What the Arabs intend for Israel

reply to post by Dnevnoi

"Retaliation "

Great informative explanation..

Originally posted by The Old American
You are correct, prior to 1967 the borders were one way. Now they are another. By your own words you believe:

"This is the way it used to be" is not a valid argument when talking about current events.

Because you operate on the presumption that people are going to drop everything and agree that yes, we should return borders to how they were 44 years ago.

That's stupid.

/TOA

No, actually, the borders are the same as they were prior to 1967's war. See, the "1967 borders" are those recognized by not only Israel and the people it signed an armistice with in 1949, but also the international community to which all of them belong. Those are the legally-binding boundaries of the nation of Israel. What is being demanded is thus not some sort of time reversal, but rather an acknowledgement of a legal issue and redress for crimes committed against the still-current body of law.

Basically the Palestinians want the stuff that was stolen from them to be returned, and the people responsible taken to trial. Just as you would if i were to steal your car.

I post dates and names of Israeli MASSACRES and the only response I get is "Retaliation"??

Since when is retaliation a good excuse for a massacre?????

PS- Yes... the Jenine Refugee Camp Massacre DID in fact happen. It was an incident which was part of "Operation Defensive Shield". The UN stated that 55 Palestinians were killed, of whom 22 were civilians.

An UNRWA administrated refugee camp near Jenin was entered by Israeli forces in early April 2002, an operation the IDF described as intending "to dismantle the terrorist infrastructure operating out of the P.A.-controlled areas". Over the next few days a battle took place between the IDF and Palestinians. According to the IDF, Israel chose not to bomb the spots of resistance using aircraft as it entered, but rather to take hold of the city using infantry, although there appears to have been a limited use of helicopters.

After the April 9 ambush, the IDF changed tactics, presumably in order to continue the operation without risking more Israeli deaths, and began operating the heavily-armored IDF Caterpillar D9 bulldozers. Earlier, the IDF maintained that heavy bulldozers were mainly used to clear booby traps and open routes to armored fighting vehicles. After April 9, the bulldozers demolished each house that was allegedly used by the militants to attack Israeli soldiers, and other houses to widen alleyways or to secure locations for IDF troops. Some Palestinians claim that there were cases when the IDF bulldozed houses while there were people inside.

The introduction of the heavily armored bulldozers, which shrugged off explosives and RPGs alike, and the threat of being buried alive, caused the Palestinian militants to surrender. Later, IDF forces withdrew gradually from the refugee camp under international pressure.

After the conflict Israeli reports claim that 8-9% of the houses within the refugee camp were destroyed. This was largely within an area of intense fighting of approximately 100 m by 100 m according to the IDF. Most of the demolition occurred in the Hawashin neighborhood.

Immediately following the event, Israeli authorities prevented the international press from entering the refugee camp for two weeks, which potentially delayed the ability of the world community to assess the damage. Later inquiries by human rights groups and the UN commission did not find evidence of massacres by Israeli forces in Jenin.

Here is a link with some information regarding it.

As for the others... Retaliation is no excuse for Massacres. Thats like saying the Germans killed the Jews because the Jews declared economic warfare on Germany first. Does that make it ok? (Here is a link to a Newspaper article to prove im not making that up

Originally posted by dontreally
Why did 800,000 Jews flee Muslim lands after the '48 war. Look it up.

Same reason that 711,000 Arabs were expelled from Israel with another seven thousand murdered; ethnic and religious hatred paired with greedy people having military power.

Now a better question is, why do you condemn the expulsion of Jews, yet cheer for the expulsion and mass murder of Arabs? Ethically speaking, shouldn't both be regarded as severe crimes against the people involved?

reply to post by Dnevnoi


It is true that thousands of full Jews fled overnight when the Zionist Israelis, the state of the United Nations. The former power structure enabled a covert continuation of the war that Hitler was now "finished" From that day Zionists attacked the Palestinians almost every day and deaths among the Palestinian population now became an everyday which is like a living hell. These are the facts.

Ashkenazi-jew or Khazars who they really are has nothing to do with Jews, but by calling themselves Jews.
This is a plot from the Khazars people, the who attack Khazars is attacking are all "Jews" anti-Semitic words is heard now and it will get people to fall silent, no one wants at all, implying support for the so-called Holocaust of the "Jews" in Germany. no one is a racist BUT the zionist who hates all mankind.

One should distinguish between the concepts and do not confuse themselves in the Zionist fictional story that is only to create confusion for the person or persons who opposes their plan for a "free israel" They're not martyrs, they are not victims of some Muslim warfare MORE than that used by Muslims in defense.
What is Hamas? and similar so-called Islamic terrorist groups? It is zionic-controlled and invented in a single purpose: to create a public opinion which supports Israel's war against muslims&Palestine and now also West West bitterly felt the manipulation of this type of warfare throughout the 911th.

Featured Israelites claim to defend "their" country "which is a complete misinterpretation.
And then to argue that by saying:
How do you know? Can you prove it? How can you trust them?
Is only cheap but effective way to reverse a call to be about an alleged holocaust, etc, instead of treating substance: can today's "Israelites" to prove that Israel belongs to them more than by Hitler's promise to Rockefeller? wich hitler keept to show good faith for the rockefellers moneysupport of ww2!
Moreover, the word Israel has nothing to with the Zionists who live there today, they are Khazars and, like their conversion to Judaism is the idea that in a few generations, this expression include the Khazars who live there today. Some of manipulating the truth and the story nothing else. It is not difficult to figure out what happens in between the East and great causes this, it is part of the Zionist plan to try to gain total control over the world
The Quran does not allow any Muslim to cover her face and kill fellow human beings in God's name among the last prophet mohammad said was, take care of your women. rest and even the lies that have not been told is nothing more than Zionist words disguised in various religions.

The world is planned to be controlled by Israel through total control of all world states, that is what the conflict in Israel is about. Muslims are the religion they have not yet gained control over or have ever had. The other religions are already in their control!

reply to post by DerekJR321


"PS- Yes... the Jenine Refugee Camp Massacre DID in fact happen. It was an incident which was part of "Operation Defensive Shield". The UN stated that 55 Palestinians were killed, of whom 22 were civilians."


that's just the problem, it's darn hard to tell who's who in these situations.

why don't they wear uniforms or big signs across their chest like any other legit military organization.

they could get some snazzy looking ones with all the money they get.

but that might make it too legitimate and loose the sympathy they count on.

Originally posted by stavis
reply to post by Dnevnoi

 

It is true that thousands of full Jews fled overnight when the Zionist Israelis, the state of the United Nations. The former power structure enabled a covert continuation of the war that Hitler was now "finished" From that day Zionists attacked the Palestinians almost every day and deaths among the Palestinian population now became an everyday which is like a living hell. These are the facts.

Well, there WERE plenty of Jews expelled, either directly or from increased pressure to leave, from many Muslim nations after the formation of Israel. Many chose to leave voluntarily; but plenty were forced as well.

Ashkenazi-jew or Khazars who they really are has nothing to do with Jews, but by calling themselves Jews.

Ugh. Really? Okay. first off, anyone who practices Judaism is a Jew. Period. End of story.

Second, Europe's Jewry is not related to the Khazars. They are, for the most part, totally European, with some families having traces of ancestry form a handful of immigrants or captives from the Roman era. The Khazars were a Turkic people in the Caucasus and southern Steppe; they got smushed by the Mongols, and later wound up divided between Sufi Islam and Russian orthodoxy. Their impact on the world was negligible.

This is a plot from the Khazars people, the who attack Khazars is attacking are all "Jews" anti-Semitic words is heard now and it will get people to fall silent, no one wants at all, implying support for the so-called Holocaust of the "Jews" in Germany. no one is a racist BUT the zionist who hates all mankind.

Uh... the Holocaust happened, guy. Hate to break it to you. Of course, it didn't happen just to the Jews of Europe, but they were probably the largest single group of victims. I suppose it's fashionable to just deny for denial's sake, but, well, it's pretty damn well-documented. Even by the Nazis themselves, who really would have had a reason to cover it up.

One should distinguish between the concepts and do not confuse themselves in the Zionist fictional story that is only to create confusion for the person or persons who opposes their plan for a "free israel" They're not martyrs, they are not victims of some Muslim warfare MORE than that used by Muslims in defense.

Well, confusing "Zionist" and "Jew" is something ignorant fanatics from both sides - yourself and dontreally, just in this thread, for example - love to do to prove their points. Most people understand the differences pretty easily, but when you've got two sides screaming ignorance, it kind of drowns out common sense.

What is Hamas? and similar so-called Islamic terrorist groups? It is zionic-controlled and invented in a single purpose: to create a public opinion which supports Israel's war against muslims&Palestine and now also West West bitterly felt the manipulation of this type of warfare throughout the 911th.

...Zionic? It helps if you don't make up the language as you go, champ.

Actually Hamas invented itself, then got funded by Israel; not as a plot to attack Israel and make it look more sympathetic, but to provide an Islamist counter to the pan-Arabist PLO. It's probably a decision Israel came to regret. And of course Israel manipulated the events of 9/11 for its own gain; so did libya and Pakistan. Suddenly these guys became our bestest buddies, in exchange for all our monies.

The world is planned to be controlled by Israel through total control of all world states, that is what the conflict in Israel is about.

Actually, Israel is the pawn in world events - the US uses it as a catspaw in the region. It does what the US wants, and if things go bad, it's Israel that gets burned. Of course the US does a lot to shelter said catspaw - the US can afford to do so, and can't currently afford to lose its hold there. The moment that a Muslim Arab nation opens up to the United States, though, Israel's going to get left in the dirt. it's my thought that this may have actually been the plan for Iraq; topple Saddam, put in a friendly Dictator who lets his nation become a US territory in effect, and divorce ourselves from our connection to Israel.

Just 'cause we can afford to cover for Israel doesn't make doing so cheap, after all.

Muslims are the religion they have not yet gained control over or have ever had. The other religions are already in their control!

Uh... Don't know much about religion, do you? Islam and Judaism are basically the same damned thing. Really, truly. This is because Mohammed was himself Jewish; it's just that he had a Joseph Smith moment.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


champ-LOL-

a) try to learn religion first hand.
b) marking words is just a way of...
c) what did you say in your post? NOTHING! ABSOLUTLY NOTHING! JUST BS Not a single fact or anything that is really true
Also: you are talking about mongol huh, can you give me full info about this...please...where did the mongols came from? hmm...I am about 3 thousend years ahead of what you are writing about...please.... you are a product of an lie manifactured around the beginning of the 18th century.

More lies.

The Jenin massacre is a hoax made up , once again, by the Palestinians.

www.peacewithrealism.org...

www.time.com...

www.guardian.co.uk...

Originally posted by stavis
reply to post by TheWalkingFox

 

champ-LOL-

a) try to learn religion first hand.

I have, thanks. Honestly, read the Koran. Then read the Torah. Same book, but the Koran has better poetry. When you're done with that, study the history of the Hejaz (modern Saudi Arabia, more or less). The cities, trade routes, and kingdoms were primarily controlled by Jewish rulers, while the bedouins were largely pagan. Mohammed himself was a prosperous trader from Medina, one of the region's major cities. he traveled frequently north into even more solidly Jewish territory. The books all say he and his family were monotheists from the start. The angel that came to him was Gabriel - by name.

He was as Jewish as lox and bagels served at a klezmer concert on Purim.

b) marking words is just a way of...

Marking words is just a way of ellipse?

c) what did you say in your post? NOTHING! ABSOLUTLY NOTHING! JUST BS

Not a single fact or anything that is really true

Sure seems to have gotten you excited though. Sorry, everything i've stated in this thread is in fact, fact. Whether you or dontreally want to believe it or not, there it is.

Also: you are talking about mongol huh,

can you give me full info about this...please...where did the mongols came from? hmm...I am about 3 thousend years ahead of what you are writing about...please.... you are a product of an lie manifactured around the beginning of the 18th century.

...Three thousand years, huh? So the mongols are due to roll in at around 4207 AD? 'Cause... yeah, they roflstomped the Khazars (what was left of the Khazars, anyway) around 1220 AD. if you want to know about the mongols, you've got the right guy.

Learn history before you deign to speak about it, please, And for posterity's sake, check out some of my other posts around here, if you really want to try to call me a "zionist shill" or whatever's banging around in your noggin.

reply to post by gravitational


From your link..

Human Rights Watch, which in a published report last week also concluded that no massacre took place, nonetheless documented 22 civilian deaths and said the Israelis used excessive and indiscriminate force during the operation. Time found that as Israeli soldiers moved from house to house, they sometimes compelled Palestinian civilians to take the dangerous job of leading the approach to the buildings.

Originally posted by gravitational
More lies.

The Jenin massacre is a hoax made up , once again, by the Palestinians.

www.peacewithrealism.org...

29 dead Israeli civilians is a massacre.

www.guardian.co.uk...

But 27 dead Palestinians is not.

Interesting. So if only the IDF had killed off two more civilians, then would it be a massacre?

Oh wait. You can have a massacre with as few as five people killed. So, what's the deal?

Here's what Israeli journalist Arie Caspi has to say about this in Haaretz, April 24, 2002;

Okay, so there wasn't a massacre. Israel only shot some children, brought a house crashing down on an old man, rained cement blocks on an invalid who couldn't get out in time, used locals as a human shield against bombs, and prevented aid from getting to the sick and wounded. That's really not a massacre, and there's no need for a commission of inquiry or a "fact-finding mission," whether run by ourselves or sent by the goyim.

Source

Originally posted by dontreally
reply to post by confreak

 

HUH?

No. Read that book, "Dhimmitude" by Bat Yeor. Or read 'Jews and Arabs' by SC Goiten, or 'In Ishmaels House', by Martin Gilbert. There are many books on the subject. How many have you read?

It is a massive misunderstanding to think "Jews had it good in Muslim lands". You know what thats like? The difference between a smack in the face and a punch in the face. Yes. The punch is worse. But why would you consider the slap, good? The slap is still demeaning, dehumanizing, and as much an outrage - morally - as the punch. The only difference is in severity.

So you think being evicted, mass murdered and genocide committed against you is the punch, and living under Muslim protection and being able to practice your religion is a slap in the face?

Living in Christian Europe was worse. But Jews who lived in Muslim lands still dealt with massacres from time to time.They were forced to pay a head tax - a compulsory for all peoples of the book - Jew or Christian, which took a great toll on poor amongst them. In some Muslim lands, Jews had to wear badges - and indeed this is where the idea was invented and only later transported to Christian Europe. In ALL Muslim lands, according to the major Islamic commentators Avicenna and Al Ghazali, Jews could only ride mules - not horses or camels - and had to ride side saddle when riding by a muslim. In some lands, Jews had a wooden demon attached to their front door. When the tax collector came by a dhimmis house, the collector would smack the Jew or Christian on the back of the ear as a sign of submission.

WOW, being massacred and evicted from their homes is a punch, and paying taxes is a slap. That's an impressive logic you got there.

Yea. this was sooo nice. Because you think the Jews excelled at one time, under one muslim government, in one country - spain - you think conditions such as that existed everywhere? They didnt. And even then, a man like Maimonides while living in 'liberal' free thinking ummayad spain, was forced to convert and indeed had to pretend to be a muslim up until the authorities found out,. And when they did, he fled for morocco. And when in Fez, he fled once more to Egypt - where the more reposed Kurd Salah Al Din (saladin) hired Maimonides as his personal physician.

I simply stated the fact that Muslims were one of the very few protectors of Jews throughout history, in the time when they were being massacred in mass numbers by Christians. That's my point, you don't seem to disagree, so why are you trying to disagree when we clearly agree? It shows how desperate you're to hate.

My original point wasn't even in reply to you, therefore it doesn't and wouldn't make sense if we don't put pretext to my point, which is against this argument:

Namely that every Jew on earth must be beheaded, likewise every other person on earth that does not convert to Islam must be killed.

Why don't you agree that the above argument is deeply flawed, the above statement is deeply flawed?

It's a joy watching you bunch wallowing in your lies, and how you twist like snakes.
The UN investigation concluded there were no massacre, but of course you have your own private court right here. Judges jury and witnesses all combined.

Anybody remembers what was happening in the months prior to that IDF operation ?
I bet you yelled massacre right there and then. Sure you did.

Originally posted by gravitational
It's a joy watching you bunch wallowing in your lies, and how you twist like snakes.
The UN investigation concluded there were no massacre, but of course you have your own private court right here. Judges jury and witnesses all combined.

Anybody remembers what was happening in the months prior to that IDF operation ?
I bet you yelled massacre right there and then. Sure you did.

The UN reported there was no massacre, because the Israeli's denied them entry into the area for TWO WEEKS. They had plenty of time to clean up after themselves.

It sort of reminds me of the Goldstone report. You know... we ALL know that Israel used White Phosphorus shells and killed plenty of civilians, just like the report says. But Israel cries up an antisemitic storm and makes the big bad report go away.

So I guess now your going to tell me that everything Israel did in Operation Cast Lead was completely moral and legal? Oh... oh... how about the Aid Flotilla... where 9 people were killed, including an American citizen.. who was executed by being shot in the face point blank?? I bet... I bet those IDF soldiers had a right to defend themselves because those TERRORISTS had pieces of wood and hoses and fishing knives. How dare they.

But then again I forgot the golden rule. Everything Israel does is perfectly fine. They are always "just defending themselves". They are always the victim. They are always right.

Spiritually and Biblically speaking Jesus Christ will return to Israel but that will take some time.

The Jews need to accept him eventually, that is part of the process there.

The Arabs and have been there God has not returned, Isreal and Temple Mount is only mentioned by a vague dream Muhammad had.

Israel is only the third holiest place to the Arabs.

Jeruselem is not mentioned in the Koran it is very vague when it comes to geography.

Maybe God of the Bible does not want Arabs in his land, they are not part of his plan and cause interference there, the land was promised and made holy for the Jews, Biblically speaking.

Many times the Bible mentions Gaza and Philistine which is Palistine today the boarder by the sea as a place where God will be angry at.


Jews under the start of Islamic conquest had to pay protection tax called Jizya Tax for protection.

This Israel is not the true size just a speck of hat it should be.
___________________________________________________________________________________

What the Bible fortels, this will happen regardless who believes or does not, if the Bible is wrong none of this will ever come close to happen, written 3000 years ago.

Genesis 15:18
On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, “To your offspring I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river Euphrates,

Joshua 11:22
None of the Anakim were left in the land of the children of Israel; they remained only in Gaza, in Gath, and in Ashdod.
NOTE: Anakim
Anakim) who have been considered "strong and tall," they were also said to have been a mixed race of giant people, descendants of the Nephilim
en.wikipedia.org...

Zephaniah 2
Judgment on Nations

4 For Gaza shall be forsaken,
And Ashkelon desolate;
They shall drive out Ashdod at noonday,
And Ekron shall be uprooted.
5 Woe to the inhabitants of the seacoast,
The nation of the Cherethites!
The word of the LORD is against you,
O Canaan, land of the Philistines:

Proclamation Against Philistia

15 ‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “Because the Philistines dealt vengefully and took vengeance with a spiteful heart, to destroy because of the old hatred,” 16 therefore thus says the Lord GOD: “I will stretch out My hand against the Philistines, and I will cut off the Cherethites and destroy the remnant of the seacoast. 17 I will execute great vengeance on them with furious rebukes; and they shall know that I am the LORD, when I lay My vengeance upon them.”’”

Isaiah 17
Proclamation Against Syria and Israel
1 The burden against Damascus.

“ Behold, Damascus will cease from being a city,
And it will be a ruinous heap.
2 The cities of Aroer are forsaken;[a]
They will be for flocks
Which lie down, and no one will make them afraid.
3 The fortress also will cease from Ephraim,
The kingdom from Damascus,
And the remnant of Syria;

Judgment on Damascus

Jeremiah 49
23 Against Damascus.

“ Hamath and Arpad are shamed,
For they have heard bad news.
They are fainthearted;
There is trouble on the sea;
It cannot be quiet.
24 Damascus has grown feeble;
She turns to flee,
And fear has seized her.
Anguish and sorrows have taken her like a woman in labor.
25 Why is the city of praise not deserted, the city of My joy?
26 Therefore her young men shall fall in her streets,
And all the men of war shall be cut off in that day,” says the LORD of hosts.
27 “ I will kindle a fire in the wall of Damascus,
And it shall consume the palaces of Ben-Hadad.”

Amos 1
Judgment on the Nations

3 Thus says the LORD:

“ For three transgressions of Damascus, and for four,
I will not turn away its punishment,
Because they have threshed Gilead with implements of iron.
4 But I will send a fire into the house of Hazael,
Which shall devour the palaces of Ben-Hadad.
5 I will also break the gate bar of Damascus,
And cut off the inhabitant from the Valley of Aven,
And the one who holds the scepter from Beth Eden.
The people of Syria shall go captive to Kir,”
Says the LORD.

6 Thus says the LORD:

“ For three transgressions of Gaza, and for four,
I will not turn away its punishment,
Because they took captive the whole captivity
To deliver them up to Edom.
7 But I will send a fire upon the wall of Gaza,
Which shall devour its palaces.
8 I will cut off the inhabitant from Ashdod,
And the one who holds the scepter from Ashkelon;
I will turn My hand against Ekron,
And the remnant of the Philistines shall perish,”
Says the Lord GOD.

9 Thus says the LORD:

“ For three transgressions of Tyre, and for four,
I will not turn away its punishment,
Because they delivered up the whole captivity to Edom,
And did not remember the covenant of brotherhood.
10 But I will send a fire upon the wall of Tyre,
Which shall devour its palaces.”

Concerning Future Jerusalem:

Zechariah 12
The Coming Deliverance of Judah

(1 The burden[a] of the word of the LORD against Israel. Thus says the LORD, who stretches out the heavens, lays the foundation of the earth, and forms the spirit of man within him: 2 “Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem. 3 And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it.)

4 In that day,” says the LORD, “I will strike every horse with confusion, and its rider with madness; I will open My eyes on the house of Judah, and will strike every horse of the peoples with blindness. 5 And the governors of Judah shall say in their heart, ‘The inhabitants of Jerusalem are my strength in the LORD of hosts, their God.’ 6 In that day I will make the governors of Judah like a firepan in the woodpile, and like a fiery torch in the sheaves; they shall devour all the surrounding peoples on the right hand and on the left, but Jerusalem shall be inhabited again in her own place—Jerusalem.
7 “The LORD will save the tents of Judah first, so that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem shall not become greater than that of Judah. 8 In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; the one who is feeble among them in that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the Angel of the LORD before them. 9 It shall be in that day that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

____________________________


No one had to be Enemies of Israel but they are, they don't believe the Bible and yet the Bible knows their will be nations and people gathered one day against Jerusalem. Europe learned its fate in WW2 with the Jews and now it will be the Arabs turn to stand in their way and learn the hard way. Mecca is the Arab holiest place but they make the most fuss about Israel. The old tribes are back, it is in their blood to act this way and God will not be a happy bunny when Israel is not taken seriously, including the Jews who don't believe they should be back, no one it seems will be left out when things will get hairy.

I can only show you more of this knowledge and that knowledge is hardly spoken of which is why fate will create what the Bible predicts. These are just some of the areas of the Middle East mentioned let alone Egypt, Iraq Jordan, Iran and other close by nations and tribes.

Prophecy is in the News as we speak in modern times.

reply to post by gravitational


Yeah, all hoax..Israel acted morally as usual..
Again, from YOUR link..
I smell coverup as usual from Israel.....
But I guess you can name all the INDEPENDENT investigators right??

Cobra attack helicopters began to pound rooftop Palestinian positions. But the Israelis' most effective weapon was unconventional: the huge, armored D-9 bulldozer, 20 ft. tall and weighing more than 50 tons; its shovel can crush a car with a single blow. Eventually, a dozen of them went into action, clearing paths for the tanks and detonating booby traps; Palestinians say Israeli troops rode atop them, firing rocket-propelled grenades. Undoubtedly, the D-9s destroyed houses, but they certainly didn't bury as many people as Palestinian officials have alleged. It takes the D-9 at least half an hour to fully wreck a building. Israeli soldiers say they always called to residents to come out before the bulldozers went in. But even if the innocents were too frightened initially to leave, most would surely have done so as soon as the D-9 started its work. A senior Palestinian military officer tells Time it was probably the gunmen's own booby traps that buried some civilians and fighters alive. There were bombs that were certainly big enough to wreck a cinder-block refugee house more devastatingly than a D-9 ever could.

But the increasing ferocity of the fighting led to tragic errors. On Day 6, Fatih Shalabe, 63, was hiding in his home with his family, including his son Waddah, 37. At 6 p.m., Shalabe says, soldiers entered his neighbor's home. Those residents, the Saadeh family, tried to flee into Shalabe's yard. Soldiers followed and ordered all 17 people out into an alley. Fatih and Waddah were ordered to stand against a wall with their neighbor's son, Abdel Karim Saadeh. The soldiers followed the procedure now widely used to guard against suicide attacks — they ordered the men to lift their shirtfronts to reveal whether they were wearing suicide belts packed with explosives. Abdel Karim had a bad back and wore a medical support; when he lifted his shirt, the soldiers saw his corset and thought it was a bomb belt. According to Shalabe, the officer then said, "Shoot, shoot." The Israelis gunned down Waddah and Abdel Karim. Waddah slammed back against the wall. Fatih went down too and lay covered in his son's blood, pretending to be dead until the Israelis moved on. "I would have been luckier if I had died," Fatih later told Time.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


Because in the latter case - the Jews in Israel stepped in and provided a home for them. And the others went to America or Europe and began a new life.

In the case of the Palestinians. Ill just quote you Musa Alami

"In the social sphere, the incompetence of the Arab governments has revealed itself in the matter of the refugees. ... It is shameful that the Arab governments should prevent the Arab refugees from working in their countries and shut the doors in their faces and imprison them in camps."

reply to post by confreak


I cannot even believe this. If a rational, and intelligent arbiter were to analyze both of our arguments, they would immediately deem me correct, and you insanely stubborn.

you dont like my analogies. Fine. Heres a more literal one. But before i give my analogy. Get one thing straight. The Jews WERE - and HAVE BEEN - sufferring pograms and massacres in Muslim lands throughout their exile there .OK? This is simply history. If youre going to deny history, or in your obscene laziness, ignore it because it interferes with a position youd prefer to hold... lets just stop taling. I dont have time or patience for this BS.

Remember all those humiliating things Jews had to put up with? And a Tax? It wasnt a simple 30% tax, you shmuck.. It was a yearly tax. Pay it up. If you didnt have the money, or were poor - and many were poor and unable, they would take a child from you. This was a common practice in the Muslim world. To take a Jewish or Christian Child and convert him to Islam. Think im lying. look it up,. Some of their own theologians regard this as a legal practice because to them - the natural state is Islam, therefore all people are born Muslims, only throughout life they pick up incorrect understanding due to society.

Anyways, thw analogy is this: Living in Christian lands was worse, and can be likened to being beat by your father. On the other hand, living in Muslim lands was like having a father and Mother who hated you, abused you, and treated you with such disrespect and contempt, that you became used to being their 'dog' or in Arabic, "Kilab Yahud" (Jew dog - type it in google and see how much comes up). go to Egypt and see how common this coloquilism is.

Is verbal and emotional abuse preferable to physical abuse and death? Id say so. But its not inherently better. Its the lesser of two evils. They are both evil. period.

reply to post by dontreally


PALESTINE

Palestine (Greek: Παλαιστίνη, Palaistinē; Latin: Palaestina; Hebrew: ארץ־ישראל Eretz-Yisra'el, formerly also פלשׂתינה, Palestina; Arabic: فلسطين‎ Filasṭīn, Falasṭīn, Filisṭīn) was a conventional name, among others, used between 450 BC and 1948 AD to describe a geographic region between the Mediterranean Sea and the Jordan River, and various adjoining lands.

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