That is no surprise here. After all this time they finally go public with the news of Korea having the capability to hit potential USA targets? People in the missle defense industry have been working on this for years to prevent a rogue leader from hitting us for a non-wartime reason.

This is proof that we need that missle defense system. Well until thats operational we should have MAD to keep us safe. Any idea what kind of payload they'll have.

Originally posted by cyberdude78
This is proof that we need that missle defense system. Well until thats operational we should have MAD to keep us safe. Any idea what kind of payload they'll have.

...We do have a ballistic missle defense system and it is being upgraded all the time.

Well most tests have resulted in failure. So we kind of rely on MAD until we can get a reliable system in place.

Big frickin deal.

Remember the Cold War? More than 20 years of a CONSTANT threat of imminent nuclear annihilation. Now it's suddenly "Omigod they can kill us we need to go in before they do".

Not that they WILL kill us, but that they CAN. Instead of screaming about pre-emptive strikes, people should try growing some cojones.

Originally posted by cyberdude78
Well most tests have resulted in failure. So we kind of rely on MAD until we can get a reliable system in place.

Not true. I know people associated closely with the Navy's portion of the program and what I am told (not classified) is that we have a very comprehensive system and it is being constantly developed and upgraded. They have had many successful tests including the 'Hit a missle with a missle' test.

Yeah but the Soviet Union wasn't some rogue nation. If the DPRK can get nukes then whats stopping some small African nation from getting them. This proves that third world nations can get nukes. Now anybody can attack us, not just the worlds largest target.

acording to experts, those missiles could hit hawaii in less then 2 hours and would hit las vegas in about 3 and a half pretty scary

Two hours just to reach Hawaii. Thats kind of slow. I mean people actually have a chance to evacuate. I remember most good ICBMs can hit a target anywhere on Earth in a matter of about thirty minutes. Really is that the best the DPRK can get.

[edit on 8/6/2004 by cyberdude78]

He's gotta be wrong, because it's impossible. A missile cannot take 3 hours to hit a target 1/2 globe away.

Originally posted by cyberdude78
........If the DPRK can get nukes then whats stopping some small African nation from getting them.

- the enormous budget for the vast infrastructural support ICBMs require, for a start?

This proves that third world nations can get nukes.

- er, no it doesn't. Far from it in fact. It proves nothing at all.

.....and the story itself might not even be true at all anyway.

Originally posted by necro99
He's gotta be wrong, because it's impossible. A missile cannot take 3 hours to hit a target 1/2 globe away.

- I agree, a missile has to fly to near orbit speed (17500mph) to achieve a ballistic tragectory to travel the kind of distances being quoted here.

If it were that slow it could not achieve the range.....it could not be an ICBM.

Big frickin deal.

Remember the Cold War? More than 20 years of a CONSTANT threat of imminent nuclear annihilation. Now it's suddenly "Omigod they can kill us we need to go in before they do".

Yes, but the Soviet Union had a lot to lose so did we during the Cold war. But what does Crazy Kim have to loose?...nothing! He doesn't care about his people, is country is poor as hell he probably just wants to take as many down with him as he can. That is the difference between a rouge nation and another regular country.

Originally posted by WestPoint23

.......But what does Crazy Kim have to loose?...nothing! He doesn't care about his people, is country is poor as hell he probably just wants to take as many down with him as he can. That is the difference between a rouge nation and another regular country.

- Don't be so ridiculous Westy.

Kim and his military have their power to lose. Why on earth are you going with this "crazy Kim" stupidity?

It is of course true NK is a military dictatorship but what makes you dismiss their leadership as "crazy"? Do you really think they operate with no rational at all? That strikes me as a crazy attitude, certainly a very ignorant one.

Why would they choose certain suicide and the annihilation of themselves and their nation (their powerbase, such as it is) is a far more rational question you should be considering IMO.

The real and only true difference between a rouge nation and a regular country is cos you President once said so. Wake up.

Uhh...even his doctors and some psychologists have said he is mentally unfit to rule a country and he is getting old anyways if he is about to die he wont care about anything else.

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Uhh...even his doctors

- Yeah right, this is about as likely as Bushs' docs coming out about his drug consumption, less even, what with NK being the closed state it is.

(unless his doctors means someone who has fled and therefore possibly not the most reliable source going?)

and some psychologists have said he is mentally unfit to rule a country

- No doubt. But then you can probably say that about most of them. For some, a desire to be a political leader really should be a bar to becoming one.

and he is getting old anyways if he is about to die he wont care about anything else.

- Oh lame or what? The guy is (as far as I can tell) 62.

What are you saying? Every aged leader is potentially going to pull the plug cos they're about to make the grand exit?!

Get real.....as if such decisions (anywhere) would truely be allowed to be down to one elderly guy so unstable.

What are you saying? Every aged leader is potentially going to pull the plug cos they're about to make the grand exit?!

Get real.....as if such decisions (anywhere) would truely be allowed to be down to one elderly guy so unstable.

No that is not what I am saying you have to stop treating N. Korea as if it is a regular country. Its not it is a rouge nation they are economically independent their people are poor most of them want to flee that is what I mean by Kim has nothing to loose and he really doesn't. That is why he is more dangerous, cuz MAD doesn't apply to people who have nothing to loose. Al qada for example they don't care if they die they just want to kill as many as they can. MAD is useless against people like that.

Originally posted by WestPoint23

No that is not what I am saying you have to stop treating N. Korea as if it is a regular country.

- It is just another country with a regimented system of dictatorial control not enormously unlike others we have seen before.

Its not it is a rouge nation they are economically independent their people are poor

- Yes, I agree. What productive wealth there is is diverted to the military and the leadership.

most of them want to flee

- I believe this is so of many there now, yes.

that is what I mean by Kim has nothing to loose and he really doesn't.

- I'm sorry, that just does not follow. So the country is mostly poor and having trouble feeding itself from time to time why does that mean Kim has nothing to lose? He and the rest of the NK leadership have everything there is to have in that poor country.

That is far from nothing when it is going to such a relatively small number.

That is why he is more dangerous, cuz MAD doesn't apply to people who have nothing to loose.

- Sorry Westy, but I cannot agree that your starting premise is correct. These people do very nicely out of being on top in NK.

Al qada for example they don't care if they die they just want to kill as many as they can. MAD is useless against people like that.

- No, AQ is something altogether different. I do not believe you can link the two at all.

AQ people have a religious belief system that has their people thinking they are not only doing the right thing for 'political' reasons but spiritual ones also.

Not every AQ person is a dirt poor refugee.