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Either God is not Love or Yahweh is not God.

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posted on Jun, 7 2011 @ 08:45 PM
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reply to post by CaptChaos
 

why dont you ask him yourself? if He does not answer you, try again. if you still dont get an answer, read the instructions.




posted on Jun, 7 2011 @ 08:47 PM
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God is love.

Add this to your basket, o cherry-pickers! :

By this the love of God was manifested in us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world so that we might live through Him. In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins. Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. No one has beheld God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us.

1 John 4:9-12
edit on 7-6-2011 by Partygirl because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2011 @ 08:58 PM
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Originally posted by Partygirl
God is love.

Add this to your basket, o cherry-pickers! :

By this the love of God was manifested in us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world so that we might live through Him. In this is love, not that we loved God, but that He loved us and sent His Son to be the propitiation for our sins. Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. No one has beheld God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us.

1 John 4:9-12
edit on 7-6-2011 by Partygirl because: (no reason given)


Party girl..in all due fairness..there are a dozen quotes from the bible that don't depict a loving father type God...and quite frankly the idea of .."That he so loved us..that he lead his only son to die on a cross for us"..is plain creepy when you actually think about it. The whole need for blood sacrifice is ...(shudders) archaic to me , and does not portray a true loving god to me.

I respect that you choose to believe that ,and if it works for you..good...but for me,at this stage of my life..where I am questioning so much..it doesn't make sense anymore.

Your prayers for me are always appreciated though , and perhaps I will come to see things in a different light,at some point...but as of now..I have too many questions , and frustrations with the bible.

I do respect that you are coming from a loving intention though, and for this I admire you.
edit on 7-6-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 7 2011 @ 09:34 PM
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reply to post by venusstarlite
 


O.k. tell me about this historical Jesus. Who was he, when was he born?



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:22 AM
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reply to post by Partygirl
 


Um...so you'll just assert something and not address the objection which is scripturally based?



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:30 AM
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reply to post by Shirak
 



Originally posted by Shirak
The bible is full of contradictions when taken out of context.


And in what way am I taking these passages out of context?



May I recommend an Audio Torrent from Professor Goldman on Myths and Mythology.


You can, but I'd like to see what specifically that has to do with this thread.



I think his lectures accurately point out the errors in translation and the fact that scribes often translated and wrote their own interpretations of text. That many stories in the bible are actually mirror images of earlier Sumerian texts. The true value of works like this are to show the values of the powers that be at the time and the populations.


True, I agree with that...I find that the Bible has no literal truth to it at all.



I appreciate the Torah etc were all meant to be translated word for word (I think there's a curse attached to that)


Crazy thing, the first six excerpts from the Bible I provided are all from the Torah...



The literal acceptance of many passages is IMO a form of ignorance or perhaps it is just a different form of perception than my own.


Alright, and why is that? Why is the declaration by a deity that it is jealous not something to be taken literally when it is reiterated quite often?



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:32 AM
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reply to post by venusstarlite
 


So you're saying that the unchanging perfect being of the universe started to suddenly...be different? Why is that?

And yes, the Bible does contradict itself, even within the New Testament. Look up how Paul handles the problem of circumcision, particularly the idea of circumcision to avoid issues with circumcised locals. In one instance, he says that it's bad to get a circumcision to fit in with local Jewish populations, on the other he circumcises his friend so that his friend will fit in with local Jewish populations.



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:34 AM
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reply to post by czygyny
 


Um...but I'm using a Biblical definition of love, not my own. In fact, I'd say that my definition of love slightly differs from the one in 1 Coritinthians.



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:41 AM
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reply to post by LicentiaEstVox
 


And now, a Bill O'Reilly cover band.


Originally posted by LicentiaEstVox
This urge you people have to turn your back to God will not go well.


Turn my back on whatnow? I'm sorry, but I don't actually believe that this being exists...so....it's not like I'm really turning my back on anything.



Look at the universe,who are you?


I'm...____ ____ ______ (not giving my name out on here), from Malta. I can go into much greater detail if you want.



Who made you?


My parents. With sex.



Why do you think you know so much,


I don't think I know so much, I just think I know a bit.



when the truth is you don't know anything...


Well, at the very least I know that I know very little.



If God demands faith wouldn't he made it that you CAN'T have solid proof of His existence so you can grow strong in faith?


Actually, the Bible says the God bestows faith and prevents some from having it. Furthermore, I don't see the point in this demand in the first place nor do I see how anything up to this point in your post has anything to do with what I've said in this thread.



Bible is a great book containing knowledge and power,




...what? You were serious? I'm sorry, but what "knowledge" and "power" can be found in the book? Power over women? Power to take a sharp stone to the genitals of an infant? Knowledge that the Earth is a flat circle with a solid dome over it with the sun and moon being simple lights moving across that dome? That the Earth was created in six days, with plants proceeding the sun?



but most important,its a guide to get to know ourselves better,to open our eyes.


Really? Which part of the Bible can I find that stuff in?



When you quote scripture in such detestable ways,you only make yourself look smaller and weaker.


What's detestable about it? Is it because it makes you uncomfortable? Is it because I said something that offends you? Or is it because I've said something that's actually wrong? If that last one is the case, why didn't you just point out that I'm wrong and how I'm wrong?



Who are you to judge what God is and wants?


I'm not judging, I'm taking the being's own words and applying it to popular conceptions.



I will leave for you a beautiful and most important verse from the Bible that makes your whole argument unnecessary:
"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
John 3:16


But if God loved the world so much why wouldn't he have just used magic to do that? Couldn't he have just...you know...exercised his omnipotence to just change the system?
edit on 8/6/11 by madnessinmysoul because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:42 AM
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reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


Still attacking other persons beliefs madness?? When are you going to learn to respect other people's beliefs? I thought by now you would have evolved, but apparently you remaining in stasis.

As for your OP, i will leave you with a picture to make a point.




Peace



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:42 AM
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reply to post by TylerDurden2U
 


...no. In this case the term 'believer' is to be recognized as something that is context-specific. The context here is a discussion of Christianity. In this context, 'believer' means 'Christian of some sort'.



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 04:45 AM
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reply to post by Seed76
 



Originally posted by Seed76
reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


Still attacking other persons beliefs madness??


No, I'm questioning other people's beliefs. It's a good ol' tradition back from the time of Socrates...um...bad example.



When are you going to learn to respect other people's beliefs?


You have every right to believe what you want, I have every right to tell you why it's stupid. That's how it works. Your beliefs don't get a special pass, nothing does.



I thought by now you would have evolved, but apparently you remaining in stasis.


Yeah, I'm in that odd stasis of questioning things that don't make sense. So horrible a state to be in.



As for your OP, i will leave you with a picture to make a point.





No, it really doesn't. In what way have I divorced the passages from context and how would the context reconcile them?



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 08:41 AM
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Originally posted by ren1999

The New Testament was ripped from the life of Apollonius of Tyana (Paul of Tarsus), a Neo-Pythagorean/Essene(Buddhist)/Krishna believer.

Apollonius was the main Jesus of history.


Not true. Utter nonsense in fact, that has been proven to be nonsense, but you'll keep on believing it because you want to.
V



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 09:55 AM
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reply to post by Vicky32
 


Is it true? Well...it's not entirely untrue. There are an insane number of common elements between many supposed first-century messiah figures. Some even within the Jewish tradition. Of course, this might have more to do with the prerequisites provided by Hebrew scripture more than anything else.

Or...who knows, maybe Jesus wasn't a particular one guy and was an amalgamation of stories of various messiahs.
Maybe Jesus was a rabble-rousing rabbi who had a bunch of stories attached to him.

Frankly, the entire first century of Christian history is mainly guess work and sorting through what biased accounts we have from the time. The period from ~30-130 is very foggy.

To claim that any claim about the time, unless it defies known laws of physics or other historical documentation, is nonsense is just as nonsensical.
edit on 8/6/11 by madnessinmysoul because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 09:56 AM
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reply to post by Vicky32
 


Prove to me that this is nonsense. Prove to me that Apollonius of Tyana and Tarsus was not the historical Jesus.



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 10:20 AM
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reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


You make way more sense to me than the bible does. You are a down to earth common sense type of person , that I respect.

Anyone who has issues with you , may very well be afraid of your logic , and the intelligence you have to point out the fallacies in their belief systems.



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 10:32 AM
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reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


Most all people that have issues about God, Jesus or Religion in general seem to base their disbeliefs on the Bible. God is no respector of persons, races, nations or religions. It was a huge mistake in my opinion that Christianity chose to boast the Bible as the infallible word of God. The actual authors of the books in the bible did not write them to be assorted into a collection of sacred wisdom, that was done by later generations. For all those who have serious questions about God and want some serious answers please check out the Urantia Book (www.urantia.org...).

I am very familiar with the Urantia Book and would be more than happy to answer any question someone has about God, Jesus or religion in general. I will give quotes or provide links to the answers. At this phase of development of the religious nature of man I think the Urantia Book has the answers. There will be a point in time where the human race moves beyond the teachings of the Urantia Book, just as we have moved past the teachings of the Bible. It served it purpose, but we must move on now. Too many youths are not involved in any type of religious thought because the bible, and those that teach it, have pushed them away. Please spend a few minutes looking through the Urantia Book, its free. There are also audio book versions that are downloadable for free. Again, I would be more than happy to direct anyone with a specific question to the paper in the Urantia Book that discusses said question. Enjoy!



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 10:39 AM
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Originally posted by ren1999
reply to post by venusstarlite
 


O.k. tell me about this historical Jesus. Who was he, when was he born?


According to the Urantia Book, Jesus (Joshua ben Joseph) was born on August, 21st 7BC in Bethlehem. He was conceived and born as all other babies before and since. The only difference is that he is a divine Son of God and picked the family on which he was born into (Joseph and Mary).



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 11:46 AM
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If god is in everyone and most the world believes in god.. of course god isn't love. most of the world and the people in it are #. So how could god be love when he represents 98% of prison inmates and terrorist (abortion clinic bombers and such).. So I'm not sure how anyone could think god has anything to do with love.



posted on Jun, 8 2011 @ 11:48 AM
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reply to post by madnessinmysoul
 


So because of inconsistencies, you decided God doesn't exist at all? That nothing in it held any truth at all? That those who wrote it, in their times were correct but as time waned on things changed, rules changed?

Keeping an open mind about these sorts of things is what brings wisdom, not close-mindedness based on your own personal review of the bible. Inconsistencies don't exactly equal proof positive God does not exist. It just proves those who wrote about it might not of seen things as clearly as they would like to have.

Atheists to me are the worst kinds of non-religious believers. At least Agnostics determine that there is not enough evidence to totally prove God but realize it is still possible he exist and very possible he disliked organised religions and encourages everyone to read and learn for themselves, because the journey is what will bring you inner peace, not just being handed the answers and believing them as i suspect you have.



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