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Men and Child support. What is the answer?

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posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 07:42 PM
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Originally posted by bluemirage5
reply to post by gps777
 


Yeah and many many mothers were bashed by their partners who demanded the women hand over the money to them!


LINK PLEASE????????
I have one,as always.................................................


On May 13, 2011, just after 5am, Michael Fox, a father, parked a hired truck near a pylon on the Sydney Harbour Bridge and climbed to the top of the arches.

The 38-year-old ex-military father protester unveiled two banners, reading "Kids First" and "Plz Help My Kids" at the top of the bridge. He claimed to the media that his children were victims of parental alienation.

Sydney Morning Herald Poll - 2 out of 3 people believe that father protestor's action was justified in trying to get help for his children - Parental Alienation

LINK


Women at the end of World War 1 had to give up their jobs to returning servicemen -- even though their husbands may have been killed in combat. There was no widow’s pension, nor child support.


Sounds tough but Age reader Steve Hills of Rosebud is not impressed. ‘‘There is overwhelming evidence that female health, safety and female lives were held as more valuable than men’s lives,’’ he says. ‘‘Men’s lives were routinely regarded as disposable. The view that women alone were discriminated against is an ignorant one.’’

According to Hills, ‘‘men have generally protected women but when women share all the power, will they look after men? No. They never have. Is there any such thing as a widower’s pension? Doesn’t exist. Never did.’’

LINK


It was “a tragic indictment of the system” that a Canberra man had committed suicide holding a letter of demand from the Child Support Agency, the ACT Coroners Court was told yesterday.

Barrister Richard Thomas said the receipt of the letter two days before Warren Gilbert's death in August had “tipped him over the edge”.

He said Mr Gilbert, 28, had died from carbon monoxide poisoning in a friend's car after being “hounded” by the CSA.

The CSA had been taking 47 per cent of his gross salary in tax and another 30 per cent for child support.

With a massive 80 per cent of his wages gone, Mr Gilbert had $150 a week to live on.

Australian Suicide Victim “Hounded” Over Child Support


Wheres YOUR proof?????????????????

edit to add: BTW,look how old the poor guy was.ONLY 28. But men in that age group dont commit suicide,because of CHILD SUPPORT.
Remember what you said................
edit on 18-6-2011 by sonnny1 because: (no reason given)




posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 08:05 PM
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The sound on this is terrible, but an important story.




posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 08:58 PM
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Kinda late to the thread but, the answer is to not get married.



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 09:34 PM
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Originally posted by CRDDD
Kinda late to the thread but, the answer is to not get married.


Not late. I just came back after dropping out for 20 or 30 pages.

But I do have to disagree with your point. Child support today has nothing to do with marriage, sadly. But it is my position that it should. If a man is not married to the woman, he should not be obligated to support HER CHOICE, and her choice alone. If you are married on the other hand, you have made an obligation before God and the courts of man to be equally responsible for the fruits of that union, whether they be favorable or not.
edit on 18-6-2011 by CobraCommander because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 10:14 PM
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Originally posted by bluemirage5
reply to post by TheLordVeack
 


What if the woman also worked fulltime before she married? By your meaning, when a couple marries everything they earned together originally belonged to him? I don't think so. Many couples marry with barely any assets at all between them or none at all.


Sorry but how on earth did you jump to that conclusion!? That doesn't make any sense and is against what I argued for. If the two equal partners are both working when they enter the relationship then when they split up everything they own and have paid for equally should be split right down the middle! I would have thought that this was obvious and fair!
Unfortunately its usually the man who works himself into a coma while the woman stays at home looking after the children. They work incredible hours to support their families only for the wife to say they were to tired to satisfy them sexually or that they were never around. The poor guy can't win. Damned if we do, damned if we don't!



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 10:30 PM
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reply to post by TheLordVeack
 


Hey, dont bring sex into it now. Some of us men are middle-aged now.



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 11:19 PM
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Forgive my ignorance as I really don't know much about this branch of the system.. but would it not be possible to discuss this situation with the mother(s) of your children and perhaps appeal to their compassionate sides? Ask them if they'd be prepared to skip the middle man and have you pay them directly or even ask them to temporarily reduce your payments so you can try and get back on your feet.

You being taxed to shiat is obviously salting your financial wounds, and with how much you work having literally nothing to show for it has got to be the most depressing feeling ever. I really feel for you mate and wish I could help you out in some way, i'm not trying to discourage you from taking care of your kids.. but you've really gotta' take care of yourself too.



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 11:49 PM
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Originally posted by YouDeserveToKnow
Forgive my ignorance as I really don't know much about this branch of the system.. but would it not be possible to discuss this situation with the mother(s) of your children and perhaps appeal to their compassionate sides? Ask them if they'd be prepared to skip the middle man and have you pay them directly or even ask them to temporarily reduce your payments so you can try and get back on your feet.

You being taxed to shiat is obviously salting your financial wounds, and with how much you work having literally nothing to show for it has got to be the most depressing feeling ever. I really feel for you mate and wish I could help you out in some way, i'm not trying to discourage you from taking care of your kids.. but you've really gotta' take care of yourself too.


Your suggestions are quite reasonable and really the way it should be to a large extent in my opinion.

But there are several jey problems.

First, and I will start with the Femnazi logic, men lie. And as much as I hate the militant femmes, they do have a point. There are some men, even more than a few men, who are human scum just as much as anyone else. Dirtbags are dirtbags and will use any excuse to get out of their responsibility, man or woman.

Second. Lawyers will never allow that to happen because it means less proift for them. It is in the interest of lawyers to draw out any divorce/custody dispute as long as they can, especially if they are defending a woman, because it means mucho profit.

Third. Even if you manage to escape the lawyer web of brainwashing and deceit, the state will STILL lock you up. If the woman of the child wind up poor, through no fault of the man mind you and requiring public assistance of any kind, the state will step in and demand money from you even if you have no job or a low paying job. If you don't pay, you will go to jail, even if the money you are ordered to pay is your rent, grocery money, or even the car insurance money you require to get to and from the job that supports those kid.



posted on Jun, 18 2011 @ 11:56 PM
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reply to post by YouDeserveToKnow
 


I should just add one thing here. The very best relationships that I see between fathers and children, who are best provided for, the woman was smart enough to trust the man she left. To trust the man that he would do what was best and within his power to do for his children.

One of my very best friends supports not only his own son, but a daughter who was never his as well, while he lives in the spare room of his parents retirement condo.



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 12:42 AM
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Originally posted by YouDeserveToKnow
Forgive my ignorance as I really don't know much about this branch of the system.. but would it not be possible to discuss this situation with the mother(s) of your children and perhaps appeal to their compassionate sides? .


Some cases work that way. As soon as the SYSTEM gets involved though,its a whole different ball game. Men are the perpetrators.Men are a few thousand dollars away from becoming felons. No three strikes,no violence involved. Stop paying,or fail to make payments in a timely fashion,you become prime suspect number 1. It happens every day. Loose your job ? Tough. Those payments have to keep coming. Try to explain? Tough. There is no compassion from the courts. They breed instability,and most importantly, Deny common sense. Mothers and kids are not safe. They too are victims.



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 12:45 AM
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HAPPY FATHERS DAY !



To many more.........



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 12:46 AM
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reply to post by sonnny1
 


Exactly, a man in jail does not pay support payments.



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 03:22 AM
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Mirage, how much must a man give? You seem to have a blood thirst. Where do you draw the line ma'am? You ridicule me for being a man who was nearly murdered. Perhaps men are destined ingratiate ourselves unto you.

And to the mods, I ask that you let this video stand as a testament of the vulgar imagery of what domestic violence entails. I am a true victim, and though I cannot show my true scars, I feel it appropriate to show what the true scars of love may entail. Brutality, on a murderous level, but that I can only show by example...

(((Warning: This video is extremely graphically violent.))))

I would not have posted it here, but You tube has allowed it and therefore, with due warning, I have chosen to include it here as relevant to the discussion.

(((Last chance: Do Not Watch: Brutal))))

www.youtube.com...


edit on 19-6-2011 by CobraCommander because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 04:27 AM
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I believe the child support system is designed to use children as a weapon to make people more productive.

See, a family is the biggest weapon that can be used against a person. When you live with your kids, your love for them will automatically make you productive for the system. If your kids want something, you will work harder to attain it.

But when families break up, this can lead to a person only having to look after themselves, which can make them less productive.

When I was paying for 2 children, I drove myself into the ground trying to keep up with the payments. I did a lot of overtime.

When tax time came, they saw I had earnt more, so the payments increased. Because I had worked harder, apparently my kids needed more. Now I had to work harder than last year.

The problem was that I am a truck driver and began falling asleep at the wheel. The only thing that saved me from eventually killing myself or someone else was that my daughter came to live with me.

Now I work 20 hours a week. I am charged around $190 a month for my son, and the Government gives me $400 a month for my daughter. Somehow, my kids no longer need $1200 a month.


My daughter set me free, and I am extremely grateful for that. People I haven't seen for a few years always comment on how healthy I look when they see me now.

But in a way, child support also saved me. If I never had to pay it, I would have bought a house, nice car and other nice things. I would be in debt for the rest of my life. A financial slave.

Child support taught me to live without in order to survive. Now, because I don't want anything, I can live in comfort on a part time job, and spend my free time enjoying life.
edit on 19/6/11 by NuclearPaul because: typo



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 04:33 AM
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Originally posted by YouDeserveToKnow
Forgive my ignorance as I really don't know much about this branch of the system.. but would it not be possible to discuss this situation with the mother(s) of your children and perhaps appeal to their compassionate sides? Ask them if they'd be prepared to skip the middle man and have you pay them directly or even ask them to temporarily reduce your payments so you can try and get back on your feet.


The problem is (here in Australia anyway) any private "agreement" must be "approved". What that means, is that it cannot be any less than what you would normally pay. It can only be equal to, or more.

For every dollar that is payed in child support, x amount is deducted from the single parent's income. So the Government actually makes (or saves) x amount in the dollar for themselves.
edit on 19/6/11 by NuclearPaul because: typo



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 11:37 AM
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reply to post by NuclearPaul
 


You needed the GOVERNMENT to "teach" YOU how to become a father? To teach you how to survive? Sorry,I dont buy that. You already stated that if it wasnt for your daughter living with you,you would be dire shape. You also stated the GOVERNMENT "gives" you money,because of your daughter living with you. So,lets see.....The "handout" you receive keeps you happy. Look,you still have bills,and you still need to work to survive. Living off the State or Government Isn't something to be proud of. Entitlement attitude,is what has KILLED OUR SOCIETY !!! , MHO. Just imagine if the courts NEVER impeded into your life. No one ASKING you for money,or set amount. You gave what YOU could afford. You also stated your children DIDNT need the thousands of dollars to live per month,and you realize that.So I ask ,how did the courts make you realize COMMON SENSE????????

BTW, Im not mad at your situation. I am happy for you.I am not happy you live off the TAXPAYERS dime though.............. I also have NEVER heard ANYONE say the system made them a better person,especially children's court..........That is over the top.
edit on 19-6-2011 by sonnny1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 12:01 PM
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The goverment should step in when children are abused. We have laws against that. If dad won't pay to get food and clothing for them, this is child abuse. So yeah, stick with the crazy woman or the law will make you pay and pay. Silly breeders.



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 01:06 PM
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Originally posted by earthdude
The goverment should step in when children are abused. We have laws against that. If dad won't pay to get food and clothing for them, this is child abuse. So yeah, stick with the crazy woman or the law will make you pay and pay. Silly breeders.



NO,its child neglect,not abuse if a father or mother isnt making sure the kids dont eat.
I agree if a child is being abused,by their parents,they should be arrested. But abuse can be put into many categories.You cant even spank your children,and that ISNT child abuse,MHO. But is is according to the state.
edit on 19-6-2011 by sonnny1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 07:19 PM
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reply to post by TheLordVeack
 


Oh yeah rightio......I was never a stay at home mother however cudos to those who do. Whats the going rate for for an inhouse babysitter, house cleaner, drycleaner/ironer, nurse, cook, tutor, prostitute, these days? Work that one out over the years you've been married and you get the picture!

What.....you men thought you'd get away with it? In your little brains, the above is what a wife and mother does all rolled in one. And suddenly you're no longer married, her worth means less than that of a pet dog?



posted on Jun, 19 2011 @ 07:25 PM
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reply to post by CobraCommander
 


I dunno matey......I'm still waiting for you to tell us if you in fact have biological kids because you seem to be confused by whether or not you do have children.

Tell me, who is the little man dressed up holding a firearm in your avatar? I just want to see who you aspire to be one day when you grow up!




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