DJINN VS DEMONS: Different names for the same being or is there more to it?

I have interacted with some of these beings so I know they are very real.

What Mohammed met in a cave was almost certainly a jinn - so anything the koran says about jinns should be regarded as disinformation.

The Gnostics explained how during the cosmic descent of Sophia (Gaia) - the Archons were created - a sort of cosmic mistake, a race of inorganic beings, without creative powers - only ability to mimic - the are led by the insane demi-urge that believes itself to be God (Yahwe).

They are a hugely diverse class of beings - some seem to have reconciled with Sophia - others are very very bad news indeed Jinn/demons/faeries/ET's.

This is what the elites throughout the ages have been dallying with via all their wierdy occult rituals - currently the worlds military gov and intel agencies are screwing around with them as ET's.

www.metahistory.org...

reply to post by beltemps


Demons... Spiritual beings not of human origin. Some are attached to particular religions. Some predate humanity and religion all together. I've never had an encounter with one that was a positive force. But then again if you are a Christian you know angels can be good or evil... So demons are probably primarily evil with some exceptions. Djinn is really just an Islamic demon. Different cultures have different names and superstitions regarding them.

Originally posted by beltemps

Originally posted by ShadowZion
Djinn is arabic for demon, i know i live in an arabic country Nuff said.

I didn't know that just living in an arabic country makes you an expert on djinn/demons....

well actually djinn and demons are not exactly the same since demons always represent the concept of evil while djinn can represent both...

moreover according to th quran djinn were created as a race of its own, after the angels and before man... according to western beliefs demons are fallen angels...

I concur though that in middle east djinn are commonly referred to as being evil in the same way as westerners use the term demon...

It does because it means that i have arabic friends of which i discuss the topic of religion more frequently than not.

Djinn you are correct can be both but thats because

We say : Angel or Demon
They Say: Jinn

They are talking about the same thing.

Isn't a demon a fallen angel as you said.......
yes

but we dont say angels and fallen angels we say angels and demons.

arabs also have angels so your statement saying that they could be either good or bad is false.

Not a reliable source below as it is from wikipedia.

However i have confirmed it with my muslim friends to be correct.

Jinn (Arabic: جن‎ ǧinn, singular جني ǧinnī ; variant spelling djinn) or genies are supernatural creatures in Arab folklore and Islamic teachings which occupy a parallel world to that of mankind. Together, jinn, humans and angels make up the three sentient creations of Allah. According to the Qur’ān, there are two creations that have free will[citation needed]: humans and jinn. Religious sources say barely anything about them; however, the Qur’an mentions that jinn are made of smokeless flame or "scorching fire".[1] Like human beings, the jinn can also be good, evil, or neutrally benevolent.[2]

The jinn are mentioned frequently in the Qur’ān, and there is a surah entitled Sūrat al-Jinn in the Qur’ān.

so they do have jinns and angels so they could not be the same thing.

plus whenever my muslim friends refer to a Jinn they describe it as a demonic creature.

reply to post by ShadowZion


thanks for the explanation, shadowzion...

I understand the arabic use of the term jinn. It's the historical background I want to understand...

just to give you an explanation why I am so insistent: I am writing a treatment for a script which is about a conflict between demons AND jinn where both entities have their own agenda. Of course it's totally fictional but all my stuff is mostly based on facts, even if it's only mythological "facts"...

but since the subject jinn is treated differently in all arabic countries, turkey, iran, afghanistan and as I learned from maung in indonesia I guess there is no universal answer... sigh...

reply to post by beltemps


Hi beltemps hows your writing progress anyway?
I hope i can help you about the historical background. Long ago god create angels from light ( essence )as strong creature but with no free will and would always do what god told them. Then god create djins from fire ( essence ) with less power , free will, ego, lust etc just like human. All the djins in highest heaven even with free will but cuz they witness god, they never try to do something bad. Until one day god create adam, the first human and taught him some knowledge about heavens layer and things in it.
So one day god ask the angels and djins about things in heavens and when they cant answer it, god ask adam and he explain about it.

The background of this event cuz of the talking among angels and djins why god said that human are the best creature, but the fact human made in the lowest form of body, just as low as animal. After he answer that questions to explain what is in heavens, god told the angels and djins to bow to adam. All bow to him, unless one djin named iblis. He dont want to bow cuz he thing he is better than him cuz he made from fire.
Then god cursed him, some people think that time iblis was killed. Then iblis become a satan, the first satan, a kind of creatures from ex human or ex djins that going bad.

Shortly after the mistake of adam eating forbidden fruit, adam and eva sent to earth, even angels ask god why god send human to earth, a kind of creature that would only give a bloodsheed. God said you know nothing about it. Then when god going to punish iblis, he ask one thing to god to suspend his punishment till the end of the universe. Iblis promise to god that he will tempt human to do bad things and become his friend in hell later as much as possible. Then god said tempt as much as u want, but you cant tempt and misslead people that ask my protection. Then god told to iblis to go to earth now.

Djins itself not like human, but got so many species that can be so different, not only about shape but about characteristic of ability, and tendency. From one species they will become lots of group, or independent with some variant of skills that usually shown what they looks like.

A bit rare info from your writing even it is fictional, that most if not say all of djin born with blind condition.They only have very strong feeling. They cant see human or fellow djins even. Usually they would start seeing around 25 or 30 years old, when they start learning skills that mostly learn from their parents, and it will be they first skill that will change their appearance from what they really looks like. Years later when the basic skill is a bit better, they would try to test it, with try to make their body more dense so normal human can see them. But for a first try, if they can show them self like a thin dark shadow or a thin white smoke or just a glimpsed from the side of eyes, it is already so good, and will keep try to make it better and can show themself to normal human fully like a 3d form in the end. But basically in the early ages, they just doing that for fun too, to scared someone then just laughing after succeeded or just want someone around where they live to know him and realized someone with them.

reply to post by maung


Hi maung, thanks for asking... I have to finish a romantic comedy til end of next week and after that I will dedicate 100 % of time and creativity to my supernatural script...


Your posts always amaze me, maung... Thanks so much for the inspiration. It's sad that official publications are so rare and not exhausting on this subject. You should write a book about your experiences or at least about the status the jinn have in your country and the attitude your people have towards them. Honestly! Indonesia seems to incorporate jinn into their belief system far more than other islamic countries do... And there is no literature about this. I checked it. or at least nothing in english. So WRITE A BOOK!!!

reply to post by beltemps


There is, because all of the other muslim countries apart from singapore, the only one of which i do not have friends from, all agree with what i am saying and i have spoken to my m8s again and they have proven my statements.

Singapore may be the odd one out with a different theory but all the other arabic countries which if i must say have more convincing evidence than singapore, as they more known for their muslim heritage or so far as i have been told.

i know your trying to write a script about this and i am sure it will be good but i could compare what your saying to as to writing a play on hitler when one person has told you he is russian.

The word Jinn derives from Arabs.
it is their word for demon.

You want to understand the reasons behind it you need to learn arabic and arabic folklore from the beduins (people who live in the desert) not from singapore.

I respect Singapore as a muslim country, and as i christian i dont have the right to judge them as i am not trying to do.

but i do believe that you need to analyze your research from the beduin people.

here is a little fact of muslims in singapore, im sure you can find more.

The Javanese

They came from Java in the Dutch East Indies (modern Indonesia). In the 1931 Population Census, the number of Javanese in Singapore was 16,063. The 1981 Population Census, however, showed that they made up 6% of the Malay population.

However, many Javanese had actually registered themselves as 'Malay'. It is likely that the actual percentage of the Javanese within the Malay population was much higher. The Javanese came to Singapore in stages. In the mid-19th century, they came and worked as ironsmiths, leather makers as well as spice merchants and religious books dealers. There were also a group of Javanese printers and publishers in the Arab Street area. There were also community of pilgrim brokers that played an important role in encouraging the migration of the Javanese to Singapore.

The political situation in the Dutch East Indies created by the Dutch government caused many Javanese go through Singapore to travel to Mecca to perform the hajj. From the mid-19th century until 1910, between 2,000 to 7,000 Javanese travelled to Mecca through Singapore until the regulations were eased (Roff 1967:39). Usually, these pilgrims would work in Singapore for several months or years before or after performing the hajj to earn money or pay their debts to their pilgrim brokers. Many of them stayed on in Singapore and became part of the Muslim community in the city (Roff, 1967:43).

extras for you

www.facebook.com...

First the word Jinn as it appears in Quran is unique. What I mean is, it never existed in the Arabic language in it's Quranic form and content UNTIL the Quran! This is amazing! In other words Allah pretty much invented this word for a purpose. It is mentioned 36 times in Al Quran and each time in its base form it is a proper noun describing a type of people.

www.facebook.com...

he Arabic word Jinn falls into a unique Quranic catagory as it has no known Arabic roots. That is the worrd itself is absent in pre Islamic Arabia. Many modern scholars tie the word to the Arabic root JNN which means hidden and this root has been used in Al Quran in words like Jannah which usually is translated as paradise or the gardens of heaven. And as we all know, this metaphysuical place is indeed hidden from human eyes.

Im not too sure about the reliability of these links because they go against what i have been telling i have been told, but i hope you find them useful anyway.

Originally posted by ShadowZion
reply to post by beltemps

 

There is, because all of the other muslim countries apart from singapore, the only one of which i do not have friends from, all agree with what i am saying and i have spoken to my m8s again and they have proven my statements.

Singapore may be the odd one out with a different theory but all the other arabic countries which if i must say have more convincing evidence than singapore, as they more known for their muslim heritage or so far as i have been told.

i know your trying to write a script about this and i am sure it will be good but i could compare what your saying to as to writing a play on hitler when one person has told you he is russian.

The word Jinn derives from Arabs.
it is their word for demon.

You want to understand the reasons behind it you need to learn arabic and arabic folklore from the beduins (people who live in the desert) not from singapore.

I respect Singapore as a muslim country, and as i christian i dont have the right to judge them as i am not trying to do.

but i do believe that you need to analyze your research from the beduin people.

here is a little fact of muslims in singapore, im sure you can find more.

The Javanese

They came from Java in the Dutch East Indies (modern Indonesia). In the 1931 Population Census, the number of Javanese in Singapore was 16,063. The 1981 Population Census, however, showed that they made up 6% of the Malay population.

However, many Javanese had actually registered themselves as 'Malay'. It is likely that the actual percentage of the Javanese within the Malay population was much higher. The Javanese came to Singapore in stages. In the mid-19th century, they came and worked as ironsmiths, leather makers as well as spice merchants and religious books dealers. There were also a group of Javanese printers and publishers in the Arab Street area. There were also community of pilgrim brokers that played an important role in encouraging the migration of the Javanese to Singapore.

The political situation in the Dutch East Indies created by the Dutch government caused many Javanese go through Singapore to travel to Mecca to perform the hajj. From the mid-19th century until 1910, between 2,000 to 7,000 Javanese travelled to Mecca through Singapore until the regulations were eased (Roff 1967:39). Usually, these pilgrims would work in Singapore for several months or years before or after performing the hajj to earn money or pay their debts to their pilgrim brokers. Many of them stayed on in Singapore and became part of the Muslim community in the city (Roff, 1967:43).

extras for you

www.facebook.com...

First the word Jinn as it appears in Quran is unique. What I mean is, it never existed in the Arabic language in it's Quranic form and content UNTIL the Quran! This is amazing! In other words Allah pretty much invented this word for a purpose. It is mentioned 36 times in Al Quran and each time in its base form it is a proper noun describing a type of people.

www.facebook.com...

he Arabic word Jinn falls into a unique Quranic catagory as it has no known Arabic roots. That is the worrd itself is absent in pre Islamic Arabia. Many modern scholars tie the word to the Arabic root JNN which means hidden and this root has been used in Al Quran in words like Jannah which usually is translated as paradise or the gardens of heaven. And as we all know, this metaphysuical place is indeed hidden from human eyes.

Im not too sure about the reliability of these links because they go against what i have been telling i have been told, but i hope you find them useful anyway.

edit on 3-7-2011 by ShadowZion because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-7-2011 by ShadowZion because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-7-2011 by ShadowZion because: (no reason given)

hi ShadowZion,

you my friend got it wrong, in arabic/Islam you have the word Shaitan for the word "Demon", Jinn are creatures just like humans both humans and Jinn are races, the word "Demon" in arabic is a description but not a race, so according to Quran a human being or a Jinn being can be a Demon, if any is evil then it is considered a Demon, see my post on page #1, i put the verse from Quran which says so.

now who said that the word Jinn wasn't known to Arabs before Islam or Quran, Allah didn't invent the word Jinn in Quran, the word Jinn is very Arabic and is dervied from arabic roots, it means hidden or invisible, it is very old and original.

Arabs didn't know Jinn before Islam? not true at all, Arabs knew the Jinn in pre-islamic era, it is islam/Quran who borrowed it from Arabs, Jinn are all over the pre-islamic literature, Jinn have been mentioned even in pre-islamic poetry.

i will tell you where things get mixed up even for Arabs, when Arabs say "Shaitan" they often mean "Iblis", iblis is the "Devil", Iblis was a Gene (from the Jinn) but he was too good so Allah promoted him to be one of the Angles (Angles in islam are all good, they obey allah automatically - no freewell), ofcourse Iblis has freewell because he was a Gene, he disobeyed allah and challenged him so he became "Shaitan", anyone be it Human or Jinn becomes Shaitan if he/she disobeyed Allah.

Devil = Iblis
Iblis is a Demon = "Shaitan", he was the first to win this title so Arabs often mean Iblis when they say "Shaitan", Iblis is considered the spiritual father for all "Shaiateen" plural of "Shaitan".

ask your Arab muslim friends this:

are there muslim Jinn?

if yes, then how can they be demons?!!

fact is there are muslim, christian, jewish, athiest .....etc Jinn

ask your arab friends to check these links for you and to get thier facts straight:

Jinn Vs Demons

Jinn Vs Demons

Jinn in pre-islamic poetry

Hi Beltemps and everyone else

My first ever post in these forums so please do be kind. some very interesting posts here, i thought i would offer my two cents on this as well.

I am not subscribed & sold to my opinions & beliefs in such a way that i would be averse to admit contrasting/opposing views. nothing makes me happier than to be corrected, for then i have gained something new, knowledge-wise.

My understanding of how islam views the jinns is as follows. The "evil" amongst the jinn of Islam, and Demons of judeo-christianity to me, appear to refer to the same entities. however, not all Jinn are evil. before man came, the angels and the jinn were already created. angels were the "noori" entities, created from the light or the sacred flame. jinn were the "nari" entities, created from smokeless fire. angels without freewill, jinn with freewill.

Iblis/Lucifer, in the time before time, was one of the created beings closest to God. being born of fire, the element was dominant in his nature as well, where his understanding that none loved God more than he, was a source of pride. this was unlike the angels, who were void of emotions of this nature.

however, he was not the only jinn to be created, though their chief. while there are different types of Jinn, these classifications seem to have emerged much later. these include janns, ghuls, ifrit, sila, marid, shaitans, as well as qareen/hamzad which may come close to the notion of the familiar spirit as understood in the west. All of these jinns have particular characteristics, dominions and provinces. I can elaborate on this, if needed/requested. iblis/lucifer was a member of ifrit. ghul, ifreet and shaitan are violently opposed to the mortals. Marid, though fewest in numbers, are the oldest and most powerful of the tribes. they are powerful enough to have confronted and defeated the aforementioned three tribes, when the war to choose sides either with or against mortals erupted. this does not mean marids are in love with mortals, at best they cherish non-interference and simple disregard for mortals.

there is a school of thought within islamic sufism, but very fringe if i might add, that does interpret the first great war in heaven in a slightly different light. the view is that when Adam was brought forth, and the angels/jinn were asked to bow down to Adam, the reason iblis/lucifer refused was because he would only bow down to the one beloved he ever had, which was God. vanity, pride, passion, motives, whatever the cause, is not for me to speculate, as I can only relate what i have read & understood. when he was banished from the heavens and cast down because of this, his commit was that if man indeed is worthy of greater love, then he will ensure that man earns it. he will beguile, misdirect, tempt and corrupt every mortal until the end of time, and only the truly worthy of the men will stand fast & pass the test, live life as God would want. In the end, iblis would make the ultimate sacrifice of being consigned to eternal damnation. Nevertheless, he would ensure that only the worthy obtain the affinity & proximity of God.

i have always viewed this interpretation with reservations, since an all compassionate & benevolent God does indeed retain it within his jurisdiction to forgive and accept all mortals, in-spite of what they have done. and besides, it was not up-to iblis to provide the litmus test of the worthiness. but as i said, none of the above is an opinion, only a mention of a certain school of thought, for the benefit of those who might be interested.

I have second hand accounts from certain people who have completed what we call the 40 day "chilla", to capture these entities. extremely dangerous. some of the depictions of how the entities manifest, reminded me of the depictions i saw and read in the lesser keys of Solomon.

the evil amongst the jinn resonate with the concept of fallen angels in Judeo-Christianity. corporeal like the demons. their world exists parallel to ours, with us simply being "out of tune" with that dimension and thus not having sight and sound of it. however, select, elect few do get a window into it. at the turn of the last century, the magician Henry Slade created quite an uproar with claims/admissions of feats that could only be completed by some one who could access the fourth dimension, like tying a knot in a circle of rope without cutting it. Michio Kaku, the prominent physicist, makes a passing mention of this in his "Hyperspace".

i know of a few people whose failure in the "chilla", cost them, literally, their sanity. they are empty shells of who they were, and seem to have become out of tune with even this reality. though i know of none who died, first hand, second hand accounts of this have been flagged to me by certain friends of that circle.

When these entities finally manifest, it is usually during the last 10 days of the "Cilla", where they become increasingly violent, just as the threat to their freedom becomes increasingly pronounced with the chilla nearing completion. the discourse with these entities is riddled with minefields, and one has to be extremely prudent/cautious. intellectual challenge to them is a lost cause, and not without reason. having existed far longer than humans, having the ability to, .. shall i say, phase-shift between the parallel realities, they have obviously seen more than any mortal would ever have. the challenge must be spiritual, and driven by faith. if it becomes a contest of who is smarter, the mortal is a write-off. except, of-course, whom God decrees to prevail.

there is much more to write on this, but i am already having second thoughts on whether anyone would be interested in the gibberish i have committed here. but i ll be happy to answer any queries, if my knowledge permits. please note that my primary areas of interest are astrophysics and quantum mechanics, demonology is a mere fascination, thus i am in no way an authority on the subject. just a curious, inquisitive soul who disregards no possibility or probability on any subject, no matter how outrageous. whether it is Richard Dawkins, Aleister Crowley, Brian Greene or the Scriptures, i approach each with equal zeal.

Peace.

Originally posted by richter13
Hi Beltemps and everyone else

My first ever post in these forums so please do be kind. some very interesting posts here, i thought i would offer my two cents on this as well.

I am not subscribed & sold to my opinions & beliefs in such a way that i would be averse to admit contrasting/opposing views. nothing makes me happier than to be corrected, for then i have gained something new, knowledge-wise.

My understanding of how islam views the jinns is as follows. The "evil" amongst the jinn of Islam, and Demons of judeo-christianity to me, appear to refer to the same entities. however, not all Jinn are evil. before man came, the angels and the jinn were already created. angels were the "noori" entities, created from the light or the sacred flame. jinn were the "nari" entities, created from smokeless fire. angels without freewill, jinn with freewill.

Iblis/Lucifer, in the time before time, was one of the created beings closest to God. being born of fire, the element was dominant in his nature as well, where his understanding that none loved God more than he, was a source of pride. this was unlike the angels, who were void of emotions of this nature.

however, he was not the only jinn to be created, though their chief. while there are different types of Jinn, these classifications seem to have emerged much later. these include janns, ghuls, ifrit, sila, marid, shaitans, as well as qareen/hamzad which may come close to the notion of the familiar spirit as understood in the west. All of these jinns have particular characteristics, dominions and provinces. I can elaborate on this, if needed/requested. iblis/lucifer was a member of ifrit. ghul, ifreet and shaitan are violently opposed to the mortals. Marid, though fewest in numbers, are the oldest and most powerful of the tribes. they are powerful enough to have confronted and defeated the aforementioned three tribes, when the war to choose sides either with or against mortals erupted. this does not mean marids are in love with mortals, at best they cherish non-interference and simple disregard for mortals.

there is a school of thought within islamic sufism, but very fringe if i might add, that does interpret the first great war in heaven in a slightly different light. the view is that when Adam was brought forth, and the angels/jinn were asked to bow down to Adam, the reason iblis/lucifer refused was because he would only bow down to the one beloved he ever had, which was God. vanity, pride, passion, motives, whatever the cause, is not for me to speculate, as I can only relate what i have read & understood. when he was banished from the heavens and cast down because of this, his commit was that if man indeed is worthy of greater love, then he will ensure that man earns it. he will beguile, misdirect, tempt and corrupt every mortal until the end of time, and only the truly worthy of the men will stand fast & pass the test, live life as God would want. In the end, iblis would make the ultimate sacrifice of being consigned to eternal damnation. Nevertheless, he would ensure that only the worthy obtain the affinity & proximity of God.

i have always viewed this interpretation with reservations, since an all compassionate & benevolent God does indeed retain it within his jurisdiction to forgive and accept all mortals, in-spite of what they have done. and besides, it was not up-to iblis to provide the litmus test of the worthiness. but as i said, none of the above is an opinion, only a mention of a certain school of thought, for the benefit of those who might be interested.

I have second hand accounts from certain people who have completed what we call the 40 day "chilla", to capture these entities. extremely dangerous. some of the depictions of how the entities manifest, reminded me of the depictions i saw and read in the lesser keys of Solomon.

the evil amongst the jinn resonate with the concept of fallen angels in Judeo-Christianity. corporeal like the demons. their world exists parallel to ours, with us simply being "out of tune" with that dimension and thus not having sight and sound of it. however, select, elect few do get a window into it. at the turn of the last century, the magician Henry Slade created quite an uproar with claims/admissions of feats that could only be completed by some one who could access the fourth dimension, like tying a knot in a circle of rope without cutting it. Michio Kaku, the prominent physicist, makes a passing mention of this in his "Hyperspace".

i know of a few people whose failure in the "chilla", cost them, literally, their sanity. they are empty shells of who they were, and seem to have become out of tune with even this reality. though i know of none who died, first hand, second hand accounts of this have been flagged to me by certain friends of that circle.

When these entities finally manifest, it is usually during the last 10 days of the "Cilla", where they become increasingly violent, just as the threat to their freedom becomes increasingly pronounced with the chilla nearing completion. the discourse with these entities is riddled with minefields, and one has to be extremely prudent/cautious. intellectual challenge to them is a lost cause, and not without reason. having existed far longer than humans, having the ability to, .. shall i say, phase-shift between the parallel realities, they have obviously seen more than any mortal would ever have. the challenge must be spiritual, and driven by faith. if it becomes a contest of who is smarter, the mortal is a write-off. except, of-course, whom God decrees to prevail.

there is much more to write on this, but i am already having second thoughts on whether anyone would be interested in the gibberish i have committed here. but i ll be happy to answer any queries, if my knowledge permits. please note that my primary areas of interest are astrophysics and quantum mechanics, demonology is a mere fascination, thus i am in no way an authority on the subject. just a curious, inquisitive soul who disregards no possibility or probability on any subject, no matter how outrageous. whether it is Richard Dawkins, Aleister Crowley, Brian Greene or the Scriptures, i approach each with equal zeal.

Peace.

edit on 4-7-2011 by richter13 because: Correction

hi richter13,

interesting, seems like you u have done your research with the subject of Jinn

you say

ghul, ifreet and shaitan are violently opposed to the mortals

according to Quran Shaitan is not one type of Jinn, Shaitan like i mentioned before is a descrption or a title given to those who disobey Allah and follow the path of Iblis from Jinn or Humans, i remember that Quran mentions marid and ifret as types of Jinn but not Shaitan, Shaitan in Quran always refers to Iblis himself or any of his followers.

janns: synonym to Jinn in arabic, you can say Jinn or Jann and mean the same thing, not a type of Jinn
ghuls: not mentioned in Quran but were known by the pre-islamic arabs
ifrit: mentioned in Quran, specifically in the story of solmon
sila: never heard of them
marid: mentioned in Quran
qareen: it is said by Mohammad that every human being has a Gene tied to him/her, thats qareen

i do agree with you that the evils of Jinn are those who are called Demons in the west.

Salam/Peace

I have a djinn attached to me and have for five years now. I have seen the shadow man and a very strange cat, that went down a hall way with nothing but walls. I jumped out of my seat to see the cat, but it was gone. It had no where to go and it was gone. I once sat back and felt a reptile like creature wiggle out from under me. I saw nothing but it's the best description of what it felt like. This Djinn must have been with other more evil djinn when it first approached me, all though I actually feel something in this ordeal has been with me for all of this life and maybe before. Had you talked to me about other lives 6 or more years ago, I would've said you were crazy. Anyway, something in that house was down right evil, but what ever followed me to my next place doesn't seem that bad, except in my lucid dreams. So what touches me through out the day? What enters my dreams and tries to scare the crap out of me, but can't any more because I either fight it, or laugh at it or both. Is this the purpose of the being? It's purpose is to scare me to the point I become stronger ? It's working, I must say. It's not leaving and it's not hurting me, so I gave up on trying to get rid of it. Strange, very strange indeed!

Originally posted by maung
reply to post by beltemps

 

I dont have any fotos of djin but ever saw few fotos that seems real. And i saw few times of them , some bad, some good, and few attack from them too. I have some friends that can see them. My good friend often interact with them and can see them clearly even got things from them, mostly weapons, stones and few artifact that hundreds or thousand year old.

About people put djin inside them, it happen often enough, like when im in high school, a close friend of mine just want to have a special ability, a knife or sword proof. He go to this town cianjur with my other close friend and met this old guy, a shaman.
Then this shaman do something to him that need not much time about 2 hour or so and its done. That time ( 1993 ) he must pay him about more or less us $ 7, but he gut that ability for 3 month and can be extended with some charges of course. Minus thing what he had if someone attack him with 2 knife stab his body in the same time, only one knife that cant hurt him but the other can cos he only pay for lower ability.

For stuff like ancient weapons or stones it is common in here that they would put the price on it base of the ability ( if someone want to sell it but it is not often for high grade weapons and must follow some "spiritual" rule ).
Basically the power are for fighting ( attack and defend ), to lure in any form include improve someone image and charm, for healing, to have spiritual ability, to curse, for protection, to get more money in certain way and some black weapons or stones are just bad that only want blood or life without nothing for return.

For example a first class merah/mirah delima stone ( red ruby )in any level would have at least sharp object proof ability when someone wear it. In here they called it hair cut proof cos thats the easy way to proof it, just hold that stone and someone cut your hair and see if they can.
Then they put it to a small chlotes bag and wear it on a chicken, then shoot that chicken with a gun to test if it has a bullet proof ability for higher level.

Then someone wanna sell a keris ( traditional weapon ) that have anti bullet proof ability, so they will try to cut that chicken to proof it. I have seen that that really work, quite amazing, but that things will be so expensive.

The basic rule of selling this stuffs that both part and the middle man must have met agreement and warranty from the seller that it wont disappear for some times ( depends of the agreement ) cuz when it disappear, it will go back to the previous owner and it considered as cheating. Most case when it happen simply the djinn refused to stay with new owner so the deal is broken and seller must give the money back.

Hello I am new on this forum,
Can you give me some information about the keris, this year I want to Indonesia (malang) to my see my friend he is also a dukun but he is 86 years now and had a stroke so I went to see him because it could the last time, my friend the dukun he helps people and have many keris, there where also two hanging above the door in the room were I was sleeping. when I came back to Holland about 2 weeks later the dukun came in my dream in my dream I was I Indonesia in his house in the room with the two keris hanging above the door where I slept during my time in Indonesia, I was sleeping on the bed and suddenky the dukun was sitting next to me on the bed and suddenly the two keris came of the wall one was flying standing straight up in the shell and the other keris was in the hand of my dukun, the dukun put the blade of keris on my forehead and at the same time he was blowing in my face and slowly he brought the keris to my chest and after that he slowly moved the keris to my right hand and he was blowing in my face the whole time and I was scared after that he looked my in face and the whole time the whole time other keris was flying next to hi face and in front of my face and suddenly everything vanished in smoke and in the smoke I saw a demonic or ghost like face but is was not human.
do you know what this dream means. and I want to make a keris for my self for protection but is this a bad thing to do is this black magic or is it normal and it cannot bring any harm.
hope to hear from you.

reply to post by Radjfromholland


Hello I am new on this forum,
Can you give me some information about the keris, this year I want to Indonesia (malang) to my see my friend he is also a dukun but he is 86 years now and had a stroke so I went to see him because it could the last time, my friend the dukun he helps people and have many keris, there where also two hanging above the door in the room were I was sleeping. when I came back to Holland about 2 weeks later the dukun came in my dream in my dream I was I Indonesia in his house in the room with the two keris hanging above the door where I slept during my time in Indonesia, I was sleeping on the bed and suddenky the dukun was sitting next to me on the bed and suddenly the two keris came of the wall one was flying standing straight up in the shell and the other keris was in the hand of my dukun, the dukun put the blade of keris on my forehead and at the same time he was blowing in my face and slowly he brought the keris to my chest and after that he slowly moved the keris to my right hand and he was blowing in my face the whole time and I was scared after that he looked my in face and the whole time the whole time other keris was flying next to hi face and in front of my face and suddenly everything vanished in smoke and in the smoke I saw a demonic or ghost like face but is was not human.
do you know what this dream means. and I want to make a keris for my self for protection but is this a bad thing to do is this black magic or is it normal and it cannot bring any harm.
hope to hear from you.

Originally posted by DrJay1975
reply to post by beltemps

 

Demons... Spiritual beings not of human origin. Some are attached to particular religions. Some predate humanity and religion all together. I've never had an encounter with one that was a positive force. But then again if you are a Christian you know angels can be good or evil... So demons are probably primarily evil with some exceptions. Djinn is really just an Islamic demon. Different cultures have different names and superstitions regarding them.

When evening came, many who were demon-possessed were brought to him, and he drove out the spirits/demons with a word and healed all the sick. This was to fulfil what was spoken through the prophet Isaiah: "He took up our infirmities and carried our diseases."

The Holy Spirit identifies that "demons" are our infirmities.

Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: astheneia
Phonetic Spelling: (as-then'-i-ah)
Short Definition: want of strength, weakness, illness
Definition: want of strength, weakness, illness, suffering, calamity, frailty.


Cognate: 769 asthéneia – properly, without strength (negating the root sthenos, "strength"). See 772 (asthenēs).

769 /asthéneia ("weakness, sickness") refers to an ailment that deprives someoneof enjoying or accomplishing what they would like to do. 769 (asthéneia) focuses on the handicaps that go with the weakness.

[769 (asthéneia) expresses the weakening influences of the illness or a particular problem, especially as someone becomeswrongly (overly) dependent.]

Believing that they are anything but our own infirmities that Jesus Christ willingly takes up from us and relieves us from is to deny what it is that Christ does for us.

They're also known as... "aliens"

reply to post by maung


Hello I am new on this forum,
Can you give me some information about the keris, this year I want to Indonesia (malang) to my see my friend he is also a dukun but he is 86 years now and had a stroke so I went to see him because it could the last time, my friend the dukun he helps people and have many keris, there where also two hanging above the door in the room were I was sleeping. when I came back to Holland about 2 weeks later the dukun came in my dream in my dream I was I Indonesia in his house in the room with the two keris hanging above the door where I slept during my time in Indonesia, I was sleeping on the bed and suddenky the dukun was sitting next to me on the bed and suddenly the two keris came of the wall one was flying standing straight up in the shell and the other keris was in the hand of my dukun, the dukun put the blade of keris on my forehead and at the same time he was blowing in my face and slowly he brought the keris to my chest and after that he slowly moved the keris to my right hand and he was blowing in my face the whole time and I was scared after that he looked my in face and the whole time the whole time other keris was flying next to hi face and in front of my face and suddenly everything vanished in smoke and in the smoke I saw a demonic or ghost like face but is was not human.
do you know what this dream means. and I want to make a keris for my self for protection but is this a bad thing to do is this black magic or is it normal and it cannot bring any harm.
hope to hear from you.

There are few secret groups in the united states, consisting of people who are influentianl, who carry out these satanic rituals to obtain the knowlegde of jinns for their gain. These people are changing the world economy and using their power to create war in countries. One major reason is to obtain oil !!!

They are using jins to create diversions so people are wasting time fighting each other, and I the other hand these influentianl people are benefiting.

It is believed that before the world ends, there will be a war between the good and evil. This war will have humans and jins fighting along each other, and against each other.

Now about Black Magic. I believe any sought of majgic is done wit the help of jinss.
Many people go to extreme satanic ritual acts to obtain company of a jinn. A good, pious and God Fearing jinn will nevr indulge or give into any human desires or demand. Through the use of Black Magic the evil jinns are casted and they are ordered by humans to carryout certain tasks for their personal gain. These task could be to harm, possess,hypnotise, an inception( to incept a thought in peoples mind to make wrong decisions, which will eventlully effect them in a negative way). There are various other ways that people end up using evil jinns throught the process of Black Magic. The human mind is infected !!!!

Now there are also Jinns tht possess humans. In the west they are known as demon possessing. Usualy a priest is bought to take out the demon, a process known as an Exorcism. These possesion vary due to different reasons. There has been certain incidents when a male jinn tend to fall in love with a human female. Hence the jinn tries to possess her. Other situations may include a jinn being disturbed by a human, and the jinn feels offended, and so he posseses the human body to inflict pain on the human.

The western way of carrying out an exorcism has always failed. To know why please read the book witten by Bilal Phillips: the exorcism tradition in Islam.

I shall continue to write more on this. For now goodbye and ta ta.....please comment

A jinn also differs from a demon in that a jinn can receive salvation. In Islam, a jinn can become Muslim and submit to Allah and be saved. A Christian demon, otoh, is pretty much stuck with his decision to rebel.

reply to post by Bedlam


Jins have free will like humans do. It need not be that christian jinss or demons are bad. They are only bad if they choose to bad...same goes for muslim jins.
Few pious and good muslim jinns also help people when needed, usually if there is a black magic spell that needds to be broken, the help of a jinn is required. Its quite a lenghty process. The good jinns only respond to human help if the respective human man or female is very religious, clean hearted and pious person.

reply to post by beltemps


The difference between Dijinn and demons.

Dijin-"worship me and I will give you all the kingdoms of the world"'

Demons-"Have you come to torment us before the time?"