot and become a democratic nation.

Originally posted by vkey08

Originally posted by UcDat
reply to post by Evanescence

 

lol that lady was a senator went to libya saw this first hand and your who where now? ya another nobody crying ra ra ra war and towing the official line spare me your platitudes.

sorry fact is I'll take one of her over a thousand of you any day.

Why because she was a senator? Look at Anthony Wiener now, and multitudes of others that have been toppled in scandal. Just because she's a senator does not mean she is above reproach or should be 100% trusted. Gaddafi (or Quaddafi, or however you want to spell it) is not a nice person. He is self admittedly behind one of the worst terrorist acts of the 1980's and was not above murdering his own people to obtain his goals. He overthrew a legitimate government, and self proclaimed himself ruler. Now none of this may matter to you, but 99% of the world looks at this as just deserts.

Do not equate, however, my support of regime change in Libya to mean I support NATO's actions, I do not, as it looks now that it is swiftly becoming a ground war that we should not and cannot afford to get bogged down in. I do support , however the desire for the people of this country to get rid of this despot and become a democratic nation.

Ya I do hold her in high regards she's been a thorn in TPTB's side ever since she stepped into the ring they had to rezone her district to get rid of her. So ya and comparing her to weiner is low she's in the same league as Ron Paul one of the few actually fighting for the people.

As for the Qaddafi thing its spelled with a Q and who said he was a saint? not me not her all were saying is NATO is lying and killing innocents. They've already killed and destroyed more in Libya than the so called dictator they are trying to remove ever had or would. Lybia was the best place to live in Africa before this unprovoked attack and occupation.


They have no leg to stand on legally or morally pretending they do is blind patriotism or pure shilling take your pick.

Originally posted by Evanescence
That's ludicrous. Having an opinion on people being supposedly massacred and a dictator is a matter of concern for all human beings.

. . .near universal support for intervention on humanitarian grounds + a madman chanting about murdering people and marching columns of tanks to do so = maybe this won't end like Egypt and we don't want it to end like Rwanda. . .

Why? You don't own all humans beings nor do they own you. It's okay to have an opinion on "people being supposedly massacred and a dictator", but it's a different matter entirely when it comes to physically intervening into a conflict between the people and it's government. It's a civil war. The Libyan people make their decisions. That's their sovereignty. You want to take that away? How is that, philosophically, any different than the current regime?

We didn't just intervene, we intervened and aren't able to tell who's a civilian or who's the enemy. That's x amount of people that could be alive right now contributing to the rebellion; people who want to live peacefully are caught in the crossfire for some feigned humanitarian reason that has no aim but to satsify political correctness.

That's what Canada is doing here: pre-determining the war/conflict by choosing their representatives regardless of the outcome.

The only reason Canada is doing what they are doing is because we have a "NAU alliance". The U.S and Canada are brother and sister.
Big Brother goes in and bullies while Sister will be a bitch and destroy peoples lives.

All I know is that this war wreaks of something funky.
What about Liberia? Congo? Ethiopia? Uganda?

yep we have no right to be in Libya fact we haven't risen up and taken out our corrupt lying warmongering regimes is pathetic if we had half the balls Yemany does we could free ourselves and the world of these parasites. Starting with their puppets like Obama and Harper!
Time to give them all the icelandic heave folks.

Originally posted by UcDat

Ya I do hold her in high regards she's been a thorn in TPTB's side ever since she stepped into the ring they had to rezone her district to get rid of her. So ya and comparing her to weiner is low she's in the same league as Ron Paul one of the few actually fighting for the people.

As for the Qaddafi thing its spelled with a Q and who said he was a saint? not me not her all were saying is NATO is lying and killing innocents. They've already killed and destroyed more in Libya than the so called dictator they are trying to remove ever had or would. Lybia was the best place to live in Africa before this unprovoked attack and occupation.


They have no leg to stand on legally or morally pretending they do is blind patriotism or pure shilling take your pick.

edit on 14-6-2011 by UcDat because: (no reason given)

Gaddafi can be spelled multiple ways, it's called transliteration when you're dealing with translations between foreign alphabets. And yes, Libya was a great place to live economically for a lot of people prior to this, but it was so far from a free country that it consistently ranked amongst the most oppressive regimes in the world along with North Korea and Myanmar (Burma). I mean that is some bad company.

The rest of your post is just whining about how NATO kills innocents and the rebels are bad without any proof and not mentioning much of the atrocities Gaddafi has orchestrated against his own people. I mean the guy said it on TV, how much evidence do you need for your blind eyes to open?

And I still hate McKinney. She's arrogant, race-jaded, and dumb enough to appear as a propaganda vehicle for a mass murderer. Her and that crazy Russian chess president that met Gaddafi and who is "visited by UFOs" would get along well. They are all crazy.

Originally posted by imherejusttoread

Why? You don't own all humans beings nor do they own you. It's okay to have an opinion on "people being supposedly massacred and a dictator", but it's a different matter entirely when it comes to physically intervening into a conflict between the people and it's government. It's a civil war. The Libyan people make their decisions. That's their sovereignty. You want to take that away? How is that, philosophically, any different than the current regime?

We didn't just intervene, we intervened and aren't able to tell who's a civilian or who's the enemy. That's x amount of people that could be alive right now contributing to the rebellion; people who want to live peacefully are caught in the crossfire for some feigned humanitarian reason that has no aim but to satsify political correctness.

That's what Canada is doing here: pre-determining the war/conflict by choosing their representatives regardless of the outcome.

So you're amongst the camp that thinks that not intervening in Rwanda was a great thing? I don't support all interventions for strictly practical purposes (though who doesn't want to see dictators go away?), but when there is a massive event sweeping the world (Arab Spring), massive support across the world for a no-fly zone (Arab League and BRIC abstaining), and a bunch of civilians about to be massacred by a guy who is screaming that he is going to hunt people down alley by alley...well, it's hard to ignore it. The West had a sweet business and oil deal with Gaddafi prior to this war, so insisting it's for oil is a ludicrous assertion.

Originally posted by Evanescence
That's ludicrous. Having an opinion on people being supposedly massacred and a dictator is a matter of concern for all human beings.

Damn straight it is a concern for all humans.

We should understand what the situation is really about.

Who are the rebels? The same guys we are fighting in at least Afghanistan. When the old rebel leader boasted about fighting NATO troops in Afghanistan, he was "replaced" with a Libyan living in CIA-paid exile in Langly, VA, for the last 20 years.

The rebels are all CIA funded AND supported by regional Al Qaeda. It also includes various Muslim Brotherhood factions that have commited terrorism in both Libya and the region for years.

And why are we supporting them? Because they set up a central bank in the early stages of the rebellion and the globalist institutions backed them to the hilt, just like in all situations where a sovereign country is invaded because they host their own currency and economic plans.

Now I don't know about you or where you are from, but I am Canadian and I sure as hell don't recognize the TNC as Libya's official government. Recognizing the TNC as the government of Libya is the same as recognizing the Taliban as the government of Afghanistan, which they were because they battled their way into power due to the power vacuum left over from driving out the Soviets and the communist government.

Recognizing the TNC now is a joke made laughable by history. This is blowback in action. You think we will be supporting them if and when they actually take over Libya? No. We will be outright invading them to save the poor Libyan people from terrorists (right around the time they turn their backs on NATO).

EDIT: Oh and another thing. What happens if Gaddafi's forces completely wipe out these "rebels" and Libya falls back into his full control? The coalition will invade him. This was never about the "rebels" or "humanitarian crisis"; this was regime change from the start and the "rebels" are just proxies. Terrorist proxies paid and armed by coalition nations. Hypocricy at its worst.