Joplin Missouri Hammered Hard by tornadoes!

No idea why people feel the need to arm chair quarterback and make statements that are so blantantly false its not even funny.

As was stated before, you guys are more than welcome to lod your asses into your car and bring em down here to see first hand whats going on. I know it will make it harder to snipe without being able to hide behind a monitor, but it might open your eyes as to what the hell is going on.

reply to post by Xcathdra


It is a combination of errors.

Logistics and Command cannot accomodate 5000 volunteers. 800 or so seems to be their max. Liability for adding additional injuries, property loss, or theft are a major concern for the organizers. Disseminating information is always a #1 priority, and the #1 challenge.

Their challenges are real, and real difficult, and I am sure they are doing the best they can, but with 1500 people missing, it is still unacceptable. They train for this stuff year around, they have a very good plan, so the problem is just in the execution. Problems in execution always stem from poor leadership.

So, I understand their challenges, and appreciate their efforts, but I will not give them a free pass. Just "trying" is not good enough. They need to be successful when lives are on the line.

Originally posted by Cloudsinthesky
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

I just don't understand why they are not sending out teams other than the teams they send out in the mornings...........Volunteer after volunteer were walking up after getting off work wanting to go out to help...........

Sign up and we will call you................okay

I can only star you once. Clouds, I hope you guys are ok. This has to be more for you than anyone could imagine. I am proud to know that you are a fellow member. Lets not allow the press to make people forget tomorrow or in a day or two, to tell the good people of Joplin to begin moving on, to put closure on this or to begin the healing process until you are ready. It may take more time to be healthy than to create a desensitization of those who are easily persuaded. Believe me, even 70 miles away the msm is beginning to make people compromise emotion by "gifting" it away. Donate and then move on... I wont forget and I cant move on or begin the healing process when I know people are suffering silently.

reply to post by antar


I drove home 9:00pm (Carl Junction) from 32nd st down Wall st which goes directly through the zone.........Not a light was shinning................

Yes we had storms but they were gone by 11:30pm............

reply to post by getreadyalready


I understand their challeneges as well. They have gone through areas not once or twice, but multiple times. I undestand that eventually you hit a point where people are crawling over each other and it degrades efficency.

But in addition to search and rescue, they are still responsible for the people who are alive and in these areas trying to recover items, as well as the rescuers themselves.

While I understand the comment about continuing a search into the night, people seem to forget that there are still gas main breaks, fires, live lines that are still on the ground. Its going to take time to get into some of these areas, and having rescuers getting killed doesnt do anyone any good, including those who mnight still be trapped.

As far as the MSM goes, Anderson Cooper is already beating the war drums about the response now from the EOC, so I give it another news cycle before the media turn into the usual jackals and lop side the story.

reply to post by Xcathdra


I agree with caution in the dangerous areas, and I agree that searches at night should be very limited to only where they have industrial lighting.

But, I don't agree with not disclosing possible addresses that are coming into the call centers, and I don't agree with not searching from 4 to 9 when there is still daylight, and I don't agree with putting legal liability for theft and vandalism ahead of potential lifesaving measures.

ETA:
I do totally agree that once the press gets their fangs out, the tide will turn, and they will jump on any little weakness like a feeding frenzy.

There is no doubt in my mind that everybody on the scene is acting with the best of intentions, and doing the best they can possibly do. It is just a shame that there are not enough strong leaders stepping up to make the effort even better!

reply to post by getreadyalready


i passed this on to a couple of contacts hopefully they will get back to me tonight.

for the intial searches i do know they wanted people that were CERT certified because of the dangerous conditions of most of the structures and the gas leaks and the continued severe weather threat.

reply to post by antar


Again quit armchair quarter backing and get in your car and come down here. the heavy rescue crews were sent to areas they knew more than likely they were going to have 100's of people trapped together quickly using up any clean air that was trapped with them under the rubble. it just so happens that 2 of those places were a walmart supercenter and a home depot, not to meantion resteraunts, smaller shops, APARTMENT BUILDINGS, and HOUSES that are in the area around those places. They also sent heavy rescue crews to the Hampshire terrace apartment and the dillons grocery store that were completely destroyed in the tornado because they knew they were a lot of people that could be trapped their as well.

also I'd like to point out that most people that were trapped and still alive in other parts of the city were dug out by the people that live in those areas that crawled out of their own houses as soon as the tornado passed and immediately started helping their neighbors. also those people that lived right next to the damaged areas that were lucky and didn't have any damage of their own rushed immediately into the damage path and started digging people out. also a lot of people crawled out of the walmart and home depot right after the tornado and immediately started digging people out of the rubble at those locations.

So Yes maybe it is good your not posting tonight since clearly you know nothing about the city of Joplin Its layout or where around 5pm on a sunday in the city of joplin there would be large groups of people and where they might be trapped.

And as for the sounds of the city I can tell you right now it is just as noisy at night as it is during the day. with all the sirens on the emergency vehicles going 24/7 as they rush across the city.

But i guess its just easier for you to watch the national media stir up stuff and critize whats going on here from afar than it is to actually come here and see it for yourself.

Hell if you believed the media you'd think that looting was widespread. there was less than a dozen incidents of looting and everyone has already been arrested and charged and currently sitting their asses in jail.

IF you believed the national news you'd think that we only had 1 hospital until we the people that live here called them out on it and set them straight. then they started saying the major hospital for the area was destroyed which again was false.

If you believed the national news then you'd believe 1500 people were still trapped somewhere in the city, again this is false. there are 1500 that were either out of town and haven't contacted their family yet or they are people that were in town and have went to stay with friends or family and people outside of joplin are looking for them and haven't been able to get intouch with them yet.

BOttom line its just to easy for some people to sit behind their monitor and make comments than it is to actually get off your asses and do something that will actually help people

ETA: right after the tornado I rushed into the damaged path to check on 2 family members. 1 was my grandfather whose house was virtually untouched by the tornado which was a surprising how close it was to the tornado, he was fine. I stayed with him a few minutes when he asked about my aunt and told me to go check on her. I rushed all the way to the west side of town to the area around St. Johns hospital. She lived on Connor street. I made it to 20th and Connor in my truck then walked 4 blocks on foot through the destruction i didn't stop until i got to my aunts house. I dug both her and my great aunt out of the rubble that was their house. I started to walk them back north towards my truck when we heard people screaming that were trapped in a house. Me, my aunt, my great aunt and alot of people that lived around there dug them out and we just kept doing that working our way back north out of the damage path.

now what exactly have you done?

Originally posted by Mercenary2012

reply to post by antar

 

Again quit armchair quarter backing and get in your car and come down here.

You know, your not very nice to the host.
This is Antars thread. You might want to take note that your the newcomer here.

reply to post by burntheships


and I'm the one that lives In joplin not her! you might want to keep that in mind

Originally posted by Mercenary2012
seems Fred phelps and his sick family is coming to joplin this Sunday.
source

wonder if they are planning on leaving Joplin alive or in body bags?

You've got to be kidding???!!! Can that be my first volunteer task, to spear his sorry ass on a very tall metal pole and use him as a lightning detector for Joplin???

Originally posted by getreadyalready

Originally posted by Mercenary2012
Effective immediately, permits are no longer required to come and go from the disaster area. However, the curfew is still in effect where no one is allowed on the streets within the disaster area between 9:00 pm and 6:00 am. Officials will be checking for photo ID when you enter the restricted area and looking for suspicious people.

That is great news!

Last I heard, my brother, and Clouds were not allowed into the search area or assigned to any teams, so instead, they ventured East of the city where there were reports of debris landing. They got the idea that people weren't looking over there yet, and tornadoes are known to carry things for miles. I haven't heard back from them yet.

I'm not going off on Mercenary, I just am so fed up with disaster responses in the past and recognize EXACTLY what getreadyalready has been posting about. I'm one of those willing volunteers that has snuck into disaster areas to help, fed up with bureacratic red tape and b.s. If I didn't live so far away, and could afford the gas, I would be there already volunteering, searching. It's really killing me, not being able to be there to help.

reply to post by RoyalBlue


I have a pretty good idea why they are turning away getreadyalready's brother. They want everyone that is available to search that day to be at MSSU by 8am to register each day and they have to be available for anytime that day because they are forming the civialian search groups each morning with people that are available all day long. getreadyalready's brother is a teacher and has to work in the mornings and can't search until the afternoons. by then they already have full teams setup for the day.

Originally posted by Mercenary2012
I have more information on the permits. They are trying to decrease the opportunity of looting as well as control the flow of traffic into the damaged areas. most of the side streets are still impassible.

This is where government fails. Believe me, I would not wait for a permit to go to my home. And I wonder what kind of person sits behind a table and babbles bureaucratic nonsense to people in shock and despair?

Government needs to get out of the way.

Originally posted by getreadyalreadyand I don't agree with putting legal liability for theft and vandalism ahead of potential lifesaving measures.

No doubt. IMHO, that's criminal in itself.

reply to post by Mercenary2012


Not true............They just work until 3;30pm .........I asked one of the MSSU groups in the zone if our guys could help..........He said "we are done" .......Shuttles are picking everyone up around 3:30pm...........

And as I stated earlier no other teams were going out for the evening hours...............A good 6 hours waited..........

Two teams should have been organized for each day...........One at 8:00am and another at 1:00pm...........With coordinated efforts..............

Another problem is that "they" are not digging deep into the rubble..........just skimming the surface.........

Some of these homes in rubble are 5 to 6 feet deep................I dug through a house yesterday that was leveled and moved 30 yards from its slab...........It had a large tree and two cars stacked on top of it..........

Today I am going back to where they pulled three bodies out of the pile two days ago...........My nurse is still missing her aunt from that building.............And the pile is 5 to 6 feet deep that was once held 40 residents.....

reply to post by Mercenary2012


I do have a medical degree which could have helped in the beginning, I have spoken to my local hospital about volunteers, they have already sent several and most have returned . I am no fool, my going down there is not going to help unless I had the money to stand at the entrance to the devastated areas and write checks to the local survivors.

This does not mean that I sit in an armchair megaphone in hand and give false accusations. If you know what I did and do have planned you would respectfully apologize to me.

reply to post by Cloudsinthesky


It is always possible that people are still in their basements, beneath ground shelters unable to surface on their own without help. Stay hydrated and in your heart, God will guide you to where you need to be right on time.

reply to post by Mercenary2012


Please excuse me if I am being disrespectful here, but with all the time you have spent on this thread, which has in many posts been very welcome, I wonder how much time you have actually spent looking for survivors and helping victims? You do seem to have quite a bit of inside information from the federal level and the logistics but few personal stories of encouragement and sadness. Are you a politician or bureaucratic?

Not to be disrespectful, just wondering about the armchair thing and why you have not met and coordinated with Clods and Getreadyalreadys brother?

reply to post by burntheships


Thank you, this is from the beginning not my thread and in fact I have been more than humbled by being the bearer of bad news.

So many unbelievable posts especially in the first several pages. This as with all other threads on ATS which show how many members are on the ground worldwide is a collective effort.

My skin is thick and nothing can hurt my feelings worse than the truth, the rest can just roll off my back like water from a duck for the most part.

Once the sun begins to shine and the bodies yet not found begin to decompose, doesn't that throw the dogs sent off? Seems I recall after the 911 tragedy something to that affect.

Also with 200mph winds and given all the lightweight debris being found over 100 miles away, wouldn't the bodies also be found miles away from ground zero? Are there people lying in the countryside along the lines of the storms path? Are there still survivors waiting to be found but unable to walk away from where they landed? Horses need to be used to look in the miles of countryside to the east of Joplin now.

As of last night, the young man that was sucked up out of the suv has NOT been found. It was all a mistake in identity at the hospital, the young man there turned out to be someone else. This poor family is STILL looking for him! I saw earlier posts stating he had been found and is in the hospital. I felt a need to correct this information. He is still missing. The family has contacted hundreds of hospitals to no avail. They have searched the pond near where he disappeared a couple of times now. It breaks my heart he was on his way home form his high school graduation. Keep your prayers going out for him!