DJINN VS DEMONS: Different names for the same being or is there more to it?

Hello everybody,

First of all I wanted to say that this is my first thread so moderators pls be patient with me and fellow ats members, I hope I'm not stepping on anyone's toes with this topic...

I am doing a research for a script which is dealing with djinn and demons besides other paranormal concepts. The djinn gained a lot of popularity recently not least because of Rosemary Ellen Guiley's and Phil Imbrogno's book "Vengeful Djinn" and the upcoming movie by Tobe Hooper. Supernatural season 6 finale deals with djinn, so it's not new not even original for a movie plot. But I'm stubborn...

No one is explaining whether djinn and demons are the same concept of evil in two different cultures or a two totally different beings. I read the mentioned book, saw every film dealing with the djinn but found no answer. I wrote a letter to Phil Imbrogno and asked him the same question. btw Phil is a very nice and knowledgeable guy. He told me that he didn't come to a final conclusion on this matter.

As far as I understood Djinn in general follow the same regularities as mankind. different genders, social positions, good or bad... That differs a lot from the demons which don't have different social positions or characteristics.

Why is it then that western lore doesn't know the Djinn while eastern lore doesn't know demons?

And is there any religious source that mentions both? If there is that would be a proof for the existence of two different beings...

What do you think...?

Djinn are actually "genies" if you read up on them. And there already are a few movies out about them too. Also, the alien guy in Stargate SG-1 is refered to as a Djinn - have fun and good luck.

reply to post by beltemps


The only place I've encountered the word Djinn was when reading about Islam, as far as I'm aware they believe there are 'good' Djinn and bad 'Djinn', similar to good angels and bad angels (demons) so I suppose they are essentially the same thing just with different names.

One in the same , different culture different classification name .

It is said that king Soloman had these entities build his temple for him and when he was done he had them sealed in a bottle , hence the genie in the bottle story .

reply to post by Time2Think


Thanks time2think but as far as I understood genies are the modern western version of the djinn like Barbara Eden's jeanny or Aladdin's blue pal in the Disney movies... Genies in movies and tv shows are around a long time... I think the first time the djinn made an appearance in movies was the wishmaster series...

reply to post by beltemps


I'll give you the basic description of Jinn described in Quran and Ahadith, so bear "raaawr" with me:

- Jinns are created from smokeless fire.

- Jinns can see humans, but humans can't see Jinns.

- Jinns have free will like human beings.

- Satan is a Jinn, he is not described as an angel hence Angels have no free will. Jinns, Humans and Angels are three separate beings, Jinns and Humans having free will, Angels having no free will, only following God's commands.

- Satan (who is a Jinn), was the teacher of Angels.

- He revolted against GOD because of his arrogance, hence he had free will (Angels have no free will).

- Jinns live amongst us, and outside the Earth as they have the ability to travel.

- Jinns are not evil, they have good and bad amongst them, just like Humans.

These are some widely accepted descriptions, some argue Jinns are created from dark matter (which is something we can't see, but they can see us). Let's not forget, that Dark Matter dominates the Universe, that makes sense because Jinns were created long before Humans, as Satan (who is a Jinn) was present at the ceremony, when the first Human Being was created (Adam).

If you need sources to back up what I said above, I'll be happy to provide quotes from Quran and Hadith.

Have fun with your project.

reply to post by Max_TO


I see, thanks... But what do you make of this news then?
UAE town haunted by Djinn

reply to post by confreak


Great answer, confreak thank you...

So if satan is a djinn who is iblis? Are they identical?

Djinns, demons, angels, a word for this, a word for that. It's all a figment of your reality. Try and imagine they don't exist. Those that tumbled, those that fell, those that exist in exile do so because they choose to do so.

The Djinn and the demon and the angel are elemental in the most unrefined fabrics of existence. Rather than trying to read about them, can I suggest you go out and try to find them and ask them about them.

Originally posted by beltemps
reply to post by confreak

 

Great answer, confreak thank you...

So if satan is a djinn who is iblis? Are they identical?

Iblis is his actual name, Satan is used to refer to him, Satan is Shaitan in Arabic, and its plural is Shayatine. Shaitan (Satan) means evil, so when Quran says Shayatine (plural of Shaitan), it is not only talking about Iblis, but also other evil Jinns and Humans. That indicates that Shaitan is not the actual name, but rather a description, or something to refer him by other than his name.

You can find many Muslims who call others Shaitan, just like Christians who call others Satan. It is common, because it is a reference to evil or "mischief" with some regards.

Iblis in the other hand is his actual name.

I'm in the other hand glad I can help you with your project

Originally posted by emberscott
Djinns, demons, angels, a word for this, a word for that. It's all a figment of your reality. Try and imagine they don't exist. Those that tumbled, those that fell, those that exist in exile do so because they choose to do so.

The Djinn and the demon and the angel are elemental in the most unrefined fabrics of existence. Rather than trying to read about them, can I suggest you go out and try to find them and ask them about them.

first of all, emberscott, I am a writer of fiction not a researcher... Although I want to stick as close a possible to reality or at least to a possible reality...

Second I don't know if it is a good idea to search for the djinn. Hearing about djinn posessions I am not too eager to find out the truth myself. You don't have to jump off the Eifel Tower to grasp the concept of height, do you?

Originally posted by confreak

Originally posted by beltemps
reply to post by confreak

 

Great answer, confreak thank you...

So if satan is a djinn who is iblis? Are they identical?

Iblis is his actual name, Satan is used to refer to him, Satan is Shaitan in Arabic, and its plural is Shayatine. Shaitan and Shayatine is used in Quran often, therefore hinting that his name is not Shaitain, that is just his description. Shaitan (Satan) means evil, so when Quran says Shayatine, it is not only talking about Iblis, but also other evil Jinns and even Humans.

You can find many Muslims who call others Shaitan, just like Christians who call others Satan. It is common, because it is a reference to evil or "mischief" with some regards.

Iblis in the other hand is his actual name.

edit on 29-5-2011 by confreak because: (no reason given)

See, that's one of the reasons why I love being here... Nobody ever explained that to me. Very interesting! Since in western terminology satan is used as a synonym for the devil I got confused. But your explanation makes perfectly sense...

reply to post by beltemps


Yes that's right , the " Arab World " , would call such things a " djinn " .

A book you might find interesting that touches on talisman and djinn is called Picatrix .

Interesting info here. I am doing a show on the Djinn myself soon. I am looking for an expert on the subject to talk to. Good luck with your project!

reply to post by beltemps


Hi Beltemps......................since you brought up jinn.

I'm going to share a link that I consider "just a good read" I am not promoting the link in any way. It is just something I found one day and favorited. Do I believe it?............................

encounter with a jinn.

www.ruhaunted.com...

Some observers have made a connection between the black smoke
appearance of these phenomena and the djinn of Islamic belief.
The djinn are described as normally being invisible to humans and
when seen having the appearance of black smoke, making them
very similar in appearance to the phenomena of shadow people.
However, some interpret the phenomena to represent guardian
angels, warning individuals of impending danger as opposed to
negative demonic beings. This could still possibly be linked to the
Islamic belief in djinn because the djinn supposedly have the choice
of committing good or evil acts according to Islamic belief (similar to
man).

in Islam Satan (Shaitan in arabic) = an evil entity, it could be djinn or human, Satan (Shaitan) is a description of an evil entity.

Iblis is a Satan because he is evil

from Quran:

And thus We have made for every prophet an enemy - devils from mankind and jinn, inspiring to one another decorative speech in delusion. But if your Lord had willed, they would not have done it, so leave them and that which they invent. (6:112)

if devils = demons (which i think is because devil and demon both translate to Shaitan in Arabic) then the equivalent of Demons could be the bad Jinn in particular, they are the evil invisible entities.

note that the word Jinn in Arabic also means invisible

Originally posted by Time2Think
www.ruhaunted.com...

Some observers have made a connection between the black smoke
appearance of these phenomena and the djinn of Islamic belief.
The djinn are described as normally being invisible to humans and
when seen having the appearance of black smoke, making them
very similar in appearance to the phenomena of shadow people.
However, some interpret the phenomena to represent guardian
angels, warning individuals of impending danger as opposed to
negative demonic beings. This could still possibly be linked to the
Islamic belief in djinn because the djinn supposedly have the choice
of committing good or evil acts according to Islamic belief (similar to
man).

from what i read here and there, people who summon Jinn actually need the somke in order for the Jinn to appear, they set in a dark room with the lights of one or more candles (the less the better) and burn a lot of Incense to make a lot of smoke then say a specific spell to summon a specific gene (singular of Jinn), it is eaiser for the gene to appear with less light and a lot of smoke, Jinn are well known for thier trickery and thier abilities of creating illusions, they can appear in any shape they want and show the person in the room anything, money, gold..whatever, but it is all illusions, no first hand experience, thats what alot of people who deal with them say.

it's amazing how popular djinn are in modern day eastern news...
Djinn in Al Arabiya

Here what i know about djinn, a bit different view.
Djinn just like human have a free will and will be dead eventually even they can be much older than human.

Just like human, they have their own believe or disbelieve, religion , agnostic and atheist too.
Some has advance civilization some are so backward.

Iblis is a djinn ( or was ) that refused to bow to adam cos he think he is much better. He should be punished for that but he ask god to postpone the punishment till judgment day. Some people thinking that in this point, iblis already dead base on a rule about people ( human and djinn ) can be forgiven as long as they still live. And there is a ( kind of ) pray too in qur an about after people die and when angel munkar going to ask them, they go and ask to god to postpone the punishment.

Iblis then known as first satan, a group of people ( satan's djin and satan's human ) that already dead and choose to postpone their temporary punishment and will not have a judgment in judgment day, straight to hell and will always try to have more friends on both side for the next life.

Most human cant see djinn, but some can, some already natural born to see them, and some learn to do it in their life. There are a lots of layer in spiritual realm. If make example we lived in 3rd dimension, there are 4th, 5th ...etc dimension after. The lower djinn and the weakest of them will stay in 3rd dimension and most of them cant see other djinn or satan in higher dimension and so on.

To be able to see them, it is either we can sense or see faster energy or they should make their own body more dense that need lots of energy of them and it mean they need to be strong enough if they show them self solid.

So i think demon in western world might just the same with bad and strong enough djinn.
Sorry for my broken english