Science fails to exclude God

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posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 06:34 PM
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reply to post by randyvs
 


Some how i feel that you miss understand what i am trying to get at.

I am one of those people who probably sees genesis differently than any one else does. When people try to correct me on my interpretation, I don't understand how they got theirs from reading genesis chapter 1.
My mind set just wont accept their explanation. Because, the version they try to make me accept dosent make sense to me. "Its hard to explain".

I think the best way to make you understand how i see things, is to explain how i interpret genesis chapter 1. By showing you the images i get in my mind from reading the verses.

The first verse in Genesis chapter 1. is the clue to how i understand what God "is" creating.

Verse 1.

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.


It states that: In the beginning God "created" the heaven and the earth.

This verse tells me what God is about to create. Verse 1 is like the title of chapter 1.
And it is supported by Verse 2 which describes what was before heaven and earth was "created".




"In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth".

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.


This is what i see in my mind when i imagine what verse 2 is saying. Darkness/deep space



I don't see earth in my mind at all. How can anyone see or imagine what earth looks like when it's without form and void?
They can only do that because they already know what earth looks like. And they imagine that Moses is looking into the sea of water. How can Moses see water/void if its not created yet? Personally i believe Moses is looking into the darkness of space, and cant see anything but darkness when he looks around.



Verse 3.

3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.


If you you share the same mind set as me, this next verse (3) will fit perfectly to the image of darkness.

You will get a new image like this:



God is now creating heaven and earth. Within science this is how they explain the singularity. From the core of this light everything will evolve as things cool down. Ref. to verse 6.

God can only have created this light one way. By a compression of energy/water. The waters represents energy being compressed. The heat from the force of this compression created the light Moses saw.

If you understand this. You will also know that there was never a Big Bang (explosion). Its physically impossible.

If you understand this view you will also understand that evolution is true, and God never physically formed/shaped man from dirt. God said let the earth bring forth all living things.

I could do all the verses but that will make this very long. The point is to make you know that at least i dont share the official interpretation of Genesis. I just can if i am to be honest with my self.




posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 06:39 PM
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Simple enough question...Where is this God? Must be a very busy chap.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 06:50 PM
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Originally posted by jexmo
Simple enough question...Where is this God? Must be a very busy chap.


God is just a observer so he is not as busy as we are.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 06:54 PM
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reply to post by spy66
 


Thats interesting, how does he know who and what to observe at what times? He must get around a bit?



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by jexmo
reply to post by spy66
 


Thats interesting, how does he know who and what to observe at what times? He must get around a bit?


No he dosent.

You might have to think a bit about what "i am" about to say:

God is the infinite, therefor God is everything; even you. That is how he knows everything at once.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 07:07 PM
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reply to post by spy66
 


Special guy, he's doing a great job. Excuse my sarcasm. I don't wish to offend anyone, I just dont believe the bible, the same as I don't believe the Spiderman comics. Why would a god spread so much uncertainty about his people and why would a god punish his people if he is all forgiving.

I apologise for the hijack.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 07:17 PM
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Originally posted by jexmo
reply to post by spy66
 


Special guy, he's doing a great job. Excuse my sarcasm. I don't wish to offend anyone, I just dont believe the bible, the same as I don't believe the Spiderman comics. Why would a god spread so much uncertainty about his people and why would a god punish his people if he is all forgiving.

I apologise for the hijack.






Why would a god spread so much uncertainty about his people and why would a god punish his people if he is all forgiving


Good question. Has God really done any harm, if he is all loving and forgiving? Or, have we spread uncertainty and harm in his place?

My bet is on that we are the cause of uncertainty and harm not God.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 07:23 PM
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Then I will be punished for a lack of faith? Something I am surrounded by? Something I have been brought up with? Something I have had no control over? Is that fair?

I sadly am one of those who have not found God, I f I am wrongm that will nobodys fault but my own. How could I have changed my upbringing?



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 07:53 PM
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reply to post by jexmo
 





Then I will be punished for a lack of faith? Something I am surrounded by? Something I have been brought up with? Something I have had no control over? Is that fair?





Is that fair?


I don't know. I am not the judge.

Faith is based on what you know and what you feel. If you lack faith, its because you lack information/knowledge to base any faith on. As you say your self, you are surrounded by people who lack faith/knowledge. These people are information/knowledge to you, you will probably not know any more than they do.





I sadly am one of those who have not found God, I f I am wrongm that will nobodys fault but my own. How could I have changed my upbringing?


By getting information/knowledge so that you can have a foundation to make a choice. Having faith is personal based only on how you feel.



posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 08:28 PM
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reply to post by spy66
 


You picked up where I left off.
We absolutely agree that the darkness that was upon the face of the deep is the nothingness/void of space.

If you remember my earlier question to X does darkness exist? No! Because darkness is the absence of light.
Darkness is what we call the absence of light. So the light slices through the darkness, never does the darkness
slice through the light because darkness dosn't exist.

Light does exist because it was created. Light is the only proof we need that there is a Creator. Who turned on the lights? If every physicality in the universe just disappeared what we have nothing/darkness.
edit on 9-8-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


Lighgt can be broken down to reveal the spectrum of colors that make up the light. It's speed can be measured.
There's dim light, amber light, pulsing, bright and many shades of light. Darkness is what you have when you have nothing. Nothing was very obviously all there was and then, God created light.

I also believe there is evidence of cohabitation between creation and evolution and it is evidenced in genesis. You lose me when you declare mankind is apart of that evolution. Mankind can adapt ! But is not and will not evolve.
He was created by God from the dust of the earth. No doubt.
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posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 08:55 PM
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reply to post by jexmo
 


Hijackers are favored here.

Nothing to aplogise for, as no one needs an invite to join in at any time. ATS is public conversations and each
thread posted here, is the property of once posted. So you can barge right in as most do. Or maybe you prefer a more well mannered entrance, with salutatiuons, which is always classy in my view. Please don't be shy.

As I like to say, SPEAK !




posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 05:49 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs

Ok your a pantheist and your definition of God is better than the Bible. You call your God, " the all and everything and it " and that makes your God better than
any other God and he can't be disproven. And the Bible is easy to disprove ?

So you ready to back that up ? Please disprove away. I endulge you in ernest.

SpY
Just a heads partner. Falling falling fall;ling asleee.....p nini.:
edit on 9-8-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


If you find one contradiction in the Bible it means it is not true. I said start at the beginning. Two different stories in Genesis on the creation. Both can not be true. The book starts off by telling you lies. In fact stolen lies and myths from other and older cultures. The book ends by telling you that if you don't believe you will burn forever. This is a very basic mind control technique called fear. It should be obvious that the whole book is about brainwashing. No one died for your sins and there is no such thing as original sin. Why would a god punish men and their ancestors for something they couldn't understand was wrong. The whole idea is silly. If there is no original sin that means no one had to die for you. Once you stop being afraid the whole book falls apart.



posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 07:39 AM
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reply to post by randyvs
 


OK, Than i am the one who has to pay more attention
English is not my prime language so its not always that easy to catch on to what people say and mean.

But i do have a few questions to you now, since you mention that the darkness dosent exist. And since mention that God must have formed man from dust.

-Darkness does exist, the darkness must be the body/dimension of God, since darkness is infinite. And as you can see from my image of verse 3. Light can only appear within the dimension of darkness; within God.

-Did God form man from dust! Personally i dont think so. But i do believe we were meant to be. If you think back to the light in verse 3. That is God creating the seed/foundation to our existence. As the seed expands/grows new life will appear in stages. The stages are explained in genesis chapter 1.
When it comes to chapter two. I have problems excepting what is written in that chapter.



posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 01:37 PM
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reply to post by BillfromCovina
 


Faith must be administered throughout the Bible. You can call what might look like a contrediction a lie.
That's one direction. Or you can go the other direction and have faith. Nothing comes close to the Bible.
I'm convinced it lives forever because that's what truth does. Lies don't live.

I have to admit I don't understand everything about this amazing book. There seems to be something going
on between trhe fist and second chapters when reference changes from God to Lord God. Let us make man in
our image? I simply don't know. But I'm sure it amounts to nothing that would be faitrh shattering. I'll pray on it
and leave it to God.


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posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 01:53 PM
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reply to post by spy66
 


Well that's why I asked if I should contnue but your english is great. I rarely detect any thing in your grammar so
It may be both of us.


Is it possible there are two parts of man, body and soul, that had to be created separately? There is always a way to conclude something other than, the Bibvle is a pack of lies. That's just unacceptable in my view.
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posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 02:10 PM
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Have to catch up on this thread...was busy defending shops in London the past few days


Pre-emptive strike: Randy, you're wrong!



posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 02:13 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 


You were defending X?
How can I believe that ?

Seriously though, I had no Idea you were in London town. Please be safe partner. I need my nemesis to keep
me on my toes..
edit on 10-8-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


Infact if you like I would be interested big time if you would send a U2U. I know some how you arn't a lightweight so you prolly been knock'in some heads. But if you killed any body I don't want to know.
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But yeah, ! tell me a little what's been going on ?
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posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 03:24 PM
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I've been Thai boxing for a few years...grouped up with a few mates when we heard 20-30 of those stupid rioters took a wrong turn and tried to torch shops and restaurants in my neighbourhood. Most of them ran after we knocked out a few of them. Almost no cops there, they were all busy in the South and North of London. We handed 8 of them over to the only few cops we could find (5, lol), the rest ran.

Cops gave us a stern talk at first saying we endangered our lives...until they found out we're all Thai boxers, at which point they were super grateful. Apparently those poor bastards had only slept for 5hrs in 3 days because of those damn rioters. Some Indian shop owner gave us food and drinks as thank you, and we also got a free dinner for 2 from one of the restaurants for each of us


I totally understand that those rioters are pissed off at being poor, but they were destroying the livelihoods of people. Mostly kids too, felt suuuuuper wrong hitting 17-18 year old kids. To our defence, we tried not to hurt them too much and held back...the cops said that was a good move, because otherwise they'd have to take us in too


To stay on topic: I haven't seen god anywhere during the riots...but I admit I was too busy dodging punches and stones flying towards me
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posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 04:32 PM
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That is an interesting way of looking at things. I would love to believe in a higher purpose but from my experiences, I find it extremely difficult.

I appreciate you spending your time to explain these things to me. It does make me feel somewhat narrow minded.

That's very kind of you randy, I just like to be as polite as possible, my passion for a good old fashion debate does, at times, make me seem like a neanderthal and I like to counter this with some manners every now and again. I know there are some, 'HIJACK NAZI'S', on the site and they would be very disappointed in me



posted on Aug, 11 2011 @ 08:37 AM
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Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by spy66
 


Is it possible there are two parts of man, body and soul, that had to be created separately? editby]edit on 10-8-2011 by randyvs because: (no reason given)


According to Genesis chapter 1. Man was the last creature to appear. What i see is a order of stages and bindings of organic matter. All these stages had to take place in order to create man.
We are from the organic dust on the ground, but we were shaped long before it actually happened. We were meant to be at the exact time we were formed by earth.

I have to mention verse 1 again: It explains the grand plan; To create heaven and earth.
Verse 3 is when God creates the seed (existence). The seed contains all life that is to be at appointed time as the seed expands/grows.

If you plant a apple tree seed in you garden, You dont have to create the apples and put them on the branches after. See my point?
The apples will come out of the tree when the time is right. After the seed has become a tree.

edit on 27.06.08 by spy66 because: (no reason given)





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