Chemtrails, Trolls, and Deer Poop.

Originally posted by silent thunder
I have read a bit about chemtrails, mostly in passing on ATS. It's not something I've ever really gotten into myself too deeply, because (like a number of other such topics) I lack the tech knowledge to say either way. So I have no "skin in the game" and no agenda to push about this issue. Having said that, I would think this should be one of the easier conspiracies to prove/debunk. I mean, either they are doing it or they aren't, right? And either way, there should be some method, probably not necessarily all that sophisticated, to confim or deny. I have hazy ideas about weather baloons, disclosure from guys who actually service jets, etc....I admit my ideas of exactly how to do this are vague and perhaps wortheless, but even so, considering: A) the relative simplicitiy of the theory (nobody is positing stargates or physics-defying free energy machines here); and B) the amount of discussion of and interest in the topic, it shouldn't be all that difficult for somebody or a group of somebodies with no agenda other than the truth to put it to rest either way.

edit on 5/28/11 by silent thunder because: (no reason given)

You would think that it would be easy to put to rest, debunkers are putting it to rest every day!

But the problem with a 'believer' is that they want to believe they are being sprayed upon for some nefarious reason, so alas, no amount of scientific explanation and basic meteorology will ever convince them (and why should it, they believe in 'chemtrails' based on faith, ignorance and gut feelings ).

Originally posted by buddha
and when I look't up I could not believe it.
about 8 chem trails in the sky.
all kinds of sizes. and a jet just coming up.
with a Very Think bright white trail. in the sun.

Not really anomalous, airplanes are creating contrails in the sky every day.

Originally posted by buddha
I was 15 mils from the air port.
I am amazed by this.

How many times does it need to be explained that air traffic is flying over you regardless of your distance from the airport?

Originally posted by buddha
I am a believer. because I have seen it.

some thing IS going on.

I get it, you have seen some contrails and now you believe in 'chemtrails'. Makes perfect sense.

reply to post by wcitizen


Do you NOT understand how ATS works???

It didn't take you long to get here, did it? Do you have an alert?

There are places where "New Threads" are announced....right here on ATS. Ever been into "CHAT"?? (Guessing, the answer is 'no'...)

IF you would also bother to check the OP's posting history....."Stewie" shamelessly (?) plugged and bumped THIS thread, by posting its link in another...that I WAS READING!!!!

Funny, too.....all those *starrers* on your illogical post, and the veiled attack and inference......so, back at ya......WHO(M) did you "call in"??

In fact, the irony of this thread title is rich......."chem"-trail pushers, in all forms, on the 'Internetz' are the actual textbook definition of "troll"......Spewing the same rubbish claims, with NO evidence, and doing so to upset and distort a rational, scientific discussion that brings forward facts and logic and reason.

reply to post by weedwhacker

Weed,
first, I "bumped" my thread as a response to Stars15k. This thread is my response to this member,
second, you are on ALL chemtrail threads, and then some, so don't complain that I somehow directed the comment to YOU.
Big ego?
If your stance on chemtrails is not understood by every member on ATS, they haven't been here long. How much longer are you going to harass ATS members?

Originally posted by adeclerk

Originally posted by wcitizen
I don't get into discussions about chemtrails on ATS.

Funny, for someone who doesn't get into discussions about 'chemtrails', you sure do seem to show up in a lot of 'chemtrail' threads. Just something to think about.

I said I don't discuss chemtrails on ATS, I never said I don't post on threads relative to chemtrails in some way.

As I've said before, adeclerk, you have problems comprehending text accurately.

Wheedwacker, I've been around too long to be taken in by your antics or to be drawn into your ridiculous and deliberately provocative rhetoric.

Originally posted by wcitizen

Originally posted by adeclerk

Originally posted by wcitizen
I don't get into discussions about chemtrails on ATS.

Funny, for someone who doesn't get into discussions about 'chemtrails', you sure do seem to show up in a lot of 'chemtrail' threads. Just something to think about.

I said I don't discuss chemtrails on ATS, I never said I don't post on threads relative to chemtrails in some way.

As I've said before, adeclerk, you have problems comprehending text accurately.

Do you understand why it would be ironic that you don't discuss 'chemtrails', and yet you read and comment in 'chemtrail' threads?

Originally posted by Stewie

As for me, I am done with the chemtrail threads unless I bring or respond to breaking news on the subject.

You have yet to have brought any evidence or related findings to any 'chemtrail' thread, so thank-you for making my job easier (no more need to debunk your 'chemtrail' rhetoric :lol.

Originally posted by Stewie
That is why so many here don't comment on chemtrail threads regardless of which side they line up on.

'Chemtrailers' stay out of 'chemtrail' threads because they will be berated by debunkers with science, meteorology and logic that goes against their narrow world view. They realize that their so called 'evidence' is not good enough for anyone scientifically inclined, so they stay out of the threads and continue living in fear of the nefarious 'chemtrail' plot (based on faith alone :lol.

Others, who realize that the 'chemtrail' conspiracy is nonsense, don't post because they don't see the point in endlessly debunking 'chemtrail' rhetoric. 'Chemspiricists' rarely come into the forum with any new findings, they just parrot the same rhetoric from 'chemtrail' websites that has been debunked, over and over and over and over.

Originally posted by Stewie
Shame.

I agree, it is a shame that 'chemtrailers' can't shed their faith for a moment, and take the time to fairly weigh the evidence. Instead they have decided that 'chemtrails' are real, and they ignore all of the evidence that goes against their belief, preferring Alex Jones, WITWATS, and other 'chemtrail' sites that offer 'evidence' of 'chemtrailing'. They really don't care to deny ignorance, if they did they surely could pay attention to basic science, meteorology and logic - even if it does go against their beliefs.

reply to post by adeclerk


Troll much? I've also noticed you never deny being a disinformant. The entire comment you made about "how would someone aim a stationary array at a chemtrail" comment proves one of two things.
(1) you are purposefully spreading disinformation for whatever reason
-or-
(2) you're the most ignorant person I've ever come across.

[quick note Mods: I'm not attacking this person..... per se. However; I am attacking his fallible logic.]

Everyone would agree that chemtrails/contrails (for nonbelievers) disperse, coating the atmosphere with a widespread haze. Since this "haze" is so widespread, HAARP doesn't need to be aimed. There is also more than one HAARP array... actually there are more than ten (which I won't even get into, because they weren't apart of your query, and I don't feel like spending my Memorial weekend teaching school). Anywho; cutting to the chase, these [many] arrays have their "efforts" magnified by this widespread atmospheric chemical aerosol.
On to your other question, my source.
I tell you what. Quid pro quo. I'll divulge my source on whether these white trails are chemtrails (unnatural) and not contrails (natural) if you can prove to me that you were conceived via your parents "efforts" (natural) and not the result of artificial insemination to a surrogate mother (unnatural). Hearsay doesn't count.

Till then I'll sit in the knowledge that I know the truth and you're just running your mouth.
Toodles.

reply to post by Mactire

Everyone would agree that chemtrails/contrails (for nonbelievers) disperse, coating the atmosphere with a widespread haze. Since this "haze" is so widespread, HAARP doesn't need to be aimed.

Could you please provide the source you have that chemtrails have anything whatsoever to do with HAARP?
Funny how HAARP is now connected to everything that happens in this world. First hurricane steering now chemtrails, wonder if they can cook my eggs if I leave them outside.
Whats next they are using it to push the moon away from us. This could be happening right it does everything else?

reply to post by Mactire


I've stated before that I am not disinfo, I'm just a college student who is unemployed. I wish I could be paid to debunk, it's too easy! Have I convinced you with the previous sentences? Of course not, a disinfo agent wouldn't admit to being a disinfo agent!

There are only 5 or so Ionospheric heating facilities, including HAARP, so how are contrails being used to bounce radio waves from these facilities? Especially since there isn't a lot of air traffic over HAARP (can you tell me why that is? :@@. And since when have contrails been blanketing the entire Earth? They only blanket areas where airplanes travel (over land and some passages over the ocean).

Your 'informant' is playing you to make you look ignorant by parroting such outlandish claims. Or maybe you don't understand sarcasm? (Unless your information comes from the internet, then you're just gullible.)

My conclusion is as follows:
'Chemtrailers' fit in one of the following categories:
1. Trolls repeating the same rhetoric about 'chemtrails' that is based in no evidence whatsoever.
2. Disinfo agents trying to cover up a real nefarious plot by fearmongering with the 'chemtrail conspiracy'.
3. The same individuals who are selling books and bogus 'chemtrail' remedies just continuing to perpetuate the 'chemtrail' hoax to turn a profit.
4. Individuals who are ignorant of basic science and meteorology who don't understand how to use logic and reasoning to form a conclusion based on actual evidence.

I wonder which category you fit into?

reply to post by tsurfer2000h


HAARP has nothing to do with weather or earthquakes (in a deliberate sense). Don't be rediculous.
You're assuming I fall into the category of HAARP conspiracy theorists.
While these arrays aren't designed to "kill us all", their application is classified as top secret,
meaning; not for your eyes, above your pay grade, "secret".
There really is nothing sinister about it, so people should stop discussing the whole mess.

HAARP/Chemtrails have nothing to do with people.

Originally posted by Mactire
I tell you what. Quid pro quo. I'll divulge my source on whether these white trails are chemtrails (unnatural) and not contrails (natural) if you can prove to me that you were conceived via your parents "efforts" (natural) and not the result of artificial insemination to a surrogate mother (unnatural). Hearsay doesn't count.

Till then I'll sit in the knowledge that I know the truth and you're just running your mouth.
Toodles.

Saying you "know" the truth (I'm assuming you mean chemtrails are both real and widespread), is the equivalent of saying you "know" that most people were born to surrogate mothers, and unless they can prove to you otherwise, that's what you are going to believe?

The problem here is that you've got about as much evidence to support "chemtrails are real and widespread" , as "most people are born to surrogate mothers". So why to you accept one as truth, and dismiss the other as silly?

Debunkers are not asking for proof of the theory - they are asking for sufficient evidence to actually start taking it seriously.

reply to post by adeclerk


I have family in Britain, Ireland, Italy, Korea, and Australia who've confirmed chemtrails. I've travelled abroad enough to see them myself in more than 13 countries. There are far more than 5 HAARP arrays around the globe (maybe you were meaning the U.S., you weren't clear), but the point is; it is what it is, and I have no need to divulge anymore at this moment. HAARP and Chemtrails have nothing to do with people.

Originally posted by adeclerk
'Chemtrailers' fit in one of the following categories:
1. Trolls repeating the same rhetoric about 'chemtrails' that is based in no evidence whatsoever.
2. Disinfo agents trying to cover up a real nefarious plot by fearmongering with the 'chemtrail conspiracy'.
3. The same individuals who are selling books and bogus 'chemtrail' remedies just continuing to perpetuate the 'chemtrail' hoax to turn a profit.
4. Individuals who are ignorant of basic science and meteorology who don't understand how to use logic and reasoning to form a conclusion based on actual evidence.

I'd add to that :

5. Individuals who assume the chemtrails theory is true, because people they trust and admire tell them it is so. These individuals have the ability to figure out why it's a hoax, but just haven't tried yet. Often young.

reply to post by Uncinus


My point was I know/have the truth, but to prove it I have to give up sensitive information and do a lot of name dropping that at the end of the day won't really be worth it, especially to me or the parties involved. That was the point of my comment. I know what I've seen, been told, and shown, just like he knows about the VHS tape in his dad's sock drawer. We all have fathers

Originally posted by Mactire
I have family in Britain, Ireland, Italy, Korea, and Australia who've confirmed chemtrails.

How do you know they weren't contrails? Did you test their chemical composition? Did you get alerted to abnormalities in the daily air samples?

Originally posted by Mactire
I've travelled abroad enough to see them myself in more than 13 countries.

Contrails are present in any country that has air travel, so you will see them in any country you fly to.

Originally posted by Mactire
There are far more than 5 HAARP arrays around the globe (maybe you were meaning the U.S., you weren't clear)

Nope, looks more like 5 in the world, including HAARP.

No need to divulge anything (doubt it would be new to us anyway) but if you do, I will gladly sort the bunk out of the information for you.

this thread is spot on...and look...A, B, and C all showed up!

S+F buddy...I honestly don't get into the chemtrail/contrail threads here because...well look at how this thread is already turning out...the ones who've shown up bashing on the OP and others really just prove the point of this thread...

So I'll wait for A, B, or C to comment on this...and rightfully ignore it and laugh for a good minute or so while I eat my sandwich

Originally posted by Mactire
reply to post by Uncinus

 

My point was I know/have the truth, but to prove it I have to give up sensitive information and do a lot of name dropping that at the end of the day won't really be worth it, especially to me or the parties involved. That was the point of my comment. I know what I've seen, been told, and shown, just like he knows about the VHS tape in his dad's sock drawer. We all have fathers

So you know the truth about this nefarious conspiracy, but won't give it up for the good of mankind and putting the debunkers in their place?

Right, as it stands the debunkers still have all of the evidence.

reply to post by Mactire


So.......HAARP uses existing cirrus clouds layers?? OK, gotcha!:

Since this "haze" is so widespread, HAARP doesn't need to be aimed. There is also more than one HAARP array....

Uh huh..Clouds, that's what you've described AT altitudes of about 6 to 8 miles, roughly (9.6 to 12.8 KM).

HAARP is used to energize, and react with, the IONOSPHERE. (Not, clouds).

Ionosphere: Ionosphere facts (and, yes...NOT from Wiki....although, there certainly is nothing wrong with visiting Wiki, to read more....

These layers are the exosphere, thermosphere, mesosphere, stratosphere and troposphere. Within these primary layers, the ionosphere occupies the space between the thermosphere and the exosphere, eventually merging with the magnetosphere.

WE live in the troposphere. The vast majority of airplanes operate in the troposphere...occasionally, depending on season and latitude, they will encounter the lower parts of the stratosphere.

See where the IONosphere resides? WAY, WAY, WAY higher than any airplane.

Someone is pulling your leg, telling you these things....I'd be mad, if I were you.....


Funny....we can look at photos of Earth, taken from space....don't see any "widespread haze".....