Arizona Wins Immigration Suit!

Originally posted by Annee
Nice map -- but feel we should have access to the full report.

www.stateline.org...

I should have posted link, I did in another thread (it is embedded in the image). but you're right there's some really good info in there.

Those workers are likely to hold low-skilled jobs, such as construction, where their share has risen from 10 percent in 2003 to 17 percent last year. Illegal immigrant workers also hold high numbers of farming, building services, grounds keeping and maintenance jobs...

17% of construction jobs?? outrageous.

reply to post by querious

I can see you are passionate and take this issue personally.

Just have a few questions for you to put in context ( I have an idea, but lets see).

1- did your grandparents(from what you said were illegal immigrants) take welfare, or apply for government assistance (doubt it, probably like my grandparents and would rather starve first)?

2- From their teachings to you (so I doubt it): did they save every dime and send money back to Sicily, to eventually move back to?

- did they live in housing with several other of your illegal family members, to maximize savings for above question?

- Did they discuss and exchange ideas on how to game and exploit the system with friends and workers, because it was easy (a leading question I know.. but relevant.)?

- Not that it matters, a lot of good hard working citizens have many children, but how many siblings did your mom or dad have?

There is a big difference, and you are embracing a culture because you might think your pride is somehow affected, I assure you it's not the same thing.

Your grandparents sounded very wise and they were in the true American spirit, if you want to immigrate to another country this should be in your soul


"you are an American, forget about the old country, this is your country and it's the greatest in the world and you have every reason to be proud of being an American"

ok 1st i SAID my sicilian grandparents MAY have been illegals and perhaps other relatives from sicily.
i only met my sicilian grandmother once,when i was 4, and it was on the sly, cause grandpa from sicily bodily threw my mom out into the street and disowned her, not cause of lil old me in her belly, but cause my daddy was a "'n-word'". this is where i 1st was told to forget the old country and later got chewed out by grandma grandpa, and an "uncle" [actually grandpa's nephew, and more of a father than "dear old dad"]and told the same.
my maternal grandpa was in the construction business, whatever that means. i'm also told he came to regret disowning mom, cause you see both my brother and i took after her and not dad though i have the family nose [jewish].

i was raised by my paternal grandmother, who was the daughter of a puerto rican farmer of Sephardim descent, they came seeking freedom to practice their beliefs, only to find that the inquisition had beaten them to it, were given the choice to convert or go back to spain, a trip they probably would not have survived. so conversion it was.

my paternal granpa was cuban of blackamoor descent who came to the USA because in cuba during the rule of batista and his criminal friends like meyer lansky he had no hope at ANYTHING just because of the color of his skin. [while i am no communist, neither i nor any of my family have any sympathy at all for the exile movement we know what those people really want and the embargo is proof enough] he died shortly after the meeting.

my parents were americans
they were also speedfreaks

so there's poor old grandma a widow with 2 grand kids her only child dad, and mom speedfreaks, and no help from mom's side of the family. with only her social security and a 3rd grade education. living in Harlem in the late 60's and 70's.

the answer to your 1st question [and the idea's you have] is F.U.

your 2nd question is facetious; of course grandma and her 10 siblings supported their aging parents.
they weren't drug laundering or planning to be big shots when they went back to the old country.
so take your doubts and...

your 3rd leading question reveals more about you than you think, i already told you that my grandparents immigrated legally.
never mind that grandma was a citizen via congressional fiat already, they still made her go thru ellis island on account of grandpa, who was a tobacconist and printer by trade. when other relatives came grandma would take em in until they managed to get on their own feet. and laziness was not encouraged, i myself was taught the basics of printing and bookbinding by my "uncle" [who was himself a guest once as well.] from a very early age.

grandma always taught us to study so we wouldn't have to work hard or live off of handouts. but was not above getting anything from the government if it was for us.***

ironically, i only applied once a few years ago as grandma lay dying from a series of strokes, no jobs see. and me the only caregiver. everybody else was off running in the rat race and baby bro was off jailing iraquis he'd send money bless him, but...
guess what, sorry no aid for you, and there were sort of hints like 'you're young and have future just let her die or you won't have a life"

while folks with bling and cellphones and cars got aid. many for not keeping it in their pant's

and btw grandma started working on the farm as a child and was still gainfully employed well into her 80's until she had a fall and broke her hip. then diabetes complications: glaucoma, and emphysema and then finally a series of strokes

the doctors had sent her home to die, claiming she had a month left, lol, i could write a book about all the times the doctors gave up on her only to have a "miracle"happen, when grandma would rally.

hell the next to last time. dad, a crackhead by now, in his 50's, asked her "when are you gonna hurry up and die already?"

well grandma got pissed, got up and "quoted" nikita kruschev: 'i will bury you! and thus it happened, OD less than a year later.

i had to get up at 7am to set up the equipment that fed her thru a tube because it had to be a slow drip i'd take down the empty bag at 3 or 4 am, and get up again at 7 to set up the equipment.

she died right in front of me one sunday afternoon never having fully regained conciousness since the strokes of 9 months previous at the age of 96. as they were carting her off to the funeral home, the nurse that came and confirmed her death took me aside and told me to call SS to report the death and claim funeral expenses:

"but, grandma already left all that paid up and i kept up the payments till 4 months ago when it was all settled...

"i know that, but SS doesn't, you've been a caregiver for her 24/7 9 months straight, who's gonna pay for that, nobody, take the money while you get your life back in order"

so i called once i'd reported grandma's and SS # it was:
"thank you very much and have a..."

"woah wait a sec! i was told by the nurse you're supposed to send me a check to help cover funeral expenses...!

"OHH!!! we don't do that any more. CLICK Dial-tone...

a year later i read somewhere that there was some sort of fraud being investigated re theft of those funds.

let's wrap this up

***nor was she above accepting a free trip for me my brother and herself offered her by
THE MOONIES
["now remember these people were nice enough to give me tickets for this trip for us 3 so be polite and everything when they talk to you, but remember now, these people don't believe in god or jesus, so don't believe any religious stuff they may tell you"]

where were you on july 4, 1976?

i was in washington dc for the bi-centennial, and in the rockets multi-colored glare i remember how proud i felt and that my grandparents were right.

i am older and wiser now.

when i was in 2nd grade grandma, my brother and i arrived at the entrance of the apartment building we lived in to find that one of the local kiddie-gangs had set up a rope and were collecting a toll

"pay or bend over" well grandma pulled a switch blade and cut through that rope.
the lesson i learned ?

don't take crap from anybody.

which brings to the why and wherefore of my bothering to reply.

not to assist you in your pathetic attempts at fitting me in your box and slapping a label on me. [and can you really claim to know anything about me any way?]

but to show any one who should stumble upon this thread,
how stupid and ignorant the post i'm replying to really is, no matter how patronizingly politely it maybe phrased.

if i were to become dictator of this country [a la Sulla] one of the 1st things i'd do is make sure none of y'all could f up the country again by forbidding anyone who was a citizen of the 1st republic the right to vote when the 2nd republic is established after i resign. there will be no sheeple endangering my country that way.

reply to post by Twisted1


while anned and i once had a difference in opinion recently
doesn't mean i don't agree with the spirit of her replies

at 1st i too misunderstood what she was trying to say

she isn't on the hater train with y'all
she is simply pointing out the DOUBLE STANDARD!

so please, give it a rest

nobody is repeating the same old tired [and BS] arguments when it comes to our northerly neighbors
why? cause unless they're quebecois and speak english with an accent nobody would ever suspect

ahh but brown people...

[many now fleeing the hell on earth that NAFTA and the drug-dealing "warriors" of the dea, have created there, never mind how american arms-merchants are making a killing.

and never mind the righteous SPEW of the good ol decadent spiritual descendents of lowlifes like sam houston and the "indian" "fighters" who would always attack when the men weren't around or sleeping like santa ana's boys were when houston machine gunned them in their tents. but don't get me started. it's 3 am now]

hope that cleared things up for you.

reply to post by grey580
I wish to dissagree, they ARE illegal immigrants and as such criminals, how would you like them to help theirselves to your prosperity, and reap all the benefits of your labors throughout life. They are just trying to make a better life..... well do it in their country. The main thrust of this, is the mexican invasion, there are roughly 30,000,000 here taking a LOT of our money and services, causing us to do without. Their government is activly helping them to cross the border with instruction pamplets and instructions on how to pillage the social systems we have in place. I'm native if California, I'm white, and damn if I will feel any kind of shame or guilt for being so. Call me racist if that floats your boat, I could not care less, even less than less. I'm a Vet, and have worked my entire life, and not for some hobits to come raid my fridge and home and jobs and my governments suppplies for its citizens. Your bleeding heart sympathy is you, not the rest of the world. If your country is corrupt, then you strive to make it better, and likewise there are many of your countrymen who will endevor the same . Tyrany can not stand long if honest citizens fight back . let them do it in their country.

reply to post by Becoming


That is because they are all from "Minnesota"

reply to post by KingAtlas


Large numbers of Chinese also helped build the railroad. But they are not allowed to come here illegally either.
I have no control over immigration policies of 1929. But now if people needed to be immigrated to work, they get a work visa. Period. Which is why we are now getting a substantial Indian population. Which despite not having the greatest economic background either, manage to come here legally.

reply to post by Becoming


>>>>I lived in Arizona for about 5 years.

Didn't meet many Canadians living there.

I saw a show on tv talking about some state (not Arizona) being forced by the federal government to enforce immigration laws. I was like what? Are we in la la land? The government all of a sudden wants to stop illegal immigration. Sometimes their antics just boggles the mind.

reply to post by haarvik
This is a step but the real problem is one the courts continue to side step. That is enforcing existing laws that make illegal entry into the United States criminal acts.

We have de facto accepted acts of criminality on invading Mexican National's part and opted to make ourselves criminals instead. This is highly irregular.

Good for Arizona. Yes illegal immigrants are criminals. Just for the record, I'm a registered Democrat. My family came to the U.S. legally. We came here from the Islamic Republic of Iran (we are Christian). If we can do it legally from half way across the world, then why can't these people? (no we are not rich and have no political connections, just average blue collar people) In fact more members of my family recently (three years ago) immigrated to the U.S. legally as well, again, blue collar average Joes. So I stand by my statement that these people are criminals (because they immigrated here illegally). We don't need this tug on the old heart strings b.s. rhetoric.

Seems to me that the U.S. should adopt similar policies and laws in regards to illegal immigration as Mexico.

From: NewAmerican:
Article entitled: Lucky Illegals Caught at Border Won't Face Mexico's Stiff Law.

An excerpt...

Mexico unlike the United States, takes immigration seriously, as J. Michael Waller showed in a report for the Center for Security Policy.

Published in 2006 during the debate about the McCain-Kennedy amnesty bill, Waller's report demonstrates just how tough Mexican law is. "Mexico, which annually deports more illegal aliens than the United States does," he writes, "has much to teach us about how it handles the immigration issue."

Immigrants are allowed in only if they will contribute to Mexican society, and the authorities are required to keep track of them. As well, "foreigners with fake papers, or who enter the country under false pretenses, may be imprisoned." Those "who fail to obey a deportation order are to be punished" and "[f]oreigners who are deported from Mexico and attempt to re-enter the country without authorization can be imprisoned for up to 10 years." Visa violators face six years in prison.

The bottom line, he reported, is that "under Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony."

1.) A penalty of up to two years in prison and a fine of three hundred to five thousand pesos will be imposed on the foreigner who enters the country illegally.

2.) Foreigners with legal immigration problems may be deported from Mexico instead of being imprisoned.

3.) Foreigners who “attempt against national sovereignty or security” will be deported.

4.) And Mexicans who help illegals are also considered criminals.

In 2010, Amnesty International reported that illegals in Mexico, almost all of them on their way to the United States, are frequently abused and, in some cases, raped.

Local officials throughout Mexico help gang members exploit the travelers, Amnesty reported, and Mexican officials often abuse them at checkpoints.

Here is the link to the article.

www.thenewamerican.com...

Any decent person can not belittle another person for wanting to improve the quality of life for his family through hard work. I'm against illegal immigration, but I have no quarrels with Hispanic people. They are an extremely hardworking people. There is no denying they work 10x as hard as I do for probably 1/10th of what I get paid.

The problem is that it's not just the hardworkers who are crossing our unsecured borders, but also gang members, thugs, drug dealers, etc. which America has enough of already.

Therefore, we need to secure our borders and have a proper way of documenting those who want to come over so they can be properly vetted.

who built the border line walls ? THEY DID

who knocks down the walls when they want to? THEY DO

who builds stuff around the towns and citys and sweats theyre asses off and get minimum wage? THEY DO

SO WERE THE REAL IMMIAGRANTS ? WE WERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

btw all they wanna do is wrk and help out theyre familys. i work at a golf course (LAND SCAPING) with a lot of immigrants and i will not kid you not these men work 2 or 3 times harder then any american or white person WHY? cause they can do it faster and know how to do it and cause they wanna make the money doing it.

so for all the people who hate immigrants how about you guys go back where your parents came from unless you a native american

Originally posted by burntoast
so for all the people who hate immigrants how about you guys go back where your parents came from unless you a native american

I am native...Cherokee...and they can go home yesterday! Which part of "ILLEGAL" do you bleeding hearts not get??? Once they fill out an I-9, or apply for a drivers license they are committing a FELONY! You can take your "woe is the illegal" crap and stick it where the sun don't shine! I don't care if they are Mexican, British, Polish whatever, ILLEGAL is ILLEGAL! PERIOD! Don't care for justification as to why they are here, they just need to go home and enter the LEGAL way just like so many others!

last time i checked bush opened the borders (canada and mexico) not really meaning the illegal are ILLEGAL

btw why must u be on the other side if the NON illegal havent done nothing for you but only hurt your ansesters ?

Originally posted by burntoast
who built the border line walls ? THEY DID

who knocks down the walls when they want to? THEY DO

who builds stuff around the towns and citys and sweats theyre asses off and get minimum wage? THEY DO

SO WERE THE REAL IMMIAGRANTS ? WE WERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

btw all they wanna do is wrk and help out theyre familys. i work at a golf course (LAND SCAPING) with a lot of immigrants and i will not kid you not these men work 2 or 3 times harder then any american or white person WHY? cause they can do it faster and know how to do it and cause they wanna make the money doing it.

so for all the people who hate immigrants how about you guys go back where your parents came from unless you a native american

LOL Say hello to my dads generation my friend. I guarantee you no Mexican could outwork my dad and a lot of the older generation Americans. You are comparing them to the youth of the nation which i have no doubt they can outwork.

In any case this is not about race its about laws being enforced. Their are lots of Americans on the streets without jobs why are you not picketing for them?

Are you guys racists against your own countrymen??? Sounds like it.

reply to post by burntoast


Yes, they took our land, however it is still my homeland. i will be damned if I will sit back and let ANOTHER wave of people take over what I have now!

This whole argument about arresting illegal immigrants is stupid. Of course we should, and deport them. If not, then what? I guess open up all the borders right? Disband all border agents, let everyone in who can get here and give them the same privileges that tax paying citizens have. Imagine that, just for a second.

OK, so nobody in their right mind is for that so obviously we have to control who enters the US and deport everyone else.

Yes, some US citizens are as bad, and maybe worse than some illegals, but they are our problem. Let other countries deal with theirs.

Has any one of you who oppose our immigration laws asked themselves why well defined borders have been enforced since tribal times?

We are a nation of laws. If you come here legally you are checked for criminal activity and diseases. Thousands of our citizens have died because of illegals and our laws not being upheld yet we are called racists and haters. Many of these illegals have had previous arrests and deportations. Many of our children have been victoms of illegal immigrant pedophiles, yet we are called racist and haters. Millions of our citizens have been displaced in the workforce by illegals and are desperately trying to care for their families, yet we are called racists and haters.

To stand up for illegals and shove the citizen aside like a sack of potatoes is a shame! Many of the so called racists and haters have donated money to the poor for most of their lives until they were unable to provide for themselves and their own family. How dare anyone assume we are racist or haters when we want our laws upheld and our people protected!

reply to post by Night Star


It is pointless to try and rationalize with these people. You can show them the facts and they will not listen. A number of people here have posted personal experiences that in themselves should have any rational person agreeing with this. These people are probably the same ones who create a stink over sweat shops and child labor, but they probably still buy their Nike and Adidas tennis shoes. They scream about unfair wages for farmers helpers, but I bet they still buy their produce from Walmart and the other big chains instead of their local farmers market. It's a double standard. As long as they don't feel the direct impact, they won't change their minds.

Reminds me of a murder case in NC. A couple was adamant about abolishing the death penalty. They led the crowds protesting at the prisons. However, after their daughter was murdered, it was amazing how fast they wanted the murderer executed! Our mentality has been "if it doesn't happen in my back yard, then it's ok".

Here you go. This applies to this this as well.
www.blupete.com...