New Vietnam Veteran Anti-Kerry Ad, page 1

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Topic started on 4-8-2004 @ 09:04 PM by ShadowXIX

This Ad was created with the people that served with Kerry in Vietnam. These are their own words about his actions in Vietam. This Ad will air tomorrow on TV.

Will this Ad hurt Kerrys image of a War hero Fighting in Vietnam that the some Dems. have tried to portray?

swiftvets.com...

[edit on 4-8-2004 by ShadowXIX]

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 10:11 PM by donguillermo

The group, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, has been discussed in this thread.

Swift Boat Veterans Oppose Kerry

In that thread, only one member of the group was shown to have actually served on the same boat with Kerry. Some of the others served on other swift boats while Kerry was in Viet Nam. The leader of the group, John O'Neill, who also wrote the book that the group has published, arrived in Viet Nam two months after Kerry left Viet Nam. John O'Neill has no first-hand knowledge of Kerry's service in Viet Nam.

But that hasn't stopped O'Neill from dogging Kerry for 30 years, trying to discredit him. This guy appeared on a TV debate with Kerry during, and with the approval of, the Nixon administration. He has been after Kerry ever since. He claims to be non-partisan, but it seems obvious to me that he is a Republican operative, and that his group is being funded with Republican money.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 10:15 PM by AmethystWolf

I hope that the American people are smart enough to see thru this load of bull. Kerry is a war hero - people don't just get purple hearts by mistake. He also had the courage to speak out against what he saw when he returned from Vietnam.

This ad is really low, IMO.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 10:47 PM by donguillermo

You can find John Kerry's complete service record here.

John Kerry's Official Naval Records

If you want to know the real story of Kerry's Viet Nam service, you should read his official military records, and ignore the slime job that is in progress. In particular, you can read Kerry's complete fitness reports and see how his immediate commanders evaluated him at the time. It would be extremely interesting to compare the signatures on Kerry's fitness reports to the officers criticizing Kerry in the Swift Boat Veterans video.

If none of the Swift Boat Veterans ever signed a Kerry fitness report, then none of them was ever assigned the job of evaluating him. On the other hand, if some of them did sign Kerry's fitness reports, and gave him high marks, what are we to think? Were they lying when they wrote glowing fitness reports, or are they lying now when they criticize him for political reasons?

Also please notice that George Bush's complete service records are not available online, or anywhere else. The so-called complete release by the White House was what Nixon called a modified, limited hangout. The Associated Press is currently suing for the release of Bush's service records. If this Swift Boat Veterans story gets mainstream media attention, the Republicans won't like the result. That will make Bush's record of AWOL and desertion fair game again. There are still a lot of unanswered questions about Bush's service record in the Air National Guard, and the Democrats would just love the chance to make the AWOL story front-page news again.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 10:59 PM by ShadowXIX

I dont have access to the political mud pit forum. So which one served with Kerry really None of them had good things to say. Also One claimed to have worked on Kerry after his injury he did not claim he was on a boat with him.

Originally posted by AmethystWolf

I hope that the American people are smart enough to see thru this load of bull. Kerry is a war hero - people don't just get purple hearts by mistake. He also had the courage to speak out against what he saw when he returned from Vietnam.

This ad is really low, IMO.

If I shot my self in the foot in vietnam I would get a purple heart. So yes you can get purple hearts for mistakes.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:01 PM by fawlty

Hopefully the more the truth comes out about this scumbag, the more people will realize that Bush is the best choice in office. Do you really want a man who self recommends all of his purple hearts and other awards? Why doesent John Kerry release his military records? Maybe he doesent want you to know how he got his military medals. Four months in vietnam and he joins Jane Fonda in calling the u.s. army murderers. Isn't he also a murderer then?

Testifying before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on April 22, 1971, Kerry was asked how a U.S. withdrawal from Vietnam would effect the South Vietnamese army and people. "[Y]es, there will be some recrimination," said Kerry, "but far, far less than the 200,000 a year who are murdered by the United States of America." (See page 190 of the attached transcript of his entire testimony)." From Human Events Newspaper at this link.

www.humaneventsonline.com...

This guy is a liar with no moral convictions that will tell you whatever you want to hear if he thinks that will get you to vote for him. The very next day he will tell a crowd the exact opposite thing if he thinks he can win votes that way. At least President Bush will tell you what he thinks needs to be done and does it and doesent flip flop all over the place.

Go ahead and vote for "I cut my thumb, give me a purple heart" Kerry. He wont win against Bush.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:12 PM by AmethystWolf

I honestly don't believe he would have received those purple hearts if he did not deserve them. There had to be some basis for his receiving them. So what if he hurt himself - isnt that what purple hearts are for - people hurt in the line of duty? He went to war, did what he was asked to do and sustained wounds. AFAIK, he saved at least one man's life while serving in Vietnam. Give the man a break. Would you rather have a president who was off getting drunk and snorting cocaine when he was supposed to be serving his country?

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:14 PM by curme

Debunked. SNOPES

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:15 PM by donguillermo

Originally posted by fawlty
Hopefully the more the truth comes out about this scumbag, the more people will realize that Bush is the best choice in office. Do you really want a man who self recommends all of his purple hearts and other awards? Why doesent John Kerry release his military records?

Excuse me, John Kerry has released his complete military records. You can view them at the following link.

John Kerry's Official Naval Records

It is George Bush who has not released his complete military records. The Associated Press is currently suing for their release.

This guy is a liar with no moral convictions that will tell you whatever you want to hear if he thinks that will get you to vote for him.

Actually, it is George Bush who is the liar.

"Bush Lied?" Let�s Examine the Facts

The very next day he will tell a crowd the exact opposite thing if he thinks he can win votes that way. At least President Bush will tell you what he thinks needs to be done and does it and doesent flip flop all over the place.

Actually, it is George Bush who is the real flip-flopper.

President Bush: Flip-Flopper-In-Chief

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:17 PM by koji_K

Originally posted by fawlty
Hopefully the more the truth comes out about this scumbag, the more people will realize that Bush is the best choice in office. Do you really want a man who self recommends all of his purple hearts and other awards? Why doesent John Kerry release his military records?

you've got him confused with Bush. Kerry did release his military records.

www.johnkerry.com...

EDIT: D'oh!

-koji K.

[edit on 4-8-2004 by koji_K]

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:20 PM by donguillermo

Originally posted by ShadowXIX
I dont have access to the political mud pit forum. So which one served with Kerry really None of them had good things to say.

Only one of the Swift Boat Veterans served on the same boat with Kerry. From the Snopes link provided by curme

Although the men quoted above are often identified as "John Kerry's shipmates," only one of them, Steven Gardner, actually served under Lt. Kerry's command on a Swift boat. The other men who served under Kerry's command continue to speak positively of him:

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:21 PM by ShadowXIX

These are the real Heroes of the Swift boats in Vietnam

The Following Men who served on Swift Boats gave there lives
in service to

The United States Of America.

May they Rest in peace
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SN David J.Boyle , BM2 Tommy E. Hill , QM1 Joseph P. Jurgella

BM2 Raleigh L. Godley , EN2 Gale J. Hays

QM3 Eugene L. Self , BM2 Hubert Tuck , GMGSN Alvin L. Levan

BM1 Kemper S. Billings , MRC Willy S. Baker , BM3 Harry G. Brock

SN Gary W. Friedmann , SN Dennis R. Puckett , LTJG William H. Murphy III

BM1 Bobby D. Carver , EN2 Carl R. Goodfellow , GMG2 Billy Armstrong

BM2 Anthony G. Chandler , EN2 Edward Cruz

RD3 Gerald D. Pochel , BM2 John P. McDermott , BM3 Richard C. Simon

EN2 David L. Merrill , BM3 Peter P. Blasko , BM3 Stephen T. Volz

LTJG Richard C. Wallace , BM2 Steve R. Luke , EN2 John R. Hartkemeyer

BM3 Gerald R. Horrell , LTJG Donald G. Droz , QM3 Thomas E. Holloway

BM3 Richard L. Baumberger Jr. , EN3 Dewey R. Decker , GMG3 Richard W. Stindl

BM3 Robert A. Thompson , RD2 Kenneth P. West , EN3 Albert M. Fransen

GMG3 Glen C. Keene , GMG3 Stephen J. Penta , LTJG Robert L. Crosby

QM2 Richard L. Wissler , LTJG Kenneth D. Norton , RD3 Martin S. Doherty

RD3 Craig W. Haines , RD3 Frederick D. Snyder , QM2 Lanny H. Buroff

RM3 Bruce A. Timmons , EN2 Jack C. Rodriguez , QM2 Frank Bowman

GMG2 Dayton L. Rudisill

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:26 PM by fawlty

Originally posted by curme
Debunked. SNOPES

That didnt debunk anything.

Kerry should be tried for Treason.

www.swiftvets.com...

[edit on 4-8-2004 by fawlty]

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:34 PM by fawlty

Originally posted by donguillermo

Originally posted by fawlty
Hopefully the more the truth comes out about this scumbag, the more people will realize that Bush is the best choice in office. Do you really want a man who self recommends all of his purple hearts and other awards? Why doesent John Kerry release his military records?

Excuse me, John Kerry has released his complete military records. You can view them at the following link.

John Kerry's Official Naval Records

It is George Bush who has not released his complete military records. The Associated Press is currently suing for their release.

This guy is a liar with no moral convictions that will tell you whatever you want to hear if he thinks that will get you to vote for him.

Actually, it is George Bush who is the liar.

"Bush Lied?" Let�s Examine the Facts

The very next day he will tell a crowd the exact opposite thing if he thinks he can win votes that way. At least President Bush will tell you what he thinks needs to be done and does it and doesent flip flop all over the place.

Actually, it is George Bush who is the real flip-flopper.

President Bush: Flip-Flopper-In-Chief

I didnt see anywhere in his military records specifying how he won all of his medals. Furthermore, I looked over his fitness reports and they are done by two officers only and only 2 of them have "not observed" marked on there. A lot of them are while he was in training in the U.S. and while he was a personal aid.

How do you justify Kerry calling the U.S. army murderers while testifying before the senate and now sucking up to vietnam veterans...begging for their vote? He will tell you whatever you want to hear and you bought it all. Take your bags of wool with you to the voting machine.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:36 PM by ShadowXIX

Originally posted by AmethystWolf
I honestly don't believe he would have received those purple hearts if he did not deserve them. There had to be some basis for his receiving them. So what if he hurt himself - isnt that what purple hearts are for - people hurt in the line of duty? He went to war, did what he was asked to do and sustained wounds. AFAIK, he saved at least one man's life while serving in Vietnam. Give the man a break. Would you rather have a president who was off getting drunk and snorting cocaine when he was supposed to be serving his country?

Im not saying that Kerry did that but stuff like that did indeed happen. People would shoot themselves in the foot to get out of Vietnam and would also get a purple heart in the process. I was just trying to prove some people got them that did not deserve them.

If I had a soldier come in with a M-16 round to the foot I would give him a (Yellow HEART) and kick his coward a$$ out of my command.

Im not trying to defend Bush either his wartime record is worse then Kerrys. I just want people to question If Kerry is a war hero as people are making it seem. Vietnam was full of real heros we dont need any fake ones.

reply posted on 4-8-2004 @ 11:56 PM by GradyPhilpott

John Kerry and I served in Vietnam at the same time, though on opposite ends of the country. By the time that I arrived in country, the criteria for a Purple Heart had been stiffened to require that a wound be severe enough to require treatment by a medical officer. These are the criteria which governed the Purple Heart Award at the time we served. These criteria have changed over time, most notably when Reagan approved the award for civilians wounded by terrorists' acts. This ridiculous act has since been rectified and the criteria are essentially as they were 35 years ago.

You should pay attention to these men and their opinions of Kerry's service in Vietnam, but the most egregious acts committed by John Kerry were not committed in Vietnam. They were committed here in the US. I can tell you this. When I went to Vietnam, there was an anti-war (read anti-American) movement, but in the heartland of America the veteran was respected and support for the war was strong. In all the years since, I have wondered what happened to my country. What happened to America in the three years between my going to Vietnam in 1968 and my getting out of the Marine Corps in 1971. The answer is overwhelmingly John Kerry.

John Kerry lied about the US in Vietnam and he maligned the service of the average combat troop in Vietnam for his own self-interest. John Kerry is a traitor. He provided aid and comfort to the enemy by lying to the Congress and traveling to France to meet with the leaders of the Viet Cong.

This is what Jeremiah Denton , a prisoner of war for seven years, has to say about John Kerry's anti-war activity.

[edit on 04/8/5 by GradyPhilpott]

reply posted on 5-8-2004 @ 12:00 AM by fawlty

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
John Kerry and I served in Vietnam at the same time, though on opposite ends of the country. By the time that I arrived in country, the criteria for a Purple Heart had been stiffened to require that a wound be severe enough to require treatment by a medical officer. These are the criteria which governed the Purple Heart Award at the time we served. These criteria have changed over time, most notably when Reagan approved the award for civilians wounded by terrorists acts. This ridiculous act has since been rectified and the criteria are essentially as they were 35 years ago.

You should pay attention to these men and their opinions of Kerry's service in Vietnam, but the most egregious acts of committed by John Kerry were not committed in Vietnam. They were committed here in the US. I can tell you this. When I went to Vietnam, there was an anti-war (read anti-American) movement, but in the heartland of America the veteran was respected and support for the war was strong. In all the years since, I have wondered what happened to my country. What happened to America in the three years between my going to Vietnam in 1968 and my getting out of the Marine Corps in 1971. The answer is overwhelmingly John KerryJohn Kerry.

John Kerry lied about the US in Vietnam and he maligned the service of the average combat troop in Vietnam for his own self-interest. John Kerry is a traitor. He provided aid and comfort to the enemy lying to the Congress and traveling to France to meet with the leaders of the Viet Cong.

This is what Jerimiah Denton , a prisoner of war for seven years, has to say about John Kerry's anti-war activity.

Excellent post Grady. Here is a nice link documenting how Kerry is the king of flip-flopping. It also further illustrates what a bad leader this guy would make and what a horrible voting record he has.

www.frontpagemag.com...

reply posted on 5-8-2004 @ 12:14 AM by GradyPhilpott

Thanks, Fawlty. I had gotten away from David Horowitz's site. I'm glad you reminded me of it.

reply posted on 5-8-2004 @ 12:53 AM by donguillermo

fawlty says

I didnt see anywhere in his military records specifying how he won all of his medals.

Then you are blind. The first entry on the page is "Military Service Awards."

Furthermore, I looked over his fitness reports and they are done by two officers only and only 2 of them have "not observed" marked on there.

If you can only count two officers who signed his fitness reports, then you are really blind. I suggest you look again.

How do you justify Kerry calling the U.S. army murderers while testifying before the senate and now sucking up to vietnam veterans...begging for their vote?

I don't have do justify anything Kerry said. Neither does he. Have you ever served in the military, let alone in combat? If you have never served in combat, you have no right to question or criticize Kerry about any aspect of his military record. I served in Viet Nam in the Marine Corps myself, and nothing irritates me more than criticism of combat veterans by people who have never served in combat.

As far as what Kerry said before the Senate, he was recounting what other Viet Nam veterans had said at the Winter Soldier investigations. Kerry has said something to the effect that if people are offended by what he said before the Senate, that is too bad. The things he testified to actually did happen. There were numerous war crimes committed in Viet Nam. He never said that all Viet Nam veterans were murderers and baby killers. Live with it.

reply posted on 5-8-2004 @ 12:53 AM by vapor

i remember reading a little while back on this site about kerry's commanding officers signing a letter saying he was not fot for office. i don't know what ever came of it.
also, my dad told me once about a guy he worked with who was drunk and fell out of his bed and broke his toe while in vietnam. for this he recieved a purple heart. so people do recieve medals without deserving them.

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