Granted Fresh 1Bil FEMA Denies Tornado Victims Aid & Rolls Out Hurricane Katrina Trailers

I don't know what the hell is going on with FEMA. Check out this local news story about what they claim is livable. The video accompanying the story clearly shows the opposite. Oh, but the homeowner can "appeal?"

FEMA Says House Ripped By Tornado 'Livable'

reply to post by Xcathdra


BTS is providing fact after fact backed up with links.

FEMA is rife with corruption as shown in these links.

Seems like the lady knows how it works better than you.

reply to post by ~Lucidity


It seems that FEMA loves it's red tape game. FEMA has seriously easlily got to be
one of the most corrupt - if not THE most corrupt governmental angency out there!

From your link -

The roof and entire second story of the home are gone.

Yet the Federal Emergency Management Agency said it won’t give the family a penny in aid.

“It’s a slap in the face when we receive a letter like that after going through all of this,” said Joe Machado.www.wsbtv.com...

Yeah guess FEMA needs to buy some more peanut butter and jelly for its "Drills".
Sheesh!

Lucidity, thanks for you comments

Originally posted by burntheships
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

You know if your going to use your opinions as a source, I see that as ignorance.
You have nothing to back up your claims aside from your vitrol and angst.

Sources have been cited in the Torando slams Joplin thread. Your source in that thread was PressTV, which as was stated then, is the offical Iranian government state media. I also offer my background in law enforcement, as well as training with NIMS.

Let me enlighten you -

FEMA - FAQ's

How does FEMA get involved in a State disaster?

Once a disaster has occurred, and the State has declared a state of emergency, the State will evaluate the recovery capabilities of the State and local governments. If it is determined that the damage is beyond their recovery capability, the governor will normally send a request letter to the President, directed through the Regional Director of the appropriate FEMA region. The President then makes the decision whether or not to declare a major disaster or emergency.

After a presidential declaration has been made, FEMA will designate the area eligible for assistance and announce the types of assistance available. FEMA provides supplemental assistance for State and local government recovery expenses, and the Federal share will always be at least 75 percent of the eligible costs.

Which is exatly what people have been telling you... on more than one occasion and in more than one thread. Going back to your hatred blinding your objectivity about FEMA.

Howstuffworks - FEMA


To further drive home the point about your lack of understanbding of how FEMA works, you fail to understand that in addition to FEMA as the umbrella, the following agencies report to FEMA when requested to assist in affected areas -

When a disaster occurs (or prior to it happening, if they have some warning), FEMA starts working with the affected state's Federal Coordinating Officer (FCO). This person is recommended by FEMA and appointed by the president. A Disaster Field Office is set up near the scene of the disaster -- from there, the FCO coordinates relief efforts and works to maintain a flow of information to rescue personnel and political leaders. Federal and state groups work together to provide the necessary relief efforts.

Federal disaster relief is divided into 12 Emergency Support Functions (ESF), each provided by a different agency or agencies. The 12 ESFs are:

ESF 1: Transportation
Provides civilian and military transportation
Lead agency: Department of Transportation

ESF 2: Communications
Provides telecommunications support
Lead agency: National Communications System

ESF 3: Public Works and Engineering
Restores essential public services and facilities
Lead agency: U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, Department of Defense

ESF 4: Fire Fighting
Detects and suppresses wildland, rural and urban fires
Lead agency: U.S. Forest Service, Department of Agriculture

ESF 5: Information and Planning
Collects, analyzes and disseminates critical information to facilitate the overall federal response and recovery operations
Lead agency: Federal Emergency Management Agency

ESF 6: Mass Care
Manages and coordinates food, shelter and first aid for victims; provides bulk distribution of relief supplies; operates a system to assist family reunification
Lead agency: American Red Cross

ESF 7: Resource Support
Provides equipment, materials, supplies and personnel to federal entities during response operations
Lead agency: General Services Administration

ESF 8: Health and Medical Services
Provides assistance for public health and medical care needs
Lead agency: U.S. Public Health Service, Department of Health and Human Services

ESF 9: Urban Search and Rescue
Locates, extricates and provides initial medical treatment to victims trapped in collapsed structures
Lead agency:Federal Emergency Management Agency

ESF 10: Hazardous Materials
Supports federal response to actual or potential releases of oil and hazardous materials
Lead agency: Environmental Protection Agency

ESF 11: Food
Identifies food needs; ensures that food gets to areas affected by disaster
Lead agency: Food and Nutrition Service, Department of Agriculture

ESF 12: Energy
Restores power systems and fuel supplies
Lead agency: Department of Energy

ESF 13: Public Safety and Security
Provides law enforcement services
Lead agency: Department of Homeland Security and the Department of Justice

ESF 14: Long-Term Community Recovery and Mitigation
Enables community recovery from the long-term consequences of a disaster
Lead agency: Department of Homeland Security/Emergency Preparedness and Response/Federal Emergency Management Agency

ESF 15: External Affairs Annex
Ensures that Federal assets are deployed to the field during incidents requiring a coordinated Federal response
Lead agency: Department of Homeland Security/Federal Emergency Management Agency

So again, your criticism of FEMA alone cleary demonstrates your lack of understanding of how FEMA works, and is again driven by your hatred and not dissent. Your citation of Iranian State Media also reinforces the fact that you have no desire to learn about FEMA on your own, rather you choose to believe propoganda put out by Iran, who has absolutely nothing to do with FEMA.



Again, not a hard concept to understand. Open your mind and do some research on your own.

As far as your FEMA trailer issue - Go read the rest of what you are leaving out of your citation. The trailers were sold, and those trailers were then resold to people who were aware of the issues with them. In order for people to purchase FEMA trailers (which were made by companies, and NOT FEMA) they have to sign a waiver that they are fully informed of the issues with the trailers. They also had to acknowledge they are not fit for human occupation, which you conveintly leave out.

The fire-sale prices, however, came with a catch -- all buyers had to sign a waiver agreeing that the government cast-offs would not be used as housing and that each unit would be marked with a notice labeling it unfit to live in. The agreement also stipulated that if units were resold, the new owners must inform the purchaser that the units are not intended for housing. If the risks and regulations are not made clear, the seller is liable for penalties and even criminal charges that could result in a five-year prison sentence, FEMA spokeswoman Mary Olsen said. Vowing never again to use the same models of travel trailers, FEMA has also rewritten specifications for emergency housing to mandate units that are larger and have more ventilation.

People who buy those trailers and decide to live in them, or any business who resells them without notifying the public, are in violation of the law, which again is a DOJ issue and not a FEMA issue.

Its amazing how you ignore facts from your own sources.

Originally posted by pianopraze
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

BTS is providing fact after fact backed up with links.

FEMA is rife with corruption as shown in these links.

Seems like the lady knows how it works better than you.

edit on 26-5-2011 by pianopraze because: formatting

Thats the problem.. She is not reading her sources, nor does she understand how FEMA works. It is blatantly evident in her posts. Her own sources contradict her claims, and again the use of Iraian State Media is a joke.


If you have a complaint with FEMA, thats one thing. To run the entire organization into the ground without first understanding how they work is something else entirely.

reply to post by burntheships


Again, misrepresenting the article.

FEMA will not provide them a grant for temporary housing. Do the people have home insurance? Are they dealing with their insurance company? Did they bother to file an appeal with FEMA, as is pointed out in the article?

People are repsonible for themselves, not the Government.

Well I I also offer my background as a skipper!
And you can talk the talk all you want to until you are sitting in a contaminated trailer with your wife and kids to get sick from. And I take it you want a reliable source if not seen on CNN it is a hoax right?

Originally posted by SkipperJohn
Well I I also offer my background as a skipper!
And you can talk the talk all you want to until you are sitting in a contaminated trailer with your wife and kids to get sick from. And I take it you want a reliable source if not seen on CNN it is a hoax right?

edit on 26-5-2011 by SkipperJohn because: (no reason given)

Which has to do with??

Originally posted by Xcathdra

I also offer my background in law enforcement, as well as training with NIMS.

Oh well I thought for a minute you were might have some real experience that would apply to
this corruption issue with FEMA.

But I see you claim you have "background" in LE and NIMS. Unelss you can draw a paralell to the
corruption in LE and NIMS to the corruption in FEMA - Nice try. But its not relevant at all.

Lots of hot air though and I would love for you to elaborate on just how many FEMA drills you have
been involved in, as in my OP I have sourced how FEMA and DHS collaberate with local LE and EM
spending lots of FEMA money on DRILLS.

As far as your FEMA trailer issue - Go read the rest of what you are leaving out of your citation. The trailers were sold, and those trailers were then resold to people who were aware of the issues with them. In order for people to purchase FEMA trailers (which were made by companies, and NOT FEMA) they have to sign a waiver that they are fully informed of the issues with the trailers. They also had to acknowledge they are not fit for human occupation, which you conveintly leave out.

I see no source for your opinion. Show me how FEMA is not providing these trailers to the
tornado victims directly. Show me your source that proves they are from another agency or a private party?

reply to post by burntheships


My background is law enforcement includes disaster preparedness and response, as almost all US law enforcement is trained in. Ill take my background over your blind hatred and ignorance on this topic any day of the week. Maybe you would be better off placing your thread in the hoax forum where it belongs?

Care to share with us what your background is in? Aside from quoting stuff from Iranian State Media?

I gave you the sources when I cited the external text - They are your sources. Its not my fault that you dont read them.

Originally posted by burntheships

And if that does not have your attention, why have they now started housing tornado victims in the same old contaminated trailers that were involved in Hurricane Katrina!? Horror stoies of mysterious rashes, burning eyes and chronic breathing problems were linked to the formaldehyde trailers.

Years after FEMA moved Hurricane Katrina and Rita victims out of formaldehyde and mold-infested trailers, the very same government-issue dwellings are once again sheltering disaster victims.

Bought at government auctions or from entrepreneurs reselling them, the trailers are appearing in increasing number along the path of the tornadoes that ravaged Alabama and other parts of the South last month. Jacked up on cinderblocks above severed tree limbs and piles of trash, the trailers cut a lean white silhouette eerily familiar to anyone who spent time in the Gulf Coast region in the past five and half years.
www.southernstudies.org...

The following is from your link that FEMA was placing people back into trailers. What you leave out is the fact that FEMA sold the trailers, and there were strings attached when they did -

The fire-sale prices, however, came with a catch -- all buyers had to sign a waiver agreeing that the government cast-offs would not be used as housing and that each unit would be marked with a notice labeling it unfit to live in. The agreement also stipulated that if units were resold, the new owners must inform the purchaser that the units are not intended for housing. If the risks and regulations are not made clear, the seller is liable for penalties and even criminal charges that could result in a five-year prison sentence, FEMA spokeswoman Mary Olsen said. Vowing never again to use the same models of travel trailers, FEMA has also rewritten specifications for emergency housing to mandate units that are larger and have more ventilation.

There is your source for the info you are leaving out. You conviently left out the fact that FEMA is not placing people into those trailers. You are conveintly leaving out the fact FEMA sold all of those contaminated trailers. You are leaving out the fact FEMA has stated in order for people tobuy the trailers, they cannot be used to house people.

You are leaving out the fact that companies who buy those trailers have to sign off on the fact they must disclose the issues with the trailer to buyers, in addition to stating they are not to be used for human occupation. You are leaving out the fact people have to sign off on the paperwork acknowledgeing the above before they buy those trailers.

What else are you going to twist to support your false claims?

You might want to read the OP's post again it is about formaldehyde and mold-infested trailers, and Fema denying assistance to the tornado victims. You got way off topic with your hot air. Please stay on topic.

Originally posted by SkipperJohn
You might want to read the OP's post again it is about formaldehyde and mold-infested trailers, and Fema denying assistance to the tornado victims. You got way off topic with your hot air. Please stay on topic.

Actually I did not. I explained why FEMA denied the tornado assistance, and provided sources as requested by the OP.

If we want to get technical, FEMA didnt deny the people who lost their house money for their house. What FEMA did was deny their request for a grant for temporary housing. What the article doesnt talk about is whether or not that person had any type of insurance on his house.

The claim made by the OP was FEMA was placing people back into contaminated trailers, which is false. I cited her sources to support that fact, and you can see it in the post above this.

I am on topic. What I am doing is correcting all the false info being provided by people who are running their own agenda against an organization they know nothing about.

reply to post by Xcathdra


Once again your "claims" to "background" in LE are irrelevant to FEMA's operations.

Let me ask you this question...do you deny FEMA has corrupt activity?

Originally posted by burntheships
Once again your "claims" to "background" in LE are irrelevant to FEMA's operations.

Its not, and since you know nothing about my background or how FEMA works, that would be your opinion, where as my response is based on first hand experience.

Originally posted by burntheships
Let me ask you this question...do you deny FEMA has corrupt activity?

Of course not.. all agencies, entites are going to be corrupt to a certain degree.

What I am taking exception to is your portrayal that anything FEMA touches is some corrupt conspiracy perpetrated against the people of the US, when in reality its not.

What I take exception to is your attempt to sway peoples opinions by misleading them with your cherry picking of paragraphs from your own sources, while ignoring information that clearly contradicts what you are portraying, namely the FEMA trailers. FEMA has not placed any person back into those trailers, and has gone out of its way to inform buyers of the problems.

What I take exception to ius your portrayal of FEMA denying assistance to counties in a manner that conveys the organization as being corrupt and uncarring, when in reality its because they are not meeting established criteria. What I take exception to is how you conviently leave out the ability of the counties to appeal the denial, which they have done.

What I take exception to is your unwillingnees to learn what FEMA is and how it works, how it interfaces with the State Emergency Management systems, and what their role is while interfacing with those state agencies.

What I take exception to is your blanket blame on FEMA, when clearly FEMA acts as an umbrella, representing over 15 different federal agencies.

What I take exception to is your blanket accusation FEMA is corrupt and doesnt spend money like theey should, while ignoring the fact FEMA makes funds available to the State Emergency management agency weho then assists in distributing money. Or how you conviently invoke Katrina, while ignoring the fact that during Katrina FEMA gave the people who received assistance the benefiet of the doubt that they would spend those funds on needed items, and not flat screen TV's.

FEMA is no where near perfect, but they are certainly not as incompetant / corrupt / evil as you are attempting to portray them as.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by burntheships
Let me ask you this question...do you deny FEMA has corrupt activity?

Of course not.. all agencies, entites are going to be corrupt to a certain degree.

I rest my case.

Originally posted by burntheships

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by burntheships
Let me ask you this question...do you deny FEMA has corrupt activity?

Of course not.. all agencies, entites are going to be corrupt to a certain degree.

I rest my case.

Which is to say your close mindedness only hears what it wants, regardless of how wrong it is. Forget the fact youve been proven wrong in your other accusations, and forget the fact you used Iranian media as a source on FEMA.

How about, instead of resting and taking the lazy, apathetic way out, you actually do something and learn about the agency your calling out in the thread?

I know its work, but at the very least you can hold yourself to the same standard you place on FEMA in terms of accountability. After all, you call them out for inaccurate information, while holding yourself and your arguments to the lesser standard.

Interesting how the OP is talking about one thing, and the other person in this thread keeps referring to "procedureal" information.

How a government agency is Supposed to run (trained and procedural) verses it's corrupt behaviors, and practices; they tend to be two different things.

So oddly, I don't see the point in the procedural comments, since it's almost like someone is repeating their programming, especially when the OP is talking about corrupt behaviors and practices.

The corruption, however, and lack of "quality" from the government, is well known.

Rather amusing that PressTV actually is citing it too.

What does that say about the agency, in question.. /cough

As per usual, tho, people will believe what they want, for what ever reasons, be it programming, or belief.

Now if we can stay on the OP's orginal post contents.. Bonus!

ya know, this really doesn't surprise me
none the least.

I think the f'up with the contaminated
trailers is actually a criminal offense.
Intentionally putting some one in a
house that is contaminated is illegal
last time I checked. They would be better
off living in a tent. Hey, that's what the
Palestinian refugee camps get. But at
least it won't kill you living in it.

and just think, if Ron Paul gets
elected, FEMA will be history
anyway. No more griping.
If a tornado comes during a
Paul administration ....
ur on ur own

nice find BTS
S&F

reply to post by Cygnis


Lets see.. The op accuses FEMA of being corrupt and refusing to assist people.

The OP calls out their million dollar training scenario. FEMA does training like this, as do state agencies. During FEMA training other parts of teh country also underwent disaster training, including Missouri who put on a earthquake preparedness scenario. FEMA is being proactive, which they are suppose to do. There is no corruption present or pointed out by the OP. Again, its procedural.

I pointed out why FEMA refused to assist the people who lost their house in the tornado, which has nothing to do with corruption, yet it was brought up by the OP. Again the reason for the denial has to do with procedural issues.

The OP brought up FEMA denying assistance to other areas hit by Tornados, while comparing them to counties that did receive their assistance. That has nothing to do with corruption, and everything to do with procedure.

The OP accuses FEMA of putting people in trailers that were essentially condemned. What the OP was trying to point out was how corrupt it was for FEMA to do that. What the OP failed to do was read the entire article (her own source) where it specifically states that FEMA did not sell / put people in condemned trailers, 3rd party contractors who bought up the FEMA trailers did. She went on to leave out the caveat that shows the Government forced any business who bought those trailers for resale to acknowledge and sign off that the trailers are not fit for occupation, and would not be used in that manner. It also required the business to disclose this to people buying the trailers. FEMA also required any person who bought the trailer to sign an acknowledgement that the trailer was not to be used for occupation. Which has nothing to do with corruption, but procedure.

The OP calls into question the manner in which FEMA spends money, yet fails to understand there are 15+ agencies who work under FEMA, which is where some of the corruption occured.

There is no doubt that corruption occurs.. It occurs everywhere, including in the ops thread where a picture was painted with incomplete, distored or otherwise intentionally omitted information in an effort to paint FEMA as something its not.

But hey.. why bother looking at facts, when we can just make stuff up to push an agenda based on lack of knowledge. Its certainly the bar that is set here on ATS, where the them is deny ignorance.

Ironic..

reply to post by Xcathdra


I'm glad I'm not the only one to see this.

Perhaps FEMA should have scrapped the trailers instead of selling them to huxters, that's about the only major issue I'm seeing here.

As for money handouts, well you Americans hate anything remotely socialist, so this would include instant government handouts, no questions asked.

But since that would be considered socialist, it doesn't happen until your insurance details are confirmed.

Blaming the big, faceless government entity is a cop out.

FEMA aren't to blame for people buying these trailers to live in, the ones to blame are the ones on-selling without disclosing the fact that they are uninhabitable.

FEMA aren't to blame for the red tape involved with getting money, granted this could be improved but again, blame American capitalism.