Ancient Aliens Debunked?

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posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 01:14 PM
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Originally posted by ObvTruth
Just a couple of other photos i came across. Try to debunk these








Source location might help Obv.




posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 01:30 PM
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reply to post by ElectricUniverse
 




You are using paintings like that one to TRY to debunk the ancient texts


Nope. How exactly would I use a painting to debunk text? I merely pointed out the show used that photo and it's a curious choice since it depicts terrestrial vehicles and not flying saucers.



the Vedas and other ancient texts do not protray them as myths, but as history, and as fact.


Many mythologies do attempt to blend history with stories of the gods, it's quite common. Heck even epic poems like the Odyssey and Iliad involve actual places but have gods in them as well. It doesn't matter what the text sells itself as, making the claim that it's a true history is not the same as being true history. Just look at the Bible, talking snakes, worldwide floods that have been disproved by geology, people being raised from the dead and ALL played as if absolutely true while being blended with real places and some actual history. But that doesn't make it true.



which corroborate the fact that Earth has been visited for millenium by alien beings which have been seen by ancient men as Gods and Goddesses.


Leaping from unidentified to aliens is just an argument from ignorance. And no, the gods were not aliens, I've already explained this, most gods had affiliations with natural phenomenon, natural processes and many had their own domains. Sea gods lived in the sea and volcano gods lived in the volcano and when they created massive statues of these gods they looked human.



or by heroes who had been given the knowledge of such weapons.


As I said they could see a meteor strike and assume that the gods must be at war with each other or at war with human beings. The fact is that natural explanations exist for this story and even if they didn't it could easily be a work of fanciful imagination that lines up with what atomic weaponry look like. Jules Verne predicted submarines, the moon landing and atomic power, Star Trek predicted the cell phone, The Machine Stops (1909) predicted video chatting - this wouldn't be the first time that something fictional matched up with something real.

And yes it is true that both people in ancient India and ancient Greece had discerned that something like the atom existed (to the Greeks however this was Fire, Earth, Water and Air). How does this prove aliens? Merely because they SAY the gods gave them the knowledge. Can you quote me the exact passage where they claim that the gods told them atoms exist? As for the Multiverse it hasn't been proved, its still hypothetical at this point. I fail to see how any of this knowledge would prove aliens, to my mind it would just prove that ancient India was far ahead of its time.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 01:36 PM
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Originally posted by ObvTruth
Just a couple of other photos i came across. Try to debunk these




Ooo, fun Saturday morning project!


The first I can't do much with, since it's a screen cap from a TV show (which isn't to say that it's fake, just that it's hard to do any direct research on it). Do you know anything about where it's from? I will say that, if it's the background for a voiceover from the Ancient Astronauts show, it might not be anything. Of the thing I know the most about (language), the background images that accompany the voiceovers on the show are wrong as often as they are right. In talking about the Mahabharata, which was originally written in Sanskrit, for example, the show alternatively shows stock images of Sanskrit, Tibetan, and some Dravidian language (looks like Tamil to me, but it could be another language that uses a similar character set; I'm definitely not an expert on languages of that area). When introducing the Mayan script, it has a close-up of skulls carved on a Mayan temple, as if we're supposed to think those are the script (which they are demonstrably not). The show seems to be going more for atmosphere than accuracy with its stock images, which is fine, but it also means that the images behind the voiceovers probably aren't the best things to use for evidence.

The second image yields a bit more. According to this website (in French), the painting is from the Cougnac Caves, which is a real place in France, and one that is known to have cave paintings! Hooray! Still, I'm a bit skeptical of this image, for a couple of reasons. First, in googling around for images from the Coungac Caves, I can't find that particular painting in any of them. BUT, as far as I can find, there isn't a comprehensive index of all the paintings in the cave, so that's not to say it isn't there, just that I can't find it. Second, the paintings that I CAN find from the cave don't look the same (you can see a sample of nice photos from the cave here); namely, the paintings all seem to be black and red on white, not white on red.

Having said that, the motifs in the painting you presented do match what's seen at the Coungac Caves: see especially the image of the "speared man" at the website I linked above, along with the shape of the "UFO," which shows up in a line drawing labeled as "Placard type signs," just below the close-up of the "speared man." This makes me think that it might well be a real image (although maybe with the red-and-white swapped after the fact, to make the figures stand out more?), but perhaps sourced to the wrong French cave. I did poke around a bit looking at other paintings from French caves, but couldn't immediately find a match in another cave. Do you know anything more about this image?



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:01 PM
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Originally posted by suomichris

The second image yields a bit more. According to this website (in French), the painting is from the Cougnac Caves, which is a real place in France, and one that is known to have cave paintings! Hooray! immediately find a match in another cave. Do you know anything more about this image?


Suomi I found this :



Which seems to suggest it might be a genuine cave painting......but when taken as a whole it looks less convincing as a "UFO" painting.........they could be buildings/huts perhaps....but then again if it is to scale with everything else in the image they are small buildings.......and small UFOs for that matter!
edit on 11-6-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:07 PM
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reply to post by suomichris
 
The first image is like nothing I've ever seen in cave paintings and raises the alarms.

It doesn't look like it's rendered in the white pigments used in the distant past. There's no patina, no sense of flair or artistic expression. It looks like someone has used a modern titanium-based white and daubed it on with a brush or used a stencil.

Unless a better source than History Channel is posted, it's just a modern hoax imo.

The second is without any credible source. It's posted across the UFO websites and has no attribution or accurate location.

ETA: nice catch LO. Still no reason to infer ET.
edit on 11-6-2011 by Kandinsky because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 02:36 PM
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Originally posted by Kandinsky

ETA: nice catch LO. Still no reason to infer ET.
edit on 11-6-2011 by Kandinsky because: (no reason given)


Thanks K,

Still can't quite work out what those triangular shapes are..........but in the context of the whole image they look much less like "Alien" space craft.
If they were ET craft, then it seems this particular ancient caveman artist was a whole lot more fascinated by animals than ET.
edit on 11-6-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 03:28 PM
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Well according to this site (which i will post below) the France Cave Painting is from 13000 BC. Thats pretty old.

www.popealice.com...


Ok I see multiple disk like objects in the 2nd one....

This is something interesting i found...




This is suppost to be to be from 5000BC. If this is real than its proof that the AAH is correct. Cause this is no animal and theres no way to say its anything else. So good luck.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 04:26 PM
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Originally posted by ObvTruth.

This is something interesting i found...




This is suppost to be to be from 5000BC. If this is real than its proof that the AAH is correct. Cause this is no animal and theres no way to say its anything else. So good luck.


Obv I've posted your image below:

The same problem with this supposed ancient rock painting is that it ONLY seems to appear on UFO blogs and websites, with no specific location details.
Where in Japan is this rock painting?


edit on 11-6-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 04:37 PM
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reply to post by ObvTruth
 
Come on? You're trolling or having fun.

The image you linked is like a kids schematic for something off Thunderbirds. Whoever drew this sorryass item used a ruler or MS Paint.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 04:46 PM
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reply to post by Kandinsky
 


Im just having fun. You'd know if i was trolling.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 04:51 PM
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Originally posted by ObvTruth
Well according to this site (which i will post below) the France Cave Painting is from 13000 BC. Thats pretty old.

www.popealice.com...

That's the same image, just cropped to get rid of the History Channel logo. And, again, it doesn't source its claim.




This is suppost to be to be from 5000BC. If this is real than its proof that the AAH is correct. Cause this is no animal and theres no way to say its anything else. So good luck.

And again, no source, and it only shows up on a handful of UFO websites. Also, it appears to be drawn on with the pen or pencil; there's no variation in the thickness of the lines, and dips in the stone are unfilled.

If it is real, then it would certainly be evidence of AAH but, like the others, it is unsourced, and appears nowhere except UFO websites. And so, again, there is absolutely no way for anyone to actually investigate it, or verify it as an actual cave painting.



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 05:30 PM
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Of course you can't debunk ancient Aliens that’s nonsense ... I’m convinced that there are certain debunkers who jump on all of these threads what for ?? are you having fun does this totally amuse you ??? you all seem to hop on every opportunity there is to kill anything that is Alien related or UFO related ..

When the truth and logic is right in front of you .. that Ancient people were all Aliens .. or sprits ???

IS it the Christian in you ?? what drives you to disbelieve in Spirits?? why dont you think Aliens exsist ???
Do you think ghosts are fake too??

So I guess you must think carbon dating is unreliable right ???

What about Lucy???
news.nationalgeographic.com...
There is so much to this an many many others have credible information but there is no way you will ever change the mind of any skeptic enuff said .. lol



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 06:38 PM
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Originally posted by NorthStargal52
There is so much to this an many many others have credible information but there is no way you will ever change the mind of any skeptic enuff said .. lol


And this coming from the Apollo Moon Landing hoax conspiracy believer?
edit on 11-6-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 11 2011 @ 11:31 PM
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I was not going to respond to your rambling incoherence, but what the hell...

Originally posted by NorthStargal52
Of course you can't debunk ancient Aliens that’s nonsense ... I’m convinced that there are certain debunkers who jump on all of these threads what for ?? are you having fun does this totally amuse you ??? you all seem to hop on every opportunity there is to kill anything that is Alien related or UFO related ..

I haven't hopped on every opportunity; I've highlighted nonsense being presented as evidence. If this is an issue for you, I'm sorry, but also very thankful that the world doesn't work like you believe it does.


So I guess you must think carbon dating is unreliable right ???

Non-sequitur that I don't know how to respond to, so moving on....


What about Lucy???
news.nationalgeographic.com...

... to another non-sequitur? What about Lucy? You link an article which has nothing to do with anything under discussion.


There is so much to this an many many others have credible information but there is no way you will ever change the mind of any skeptic enuff said .. lol

I have, in nearly every post I've made on this thread, asked for a single piece of credible information. Any yet, the response I get is, "There's tons!!!!!!1!! LOLZ!!" Really? Then where is it? If it's so abundant, and so credible, why can't anyone provide a single link to a single credible source for the claims that they make? Not THEIR (or some other nutjob's) interpretation of ancient myths, not THEIR jumping to asinine conclusions without evidence, not THEIR inability to read, but ACTUAL, CREDIBLE evidence.

Do you know why they can't? Because it doesn't exist. I can hear you shaking your head over there, so go on, prove me wrong. Show me how ignorant I am by posting the smoking gun, the undeniable piece of evidence that is credible, easily sourced, and can be investigated on one's own, and that also demonstrates, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that ETs have visited the Earth in prehistory.

But you won't, will you? You'll either post some drivel about how you wouldn't change my mind anyway, thereby dodging the question, or else you'll post a link to nonsense.

But again, I'd love to be proven wrong, and actually see some real evidence...



posted on Jun, 12 2011 @ 05:51 AM
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reply to post by suomichris
 


That's a decent amount of research you did to disprove that one claim, gotta admit I was too lazy to do that much digging around about most of the claims being made about ancient Indian accounts. The thing is that even if the quote were absolutely authentic it still wouldn't prove ancient aliens.




posted on Jun, 12 2011 @ 06:24 PM
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reply to post by suomichris
 


Yes Native peoples have ancient beliefs and for one I would never share them openly .. there are some things that are very private .. but If you do some reading you will find out some things that go way back to the time after earth was formed .. I will not sit here and argue with someone who does not share my traditional beliefs ..

If you insist on believing that what you know, through books and the history channel that’s fine with me and all I know is that you don’t believe in ancient Aliens or the connection or ties to ancient religions to each his own.

Our belief is much deeper than that it .. and I believe it would be way over your head to try an explain any type of spiritual entity’s to you .. it isn’t just about painted rocks or carvings its about the spiritual aspect of knowing that everything was given life .. the Dinosaurs were ancient prehistoric yet can you tell me how they got here ??? Now they left fossils behind are they just rubbish too?

They have found remains of giant men in mounds who were 13 feet tall .. Now is that just BS also?

There are sacred places that aren’t in the books

and our oral history has been passed down just like many others have done also,,but of course certain people will scoff at that too .. Whether its God , the Bible or Jesus or anything for that matter there will always be someone like you . Who will come up with a subject as this .

Just because we cant prove our beliefs don’t make it wrong or untrue.
how did the continental drift happen ?? I think a lot to what your trying to present has to do with peoples singular beliefs .. one cant just claim ancient aliens didn’t exist .. the terminology for one Alien would be a spiritual belief to many >>>Spiritual Entity’s that gave us the earth as we know it ..

which leads us back to what you believe and what others believe in .. No one ever said you have to believe in anyone’s beliefs and the Ancient Aliens who really were here at one time and visit us are a part of my beliefs and who ever else chooses to believe
edit on 12-6-2011 by NorthStargal52 because: Sorry I left out a few words had to include so that it would make the sentance more clear



posted on Jun, 12 2011 @ 09:49 PM
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Wow...You weren't kiddin when you said long one.

Thank you for taking time out to research & post it up on here, amazing amount of detailed info on here. So many points to break down, but on the whole a very informative post.

Had a feeling ObvTruth would be commenting on this. He can be stubborn when it comes to whole-heartedly believeing the Ancient Alien Theory
edit on 12-6-2011 by SmoKeyHaZe because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 13 2011 @ 01:17 AM
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reply to post by SmoKeyHaZe
 


Thanks Smokey, good to know someone out there appreciates what I went through, but between you, me and everyone who will read this post I actually didn't have to do that much research. I was actually amazed how few times I had to dig something up in order to defeat a claim. The reason for that is simple, the proponents of AAH in the episode commit the same logical fallacies over and over and make lot's of baseless assertions and reinterpretations without real evidence to back them up.

Yeah, ObvTruth is in here, although I don't think he's presented any obvious evidence of the truth of aliens. Of course as someone who researched and, for a period of about a year, believed this kind of stuff I'm not surprised there's been a lack of evidence presented for AAH.
edit on 13-6-2011 by Titen-Sxull because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 13 2011 @ 01:22 AM
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reply to post by Titen-Sxull
 


If you did more research you would have some of your answers. I saw Giorgio Tsoukalos discuss some of these things last night at a conference and he talked about the planes among other things and how they have been reproduced and were the engines were and that they worked when reproduced. One episode and you think you know all there is to know? You did not even make a real effort to dissect it, you just chose bits and scoffed at it without presenting any alternative evidence.



posted on Jun, 13 2011 @ 01:28 AM
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reply to post by Titen-Sxull
 


Some of the accounts on Ancient Aliens may just be the believers of the Ancient alien theory taking this specific THEORY a tad to far. On the other hand, the rest of the evidence may show actual proof of "Aliens". To ancient people, Aliens decending down onto Earth may have looked like God had sent his Angels down to bring a great message. Also, Enoch was taken by those so called "angels" for reasons unknown. Upon his return, he was said to have great knowledge of the universe and life itself. So...interpret however you want. But I do not believe that God would want any man to know such a vast majority of things. (Even if he was a prophet)





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