The US space program and its secret advancement in our solor system exploration!

reply to post by TheMur


Many aircraft and ships have just as long or even longer service lifes,and if you really think they already travel about the solar system why do we never see evidence of that.

It was a struggle to build the ISS yet some people on here think we can travel as we please in the solar system to many sci fi fans on here.

Originally posted by Illustronic

Originally posted by TheMur

The Space shuttle, in 1981 the space shuttle made its "maiden" flight and still to this day 30 years later that very same shuttle still was still being used.

Soyuz (Russian: Сою́з, IPA: [sɐˈjus]), Union) is a series of spacecraft designed for the Soviet space program by the Korolyov Design Bureau in the 1960s, and still in service today. This image is to scale.

The space shuttle has been a plague to NASA time and time again , its faulty, has blown up on a few occasions and is built by the lowest bidder.

You can provide documentation components used in the Space Shuttle system are built by the lowest bidder correct? No you can't and you won't and you know why? Its simply not true.

The space shuttle cost 1.7 billon to make(endevour if im correct) the B2 cost 300 million more and does not need as much science as the shuttle would need to accomplish its mission. So YES the space shuttles are a lowest bidder project, not all components but many.

WHy would you want to explore space,in a space "race" nevertheless with a poorly made, not dependable, bus with rockets attached to its back?

It was designed to only go to LEO, repeatably, the only craft in the world that does that. It never was intended to escape earth orbital velocity.

so I guess we have decided to only stick our feet in the pool and not dive in the deep end.

The US goverment is a Military govenerment, everything from cell phones to GPS was first designed and used by the military years before it was made into a public economy enhanceing toy

Not true, portable telephones were available to the public in the 60's but few people had them because they were big, bulky, and cost about $5,000.00 and required a huge battery pack at first. You could even buy military models at military reserve depos.

My examples were just quick examples, maybe i should have referenced a microwave?

Some of this tech and hardware could very well have been attained from a crashed ET's Bentley, how would you explain how this tech was attained if the Goverment themselfs dont have all the answers.

This is a pure bating statement with no base in reality, unless you care to provide one.

This is just a Theory, never stated it was fact.

Now why would you cancel a program that was supposed to get mankind into outer space so that we could explore our solor system

Again you are adding to an already false assumption.

Oh so i guess we went in space to get a better look at stars or maybe see Earth from a higher view point.

This is because we have already explored our solor system to great lenghts and there was no reason to pump money into a program that was for a lie, especailly when budget cuts were needed.

Now you are really going out there into the depths of speculation and fantasy. I'm sure you can provide evidence?

Again this is a Theory, you do know what that is correct?

Im pretty sure we have been to the moon, mars, and many other destinations in our solor system however i think it will be years before we get the facts about our exact capabilites.

Correct, men have walked on the moon, rovers have operated on the surface and in the orbit of Mars, NASA has collected samples from comet WILD 2, and sent deep space probes to planets, in fact a couple are in orbit around two different planets or very soon. The capabilities that the general public are not aware of largely reside in specifications mostly in the military hardware development, which for obvious reasons is closely guarded.

If i could place all the facts on the table with tea and crumpets I would, however i only have the freedom of idea , speculation, theroy and thought. Forgive me for using what freedoms i have left.

Originally posted by TheMur
reply to post by Sinny

 

I agree that we all assume this however there has never been a clear direction to look for factual annomolies, NASA has granted us that. I honestly think NASA would love to tell all and we can see alittle of that from past astronauts trying to tell the truth. Unfortunately for them the Govenerment controls there pensions and there budget so they keep there mouths shut for the most part.

Absolutely, Senator John Glenn gets a nice government paycheck, and benefits too! Still kicking after all that terrible radiation exposure. Why don't you ask Boeing, Rockwell International, Pratt & Whitney Rocketdyne, Thiokol Chemical Corporation, David Clark Company, SPAR Aerospace Ltd., and a myriad of non government companies that actually make the hardware NASA uses?

If i could place all the facts on the table with tea and crumpets I would, however i only have the freedom of idea , speculation, theroy and thought. Forgive me for using what freedoms i have left.

Well then, we're done here!

reply to post by downunderET

Yes, I agree, our technology has zoomed over the past 20 years, however the shuttle uses rocket propulsion that is ancient. So whats going to replace the shuttle, I dunno, but there's one thing I think a lot of people have forgotten about, MONEY. If there is a replacment for the shuttle, it's going to cost, RIGHT, so who's cheque book do you use, dont forget the US is broke.

You assume the checks hadn't already been written, we did not "go broke" overnight, in fact 20 yrs ago we were on the surplus side of the equation, the defense budget has grown exponentially and it's not just because of the wars, not saying they're not expensive, but they do not account for everything, we do still operate deep black budgets, some of them even in Australia at Pine Gap or at AUTEC in the Bahamas - Pine Gap Wiki & AUTEC Wiki


reply to post by kro32

The U.S. often keeps things in service way past when they should be replaced. They do it with military aircraft and ships sometimes longer than 30 years. B-52 still fly today when they were made for Korea. As to taking the shuttles out of service there is a very good reason. There's not much need for the shuttle since we can accomplish most of the tasks either with the space station or or specific missions like the mars lander project. The benefits of keeping the shuttle program compared to the cost doesn't justify keeping it around anymore. I don't see any conspiracy here.

You're not wrong, but at the same time they are using those older models, they do indeed have much newer and more technologically advanced vehicles that are in service.

Just with the Airforce, while we were still using those B-52's we were fully and openly utilizing B-1's and in the dark developing and using B-2's, F-117's and B-2's had been operational for 20 years before their "public" disclosure in the early 90's.

I know for a fact (and no will not expand beyond that) what direction and the x-type projects that were in development in the 90's, and they were ALL space-based platforms, the F-22 Super-Cruise engines were a direct result of those programs, and you would have to be a hard core denier to ignore "The donut on a rope" or the various mysterious sonic booms that are even picked up by USGS.

I'm not saying anything too speculative here, just that the possibility does indeed exist. I'm not willing to go so far as to suggest Aliens are involved, but not going to close my mind off to the possibility either, without Aliens in the picture we do have or should already have the technology to pull this off, even if it's not in the public arena, it's how our country has operated for a century, we're not just going to give up the technological edge now.

Absence of proof does not mean proof of absence.

And I do not know how the ATS community feels about Gary McKinnon - Wiki - but despite people's feelings on the subject, he did pull off the hack, and we manipulated law with the UK to get him without having to provide proof

McKinnon remained at liberty without restriction for three years until June 2005 (until after the UK enacted the Extradition Act 2003, which implemented the 2003 extradition treaty with the US wherein the US did not need to provide contestable evidence), when he became subject to bail conditions including a requirement to sign in at his local police station every evening and to remain at his home address at night. In addition, he was banned from using a computer with access to the Internet. There have been no more developments in respect of the charges relating to United Kingdom legislation but in late 2005 the United States began extradition proceedings.

His hack was to specifically get UFO evidence and has stated -

There is evidence that the U.K. and the U.S. governments are co-participants not only in a global expansionist military policy as in Afghanistan, but also in interplanetary military expansionist policies involving secret solar system and galactic anti-gravity fleets. Evidence of these fleets was uncovered by UFO researcher Gary McKinnon, whom the U.S. government is prosecuting and whose extradition the U.K. government is facilitating in contravention of international humanitarian law.

Gary McKinnon discovered secret U.S. space fleet

So is it possible? Yeah

Would it be US M.O. to keep it in the dark for a couple of decades? Yeah

Is there going to be "proof"? I don't think so, any proof that has been let out by so called whistleblowers is quickly debunked to never be paid attention to again, to me though some of that gives it credibility, it IS what we did with the F-117 also, and it was/is very much real.

You talk as if you are employed by the Govt.:

reply to post by Hijaqd


Right on buddy!

Originally posted by TheMur
You talk as if you are employed by the Govt.:

OPSEC!

Operational Security, I will NOT expand past that, other than to say that Disney is not the only folks employing "Imagineers"

I'll posit this as an answer. We can only do what we are told by those who control "space." NASA is at the beck and call of others, most likely those off world, or at least beneath our world. They told NASA, you can do as you please, in low earth orbit, but that's it. Key point, you can do it until the summer of 2011, so there is no point to making something new as you'll be done by then for good. We'll know the reason why the secrecy in three months time or so.

OPSEC! oh man your on to me! Im out!

reply to post by crankyoldman


Whoa! Nice angle! True or not, makes ya think about it and thats all it takes.

reply to post by TupacShakur


We do however most of this we will never hear of because everything in this world is competition and protection, If your better at something you set the threshold for competition, if your foes do not know you abilities this will grant greater protection.

reply to post by TheMur


The shuttle was never intended to explore in space. It was designed to carry large payloads and a crew into space in relative comfort and safety and be reusable. The shuttle is a masterpiece of engineering and a showcase of technological andvancement. In no way has it been a technical disappointment. Even financially, it has paid for itself through it's contributions to a wide range of technological and medical developments.

reply to post by TheMur

The Space shuttle, in 1981 the space shuttle made its "maiden" flight and still to this day 30 years later that very same shuttle still was still being used. Now to me this seems like the first red flag. Does it not seem strange that NASA would use the same transport for 30 years!

So your first argument for a conspiracy is that NASA used the Shuttle for so long...

The second red flag that should have made people awaken was the announcement of the end of the shuttle program and the outsourcing of flights to low orbit. Now why would you cancel a program that was supposed to get mankind into outer space so that we could explore our solor system.

...and your second argument is that they’ve stopped using it.

What flawless logic!

Listen. The Shuttle cost $145 billion (1) over the life of the programme, which consisted of 134 flights (2). That’s about $1.3 billion a flight, though later flights cost less than early ones. Why do you think that was? Partly, at least, it was because some of the upstream costs had been amortized. Do you get it now? The reason they used the damn’ thing for thirty years was to squeeze whatever value they could out of a ruinous investment. And because they couldn’t afford to develop a new shuttle. That’s how the real world works – very different from the fantasies of conspiracy theories.

And why did they stop using it? Because they couldn’t afford $750 million a flight, which is what it costs now (1). NASA stopped using the Shuttle because they can’t afford it any more; it’s as simple as that.

reply to post by Fiberx


Thank You!!


To the OP.


The shuttle has been retired for many reasons and they are working on a new design as soon as the shuttle program ends in July. Well actually they are working on it now. I have friends who will be working on the new design and program. It will be about 5yrs before it comes out, which is why the shuttle has been taking payloads to the ISS. It's been taking supplies up there for those who will be there the next five years or at least until another country gets up there. I can only imagine being on the ISS for that long...In a way I am envious but in another way I don't think I'd want to be up there that long.

I live right next to the KSC and I meet a lot of people from the shuttle program and NASA, they are all good people who believe me would love to be able to tell what they know and have seen but they just can't. I have been told a few things and it bothers me when people put down NASA because these people want the public to know what is going on but their jobs, pensions and lives are probably at stake if they talk. Not everything they do is a conspiracy. I believe we have explored space more so than we are told and I also believe we have been to Mars already but that is my opinion based on personal research. NASA is huge and of course they are going to do things we the public don't know about and I am positive they have far more advanced technology than we are told.

Yes they have secret space programs, that isn't really all that secret if you know where to look I have a link in my signature (Navy Space Command) that has some awesome information about the various secret projects. You should check it out it's a great read and thread by Zorgon. It's probably one of my favorites.

Also the shuttle didnt blow up a few times, it was only twice and they were horrible accidents and when you are putting something like that into space accidents can happen as horrible as it is. You can't say that the shuttle was bad based on two accidents out of all the launches it has made. The shuttle is an amazing piece of technology and an amazing accomplishment, I will miss her for sure. I have seen the shuttle and launches up close and it is the coolest thing ever to see something that big shoot off for space! You feel the vibration all the way through your body and you realize wow that thing is going to space! Well maybe it's just me and my love of the shuttle and all things space. I am proud of the shuttle program and all its accomplished. I look forward to the next one and by that time I hope to be one of those working on the next fleet of space orbiters

Anyway you should check out the Navy Space Command thread and if you like I also have my Endeavour thread of the launch and a little history on her in my signature as well. I also have one on Discovery, one will follow for Atlantis which I just saw Tuesday at the rollout (where it goes from the VAB to the pad).

reply to post by TheMur


OK. Then lets start some serious discussions and demands about the triangles.
The shuttle, the B-2 bomber, F-117A, F-35,.the stupid VT-Ospray on and on, etc. and even the space station are all "make work" projects to be cover the real work that has been done. The billions and billions spent on such activities was actually necessary, of course, to cover the big secret of developing our version of real UFOs.

Such typical activities also conveniently covered the creation and deployment of the triangles which as I've stated on these pages many times, is our early, three-axis re-engineering of alien craft. (But the triangles have also been slipped in, probably with lots of disinfo help and a strange lack of recognition from sources involved in reporting on aviation, into the UFO enigma to make a nice muddle about their identities if not actual existence. After all if flying saucers are just figments of imagination and poorly understood astronomical and aerial phenomena, certainly the triangles can be explained the same way I mean, sheesh! Could we actually believe without having official governmental confirmation that we actually have craft that move--not fly--but move low, slow and quietly over towns and roads?

As we know, some aircraft have always been secret, the SR-21 was strictly a recon craft and highly secret for decades, the F-117A, now retired, I understand, was operational in squadrons for twenty years before it was revealed to the public. But it was never much of hot aircraft in the first place. Neither is the B-2 bomber Both, in fact, are true dogs. While the shuttle and the ISS probably got every penny allocated to to them , we should suspect that Lockheed, Boeing and Northrupt didn't work for free and some of the projects and programs for other things were created only to channel money to the UFO and triangles areas. Because the money had to come from somewhere.

The thing of it is that the public is always the last to know about nice, new weapons. Only a sprinkling of the American public knows the term "black triangles." Some have actually witnessed the antics of these devices, but few want to believe that they are what they seem to be. But how about our possible enemies? It seems more and more apparent every day that governments the world over are revealing that they have secret UFO files and the Chinese are no exception. Do they not know about triangles from various sources, spies and investigations? Certainly, they know. So who is the secret being kept from and for why?

The terrible secret of the triangles must be kept as long as possible because of the rich heritage behind the triangles. How long after they were made public would it be before questions arose about how they seemed to operate pretty much like the typical UFOs that have been witnessed for over half a century. So that can of worms would be slow to boil over, but in short order the realization that ETs are here and have been for a time, would rock the world.

For those of us that want the truth out, our hands are tied. Secrets can be kept for decades. And in my estimation, the secrets extend back to an extended form of contact one way or another with the ETs for decades. This than is the big secret, we cannot expect the triangles to be revealed soon. Nor for the same reasons should we expect disclosure anytime soon strictly by design.

My personal view is that it will take one of four events to get the triangles revealed which would then, eventually, unraveled the hidden UFO story. The first possible way of info release would come from a public crash of a triangle that despite the best efforts of the military, could not be kept under the covers. The second possibility would be that such a devastating economy befell the US that as a desperate measure the triangles were released as a fabulous new type of transportation device that would revolutionize the the movement of people and goods across the world thereby causing a global economic boon but especially to the makers/owners of those craft.

The third possibility would be for a world war in which those craft were deemed necessary for the victory of that war. In that same vein, as long as the Chinese know that we have these remarkable craft, they will be careful in their actions and not start a war.

The final, doubtful possible way triangles may be revealed would be the decision to simply do that despite the social and cultural uproar over the core true being virtually reveal at the same time.

I did not include the possibilities of an E-initiated contact starting the triangle revelations rolling is because in over half a century, at least, we have not seen such overt actions.

So, in my unbridled estimation, this is where the situation stands.

reply to post by Aliensun

So, in my unbridled estimation, this is where the situation stands.

Unbridled is right. Phew.

Do you have one single shred of evidence to substantiate your wild allegations?

No?

Thought not.

reply to post by grey580


NASA is like Interscope records/ Aftermath ......

They sign all the top talent so other labels can't make money off of them , and then never release their albums or just shelve it and switch themes for a cd ...

Same thing for NASA....They horde all the smart people by making them think they are cream of the crop at NASA...

Who wouldn't want to work for them right ? Then you have them mindlessly and uselessly develop tech that is not top of the line but they work with it to find a way to make money off of the lower tech selling it to us and use that money to fund the Actually Hi-tech stuff that has kept us far into the solar system for decades....

It just makes sense.....think about it...

Trillions of dollars in black projects for what ? Research facilities and secret space exploration vehicles and tech.


NASA figured out long ago how to use the electro-magnetics that the Universe/space is made of for their propulsion.

they literally ride on a never ending wave of electro-magntism provided for free by the universe....

IT's not hard to comprehend, but it's so so so so easy too fool people.

let me just state that the shuttle was first and foremost, developed in an era where the US and the soviet union were competing at building space stations. the shuttle was created for the purpose of supporting and supplementing america's plans in creating her space stations in order to project a credible threat to the soviet union's efforts.

and if somehow a reentry vehicle like the shuttle can overfly enemy territory at Mach 20+ while keeping the russians in tthe dark about what it's got inside the cargo bay then the threat that it represents just increased markedly, especially when one takes into consideration the fact that the shuttle retains some semblance of maneuverability even if its just a glorified bastard of a lifting body and a glider.

but it was the idea of projecting a threat to america's enemies that was important. same thing the USAF did with the B-2, create a credible threat and watch your enemy crumble while they try to counter the threat you created.

does anyone else see a common thread here?

US Tech - Soviet Response

XB-70 - MiG-25
SR-71 - accelerated research in AAM tech
U-2 Dragonlady - accelerated research in AAM tech
F-15 - Su-27
F-16 - MiG-29
B-2 Spirit - collapse of the Berlin Wall
F-22 - PAK-FA

Originally posted by TheMur
reply to post by TWILITE22

 

From my knowlege the shuttles never even went to the moon, that was all rockets with pods. Maybe someone else can clearify this?

If you don't know the answer to this question, you are not even remotely qualified to be making any statements about NASA, the space shuttle or the space program in general.

I would suggest you do at least a cursory amount of research before forming broad-reaching opinions as the one in the OP.