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A380

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posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 03:33 PM
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I have made a search on ATS to see if this has been talked about before, and maybe I don't know how to use the search(I don't) because nothing came up.

But here it is, the AirBus A380


To me it is an amazing aircraft.

www.airbus.com...

Some back up information:Link

Shattered OUT...




posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 03:56 PM
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Yeah that sure is one amazing plane.

(now cue those who've spent too long supping up Boeing's propaganda.

It's pretty funny they've gone through all the usual stages

1) it'll never sell/happen, there's no demand/market for it

2) it'll never work.....maiden flight coming very soon!


and undoubtedly there'll be a stage 3 when the US airlines have to start buying loads of them to compete and some Americans begin to howl about why aren't Americans making similar.)

[edit on 6-8-2004 by sminkeypinkey]



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 04:13 PM
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Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
Yeah that sure is one amazing plane.
(now cue those who've spent too long supping up Boeing's propaganda.


Sminkey, I do love your flame baiting.

The A380 is a marvel of technology from its sub systems to its use of novel structures in its airframe. The bulk of the objections to Airbus in general deals with the unfair practices of the EU.



"Airbus partner governments have borne 75 to 100 percent of the development costs for all major lines of Airbus aircraft and provided other forms of support, including equity infusions, debt forgiveness, debt rollovers and marketing assistance," the trade representative's report said, adding the situation raised "serious concerns" about EU compliance


Note that Airbus does not have to begin paying off the debt from its loans untill it reaches a certain production target. Airbus makes some awesum planes, there is no doubt to that. I am partial to the A340 as it reminds me alot of the 707 of yesteryear.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 04:27 PM
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Yeah, the A380 will be great. Finally Europe has designed a great plane, maybe as revolutionary as the 747 was.

I was watching a programme on it just a few hours ago. They said in an all economy configuration, it could seat 966 people but I doubt airlines will dispense with the conventional three class layout.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by Hyperen
I was watching a programme on it just a few hours ago. They said in an all economy configuration, it could seat 966 people but I doubt airlines will dispense with the conventional three class layout.


It depends. If the charter airlines ie ATA find that the business model suits them, then you may see it,, Japan uses the 747-400D on domestic routes and it can get up to 560 (I think on board.) in a once class cattle configuration.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 05:02 PM
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I can't wait till this thing flies. I've been waiting for a while now to see something new and big pop up. It's going to be quite the sight at airports. Can't wait to see it beside a 747-400 for comparison.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 07:43 PM
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Yeah I like it, but it will never be able to be as popular as the 747, and Boeing's 7E7 Dreamliner will sell many many more then Airbus'es huge bohemith.
I was wondering if the President will want this plane for Air Force One? I mean its quit a bit bigger which he would like but I think there is 2 reasons that that would never happen.
1. Theres only a little over 50 Airports in the world that can support this giant.
2. It's not MADE IN AMERICA.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 07:52 PM
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imagen when this thing crashes
oh the maddnes



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 08:01 PM
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Originally posted by Murcielago
Yeah I like it, but it will never be able to be as popular as the 747, and Boeing's 7E7 Dreamliner will sell many many more then Airbus'es huge


I agree with the marketing. The hub to hub transport to slot limited airports is a limited market. Boeing is betting on smaller city pairs with the 7E7. The A380 will accell in the stockyard runs say London to SF with 1 flight a day versus 2 to carry the same amount of people. Airbus will no doubt see good profitability from all the subs. and loan provisions it gets from the European governments.

Air Force One will be an Airbus the day you can pry the yoke from cold dead hands



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 08:04 PM
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europe will fall,, airbus sucks, boeing rocks, europe hate america reemember.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 08:06 PM
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Originally posted by Murcielago
I was wondering if the President will want this plane for Air Force One? I mean its quit a bit bigger which he would like but I think there is 2 reasons that that would never happen.
1. Theres only a little over 50 Airports in the world that can support this giant.
2. It's not MADE IN AMERICA.


The president of the US won't anyway almost purely based on the fact that it is not american but also just think of the cost and just before/after an election



I think the A380 is more of an evolutionary step than a new a/c. In reality if you stretched the top deck of a 747 and changed the cockpit and stuff then basically they are the same (ok I realise there are other details but I am not picking).


As for not being able to find anything on this there was definately a thread about a month ago where we got down to discussing about the effect it had on airports and general stuff about it.


And just what are these unfair practices? I have heard of some funding issues (minor btw) but if that is it then chances are that the US government has funded boeing (or permitted loans). Also just look in a thread about the TSR-2 (I think that is it) where the US stopped the UK developing a better fighter than the F-111 yet as it was in competition and we needed a loan the US decided to blackmail us into giving up the program and hence competition. So need we go any further regarding "unfair practices" or should we drag more US ones out of the cupboard? (N.B. Not that I know any but there must be some and other members will know of them)



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 10:07 PM
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The A380 will definatly do better than the 7E7 because even though the A380 is big, it can be accomadated so that all classes are pure luxury.

Plus the A380 is more cost effective.

The A380 however will only be owned by European airlines or Virgin Atlantic.

Although this is all true, Boeing will show AirBus with an even bigger and more luxurious aircraft, the BWB.

The BWB will come out up to 5 years after the A380, so the A380 will have 5 years to shine. The BWB does better than the A380 and is bigger.

Only problem with the BWB is that not many airports can accomadate a Mammoth size aircraft such as this.

The BWB and A380 are economically efficent and act as good Flagships. Both aircraft will be used to transport large numbers of passengers to a large airport at once, so from there they can go on their final destinations on in style on the 7E7 DreamLiner.

That is how it should work.

Shattered OUT...



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 11:36 PM
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Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
The A380 will definatly do better than the 7E7 because even though the A380 is big, it can be accomadated so that all classes are pure luxury.

Plus the A380 is more cost effective.

The A380 however will only be owned by European airlines or Virgin Atlantic.

Although this is all true, Boeing will show AirBus with an even bigger and more luxurious aircraft, the BWB.

The BWB will come out up to 5 years after the A380, so the A380 will have 5 years to shine. The BWB does better than the A380 and is bigger.

Only problem with the BWB is that not many airports can accomadate a Mammoth size aircraft such as this.

The BWB and A380 are economically efficent and act as good Flagships. Both aircraft will be used to transport large numbers of passengers to a large airport at once, so from there they can go on their final destinations on in style on the 7E7 DreamLiner.

That is how it should work.

Shattered OUT...



Your posts are not very good, you should learn what your talking about before you type it. You have so many flaws in this post its rediculas.


For starters the A380 won't be luxuries, those are just the "Selling the Aircraft" pictures you have seen the airliners will pack it full of seats just to squeez every cent of profit out of it.

Airbus will by no means even come close to selling more A380's then Boeing selling 7E7's. Boeing will sell twice as many 7E7 Dreamliners then Airbus'es A380.

The Blended Wing Body design is a ways away from being a civilian transport jet. First military will have it for there uses such as: Tanker, Moving Troops, and Moving Vehicles. But even that is around 10-15 years away.

As for it moving the public thats 15-20 years if it ever pans out! Reason being people don't want to sit in a plane where you look left and you see hundreds of people then you look right and you see hundreds more, and if you like having a window seat
Forget about it.

PS: The only way for Boing to sell that thing to the public is this.
First you make some of the upper level of the aircraft reserved for First Class and you have a big sky window for them to see the nice day or even better the stars at night. As for the rest of the plane you have make several hallways with walls, you have to section off the plane into smaller areas so everbody can't see each other, people like there personal space. For everbody with out a first class or window seat they can get up and go to a certain area of the plane with alot of big windows and it can be the look out point. I personally would love to look out of it.

But the down side with this plane it it's subsonic and in 20 years I for one hope we can get past that and have jets that can supercruise around mach 2.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 11:37 PM
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The A380 is a beautiful aircraft and is a shining example of why Airbus and Europe IMO better civvie jet manufacturers than Boeing. The Airbus experience is just a lot nicer to Boeings when you fly.

I believe there is a market for the A380 out of Europe, my countries big airline QANTAS has already ordered some, as I am sure some middle eastern airlines have as well. But the 747-400 is here to stay a long time. I also believe if aircraft manufacturer's outside the US have a choice between the A380 and 7E7 for routes that can handle both, they will go with the a380
. Unless Boeing cuts a sneaky deal
.

The TSR-2 would of been a great plane, but sadly went the way of the Avro Arrow, which even today would of been a great craft.

thanks,
drfunk



posted on Aug, 6 2004 @ 09:05 AM
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Just looking at the trends it seems to me that the A380 might be a really big flop. Most airlines are moving to a point A- to point b rather than the hub and spoke system. The A380 could work really long distance flights( ie Australia, Japan, South Africa ect) but I think it will only be used in a limited quantity. The 7E7 is perfect for this type of system and will likely thrive. To put this in perspective you need only look at the Europe to US flights. While the 747 still has power in this area, it is rapidly being replaced by 767s and Airbuses because of the economy and flexibility offered.



posted on Aug, 6 2004 @ 03:21 PM
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Originally posted by FredT

Sminkey, I do love your flame baiting.


- thank you, it's a gift.



The A380 is a marvel of technology from its sub systems to its use of novel structures in its airframe. The bulk of the objections to Airbus in general deals with the unfair practices of the EU.


- I'm sure that is true (but only to a point).....as I am also sure it is really only so if one ignores practices by the US gov that favour the US companies.

US practices regarding defense contracts have long been seen by euro companies as a 'slight-of hand' system of subsidy. There's little point in attempting to defend the indefensible over this as just about everybody now recognises the truth of this situation....as evidenced by some of the WTO decisions in the 'aero field'.


Note that Airbus does not have to begin paying off the debt from its loans untill it reaches a certain production target.


- That makes a nice change. Usually the whole position of operating under loan agreements gets ignored and treated as if it were some sort of governmental or EU 'gift' (and some American ideas of how the EU really operates are almost as funny as those that are EU-hostiles in the UK....who also tend to have little idea of the actuality of it all too).


Airbus makes some awesum planes, there is no doubt to that. I am partial to the A340 as it reminds me alot of the 707 of yesteryear.


- Yeah another pretty one, and like all of them, a great performer too. Airbus makes a great product, there is no getting away from that fact.

Agreeing that this is so is hardly to claim the old Boeing stuff is (that) 2nd rate, is it?


Jokey comments aside what's so hard to understand about any of this?

The days when europe bought any old product off of the US shelf, had tiny aero-industries and were incapable of matching or bettering US product are long over. Sorry and all but there it is.

We in Europe have a need to maintain a high-end tech capacity and capability as does the US......and the day 'made in the US' becomes utterly worthless to US companies and the US gov is the day we can all sit down and discuss completely honest 'free trade'.

The US isn't going to give up it's capacity and capability in this field and neither are we.

If you like Airbus products, fine buy them, if you don't, don't.

It's a big world market out there and we're (already) getting plenty of it, ta very much.



posted on Aug, 6 2004 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by roniii259
Just looking at the trends it seems to me that the A380 might be a really big flop.


- That must be why it is already half way to break-even without having left the ground yet, hmmm?


Most airlines are moving to a point A- to point b rather than the hub and spoke system.


- No that is a Boeing claim.....which just happens to coincide with their plans and projects, wow imagine that, huh? Who'd a thunk it?


The A380 could work really long distance flights( ie Australia, Japan, South Africa ect) but I think it will only be used in a limited quantity.


- Yeah, as 'limited' as like the 747, eh?



The 7E7 is perfect for this type of system and will likely thrive.


- I have no doubt if Boeing make this aircraft it will sell. But it will not have the market to itself and it will not be around for a long long time yet....how much use is a paper plane to anyone?


To put this in perspective you need only look at the Europe to US flights. While the 747 still has power in this area,


- Um what are you talking about? The 747 is all over the world. Everyone of them is a candidate to be replaced by an A380.


it is rapidly being replaced by 767s and Airbuses because of the economy and flexibility offered.


- There is some truth in that but it hardly reflects the entire picture of why 767's and certain Airbus jets have taken over. Cost per seat/mile are what it is all about....and a brand new A380 will beat everything in the air today on the long haul runs at that, (what will be by then) old 767's included.

A380 sales are now up to 132 @ 31st july 2004 (www.zap16.com..." target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow"> www.zap16.com...)




posted on Aug, 6 2004 @ 05:53 PM
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Originally posted by Murcielago

Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
The A380 will definatly do better than the 7E7 because even though the A380 is big, it can be accomadated so that all classes are pure luxury.

Plus the A380 is more cost effective.

The A380 however will only be owned by European airlines or Virgin Atlantic.

Although this is all true, Boeing will show AirBus with an even bigger and more luxurious aircraft, the BWB.

The BWB will come out up to 5 years after the A380, so the A380 will have 5 years to shine. The BWB does better than the A380 and is bigger.

Only problem with the BWB is that not many airports can accomadate a Mammoth size aircraft such as this.

The BWB and A380 are economically efficent and act as good Flagships. Both aircraft will be used to transport large numbers of passengers to a large airport at once, so from there they can go on their final destinations on in style on the 7E7 DreamLiner.

That is how it should work.

Shattered OUT...



Your posts are not very good, you should learn what your talking about before you type it. You have so many flaws in this post its rediculas.


For starters the A380 won't be luxuries, those are just the "Selling the Aircraft" pictures you have seen the airliners will pack it full of seats just to squeez every cent of profit out of it.

Airbus will by no means even come close to selling more A380's then Boeing selling 7E7's. Boeing will sell twice as many 7E7 Dreamliners then Airbus'es A380.

The Blended Wing Body design is a ways away from being a civilian transport jet. First military will have it for there uses such as: Tanker, Moving Troops, and Moving Vehicles. But even that is around 10-15 years away.

As for it moving the public thats 15-20 years if it ever pans out! Reason being people don't want to sit in a plane where you look left and you see hundreds of people then you look right and you see hundreds more, and if you like having a window seat
Forget about it.

PS: The only way for Boing to sell that thing to the public is this.
First you make some of the upper level of the aircraft reserved for First Class and you have a big sky window for them to see the nice day or even better the stars at night. As for the rest of the plane you have make several hallways with walls, you have to section off the plane into smaller areas so everbody can't see each other, people like there personal space. For everbody with out a first class or window seat they can get up and go to a certain area of the plane with alot of big windows and it can be the look out point. I personally would love to look out of it.

But the down side with this plane it it's subsonic and in 20 years I for one hope we can get past that and have jets that can supercruise around mach 2.

No man, you need to do your research, before you insult me, understand that the BWB will not be military, it will be civilian.

IT EVEN SAYS THAT WITH MY SOURCES.

Do not make me mad, I have had a bad day, and you apparently have not read the schematics of al the aircraft.

There are about 7-8 different versions of the A380. IT will not be packed to save money, that is juqst stupid, that is more cause for an accident.

You want the aircraft to be well balanced and safe. You also have not stopped to think about that have you?

You are just some nationalist who thinks everything American made is better than all the worlds, but guess what, everything in your house is made in China, probably the materials for your house were shipped from china.

You are blind, America is not the best at everything, yes they do have a strong Military Force, but as for Civilan, that comes last in America's Agenda.

Europe specializes in civilian transport, why??

Well lets see now, Europe=more people than in America. Europe=has the fights brought to them, so they dont need to bother with overseas transport.

What you do not understand or see you walk all over, there is a bigger truth out there than Boeing being the best there is.

I do not know where you get your information, but the BWB is just a civilian transport, it will come out as one, it says that in all of the economic information I have read about it.

I did my research before making these posts, did you?

I do not post threads out of stupidity without doing research, notice how I rarely post any threads at all, that is because I try to find something most valuable and then post it, some people beat me to posting certain topics, that is O.K. as long as the message is getting out.

So please, PLEASE by all means prove me wrong, I do not mind, that way I will learn something, as for you, I am not so sure.

Shattered OUT...



posted on Aug, 6 2004 @ 06:31 PM
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Shattered

If you havn't seen any artist renderings or talk info about the BWB being a Tanker then use google for 10 seconds and you wil find info on it.

You think that the A380 will be luxurious
, we'll just wait and see.

As for the part where you said that "Europe lets the fight come to them", True, like if the keep disagreeing with the United States we will see that.


You think you have educated posts? On a different thread you though Bill Sweetman was a Aircraft Engineer!



posted on Aug, 7 2004 @ 03:39 AM
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Originally posted by ShatteredSkies
I do not know where you get your information, but the BWB is just a civilian transport, it will come out as one, it says that in all of the economic information I have read about it.


Prove you wrong eh? Yes Boing did do a little research on using BWB for commercial craft, but there are alot of limitations to be practical at this time. The window issue is minor compared tot he fact that given the ride of the body, half the people on the either side of the plane would be pukeing thier lungs out from the active ride. The BWB will as Murcielago pointed out will have military apps first. DARPA is doing research intot hem as well. From Cargo, to tankers to bombers they have alot of possibities.
www.boeing.com...




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