5-21-2011 Rapture... Get the facts strait...

Originally posted by gabby2011

wow..thankyou for showing us your true colours...

a christian who hates americans ,and thinks she is superior to anyone in north america.

(chuckles)

Since when did "I don't like" equal "I hate"?
Look you and Predator have too much time on your hands, obviously, and have ganged up to double-team me. Play your silly reindeer games!
Pred, there are no other theists around this thread, so your little dig missed. Sorry buddy!
I hope when you were at Uni, that your language use was a bit better - but in the USA 'university' actually means a two year college, right? The equivalent of 6th and 7th form in high school here... so really, it doesn't mean a lot.
The upshot of it all is, I am very very bored with two such deeply childish people.
V.

Originally posted by Vicky32

Originally posted by gabby2011
I might add that if you think you're superior because you have some kind of higher understanding of the english language, then you are delusional as well.(It does not make you superior)

What makes you think that having a superior knowledge of English makes me superior? It simply makes me a teacher, which is what I am...
Seeing grammar and spelling mistakes makes me feel ill, and when I see that someone has misunderstood me because of their own lack of knowledge, upsets me.
V.

What makes me think that, is because you said it,in plain english.

What did I misunderstand about you "not liking" americans..??

Was that some kind of english code for saying they are great?..(chuckles again)

You yourself, said you were christian...

What have I misunderstood? Nothing!!

I won't respond to anymore of your nonsense..have a good day vicky.

(its a good thing we don't judge everyone in your country by your representation)

Originally posted by gabby2011

What makes me think that, is because you said it,in plain english.

What did I misunderstand about you "not liking" americans..??

Was that some kind of english code for saying they are great?..(chuckles again)

You yourself, said you were christian...

What have I misunderstood? Nothing!!

Poor silly little girl! Yelling "You can't fire me, I quit!" as you just did after I said I was sick and tired of you, is the action of a 12 year old.
Once again, for the hard-of-thinking, "don't like" is not the same as 'hate'!
I never denied being Christian and I never will - but please note that Christian does not equal doormat. It amazes me how often atheists make that mistake.
For the record, I don't go a bomb on Canadians either - I was engaged to one for years, and discovered what mewling hypocrites and wanna-be Americans most of them are.

reply to post by Vicky32


Sounds like your canadian fiance escaped just in time.

Keep posting vicky..you just keep sticking your foot in your mouth deeper and deeper with every post.

You call me a silly child? Why don't you read what you have written,and get back to me on that.

I never said being christian was being a doormat,by the way. I implied that a christian would not say they do"not like" all americans.

For someone who has ranted about being so misunderstood,you sure have a way of misunderstanding..or should I say"twisting" what others say.

You also have a bad habit of assuming ..you assumed I was american...and now you are assuming I am atheist??

I have stated vicky,that I am not perfect,and have made some bad judgment calls from time to time...but your accusations of me are unfounded , and I resent them.

Can we please stick to the topic at hand? Bashing religion!

Vicky, as a Canadian I do not understand your hurtful words. Americans while having a lackluster education system is not the product of the people themselves, but of their corrupt government. And just because their education system is lacking is a pathetic excuse to degrade them.

If you claim to be a Christian why do you mock and bash others? Is that not something your god frowns upon? I could talk circles around you in the realm of physics but that does not make me better or more intelligent, it simply means that I spent more time learning about it than you. It is a passion of mine, and something I enjoy, it doesn't make me better than anyone, period.

What kind of god could you possibly believe in that would approve of you belittling and insulting other people?

I think this is funny, the atheists are the calm ones and the Christian is spewing venom. Typical. Your lack of a valid argument and ad hominen attacks is proof that you have no idea about any religion.

Pred...

reply to post by gabby2011


My apologies as I insinuated you were an atheist as well. What are you religious beliefs? Nice to have someone level headed in here with me, some religious people hey?

And congratulations on being Canadian, we suck and are American wanna-bes!!

Pred...

reply to post by predator0187


lol..I did not choose to be canadian,but am very grateful I am.

I understand your assumption that I was athiest ,because as of late I really am not sure what I am.

I want to believe that there is a God,who somehow and at some point, can redeem this world back to sanity....and I have to admit..it makes me FEEL better to believe that. At the same time,I question a "loving" entity,who allows so much sorrow,and despair to happen, especially to children.

So,predator, I guess I would say ,I'm confused on the issue of God...but I would rather believe in something,than nothing at all. Since I have been conditioned from childhood to believe that God is good,fair and righteous, there is a strong part of me that can't ,or doesn't want to let that go.

Hopefully I have answered your question...(which seems to make me ask more of myself..lol)

As far as vicky goes, I hope she was just having an off day..(PMS can be brutal at times)

I don't want to dislike anyone,but at times, people just get under my skin,and its hard to let things go.
I'll have to work on that.

Originally posted by gabby2011

I want to believe that there is a God,who somehow and at some point, can redeem this world back to sanity....and I have to admit..it makes me FEEL better to believe that. At the same time,I question a "loving" entity,who allows so much sorrow,and despair to happen, especially to children.

So,predator, I guess I would say ,I'm confused on the issue of God...but I would rather believe in something,than nothing at all. Since I have been conditioned from childhood to believe that God is good,fair and righteous, there is a strong part of me that can't ,or doesn't want to let that go.

I was in a similar situation to yours a while back, I felt like something had to be there. I considered myself agnostic for a period of time, almost for fear of the thought there was nothing. As I sat back and stared at the world to reveal all the corruption, hate, materialism and selfishness, I realized there was no god. Not in any sense of the word that we know anyway.

If there was/is a person/being that watches over us, he is doing a crappy job, I thought. To let all these children die of hunger is beyond my comprehension, let alone to have all the rich people hoarding large amounts of money. Then I looked at the catholic church, and the amount of cash the Vatican made every year. It blew my mind, they could feed, clothe and shelter every unfortunate person on the planet and still have a ton of money. But, they choose not to do it, why? Because there is no difference between the rest of us and these "closer to god" types.

They would like you to believe there is, but the truth is in plain sight if you just look for it. They value the dollar more than human life just like the rich elite do here. Think of these priests that have molested these boys, they do not fear "hell" or "judgment", they let temptation (disgusting word for this) get the better of them. And yet when they (hopefully) called on god for help, he wouldn't even help them. What kind of god is that? A pityful one...

I figured out in my agnostic days that if a higher spiritual plane/another dimension exists that this created "god" has nothing to do with it, love is the key. Love, understanding and acceptance. Something that very few religious people follow nowadays. They like to lie to themselves, but they are swearing at each other in the church parking lots, or gossiping about the couple down the street. They love to judge people, it part of their scriptures to stick with people who believe in the same god. Not every religious person falls in this category but a majority does. But, how can a god that judges people tell his people not to judge? How can he have such a petty human fault?

The roots of some religions touch on the idea of love, the Bhagavad Gita is a good book to read, but they have been taken over by greedy, hateful and self centered people that have twisted religion and god beyond comprehension to what it once was.

And, finally, the day where I thought "screw this", there is nothing, is the day when I decided to be full of love, understanding and acceptance. I don't need a fictitious man in the sky to tell me right and wrong, I know what's right and wrong. I do not need to be scared and fearful of being judged and going to "hell" to treat people good, I want to because it's the way everyone should be. I need no religion or god to teach me what I already know.

I have no fear if death now because either there is a higher plane were we go to our next existence or it's black. If it turns out to be black we won't even know anyways. Who remembers falling asleep? I won't even know I'm dead. If it turns out to be something mystical, that's great.

I truly think if there is a "higher power" he would like atheists the best, because we are still good people and we do it for no rewards or fear, we do it out of compassion. I have been told that I sound religious before to my dismay, but I purely think through science.

I don't want to dislike anyone,but at times, people just get under my skin,and its hard to let things go.
I'll have to work on that.

I try and never get mad, not only because I'm getting grey hair and I'm not 30 yet, but because people cannot think properly when they are upset. They think emotionally rather that logically, which gets you in bad situations at times. Take a couple deep breathes, that always helps me.

Pred...

reply to post by predator0187


Hi Pred,

I understand you and that it is indeed your religious background that led you to where you are now, as I have also pointed out in an article of mine HERE.

Meanwhile, as you said you have read most of the religious books, what do you think about THIS?

Originally posted by sHuRuLuNi
reply to post by predator0187

 

Hi Pred,

I understand you and that it is indeed your religious background that led you to where you are now, as I have also pointed out in an article of mine HERE.

While I have read the "god delusion" many of times to say that after you finish you will be an atheist is a tall order, I also think it is a selling ploy on Dawkins part. I understand the rebuttal to the book but yet the author points out all the name calling Dawkins did only to call him names.

The fact that Dawkins only points out bad parts of holy books is attributed to the fact that all the followers only point out the good parts. No religion is perfect, understood, but nobody is changing these flawed systems that have created many wars into something that brings about co existence. Why must every god be the only one? Why must people argue about it rather than just accepting that they could be wrong? Why do all gods not like when you question them?

Questioning anything is good, questions lead to answers which promotes learning. Religion has a built in conflict creator when god is involved, especially a jealous god that will punish if you even think about believing in another god.

I think a lot has changed within the last couple of thousand years. Our mentality, our science, our food, our math, but yet we hang on to the old religions, they need to evolve with us. They are static at a time when we knew nothing, we could not explain the ideas and thoughts we know today and attributed nature to a higher power who created what we saw.

Evolution is another topic altogether. Evolution is a fact, it has been demonstrated many, many times over. The idea of self replicating life starting with RNA is our best theory at the moment as we have not yet created life in the lab yet. We will, very soon, and when we do a paradigm shift will happen with humans. We are on the verge now and have made baby steps in these fields, but it takes time. It took at 10+ billion or so years to get to the point of self replicating RNA and we have been studying it much less time than that.

Meanwhile, as you said you have read most of the religious books, what do you think about THIS?

I love the idea there are anomalies like that in books, but it generally proves that the author was a brilliant man, and perhaps a mathematician. Leonardo da-Vinci was one of those, unbelievably brilliant, he did things centuries ago that we are undestanding now. He has codes in his paintings that we have yet to crack. And he is one of many, many brilliant minds that go back throughout history.

There are a couple facts that throw me off, as in the 365 days, who decided there would be 365 days? In some calendars there are not. The big bang is a theory, yes, but it is slowly being disproven as we speak. As with months, pretty obvious when it is based on a lunar calendar. Ancients knew of lunar calendars.

I will look into them more when it is not so late. Quite interesting though, but if there were billions reading any book, they will be able to find anomalies. They did in the bible, hell they have done it in useless books as well. I will get back to you though...

Pred...

Originally posted by predator0187
I love the idea there are anomalies like that in books, but it generally proves that the author was a brilliant man, and perhaps a mathematician.

There are a couple facts that throw me off, as in the 365 days, who decided there would be 365 days? In some calendars there are not. The big bang is a theory, yes, but it is slowly being disproven as we speak. As with months, pretty obvious when it is based on a lunar calendar. Ancients knew of lunar calendars.

But this is the thing - he wasn't a mathematician. And even his *adversaries* attest to this. In fact, I have only provided a FEW mathematical things in there - the system is so ADVANCED and so COMPLICATED that it cannot be replicated even with today's technology.

As for 365 days - well it is a FACT that there are so many days, simply because that is the amount it takes the earth to rotate around it's axis while reaching the starting point in space around the sun.

But that is not the point: The point is that in the book which is a Law, a poetry, a Guide, containing history and every day verses - the word "day" itself - scattered throughout it - is found exactly 365 times.

You see - anyone can do that, and say: OK, I will write a book, and I will make it so, that the word "day" at the end will be mentioned exactly 365 times.

But then, he must make sure that the book itself does make SENSE and the text is coherent.
Now, try doing this when you do NOT have computers, and not even PAPER (there was none in 7th century Arabia).

Furthermore - while you are writing the book, and making sure "day" is mentioned exactly 365 times, you also make sure that "Month" is mentioned only 12 times - in the WHOLE BOOK.

Also, you make sure that whenever you compare something in an affirmative way ("this" is like "this") -then the words for both - mentioned anywhere in the book (and NOT TOGETHER) are mentioned exactly the same number of times.

So, when God says "Jesus is like Adam" in the Chapter 3, verse 59 - this is the first and the only time they are mentioned together - but throughout the book, both Jesus, as well as Adam are mentioned exactly 25 times!

Not only that, but the verse where they both "meet" is FOR BOTH the SEVENTH time they are mentioned from the beginning! And if we count from the end, it is the 19th time they are mentioned!

Even more, when these names are both used for the 19th time - do you know in which chapter is this? (Do not forget that the names are NOT used ON ALL chapters) - THey are mentioned for the 19th time in the Chapter called "Mary". And this is chapter number ...? What do you think?

On the other hand, when God says "this is not equal to this" - then the occurrence of both words is inevitably NOT THE SAME (e.g. the first is mentioned 92 times, and the second 93 times).

At the same time - the following also happens: In various chapters, and various verses, the color "white" is mentioned. In arabic, the word is "abyad". The mathematical value of this word is 813. If we add up the numbers of the verses where the color white is mentioned in all its derivatives, we end up with the mathematical value of the word, viz 813. The word "white" is mentioned in these verses:

2 187
3 106
3 107
7 108
12 84
20 22
26 33
27 12
28 32
35 27
37 46
37 49
Total 813

Now, do not forget, while you are writing accounts of Jesus and Adam in various chapters - still have to make sure that thing about the word "day", "month" and white from the beginning ... In case of "white" you must also make sure WHERE will you put that word, since if you have put it as verse 27:13 instead of 27:12, for example, then the end sum would not be 813, but 814.

Do you see where this is leading ...?

I have only SCRATCHED the surface ... TOMES OF BOOKS would be needed to even start to describe all these occurrences ... or as God has put it:

And if whatever trees upon the earth were pens and the sea (was ink), replenished thereafter by seven (more) seas, the words of Allah would not be exhausted. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise. - Qur'an, 31:27

reply to post by predator0187


What you say makes a lot of sense to me. To be a good fair person, because you believe it is better to be this way,and not out of fear, has more moral attribute,than the reverse.

Thankyou for responding.

I have read thru this thread in its entirety. Some very enlightening posts, and also some very sad, judgemental and downright cruel ones. My conclusion, that certainly is not how Jesus lived or loved. For people who believe in a messiah that was perfect and kind, it does not come across in many of you judgemental Christians. Instead of defending your beliefs to the teeth why not just be happy you believe you are going to be in the elect, and not bash others as anti-christs. It is really a slap in the face to what Jesus stood for. THIS right here is one of the biggest reasons I left religion. How can one live a life of goodness and light when they are constantly condemning others for not living and believing as they do? Faith is a personal journey, not a face off of who is a better believer. This is downright ridiculous. WWJD? Definitely not this!

reply to post by troubleshooter


It takes more than just believing. Satan believes in the Christ and knows he resurrected from the dead. A Christain is someone that not only believes, but makes Christ Lord of their life.

reply to post by predator0187


I think it is quite sad to think that life means nothing.

Originally posted by gabby2011
reply to post by predator0187

 

What you say makes a lot of sense to me. To be a good fair person, because you believe it is better to be this way,and not out of fear, has more moral attribute,than the reverse.

Thankyou for responding.

No problem.

This is something I enjoy talking about, same with physics, I find I blab on a lot when it comes to these subjects.

I try and keep things short, but I'm on an iPad. I only see a bit at a time and by the time I post, I scare myself with the large block of text.

Figuring things out in fun, as is change. I always embrace them as to fight them will suck the energy out of you. Remember to be truth to you and make sure others do not influence your decision.

Pred...

Originally posted by IHEARTBACON
reply to post by predator0187

 

I think it is quite sad to think that life means nothing.

No, don't think of it in a negative way, I don't. The idea that I am in control of my life is an invigorating one, that the decisions are to appease me makes me feel empowered. I don't need a god to tell me what is right or wrong, I can figure itout myself.

I am a good person, I have no malicious intent in my life, I treat everyone with respect and I consider myself a good person, so even if I was a believer I'd make it into heaven.

But, that's not my point, life is what you make of it, there is nobody watching and judging you, the ones that care about you are the ones you care about, if you want a life full of love you must fill yourself with love initially. The fact that we mean nothing in the scheme of things takes the pressure off.

Pred...

reply to post by sHuRuLuNi


Brilliant!

I'm going to start to study this code. That's my thing is patterns, that's all physics means is patterns in nature.

While I understand why you attribute this to a god, and his adversaries say he was no mathematician, some, not a lot, but some autistic minds are brilliant when it comes to math. They have a hard time with the ability to comprehend things other than math. They would do math that theoretical mathematicians Would have a hard time with. And, remember, the smartest thing you can do if fool your enemies into thinking you are weak, it's in the art of war.

There was a man, that had a dream and wrote a mathematical equation down in his sleep, this was a long time ago, like 1940's, but to this day we do not fully understand it. I'm not sure exactly of his name, but the story was on the "story of maths" done on BBC. But this equation was worked on by the best of the best and they have figured out very little on it, the original author has no idea what it meant, but they all agree that it makes sense, that the numbers balance.

There are plenty of anomalies attributed to ancient times, the parthenon is built to a standard we could not reproduce now, even with computers and C&C machines. They are dealing with marble, and I am a mason, I have plenty of experience with granite, travertine, sandstone , limestone and marble, that was my trade when I started working. I have made almost anything you can out of it, and too look at the ways in which the marble was flattened, to the precision the columns bow out is amazing to say the least. That is just that one building too, when we think about the pyramids, the amount of stones involved and the time period it took place, another anomaly.

The best and craziest anomaly, in ancient times, to me anyway, is puma punku. They did amazing things with granite. Granite is the second hardest substance on earth, everything you do to it involves diamonds, it has to or you do nothing to the stone. The ones thing that most stone masons frown upon is an inside 90 degree and in a corner. Now to do that into a boulder and literally inset a box, ask any mason, with the tools we have now, including C&C machines, it's damn near impossible, and would take lifetimes to accomplish to the accuracy they did in ancient times, if even then. Now these people did it back when there was no technology, and no writing. Now that's crazy.

I am only explaining anomalies as they are quite common, either ancients were unbelievably smart, helped by others (gods/aliens) or we do not understand their methods. The anomalies could be attributed to any of these, but I cannot just with blind faith attribute it to a god. Same with your holy book, amazing things and I thank you for all these, I will make sure and read it again, but the man, if only written by one man, was brilliant.

Anything else cool? Love the anomalies.

Pred...

Why is it that anytime any person from any religious (and I am including atheist in this for convenience) posts something, the topic always gets "taken over" by argumentative, hard-headed people? I think this thread is screaming Off Topic by now.

I mean seriously? The OP was just trying to say that all Christians didn't believe that May 21st was "doomsday" it was an idiotic prophecy by an idiotic man. ANYone that claims to be Christian and yet says they know when "doomsday" is, is a liar. You can SUSPECT it is coming soon and let us know about feelings of doom... but yeah...

The truth is, anytime anyone... ANYone gets into one of these, "is there a God?" arguments BOTH parties come out looking like close-minded ignoramuses. (I know, it's happened to me.) For those of you that go "hunting" for topics just so you can frustrate the other party and make them look dumb... first all, Dear god... please... get a LIFE!!!! second of all. You look just as dumb as they do!

The truth is, we all have our personal experiences and our personal convictions. You atheist are not going to convince anyone of anything aside how dedicated you are to your religion. Congrads. You Christians are normally, less educated than the atheist (whose professors carefully molded them to think like they do today AND supplied them with arguments for each and every one of yours) but that's OK... as long as you don't get into a debate. You know it, you've already said your piece in the OP or in whatever order you posted. Politely say that you disagree, tell them that God loves them, present whatever proof you have... biblically and WALK AWAY. The most you can do is plant a seed. If you think that this person is suffering from something like they were burned by a church before, focus on that. Focus on the love you have for people through your God.

I swear... I'm not on here much because A: I have this thing called a LIFE, B: I can't stand all the arguing. Just... grow up! All of you... please!

Originally posted by EvolEric
I've seen too many people on here mock Christians
over this stupid Rapture prophecy BS...

I wanna set some things strait...


Christians are not saying this... extreme fundamentalist lunatic's are...

I'm Christian... my family is Christian... we aren't saying the rapture is coming...

Jesus did not predict Sunday's Rapture...

The Bible is not saying 5-21-2011 is the Rapture


A lunatic by the name of Harold Camping did....


This is what is in the Bible says about the Rapture and the End of Time...

Mark 13:32 "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father.

Acts 1:7 He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has put in his own authority.

Mathew 24:36 "But the day and hour no one knows.not even the angels in heaven,but my Father only.

If Harold and his followers actually read the Bible...

They would know they were wrong...

Harold Camping is a false profit...

-End of Line

edit on 5/20/11 by EvolEric because: (no reason given)

I think it's interesting that Camping is an "idiot" for predicting the date of something you believe by your very faith will indeed happen some day. Is it becaus he thought he could predict the date, or that indeed something called the rapture was going to occur?

ColoradoJens