Men and Child support. What is the answer?

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by CobraCommander

Originally posted by Annee

Someone must have really done a number on you.

You do know - of course - women have to get men's permission to fight in wars. It is still men making the military rules.

There are plenty of women in Congress, write your senator if you don't like the rules of the military.

I for one really don't care who goes to war, but mixed gender units lack cohesion. As do mixed gender-preference units.

You are reaching off topic.

And blowing up a simple and factual statement I made.

Just replying to what you said, so let's go ahead and stick to the topic then. Shall we?

Originally posted by Annee


The minute your zipper went down - - you became 50% responsible.

That's called biology.

Thanks for showing the world how you feel about procreation,and family values. Glad to know it involves just dropping a zipper. Dont know if you have kids,but I feel for the father(s),thats for sure ,if you do.

I have not read through all of this thread, but I will say that in my case with my Ex, from the moment we split up, we just had an agreement for me to give her a certain amount of money per week. We did this for a couple of years. She never reported me to the state or anything. We realized early on, that even though we were no longer together, that we still were going to be stuck dealing with each other and the best thing we could do was make every effort to remain civil.

About 3 years ago, the state sent us both papers saying that I owed however much in back child support. At first I was pissed because I felt like she went behind my back(she didnt) to get court ordered child support when we had an agreement for so long that was working just fine(the state wanted me to pay less then she was getting anyway). I called her up to talk about it, and the next day we both went to the child support office and she waived all the back payments. Then a few weeks later, she called me up to tell me to come sign some paper. I did and as it turns out, she had filed the paperwork, which lets us keep our arrangements private and the state cannot go after me again for child support ever. We are totally out of the system.

I know that my situation is not normal. We have been split up for about 6 years now, but we are still very close friends who would help each other out whenever possible. In our case, I guess it just works.

Originally posted by CobraCommander

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by CobraCommander

She did choose to by herself, that's the point. It's her choice, not the man's. And don't say that the man made the choice when he had sex because if that's the case, then so did the woman and abortion should be outlawed.

I'm really tired of your Poor Me whining.

She chose by herself to have intercourse that can result in a pregnancy? Sure she did.

Or is it immaculate conception?

Oh Gawd! Another man giving his opinion on abortion. Sorry not interested.

The only people here with the "poor me" mentality are the women who whine about how they can't afford a kid THEY chose to have.

And I know you don't want to hear it, because you are biased and unwilling to accept that your position is one of hypocrisy.

EXACTLY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Abortion,womens choice,child support,they have so many similarity's in common. Fact is women let the politicians hijack their own feminist movement. Goodbye the choice,reason driven,independent women. Now all women are put back into that "evil" place by greedy government,hell bent on destroying the values of a common family. Dont believe me? The RADICAL feminist agenda has done that.

Early feminists looked at the world through reason. Modern feminists see EVERYTHING through a gender prism.

Hijacking a Noble Cause.

reply to post by Cheesefacedogbone


She is bull#ting you. Unless she applied for some sort of state-aid, she would have had to report you for the state to even know you weren't paying support in the first place. Second of all, there is nothing illegal about paying support out of pocket, and you don't need "exempt" status to do so. And, regardless of your "agreement" is she were ever to go to the state and claim that you were not making payments, your agreement would have very little legal bearing. Particularly if she went to the state for some sort of social services assistance.

Originally posted by CobraCommander
reply to post by Cheesefacedogbone

 

She is bull#ting you. Unless she applied for some sort of state-aid, she would have had to report you for the state to even know you weren't paying support in the first place. Second of all, there is nothing illegal about paying support out of pocket, and you don't need "exempt" status to do so. And, regardless of your "agreement" is she were ever to go to the state and claim that you were not making payments, your agreement would have very little legal bearing. Particularly if she went to the state for some sort of social services assistance.

I agree also. Childsupport works if the custodial makes a stink about it,or if she is in need of social services. Its A FACT. Also a FACT that if she wants,at anytime,she can take you back for childsupport.

I would just like to add too, that a good friend of mine pays no support at all. He does however, have an active role in the lives of his two children and they want for nothing. Both my friend and his ex are professionals, so there is no serious financial strain. He buys the kids the things they need as they need them. Clothes and sneakers are pretty much Dad's responsibility and going to the mall gives him something to do with the kids. Big purchases like computers or bicycles, he usually splits the bill with Mom.

reply to post by CobraCommander


Ok you are right. I forgot about that. The state did find out because she did apply for state-aid. But like I said, I have a signed and notarized document, stating that I dont have to pay anything at all. But in my case, all of that paperwork is totally irrelevant. It simply doesnt matter. Maybe she could take me to court and win, but the simple fact is she wont. We get along perfectly. always have. She's married now, and everything is still cool. In the last 4 years we have not had a single argument or disagreement that we couldnt work out peacefully. I guess my point is, we get around all the drama by remaining friends mostly for our daughters sake, but also because, even though we are not in a relationship, we still care about each other. I know its not like this for many people. Im just sharing my experience.

reply to post by sonnny1


And get receipts. I know a man that paid support in cash for over ten years, only to turn around and be sued for back support for all of those ten years. He lost in court trying to fight it. He is in prison today after robbing a bank.

But you hear nothing - nothing about this social damage caused by the direct, purposeful elimination of fit fathers from families. That’s not PC; it’s not part of the ‘agenda’.

Virtual silence reigns about:

· statistics on how many fathers are eliminated by family courts,

· statistics on how many fathers are sent to jail for not being able to pay the child extortion ordered

· statistics on the social pathology of fatherless children

That’s because they would reveal the ‘abuse’ that femi-nazism has imposed on society and its laws. It’s all simply ignored.



Feminist-Fostered Social Fallout of ‘Best Interest of the Child’ and ‘Safety of Women’ Excuses

Another great read.

The only thing that needs to be said in this thread is this: If you have sex with someone and a life is created from that encounter, both parties are responsible for that life. Period. The ONLY exception to that would be if both parties would agree to the complete and total renig of the other's rights, for instance for adoption purposes.

I am a woman and I pay child support.

I'm sick and tired of hearing men complain. There is absolutely ZERO excuses that you can come up with that, even though you can't stand the person that you produced your offspring with, you cannot maintain a healthy and responsible relationship with the life you directly brought into the world. NONE.

Originally posted by Cheesefacedogbone
reply to post by CobraCommander

 

Ok you are right. I forgot about that. The state did find out because she did apply for state-aid. But like I said, I have a signed and notarized document, stating that I dont have to pay anything at all. But in my case, all of that paperwork is totally irrelevant. It simply doesnt matter. Maybe she could take me to court and win, but the simple fact is she wont. We get along perfectly. always have. She's married now, and everything is still cool. In the last 4 years we have not had a single argument or disagreement that we couldnt work out peacefully. I guess my point is, we get around all the drama by remaining friends mostly for our daughters sake, but also because, even though we are not in a relationship, we still care about each other. I know its not like this for many people. Im just sharing my experience.

You are a lucky man, but I don't have to tell you that. Glad to hear a story like your too. There are a few stories out there like that.

But I will say this, no matter how well you get along with her, if she winds up on welfare or something like that, it won't amount to a hill of beans how well you get along or what your notarized statement says, The state will sue your rear off, and will demand of her documentation for all support payments ever made.

Originally posted by CoherentlyConfused
The only thing that needs to be said in this thread is this: If you have sex with someone and a life is created from that encounter, both parties are responsible for that life. Period. The ONLY exception to that would be if both parties would agree to the complete and total renig of the other's rights, for instance for adoption purposes.

I am a woman and I pay child support.

I'm sick and tired of hearing men complain. There is absolutely ZERO excuses that you can come up with that, even though you can't stand the person that you produced your offspring with, you cannot maintain a healthy and responsible relationship with the life you directly brought into the world. NONE.

edit on 11-6-2011 by CoherentlyConfused because: (no reason given)

The difference in your case though, is if you did want to, or could not pay support for any reason, YOU and you alone could have aborted the pregnancy or put the kid up for adoption. Show me where men have that same choice.

reply to post by Cheesefacedogbone


Its good to see you and the Ex working things out,to the point of not having a corrupt judicial system ruin your life. Very rare,but also very special. Very rare indeed.......

reply to post by CobraCommander


Im not trying to argue with you. Mostly because I admit I dont know a ton about how the whole deal works, But, When I initially got the paperwork saying I owed back payments, It said I owed somewhere around $3000, and my ex simply signed a waiver that said I had payed, and that was that. No reciepts were necessary. Even if something were to happen and they wanted me to pay back payments, wouldnt we be able to do that again?

Originally posted by Cheesefacedogbone
reply to post by CobraCommander

 

Im not trying to argue with you. Mostly because I admit I dont know a ton about how the whole deal works, But, When I initially got the paperwork saying I owed back payments, It said I owed somewhere around $3000, and my ex simply signed a waiver that said I had payed, and that was that. No reciepts were necessary. Even if something were to happen and they wanted me to pay back payments, wouldnt we be able to do that again?

No I know you're not trying to argue dude, it's cool.

Here's a little story though. I know more than one couple who have had dealings with welfare, and know a little something about life in the projects. But let me make an example of just one couple. For something like six or seven years the mother was on welfare with Section-8 housing (while also working a job, legally.) She never stated who the father was, claiming she had no idea, so that there would be no interruption in her benefits, also knowing full well that she would never get support from the man who was the father, even though she got along with him just fine. He was just dirt poor and had nothing to contribute on a regular basis, and certainly nowhere near enough to make up for the loss of her benefits if she were to claim he was the father.

Anyway, somehow the state finds out that he is the father. I really don't know how they found out, but she had to either admit it, or lose her welfare (and be up on fraud charges.). So she admitted it. Now she still has the welfare, so good for her and the kids, but the state locked him up for non-payment of back support and are using his tax filings against him as proof, even though he only made like $15-grand a year. He is in the hole for many thousands of dollars with no way to dig out, AND on the hook for non-payment of newly mandated support too.

reply to post by CobraCommander


You're right, you're right....men should have equal say in a woman's pregnancy. I do believe men should absolutely have a say. And if a woman thinks she wants to abort or put the child up for adoption, then a legal agreement by both parties needs to be signed. It should be equal rights from the moment of conception. I agree.

Originally posted by CoherentlyConfused
The only thing that needs to be said in this thread is this: If you have sex with someone and a life is created from that encounter, both parties are responsible for that life. Period. The ONLY exception to that would be if both parties would agree to the complete and total renig of the other's rights, for instance for adoption purposes.

I am a woman and I pay child support.

I'm sick and tired of hearing men complain. There is absolutely ZERO excuses that you can come up with that, even though you can't stand the person that you produced your offspring with, you cannot maintain a healthy and responsible relationship with the life you directly brought into the world. NONE.

edit on 11-6-2011 by CoherentlyConfused because: (no reason given)

You do understand that nobody is claiming you cant. You DO understand that men are the primary payers of childsupport,you being an exception to it. You also understand that you are being held under indentured servitude,by the very system that claims the well being of the child. Why would you let a Judicial system thats broken,be involved with that "heavy responsibility" that ONLY the two of you should have? Personally,If I could have done what the above poster did,that is,not let the "system" get involved,I would have. Greed was in the way. That being said,I have my kids ,I dont HAVE my ex's paying child support, and I am not on the system,leaching from it. Men might be angry at the Gender-Biased system,that prevents them from being the person they want to be. A loving father.

Originally posted by CoherentlyConfused
reply to post by CobraCommander

 

You're right, you're right....men should have equal say in a woman's pregnancy. I do believe men should absolutely have a say. And if a woman thinks she wants to abort or put the child up for adoption, then a legal agreement by both parties needs to be signed. It should be equal rights from the moment of conception. I agree.

edit on 11-6-2011 by CoherentlyConfused because: (no reason given)

Sounds more reasonable than a lot of what we have been getting in this thread, cheers.

You also mentioned that you might be amendable to the idea that one party or another should not have to pay if they forgo all parental rights. That too I agree with.

I am only under the servitude of the welfare of my children. The state is not involved. I am paying above the state guidelines and have been for the past 8 years. I cannot stand my ex and sometimes vomit a little in my mouth when I think about him. I absolutely, unequivocally and with all my being hate my ex. Edited to add: He's not real fond of me, either.

I absolutely, unequivocally and with all my being love my children.