Preachers who are not Believers

reply to post by aceto


This is why religious leaders are amongst the most disgusting on the planet. Most know full well what they are preaching is bull#, they dish out false hope and fear to the masses, in some cases they use their position for their own perverted desires. But all it is to them is a career, an income. Don't they care about the lives they are destroying?

reply to post by AlreadyGone

I think the church has fallen into the same mindset as the rest of the world. It's so much easier to let someone else figure it all out for you, and then tell you what it means, and how to live it.

If the christian religion is going to survive in any biblical context at all. It's going to take a "grass roots" movement, and a radical departure from the buildings, the pulpit, and the collection plate.

Christianity has become big business. It's time for christians to leave the storefronts behind, and make it about their faith, and not their appearance.

I may not be a believer. But I hold nothing against the average christian. The leadership however, I have plenty against.

reply to post by Klassified


There are variations on this saying and offhand I can't remember who first said it, but it's true:

"The Jews tried to keep Christ contained within their law, while the Greeks sought to turn Him into a philosophy; the Romans made of Him an empire; the Europeans reduced Him to a culture, and we Americans have made a business of Him."

reply to post by Firefly_

But all it is to them is a career, an income. Don't they care about the lives they are destroying?

There is a quote to this effect in the study. One of the participants says money and recruitment are taught as an important aspect of pastoring.

Originally posted by Klassified
reply to post by Firefly_

 

But all it is to them is a career, an income. Don't they care about the lives they are destroying?

There is a quote to this effect in the study. One of the participants says money and recruitment are taught as an important aspect of pastoring.

There is even a book out called PastorPreneur. All about growing a successful church. It really should be no surprise, Christ spoke a lot about false teachers, false christs, etc. It was prophesied.

reply to post by Klassified


This is not stunning unless you haven't studied theology... there is a huge difference between theologists and ministers.....

reply to post by pcrobotwolf


Sorry but none of that makes any sense. A perfect being would be incapable of creating imperfection. And yes creating human beings with NO knowledge of good and evil makes us imperfect. To be honest I don't know why a perfect being would create anything as God would already be perfection, there's nowhere to go with it. The whole story is a mess if God is perfect.

reply to post by HunkaHunka

I have. But if I were still a christian, I certainly wouldn't want these guys in the pulpit preaching scripture to me.

And I wouldn't there seminary professors educating pastors who were going to be filling those pulpits.

So stunning is a subjective word depending on perspective. You wouldn't want a christian teaching buddhism. So why would anyone want an atheist teaching christianity?

Thanks for posting HH.

Originally posted by Klassified
reply to post by HunkaHunka

 

I have. But if I were still a christian, I certainly wouldn't want these guys in the pulpit preaching scripture to me.

And I wouldn't there seminary professors educating pastors who were going to be filling those pulpits.

So stunning is a subjective word depending on perspective. You wouldn't want a christian teaching buddhism. So why would anyone want an atheist teaching christianity?

Thanks for posting HH.

edit on 6/11/2011 by Klassified because: redacted.

I dunno... I know many Christians who would do a great job teaching Buddhism...

I don't think the person giving religious instruction needs to be under the same delusions as those receiving it...

reply to post by Klassified


very very interesting - and i've often suspected as much. personally i believe in God but not in religion. religion is an institution created and administered by human beings - how can it not end up being corrupted?

i've been saying for awhile now, a big part of Jesus' message was anti-religious. why else did he overturn the money-changers tables in the temple? and why else did the establishment have him killed? it astounds me that so many people don't seem to make the connection....

I don't know how anyone can read Jesus' "not so among you" lecture or about his foot-washing example and think he came to merely start the second verse of the same old song. He turned the kingdom upside down (see the first image here), free the imprisoned, and lift burdens from the oppressed. Everything he did and said was a judgment against the old order of hierarchy, but like the ancient Israelites demanding a king, Christians demand a pastor or pope to rule over them. And that's what they got.

reply to post by SaberTruth


(Everybody has some doctrine or dogma, mixed or not. There is no such thing as a completely neutral person, or one who does not bring certain convictions to the table. The question is never whether morality can be legislated, but whose morality it will be. )

that may be a primitive human condition, the desire to control and trash others, as seen in animal behavior.
the pecking order.

i live in Massachusetts, where religeous freedom, in the sense of individuals being able to express their own thoughts is better than anywhere else i have lived at.

yet here the persecution of those who smoke cigarettes, the "East German" propaganda signs everywhere, serves the same primitive need to trash and control others of ones species.

i resented the constant attempts to brainwash me when i was young.
cultural, religeous, political, school, church, it was everywhere.

neutral to me, is the respect of the other person, whichever Faith they follow.
helping others according to what is best for that person, with no agenda of political or religeous ideology.

for years i helped kids learn skiing, skating,surfing,etc.
while John 4-18, for me, was the basis of how to help kids overcome their negatives(fear of heights, etc), and learn to have a nice day, i never mentioned religion or politics to a kid.
i respected them as a person.

you are right about morality being legislated, whether religeous or cigarettes, it's repulsive.

Originally posted by citizen6511
that may be a primitive human condition, the desire to control and trash others, as seen in animal behavior.
the pecking order.

Now that you mention this, it's actually being actively promoted as God's order! The growing return to blatant misogyny and hierarchy is taken not from scripture but from animals. But calling this out earns a person some pretty vile labels.

i resented the constant attempts to brainwash me when i was young.
cultural, religeous, political, school, church, it was everywhere.

It certainly is everywhere. Re. education, I have collected quotes from founders and authorities over the years which make it very clear what their agenda is: to indoctrinate, to take children's upbringing from parents and give it to the state, to undermine morality, to control thought and behavior, etc. It is deliberate.

while John 4-18, for me, was the basis of how to help kids overcome their negatives(fear of heights, etc), and learn to have a nice day, i never mentioned religion or politics to a kid.
i respected them as a person.

Yes, Jesus showed by example that the lost were to be pitied and helped. Yet he also showed that they were to be told the truth, not told how to be better lost people. Many Christians fail to make that critical distinction, which is why the churches are so weak and can't seem to remember what the Christian faith is anymore.

Originally posted by aceto
reply to post by Klassified

 

Religion is just a way for semi intelligent people to control the actions and thoughts of the less intelligent people around them. That is how it started, and it continues today.

You see i have heard this statement alot from atheists and i cant seem to agree to it, I think you got it all wrong, if you look at the facts its actually making us more intelligent, the ability to see true right from true wrong.

The only way we are being controlled is by being manipulated into becoming ----> better people

Lets Analyze the Lord's prayer shall we:

Our Father Who art In Heaven
(our creator who resides in heaven)
Hallowed be thy name
(holy is your name)
Thy Kingdom Come
(Your Kingdom come)
Thy Will Be Done On Earth As It Is In Heaven
(your will be done on earth as it is in heaven)
Give Us Our Daily Bread
(please ensure that we have food on our plates)
And Forgive Us Our Trespasses As We Forgive Those Who Trespass Against Us
(and please forgive us for the people we hurt and please for give those who hurt us)
Lead Us Not Into Temptation
(Dont let us be tempted by evil)
But Deliver Us From Evil
(and keep evil away)
For thine Is Kingdom,The Power And The Glory
(Because You are the Kingdom, strongest and the most holy)

Amen.

Now you tell me what you feel from that, i dont feel controlled, i feel as though i have learnt more things, it basically says dont commit any evil crimes, dont steal, treat each other as equal, love fellow man as though he was your own flesh and blood.

I see nothing in here that is control. even if it is control (which i fail to see) It is the teachings of the purist of hearts and the upmost positivity.

If Religion had not been abandoned by the masses, we would not have all of these criminals running around, raping people, killing people for a materialistic object known to us as money. (you know TPTB want you to depend on their materialism,plastic, fakeness)

The teachings tell us of a way to use our free will to do good. e.g not swearing, not shouting, not cheating all those petty sins, create negative energy, that energy that you emit to everyone around you without you knowing it.

Ever walked into a room at a party, where a fight has taken place, the fight has stopped, and everyones back to normal, but you from just entering the room get an unexplainable emotion of aggression run down your spine? as though you know something has just taken place here.

That is the left over negative emotion embedding itself into the walls and doors etc...

We must stop this ideology that we are nothing more than mere animals in a lost world with no hopes, with no dreams it just makes you depend more the materialistic of life, "oh im not going anywhere after this life, so i will go spend some money and make sure i live the best life possible" but would it not be good to take half your money, dont just put it in a charity box, take the money and give it too poor people, in their hands, watch them use it, watch them smile and run in joy and happiness. That is God's will, to cleanse the hands of the wicked and to clean the hands of the poor.

But no it doesent work that way for you does it,

a great war is coming with the constant rise of knowledge of TPTB and the coming of the antichrist. o btw did anyone come to think that it is said, that "when the antichrist comes he will have ONE bulging eye" hmmmm The illumi always make their pop stars cover one eye, their symbol is one bulging eye at the top of a pyramid....................................................................

Eye of Horus = one bulging eye hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Put two and two together and you get four (if you do not get the use of that here, may he please help us).


Peace and love

reply to post by Klassified


CHRIST HIMSELF was MOST HARSH toward the RELIGIOUS LEADERS of His dusty pathed days.

Thankfully, I hate RELIGION as well.

MORE THANKFULLY, a REAL RELATIONSHIP

WITH CHRIST HIMSELF

HAS made and makes ALL THE DIFFERENCE.

Those with merely an argument need never be at the mercy or one down from those with an authentic EXPERIENCE

of walking with the RISEN CHRIST YESHUAH.