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Birthers: We Were Right. The BC is a FRAUD!!! Obama Lovers: Debunk THIS!

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posted on May, 19 2011 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by ZeroPointEnergy
As one of the few people who have also tried to reproduce these anommalies by scanning a document, I concur it is impossible to reproduce anything like the Obama certificate with out intentionally creating it with digital software.


Out of curiosity, what format would you expect from a document transferred via the internet to be displayed on your computer monitor. #2 pencil on legal 8 1/2 x 11 or perhaps india ink on 3 x 5 notecards?

Would digital software not be required to digitize a document?




posted on May, 19 2011 @ 03:12 PM
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Originally posted by ZeroPointEnergy

Originally posted by DZAG Wright
Of course the NSA and other security persons for the WH and Presidency would require the President to not submit his actual unaltered BC. If he submitted the actual document for all to see and DUPLICATE he would open himself to fraud or identity theft."
Doing what you say would also be a crime in itself.

I’m not going to comment on the theory because quite frankly I can’t endorse it, but since you made the accusation I’m curious: exactly what crime has been committed by, supposedly, digitally altering the scanned image of the birth certificate?



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 03:20 PM
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Originally posted by Drunkenparrot

Once again folks, don't take this stuff at face value as presented on youtube. Do your own research, if you don't understand some bit or another, do more research to fill in the blanks so when you step up to the plate you know of what you speak rather than quickly showing that you bought into more ignorant misinformation.


Just did some research on youtube and found some facts.... much better than face value stuff, when you have actual faces to see and hear.

My conclusion: Obama is a fraud!

What more proof do we need, Obama has a fraudulent Birth Certificate, he's from Kenya!

According to his grandmother, as well as his half-brother, half-sister and friends, Obama is from Kenya.

His grandmother


His "wife"


His friends




Obama himself


Fraudulent SS# 042-68-4425

That was easy..... and there is more.... there is no way his BC is real !!!


edit on 19-5-2011 by imitator because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 03:23 PM
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Originally posted by Drunkenparrot
Would digital software not be required to digitize a document?
He’s insinuating the whole thing was created with digital software, not just some incidental use of software like one would be required to use for scanning, like you mention.

These “forged birth certificate” birthers also, apparently, claim Adobe Illustrator was used to create this alleged forgery. I have yet to understand why Illustrator was used, since it’s not the preferable tool to do the kind of digital manipulation they’re proposing.

Maybe the forgers didn’t have Photoshop installed...



edit on 19-5-2011 by aptness because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by aptness

Originally posted by ZeroPointEnergy

Originally posted by DZAG Wright
Of course the NSA and other security persons for the WH and Presidency would require the President to not submit his actual unaltered BC. If he submitted the actual document for all to see and DUPLICATE he would open himself to fraud or identity theft."
Doing what you say would also be a crime in itself.

I’m not going to comment on the theory because quite frankly I can’t endorse it, but since you made the accusation I’m curious: exactly what crime has been committed by, supposedly, digitally altering the scanned image of the birth certificate?


For starters, you can't digitally modify a birth certificate and claim it is a true copy of the original. On top of that people have born testimony that it is a copy of the original.



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 04:01 PM
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I've used Photoshop, Illustrator, and other various editing software for just about 7 years now, and I'm currently going to school for graphic design / computer programming. Based on the article from OP, the BC looks like a fraud, and a bad one at that.. which is what shocks me most. I've forged notes/other things using Photoshop in the past, and if in fact a fraud, whoever did this one overlooked simple things.. the lettering and spacing is sloppy; the spacing especially is something that anyone with moderate experience would pay attention to.. and was one of the first(and most important) things I kept in mind. Also, how some letters dip down, while others don't.. something that could have been easily edited to match but wasn't. The color(s) of the pixels around/on some letters don't match the background, or the letter itself.. once again this could have been corrected with minimal effort. However, I never thought of checking the dots on "i", which leads me to believe that if it is a fraud, the creator may have just overlooked these small details on the assumption that people wouldn't be examining every single inch of the BC with a 500% zoom.



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by kevinrulezdood
I've used Photoshop, Illustrator, and other various editing software for just about 7 years now, and I'm currently going to school for graphic design / computer programming. Based on the article from OP, the BC looks like a fraud, and a bad one at that.. which is what shocks me most. I've forged notes/other things using Photoshop in the past, and if in fact a fraud, whoever did this one overlooked simple things.. the lettering and spacing is sloppy; the spacing especially is something that anyone with moderate experience would pay attention to.. and was one of the first(and most important) things I kept in mind. Also, how some letters dip down, while others don't.. something that could have been easily edited to match but wasn't. The color(s) of the pixels around/on some letters don't match the background, or the letter itself.. once again this could have been corrected with minimal effort. However, I never thought of checking the dots on "i", which leads me to believe that if it is a fraud, the creator may have just overlooked these small details on the assumption that people wouldn't be examining every single inch of the BC with a 500% zoom.


I agree



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 04:47 PM
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Originally posted by ZeroPointEnergy
For starters, you can't digitally modify a birth certificate and claim it is a true copy of the original.
I don’t see any statement on the White House page indicating they are claiming the PDF is a “true copy of the original.”


On top of that people have born testimony that it is a copy of the original.
If you are talking about the stamp from the state registrar, well yeah, but he certified the photocopies, not the digital file.

Again, what crime has been committed?



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 05:11 PM
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o.k., here it is: proof that the constitution says that a person has to have two american parents in order to be a 'natural born citizen', and thereby eligible to be POTUS.
In other words, Barack Obama Jr. is not eligible to be POTUS!



www.theobamafile.com...



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 05:54 PM
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Originally posted by roadtoad
o.k., here it is: proof that the constitution says that a person has to have two american parents in order to be a 'natural born citizen', and thereby eligible to be POTUS.
In other words, Barack Obama Jr. is not eligible to be POTUS!
This nonsense has been debunked numerous times.

The Supreme Court in United States v. Wong Kim Ark (1898) said that everyone born in the United States is a natural born citizen. Citing United States v. Rhodes (1866), the Court noted “[a]ll persons born in the allegiance of the King are natural-born subjects, and all persons born in the allegiance of the United States are natural-born citizens. Birth and allegiance go together. Such is the rule of the common law, and it is the common law of this country, as well as of England.

More recently, in an eligibility suit, Ankeny v. Governor of State of Indiana (2009), the Court of Appeals of Indiana said “based upon the language of Article II, Section 1, Clause 4 and the guidance provided by Wong Kim Ark, we conclude that persons born within the borders of the United States are "natural born Citizens" for Article II, Section 1 purposes, regardless of the citizenship of their parents.

This birther theory of natural born citizen, being totally unsupported by US jurisprudence, is void of any merit. Like most of their other claims, I might add.



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 05:59 PM
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Originally posted by aptness
If you are talking about the stamp from the state registrar, well yeah, but he certified the photocopies, not the digital file.


DOH is saying what was posted is a "certified copy".


On April 27, 2011 President Barack Obama posted a certified copy of his original Certificate of Live Birth.


Frequently Asked Questions about Vital Records of President Barack Hussein Obama II



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:04 PM
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Originally posted by roadtoad
o.k., here it is: proof that the constitution says that a person has to have two american parents in order to be a 'natural born citizen', and thereby eligible to be POTUS.
In other words, Barack Obama Jr. is not eligible to be POTUS!



www.theobamafile.com...


Absolutely wrong.

1 - Neither the Constitution nor US Code has defined the term - period. So any other definition is unofficial and NOT legally binding. Until (and "if") the SCOTUS does so - there is NO legal definition.

2 - Whoever put this chart together is a complete idiot.
A - Wong Van Ark concluded that even though Wong was born of two CHINESE born immigrants - his physical birth on US soil made him a US citizen. Further, in the majority opinion, Justice Gray even said the following "His father and mother were persons of Chinese descent, and subjects of the Emperor of China; they were at the time of his birth domiciled residents of the United States,..."
www.law.cornell.edu...

B - Perkins V Elg held that even though born in the US of NATURALIZED citizens - she was still a US citizen.
supreme.justia.com...

THIS is precisely why you can't rely on a blog or some web site with an agenda (like the one you selected) - you wind up looking the fool. Birthers MUST learn to do the homework necessary to intelligently argue a point rather than "just assume" that what they've been told/read is correct and fact checked.



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:09 PM
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Originally posted by aptness
The Supreme Court in United States v. Wong Kim Ark (1898) said that everyone born in the United States is a natural born citizen. Citing United States v. Rhodes (1866), the Court noted “[a]ll persons born in the allegiance of the King are natural-born subjects, and all persons born in the allegiance of the United States are natural-born citizens. Birth and allegiance go together. Such is the rule of the common law, and it is the common law of this country, as well as of England.


Which is yet another example of why the birther argument about Vattel being the definitional basis for "natural born" is pure crap. Thank you for posting that decision.



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:17 PM
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Originally posted by userid1

Originally posted by roadtoad
o.k., here it is: proof that the constitution says that a person has to have two american parents in order to be a 'natural born citizen', and thereby eligible to be POTUS.
In other words, Barack Obama Jr. is not eligible to be POTUS!



www.theobamafile.com...


Absolutely wrong.

1 - Neither the Constitution nor US Code has defined the term - period. So any other definition is unofficial and NOT legally binding. Until (and "if") the SCOTUS does so - there is NO legal definition.

2 - Whoever put this chart together is a complete idiot.
A - Wong Van Ark concluded that even though Wong was born of two CHINESE born immigrants - his physical birth on US soil made him a US citizen. Further, in the majority opinion, Justice Gray even said the following "His father and mother were persons of Chinese descent, and subjects of the Emperor of China; they were at the time of his birth domiciled residents of the United States,..."
www.law.cornell.edu...

B - Perkins V Elg held that even though born in the US of NATURALIZED citizens - she was still a US citizen.
supreme.justia.com...

THIS is precisely why you can't rely on a blog or some web site with an agenda (like the one you selected) - you wind up looking the fool. Birthers MUST learn to do the homework necessary to intelligently argue a point rather than "just assume" that what they've been told/read is correct and fact checked.


All it is is a shameful excuse to deny a black man the chance to assume the highest office in the land by twisting our laws and code to suit their agenda. That is why all this boils down to is blatant racism while hiding behind lies and rhetoric as every single time we are able to hit back firmly on facts they want to attack, belittle and have the audacity that we are somehow "Anti American".



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:17 PM
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Originally posted by Elbereth
DOH is saying what was posted is a "certified copy".
The Department of Health vouching for what is posted on the White House page should settle the question, if there was still any, for any sane person. I believe, IIRC, that it settled it for you.

But it won’t convince the hardcore birthers, that believe the Department of Health is in on the conspiracy. But if the DOH is in on the conspiracy and is vouching for “an amateurish forgery,” as they believe, then there is nothing the DOH can do or release that will convince them.

It’s clear the birthers, at this point, will only be convinced by one document: a Kenyan birth certificate for Barack Obama. Since such document doesn’t exist, they will keep believing this nonsense and fantasizing about massive conspiracies until the end of days.

I’m fine with that



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:18 PM
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reply to post by aptness
 


"minds are like parachutes. They work better when open."



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:22 PM
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Hes a fraud...a creation...someone made to fill a particular place at a particular time to do a particular job...then he will go away and be taken care of for the rest of his life....his handler is the mrs...shes as crooked as he is
edit on 5/19/2011 by Homedawg because: sp



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:23 PM
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reply to post by imitator
 


Still pushing the Barry Soetoro nonsense aren't we? My, my.

There is no person by the name of Barack Soetoro so your credibility is instantly trashed and shredded.



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:23 PM
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Originally posted by Homedawg
Hes a fraud...a creation...someone made to fill a particular place at a particular time to do a paricular job...then he will go away and be taken care of for the rest of his life....


Tell us how you truly feel and please don't hold back!



posted on May, 19 2011 @ 06:27 PM
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Originally posted by Lono1
"minds are like parachutes. They work better when open."
My mind is open. Convince me Obama wasn’t born in the United States. Don’t tell me fairy tales and conjecture about “Marxist conspiracies,” show me the documents. Where is the documentation to support the theory that Barack Obama was not born in the United States?


Originally posted by imitator
His "wife"
You’re embarrassing yourself.



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