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Doug Vogt Expert Interviewed Files Criminal Charges With The F.B.I vs Obama's forged BC

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posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 12:14 AM
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Originally posted by QuantumPhysicist
reply to post by Stormdancer777
 


Yup! That is the exact document. I downloaded it from the white house's government website and marked circles on it. You would be able to do the same thing too. The "k" is real and you can tell because they letter is kind of blurry. But the rest of the word has perfect square edges which can only be done on a computer editing program. In Laymen's terms anyway


Yep so many things wrong with the BC its a feat of pure will not to see it's fake


Wonder how long congress the FBI and the media will hold off the inevitable? No way will he make the next election I think.




posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 07:04 AM
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Originally posted by dillweed
If this holds it could be the greatest moment in the history of the USA


It will not hold, it is just another birther beatup over nothing


We know virtually nothing about Barry Soetoro. Don't you find that rather odd? The guy is a fraud, and needs to be sacked.


Who is Barry Soetoro? Just another birther made up story!



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 08:10 AM
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reply to post by QuantumPhysicist
 


Main stream America isnt buying this birth certificate conspiracy. So i wouldnt hold my breath while waiting for Obama to get impeached. Youll likely be holding it for a very very long time.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 08:17 AM
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Alrite I'm about 8 mins into the vid. And the guy is listing the requirements for the birth certificate that are required by law.

One of them is a seal right? Says it's not there on the BC?


Well I've played with the levels in photoshop. As you can see there is the seal. It's very faint. But it's there. Probably since there isn't any contrast in the seal the scanning software didn't pick it up very well.
All it is is raised paper anyways. Not black text.

Can we agree the seal is there?



edit on 9-6-2011 by grey580 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 08:25 AM
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Originally posted by QuantumPhysicist



I'm sure even a 5th grader could point out these irregularities. Obama could have done a better job


I'm not looking to dicker with a QuantamPhysicist and all but I reckon a 5th grader might have noted the "M" is part of the form. It is there with the other pertinent recurring data to save typing.

Just an observation.


/MD



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:00 AM
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The simple fact is that this man is not looking at Obama's birth certificate.

He's looking at a file that came from a scan that came from the real document. It is a digital representation of Obama's BC. It's a picture, made by using ones and zeros to graphically display something that looks very similar (but not even close to exactly) like the actual document.

There is NO WAY ANYONE can take a picture of a document off the Internet and verify it as either real or fake. And anyone who would even try is not a professional document verification expert, that's for sure.

Besides that, notice the number of times the man says words like "likely" and "probably", and "may have" and other key non-committal phrases all throughout his explanations. That indicates someone has presumed a conclusion and is filling in the story to match his presumptive conclusion.

I you walk into a room and find a dead cat hanging from a lamp and a live mouse huddled in the corner, you can assume that the mouse killed the cat. And your story would have to be filled with these non-committal phrases: "The mouse likely attacked the cat from behind and probably pounced on his back and may have bitten into the cat's neck..." and so on. You could make up an entire story to make it seem reasonable that the mouse killed the cat, but when you take out all the non-committal words, you have nothing. No proof, no evidence, no facts. Just a cat hanging from a lamp with a mouse huddled in the corner.

That's what the birther movement has done with their cause. They want Obama out. They determined that his BC was fake and they have been busy little bees ever since, trying desperately to make the evidence match their conclusion. But the fact is, there are explanations for everything we see on this digital representation of Obama's BC.

This is not in any way scientific or trustworthy.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:05 AM
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Originally posted by grey580
Alrite I'm about 8 mins into the vid. And the guy is listing the requirements for the birth certificate that are required by law.

One of them is a seal right? Says it's not there on the BC?


Well I've played with the levels in photoshop. As you can see there is the seal. It's very faint. But it's there. Probably since there isn't any contrast in the seal the scanning software didn't pick it up very well.
All it is is raised paper anyways. Not black text.

Can we agree the seal is there?



edit on 9-6-2011 by grey580 because: (no reason given)


Yep looks like a seal to me good catch.

@ Maskeddebater your saying that m is preprinted on the form could be tho it seems a bit unusual. Is it the same on that one for the twins?

Still doesn't account for the multiple typesets and other discrepancies.


edit on 9-6-2011 by UcDat because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:12 AM
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Originally posted by UcDat
@ Maskeddebater your saying that m is preprinted on the form could be tho it seems a bit unusual. Is it the same on that one for the twins?


Yes




posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:23 AM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by UcDat
@ Maskeddebater your saying that m is preprinted on the form could be tho it seems a bit unusual. Is it the same on that one for the twins?


Yes



Oh dear, so yet another birther silly claim destroyed. When will they give up with their silly claims?



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:24 AM
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If I heard him correctly, he did not deny there was a seal.

His point was,knowing the process and the equipment, the seal does not look like it was embossed into the BC.

That alone, accordingly to him is open to suspect.

Even if it's a copy it should have different characteristics.


I have no clue...just pointing out his explanation.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:28 AM
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reply to post by spoor
 


My guess is never. Birtherism has become a fanatical religion. It takes faith. And the faithful will continue to preach their gospel regardless what the facts show, regardless of the truth and regardless of the crazy machinations they need to go through to convince people of the fantasy.

It interesting that they will pore over the document representation with a fine tooth comb and skepticism, but when some unknown guy claims he's an expert and points out these anomalies (that appear on ANY document scanned, converted and opened in Adobe) the birthers just accept it as fact without one question or doubt.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 09:58 AM
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reply to post by lokdog
 

Impeachment is a real thing, just ask Bill Clinton.
No need to spew your rhetoric in these threads, just move on...this a job for experts!



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 10:10 AM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by spoor
 


My guess is never. Birtherism has become a fanatical religion. It takes faith. And the faithful will continue to preach their gospel regardless what the facts show, regardless of the truth and regardless of the crazy machinations they need to go through to convince people of the fantasy.

It interesting that they will pore over the document representation with a fine tooth comb and skepticism, but when some unknown guy claims he's an expert and points out these anomalies (that appear on ANY document scanned, converted and opened in Adobe) the birthers just accept it as fact without one question or doubt.


whoa easy now

we are doing so well with this debate no need to get personal unless you got facts to discredit mr Vogt?

So the m is confirmed as preprinted on the doc and grey found the seal great work.

But neither of those fact counter the many other discrepancies on the BC

As for your but its a copy argument I'd say first its an official certifiable document and copy or no we can all see the flaws quite clearly. Most obvious are the issues with the margin text and with the different typesets. As for him being qualitative he does say straight up its a fraud and that he's filed charges with the FBI.

In my mind its a far greater leap of faith to believe in this document Obama and the people behind him than the fact its forged.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 10:16 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


Holy Cow! That is one jacked up typewriter. Look at how bad the letters are in Los Angeles and Honolulu.
I think some of the letter discrepancies in the obama BC are from a over used and jacked up typewriter.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 10:29 AM
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The fellow in the interview said a couple things that make me doubt he is an "expert".

He couldn't remember that PDF stands for Portable Document Format, pretty basic stuff.

He said that PDF was a standard arrived at by a committee 20 years ago, this is nonsense.

The PDF format was a proprietary format created by Adobe in 1993.

It was released to the ISO committee as a public format in 2008.

One would think an "expert" would know simple stuff that a layman, like myself, can look
up in 5 minutes.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by UcDat

As for your but its a copy argument I'd say first its an official certifiable document and copy or no we can all see the flaws quite clearly. Most obvious are the issues with the margin text and with the different typesets. As for him being qualitative he does say straight up its a fraud and that he's filed charges with the FBI.

In my mind its a far greater leap of faith to believe in this document Obama and the people behind him than the fact its forged.


I'm looking at this Nordyke BC. It seems that the bottom part with the seal is a seperate piece of paper that sits on a metal plate or something of the sort. Or was seperate when this copy of the original was made. I can see the seal there. Funky.

Both dates accepted seem to have been placed there with a self inking Stamp machine. That could account for their faded appearance.
Like this one.

So that's out.

Ya gotta remember that a manual typewriter is basically a little typeset font on a metal rod. Metal can flex so you can get variations. Selectric typewriters from ibm are different in that they use a ball to have the font.

here you can see the little rods in the typewriter.

Those rods are bendable and they have a habit of sometimes getting stuck if you type too fast and they can bend. Might not be to hard to imagine that the font would be crooked at times if there's striking between rods.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 10:47 AM
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Originally posted by Version100

The fellow in the interview said a couple things that make me doubt he is an "expert".

He couldn't remember that PDF stands for Portable Document Format, pretty basic stuff.

He said that PDF was a standard arrived at by a committee 20 years ago, this is nonsense.

The PDF format was a proprietary format created by Adobe in 1993.

It was released to the ISO committee as a public format in 2008.

One would think an "expert" would know simple stuff that a layman, like myself, can look
up in 5 minutes.



yeah that an expert didn't know what a pdf stood for boggles my mind a bit.

And in my experience. A CEO usually knows a good basic knowledge of the technology. But not the in depth knowledge of an person that like an IT guy.

IMO I think that Obama got a copy of his birth certificate from Hawaii. Then had a staffer scan it on his Mac and upload it to the net.
I doubt that a government office would shell out the money it costs to buy a mac. Too pricey.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 11:06 AM
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Originally posted by UcDat
no need to get personal unless you got facts to discredit mr Vogt?


I don't even know that it's Mr. Vogt's voice. It's a voice of someone who doesn't even know what PDF stands for or when the format was originated. He speaks out of his ass. It doesn't give me confidence. And the interviewer is a known extreme Obama hater. He's been working to unseat Obama for years. He has repeated lies about Obama many times. He's as trustworthy as Jerome Corsi.



But neither of those fact counter the many other discrepancies on the BC


The other discrepancies have been debunked in other threads and on the Internet.



I'd say first its an official certifiable _/quote]

You would, huh? You would be wrong. It's not a document at all. It's an uploaded, converted, scan of a document. Let me clarify:

This is not a dog:



It's a digital representation of a dog. It doesn't eat or sleep or poop. It's NOT the actual dog. It contains none of the qualities of an actual dog. It's not warm or fuzzy. You can't tell ANYTHING about this dog except get a general idea of what she looks like. In reality, her coloring is slightly different and she actually has back feet. The hair around the edges does not glow as it appears in the photo and her face is complete and not all blacked out.

These are not flaws in the dog. They are misrepresentations of the actual object. If there are flaws, they are in the digital representation, not in the source item.



As for him being qualitative he does say straight up its a fraud and that he's filed charges with the FBI.


Anyone can file charges about anything. That means nothing.



In my mind its a far greater leap of faith to believe in this document Obama and the people behind him than the fact its forged.


I do not 'believe' in this digital representation or any other. I've already said that no one can verify a document over the Internet as real or fake.
edit on 6/9/2011 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 11:16 AM
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Here's a nice rebuttal to Mr. Vogt's 'findings'...

www.obamaconspiracy.org...



I can prove Mr. Vogt “wrong” in his contention that the long form is a forgery quite simply: The State of Hawaii’s web site says: “On April 27, 2011 President Barack Obama posted a certified copy of his original Certificate of Live Birth.” QED. So there is no need for me to prove that Vogt is wrong, but I will explain why he is wrong.



posted on Jun, 9 2011 @ 11:16 AM
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reply to post by Benevolent Heretic
 


sure lets try this argument then

if you gave me a three dollar bill and i made a photocopy of it and sent that copy to an expert and he told me its a fake would ya doubt him?

just saying a copy is all you get when you reorder your BC is that not usable as ID? as for it being off the 'internet' sure off the official Whitehouse site...

as for this guy talking out his ass i could very easily say the same about you but unlike you he does give his real name and credentials both verifiable.



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