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Librarians…our First Line of Defense

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posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 07:40 AM
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Sometimes, I think they may be our only line of defense. You don’t see many groups or agencies standing up for anything that questions the government’s actions or policies……as we drift into the Orwellian abyss.




After a government documents recall notice posted on the Government Printing Office (GPO) web site generated strong reactions from librarians, the Department of Justice (DOJ) said late last week that depository libraries could keep the disputed materials on their shelves after all.

www.libraryjournal.com...

Respects,




posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 02:11 PM
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I agree, bookstore owners and librarians are the people who defend access to diverse ideas and thereby foster actual intelligent debate on new and uncommon viewpoints on things.

Our last line of defense in the free marketplace of ideas.
.



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 02:21 PM
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I worked in a large metropolitan library for many years. IMO, librarians are over-rated. They are a group of people who created a Master's Degree Program for job security purposes. Many of them wouldn't know intellectual debate if they sat in on it. Many of them can't get off their chairs to help their customers. Some of them can't even figure out how to order current fiction for their customers.

If they are our only line of defense, our country is in BIG trouble!
____________
Correct me if I have drawn the wrong conclusion here: are we saying that the GPO is deciding what is sensitive information in the DOJ???
Can they do that? So, if an error was created, the information stays in the public domain?



[edit on 4-8-2004 by DontTreadOnMe]



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 05:50 PM
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Originally posted by DontTreadOnMe
I worked in a large metropolitan library for many years. IMO, librarians are over-rated. They are a group of people who created a Master's Degree Program for job security purposes. Many of them wouldn't know intellectual debate if they sat in on it. Many of them can't get off their chairs to help their customers. Some of them can't even figure out how to order current fiction for their customers.

If they are our only line of defense, our country is in BIG trouble!


Well, being a grad student in a Master's program for library science I naturally take offense. Instead of the rude response questioning your intelligence that was my first reaction, I will say this: On the contrary, librarians are usually much more intellectual than the average joe, and VERY interested in personal freedom and privacy of their patrons. Free flow of information is the most important principle of library science. Librarians are absolutely opposed to the Patriot Act and anything else that threatens the flow of information and the privacy of individuals.

So...we're alot more useful than you think we are. Read up.

www.ala.org...



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 05:55 PM
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Actually If you are a historian that decided to go into been a librarian I will say you will know your stuff, but here were I am in the south the libraries are run by students and the real librarians are sitting in their comfortable offices doing who knows what.


I do a lot of research and I am an avid reader I know more about my local library (had to said very outdated) than the poor girls or boys working in there.

No offense.



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 07:52 PM
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Originally posted by marg6043
Actually If you are a historian that decided to go into been a librarian I will say you will know your stuff, but here were I am in the south the libraries are run by students and the real librarians are sitting in their comfortable offices doing who knows what.


I do a lot of research and I am an avid reader I know more about my local library (had to said very outdated) than the poor girls or boys working in there.

No offense.


Well you've got to differentiate between public libraries and the other kinds of libraries. We do.


I personally would never work in a public library, they're all you said and sometimes worse. I'm an academic library or special library type. Most of the people in my masters program are going into Academic libraries. These libraries tend to be better run, well funded, and have less "riff-raff" in them. They cater to a more specific audience )students, researchers, and scholars), instead of the general public.



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 07:58 PM
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Well were I'm from the public libraries were better than the school libraries. The computer server didn't crash every week! The public libraries near me are very well run. But seeing as its a small town whos schools have superb academice records most people who end up in our library are usually there researching something serious, very few kids there seeing as the schools have their own libraries.



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 08:13 PM
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Originally posted by cyberdude78
Well were I'm from the public libraries were better than the school libraries. The computer server didn't crash every week! The public libraries near me are very well run. But seeing as its a small town whos schools have superb academice records most people who end up in our library are usually there researching something serious, very few kids there seeing as the schools have their own libraries.


By school libraries do you mean high school and elementary school or do you mean college and university libraries?



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 08:30 PM
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I agree...

Librarians are our first line of defense.



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 08:35 PM
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Originally posted by Flinx
Well, being a grad student in a Master's program for library science I naturally take offense. Instead of the rude response questioning your intelligence that was my first reaction, I will say this: On the contrary, librarians are usually much more intellectual than the average joe, and VERY interested in personal freedom and privacy of their patrons. Free flow of information is the most important principle of library science. Librarians are absolutely opposed to the Patriot Act and anything else that threatens the flow of information and the privacy of individuals.

So...we're alot more useful than you think we are. Read up.

Excuse me, but your response to Marg was this:


I personally would never work in a public library, they're all you said and sometimes worse.

You stop short of rudely questioning MY intelligence, but you give Marg a free pass and say you wouldn't even work in a public library. Everything and more I said is true. I was speaking from my experience in a major metropolitan library.
I guess you missed the part where I said I worked in a library for many, many years, huh? I don't need to read up on ALA. I walked the walk.
Many of the librarians I worked with were people who couldn't get work in their field or they couldn't hack the REAL world. So they went back to college and got their MLS. Then they got cushy jobs in public libraries. Many of them "kicked back and collected their paychecks". Some of them rose through the ranks and reached their level of real imcompetence...and are now administrators.

____________
On the flip side, I've worked with a few librarians who went the extra mile and are a credit to their profession. But, they are few.
Didn't want you to think I had a grudge against the profession, ya know.


[edit on 4-8-2004 by DontTreadOnMe]



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 08:55 PM
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DontTreadOnMe,

Ok....I was a bit snappy.


So what was your job when you were in the library? Also, were the majority of people in your library paraprofessionals or people with Masters degrees?



posted on Aug, 4 2004 @ 08:55 PM
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Originally posted by Flinx

Originally posted by cyberdude78
Well were I'm from the public libraries were better than the school libraries. The computer server didn't crash every week! The public libraries near me are very well run. But seeing as its a small town whos schools have superb academice records most people who end up in our library are usually there researching something serious, very few kids there seeing as the schools have their own libraries.


By school libraries do you mean high school and elementary school or do you mean college and university libraries?

High school and elementary. The town I'm from doesn't have a college or university. Most kids go to a community college somewhere in the same county or nearby. But the libraries at our school are first rate if a bit small. But there actually quite large considering that our schools are tiny.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 06:51 AM
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OK we clarify about what kind of libraries you used, Yes I agree that college libraries are better run and kept but students still work on then as part of work study programs and yes if you need a professional help you can get it.

I personally like to the local books store were I can do research and if I want I can buy the book on the subject I'm researching on and have an up to day variety to choose from.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 12:49 PM
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I find the DOJ's actions offensive. It appears that the DOJ is challenging the right of a citizen to research his/her rights in the case of asset forfeiture independent of an attorney -- and I'd bet it was just a test case. I was a legal secretary for over 10 years, and if I got into legal trouble, you can bet I'd look into the law on my own even if I retained a lawyer. While I'm not saying that all attorneys are bad by any means, an informed citizen stands a better chance of winning a case than one who relies totally upon a lawyer to do it for them.



posted on Aug, 5 2004 @ 08:46 PM
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Originally posted by Flinx
DontTreadOnMe,

Ok....I was a bit snappy.


So what was your job when you were in the library? Also, were the majority of people in your library paraprofessionals or people with Masters degrees?


back at you. I am not nor have I ever been a libraraian. I clerked during my career, everythng from ordering to cataloging books (yes, even that bastion of librarianship), shelving and circulating and processing. I enjoyed cataloging the most.
I also worked with the public for too many years. It burnt me out

There is a clerical support staff. Public duties are mostly done by librarians, with some clerical assistance.
Since this is a public forum, please refer more specific ??s to a u2u. If you have any




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