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China admits to dumping chemtrails for weather modification. What do they look like??

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posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:27 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
What about it am I not going to accept?


Well you were already inventing up nonsense that spraying chemicals into the air to reflect sunlight would not be a "chemtrail," because apparently you think they are talking about flying literal dust off the ground up into the sky and throwing it out.


You can believe that if you want, but realistically they would use something a little more efficient for all that time and effort, if you ask me at least, though of course you wouldn't.



Now - how about telling us how you are so sure that we won't be able to tell these from contrails


Because you literally don't even know what the visual difference is between them, even right now.




posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:29 PM
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reply to post by bsbray11
 


Obviously, no evidence has ever supported the existence of a single 'chemtrail', so how could we visually tell the difference of something that doesn't exist?



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:30 PM
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Originally posted by adeclerk
Obviously, no evidence has ever supported the existence of a single 'chemtrail', so how could we visually tell the difference of something that doesn't exist?


Exactly, so now you finally agree with my point.

I'm ignoring your assertions that chemtrails don't exist for now, because you would obviously not be able to prove that since you wouldn't even know what they look like.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:33 PM
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reply to post by bsbray11
 

There is no clear distinction between spraying chemicals into the air for weather modification, and chemical trails in the air (chemtrails). This should be pretty freaking obvious from the words alone.
The only one who doesn't want to admit they are wrong is you, and this is why you insist that cloud-seeding is not a form of chemtrails.


Actually, the distinction is quite clear, except when the "chemtrail" faithful try to blur distinctions.

"Spraying chemicals in the air for modification" does not leave a trail that persists, visible from the ground. Every such theory describes either cloud seeding, in or above cumulus cloud formations; or solar radiation mitigation, which (theoretically) would take place in the stratosphere.
The first is open and obvious, the latter is speculative and theoretical.
There is no objective proof for "chemtrails."

Your failed attempt to equate contrails with the observed performance of cloud seeding cannot be revived or propped up with semantics.

Contrails are real and normal. Cloud seeding does not leave a persistent trail visible from the ground. Proposed SRM geo-engineering would not leave trails visible from the ground.
"Chemtrails" are a myth.

deny ignorance
jw



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:34 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by adeclerk
Obviously, no evidence has ever supported the existence of a single 'chemtrail', so how could we visually tell the difference of something that doesn't exist?


Exactly, so now you finally agree with my point.

I'm ignoring your assertions that chemtrails don't exist for now, because you would obviously not be able to prove that since you wouldn't even know what they look like.


Oh my. So ignorant.
Got an air test that shows anything anomalous that you could attribute to a contrail that isn't a contrail? No?

It's okay to be wrong. (Hint: You are wrong, there is no evidence to support the existence of chemtrails, spray planes, anomalous data from environmental sampling, nothing.)

How can you take this 'chemspiracy' on faith alone?



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:37 PM
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Originally posted by jdub297
Actually, the distinction is quite clear, except when the "chemtrail" faithful try to blur distinctions.


I see you're reading earlier posts from this thread. Keep reading them and you'll find at least 20 responses I have already made to what you are posting now.



Originally posted by adeclerk
Oh my. So ignorant.
Got an air test that shows anything anomalous that you could attribute to a contrail that isn't a contrail? No?


There are air tests that show elevated levels of this and that from various places, but I'm not going to waste my time posting it, because you would instantly start making excuses.

Why don't you sit and try to think of how you can prove that every single white trail behind a plane must be a contrail for a change? That's apparently what you think, and that's exactly why I'm telling you that you are wrong. You can try to deflect all month and that won't change.


And for the 1000th time, I am not claiming that any specific trail is a chemtrail. I am making no such claims. But you are every time you say, "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," ..... Based on nothing.
edit on 31-5-2011 by bsbray11 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by B.Morrison
 

He is suggesting that cloud seeding is potentially dangerous to the health of living organisms via the interaction of chemicals with said life and that as such the seeders of clouds have vested interest in keeping that quiet.


Sorry Bob. "Suggesting" and "potentially" prove nothing other than the author's ignorance and grasping at straws.

Given the fact that cloud seeding is almost 100 years old, and that it is used arounfd the world, there is no reasonable basis for any assertion that those involved are "keeping that quiet."

You can't create a conspiracy where none exists, except in your own mind.

No one has published any reports anywhere of chemical harm resulting from cloud seeding.

deny ignorance

jw



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:43 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11
There are air tests that show elevated levels of this and that from various places, but I'm not going to waste my time posting it, because you would instantly start making excuses.

Please post it, and show me where it connects to 'chemtrails'.


Originally posted by bsbray11
Why don't you sit and try to think of how you can prove that every single white trail behind a plane must be a contrail for a change?

No one has claimed we can prove that, the evidence supports that all white trails are contrails, this is not a hard concept.


Originally posted by bsbray11
That's apparently what you think, and that's exactly why I'm telling you that you are wrong.

See above.


Originally posted by bsbray11
And for the 1000th time, I am not claiming that any specific trail is a chemtrail. I am making no such claims. But you are every time you say, "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," ..... Based on nothing.

Again, evidence points to just contrails. Unless you have some damning evidence that any white trail has ever not been a contrail? I'll save you the time, you don't.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:45 PM
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Originally posted by adeclerk

Originally posted by bsbray11
There are air tests that show elevated levels of this and that from various places, but I'm not going to waste my time posting it, because you would instantly start making excuses.

Please post it, and show me where it connects to 'chemtrails'.


Exactly, you are already putting your foot in the door of making excuses before I've even had a chance to post these studies. So I'm not going there.

Either prove that every white trail behind a plane must automatically be nothing but a contrail, or stop arguing with me. I am not talking about any other nonsense with you.
edit on 31-5-2011 by bsbray11 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:46 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by adeclerk

Originally posted by bsbray11
There are air tests that show elevated levels of this and that from various places, but I'm not going to waste my time posting it, because you would instantly start making excuses.

Please post it, and show me where it connects to 'chemtrails'.


Exactly, you are already putting your foot in the door of making excuses before I've even had a chance to post these studies. So I'm not going there.

Either prove that every white trail behind a plane must automatically be nothing but a contrail, or stop arguing with me. I am not talking about any other nonsense with you.
edit on 31-5-2011 by bsbray11 because: (no reason given)

And this is where I stop feeding the trolls. Have a good night, don't breathe that dangerous dihydrogen monoxide!



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:53 PM
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reply to post by bsbray11
 



Cloud seeding = spraying chemicals into the air to manipulate weather. Chemtrails = chemical trails


And thus far, you have shown NOTHING that makes one resemble the other.

If you are embarassed by an ignorance of cloud seeding mechanics, results and availability, that is understandable. I'm from the Southwest. I have employed cloud seeders for the Atascosa Rural Water Supply district. All of our members know about it. Most of South and West Texas knows about it.

That does not mean that they know or understand it on the Jersey Shores. So I take your claims as referent to lack of knowledge rather than intentional deception (unlike your use of a photo you knew did not depict what you claimed).

Not all spraying of chemicals results in persistent trails. You know this.

Your inferred conclusion (i.e., cloud seeding =chemtrails), is also false, and you SHOULD know it.

deny ignorance

jw



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
What about it am I not going to accept?


Well you were already inventing up nonsense that spraying chemicals into the air to reflect sunlight would not be a "chemtrail," because apparently you think they are talking about flying literal dust off the ground up into the sky and throwing it out.


I don't believe I said anything of the sort - please stop putting words into my mouth that are untrue





Now - how about telling us how you are so sure that we won't be able to tell these from contrails


Because you literally don't even know what the visual difference is between them, even right now.


I can certainly tell them apart right now - contrails are long white lines in the sky, the others don't exist - easy.

Now, why do you think I won't be able to tell them apart when they do exist? Presumably you have some evidence that tells you that they will look just like contrails - so what is that evidence?

for example I DO know what soot trails look like - here's some here -



why do you think I won't be able to tell them from contrails??


There are a few other a/c that still leave soot trails too - C-130's up to the H model are quite notorious for them on a clear day -


so tell me again how this resembles a contrail??

And why you think other things dispersed from a/c must necessarily resemble contrails?
edit on 31-5-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by jdub297

Cloud seeding = spraying chemicals into the air to manipulate weather. Chemtrails = chemical trails


And thus far, you have shown NOTHING that makes one resemble the other.


Do I really have to "show" anything, for chemical trails in the air to be synonymous with chemicals sprayed in the air?....


Leave it to you "debunkers" to drag the argument down to this level of semantics.




Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
why do you think I won't be able to tell them from contrails??


Because you are not even talking about the same things I posted about earlier, which you claim don't even exist.



These:


edit on 31-5-2011 by bsbray11 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:12 PM
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reply to post by bsbray11
 

Why don't you sit and try to think of how you can prove that every single white trail behind a plane must be a contrail for a change? That's apparently what you think, and that's exactly why I'm telling you that you are wrong. You can try to deflect all month and that won't change.


And for the 1000th time, I am not claiming that any specific trail is a chemtrail. I am making no such claims. But you are every time you say, "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," "ohhh that's just a contrail," ..... Based on nothing.


You have willfully chosen to ignore the evidence I have posted from numerous independent scientific, peer-reviewed journal, from universities and from NGOs who have tested countless contrails and found 100% of them consistent with jet exhaust.

Since, thus far, EVERY contrail tested by independent authorities has been shown to be a product of jet exhaust, there is no need to test every single contrail.

At some point, the burden shifts to the person claiming "this one is different" to show that it is. You will NEVER be able to do that.

I'm not asking you to perform the impossible. Since you and the other faithful obviously do not have a SINGLE example of a contrail being anything else, I can understand your reluctance to support your premise with anything more than conjecture, false connections and logical fallacies.

Sadly, that doesn't make it true or even worthy of consideration.

In everything, the person making an assertion has the burden of offering a preponderance of the credible evidence. You assert that cloud seeding creates "chemtrails." You have failed to meet your burden.

Sorry for you. Enjoy your speculative, fearful faith. You have nothing else to offer.

deny ignorance

jw



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by jdub297
You have willfully chosen to ignore the evidence I have posted from numerous independent scientific, peer-reviewed journal, from universities and from NGOs who have tested countless contrails and found 100% of them consistent with jet exhaust.


I have no doubt most of them are contrails, but you still aren't ruling out other possibilities. If 100% of them are consistent with jet exhaust then there are automatically a number of flights that dump other materials that were never tested at all, such as cloud-seeding and etc.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
why do you think I won't be able to tell them from contrails??


Because you are not even talking about the same things I posted about earlier, which you claim don't even exist.



These:


edit on 31-5-2011 by bsbray11 because: (no reason given)


huh??

when did I ever say they don't exist?

i have posted that they are WELL KNOWN TO EXIST - I provided a wiki link for you to have a look at - so why do you spout this lie??!!


Here's the link again - en.wikipedia.org... - there'sactually more techniques than in your extract - how does it feel to know that I know more about these than you do??


now - why won't you answer the question - how do you know those techniques will be white trails behind aircraft?

And yes I specifically mean the stratospheric ones because for the time being I am going to assume you are not so stupid as to think that aircraft are going to spray stuff into space.

It's a simple question - I've asked it many times - you haven't answered it yet - why not? What are you trying to cover up??



edit on 31-5-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:19 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
huh??

when did I ever say they don't exist?

i have posted that they are WELL KNOWN TO EXIST - I provided a wiki link for you to have a look at - so why do you spout this lie??!!


You're now saying that chemtrails are proven to exist?


Maybe you're confused as to what I'm talking about?

You've obviously confused yourself as to what I was saying in my last post so maybe you should take a second look.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by bsbray11

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
huh??

when did I ever say they don't exist?

i have posted that they are WELL KNOWN TO EXIST - I provided a wiki link for you to have a look at - so why do you spout this lie??!!


You're now saying that chemtrails are proven to exist?


Maybe you're confused as to what I'm talking about?


You posted a list of known Solar Radiation Management proposals - they are not chemtrails to anyone except you, they are known to exist.

nothing confusing for me except your dishonesty.


You've obviously confused yourself as to what I was saying in my last post so maybe you should take a second look.


I'm not confused in the least...I quoted the entire part of your post that was directed at me and left nothing out of it.
edit on 31-5-2011 by Aloysius the Gaul because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:28 PM
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Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
You posted a list of known Solar Radiation Management proposals - they are not chemtrails to anyone except you, they are known to exist.


What in the hell are you talking about?

Dumping chemicals to manipulate the weather isn't chemtrails according to you.... dumping chemicals higher in the atmosphere to reflect sunlight isn't chemtrails according to you.... You don't even believe in chemtrails, so what do you think you don't believe in?

Either you've forced your own beliefs into some warped pretzel shape or you are deliberately being obtuse.



posted on May, 31 2011 @ 11:33 PM
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reply to post by bsbray11
 


I also dont' believe that Star Trek's warp drive exists - but it doesn't stop me knowing what the words refer to.

The commonly accepted definition of chemtrails was posted for you days ago - seems you have a short term memory problem - you should probably see a doctor to see what can be done for that


So here it is again:


The chemtrail conspiracy theory holds that some trails left by aircraft are actually chemical or biological agents deliberately sprayed at high altitudes for a purpose undisclosed to the general public in clandestine programs directed by government officials.


- en.wikipedia.org...



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