It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
it condones fighting only in self defence and martyrdom only when it's involuntary
merely the way certain people misrepresent it.
There were hundreds of thousands of refugees from Israel, whether they arrived there 20 years before they were displaced or 1000 years before they were displaced is a non-issue. Of course this is all history and cannot be undone, but it's because of this history that it's important that people don't just ignore the genuine grievences of the Palestinians or simply attribute any outrageous act committed against Israel as 'religious extremism' considering the complex history of the region.
Ummm.. What on earth are you talkin about? Do all threads which discuss Palestinians have to tie exactly into the Israel-Palestine conflict? This merely points out that in PALESTINE - and NOT IN AMERICA, OR EUROPE, ie; in a western paradigm, where the Muslims you regard as normal are not subject to the Islamic paradigm, being that they live in a non-muslim country, and so accordint to Islamic jurisprudence are NOT supposed to be friendly towards non-Muslims, or, at the very least, are following a different Islam that the VAST MAJORITY of muslims, living in Muslim countries follow - theres an incredibly fanatical and radical hatred for Jews, where mention of a horrendous massacre of Jews 80 years earlier evokes Arab pride and glory, as opposed to regret and shame. .............
at the very least, are following a different Islam that the VAST MAJORITY of muslims, living in Muslim countries follow - theres an incredibly fanatical and radical hatred for Jews, where mention of a horrendous massacre of Jews 80 years earlier evokes Arab pride and glory, as opposed to regret and shame
You merely reiterate the views on CNN of "Islam is a religion of peace"...
So because he is a Shi'te, his views apply specifically to Israels Northern enemy, Hizbollah, who of course are Shi'te.
Seriously.. What is fear mongering about quoting Ayotollah Khomeni - a major figure in Shi'te Islam, or Yusuf Al Qaradawi, a major cleric who has A SHOW ON AL JAZEERA? Are you INSANE!? Seriously. Im simply quoting verbatim their words and saying, " Do you see...Islam does not intend peace! as we are told by the Media". These are THEIR WORDS.
Have you ever lived in an Islamic country? How may muslims have you actually invited into your home, shared food with ect? - These radical views are not retained by the majority of Muslims. Infact I would go as far to say that the majority of Shia don't retain such views. Provide me hard evidence that the majority of muslims are violent, anti-Semteic extremists.
b) You merely reiterate FOX news "Muslims are crazy and Islam is evil"
) I'm not saying Islam is a religion of peace, I'm saying the majority of devote and moderate Muslims (many being Shia) who have lived in Middle Eastern countries do no retain the extremist views you claim most do
you know those settlers that kill, intimidate and hate Muslims?
I'm sure you have read the Old Testament - You can easily conclude that there are a multitude of violent passages.
didn't state that quoting Khomeine was fear mongering I'm saying your demonization of the Arab, Muslim and Shia people is. You continuously claim the vast majority are violent without providing proof other then a few individuals speaking for themselves. I don't quote a solitude Jew and state that this is the way all Jews think becuase it is untrue, yet you quote a single Muslim and state that this is how all muslims think.
Look at this thread or at filosophias post. He has a weird compulsion to justify everythng the Arabs do and criticize th zionists
Get a Clue. You SHOULD NOT forget. Your memory of the past prevents this evil from occurring again.
A distinct group of people gleefully butchering, raping, and burning people alive only 09 years ago and you say, "so what" and then "with respect." You have no respect for people.
Being Jewish is not a title to be dropped or picked up as one chooses to follow or abandon a particular narrative
I am a Jew. More than that, I am an Israeli. More than that, I've served in the IDF in a combat role.
Do we condemn the entire validity of a peace process, or coexistence, for the actions of a few radicals? For the actions of many radicals? For acts that happened during our grandparents' 20's?
Or should I simply dislike those that hate Jews for no apparent reason?
Originally posted by dontreally
My point was: is it worth the turmoil that goes along with it? Do you really believe that 'forgetting' will solve the problems of anti-semitism? Like i said, that scheme has already been played out, and look at how it ended up. Germany, Poland, Austria, France, Hungry etc Jews were very assimilated, especially in Germany, and Warsaw, Budapest, Vienna.....These Jews kept the "Jew" title, as you do, discarded the religion, as you do, and chose to forget their painful past, as you do... Whats the difference between you and them?
I appreciate your stubborn insistence on keeping the "Jew" title. If i wanted, i could become a Jew through conversion. Do you believe that? Do you understand how being Jewish is MORE than just an ethnic distinction?
Have you read anything about Islam? do you get why i continue to bring this subject up?
Whos talking about hating gentiles? IM A GENTILE. I speak to you as Gentile. I am apart of this community. I love all people, Jew or Gentile. But i am also very realistic about what threatens the existece of the Jewish people. I care for the Jews because i have grown knowledgeable in their Torah, and the Kabbalah, and so i care to apply my political knowledge (i go to school for this) in defence of Israel, the Jewish people and Judaism.
The Arabs who lived in the interim were simply tenants. Now the original owners are back, as the Hebrew Bible SAID they would. Its not like their return was random.. it was was predicted, now they must go. Its that Simple.
dontreally, I don't really think you're at all interested in stopping antisemitism. In fact, as you are a gentile who pretends to be Jewish with alarming frequency, and uses that claim to justify your own hatreds, ignorance, and vitriol, along with a severely ill-educated version of Jewish history, you're pretty antisemitic yourself - granted, it's probably unintentional.
this is why the neo-nazi sorts keep blaming everything on "Jewish conspiracies" while the zionist sorts keep asserting that literally everything is "anti-semitism."
Might want to tell Eliad that, by your unquestionable standards, he's actually not a Jew, and by your own arguments, he should be driven from his nation as a criminal and an imposter.
I'll bet Eliad probably has more experience with Islam than "reading about it." I know I do. You clearly don't. And you continue to bring the subject up because you think it makes you cool, just like how you think pretending to be a Jew grants you immunity for your hatred of Muslims.
In other words, you're to Judaism what these guys are to the Chicago bears:
Hate to break it to you, but nothing in this day and age actually threatens the existence of the Jewish people; hell, even the Nazis were only a threat to the Jews of Central and Western Europe. If you meant Israel, well, that's a vastly different thing from "The Jewish People." And the biggest threat to Israel is its own policies and its continued support by America's apocalyptic death cultists
Does the situation you just spoke make a single lick of sense, in this new context? I don't think it would, since your argument hinges on a deed granted by god, preserved only in the handwriting of thepeople who supposedly recieved it. Would a deed you wrote for yourself stand up in a court of law anywhere? Probably not, right?
Wow.. You seriously have no comprehenson of human behavior, politics etc... Do you get that a person like Khomeni projects power and authority? Do you know how many deeply relgious shi'ite regard him as a latter day prophet? His words are not the words of just "one" muslim. His words represent the belief of millions, becaue his words unlike the words of som pauper, are heard and respected, just like in school on reveres the words of his teacher, or any person he learns from. This is how human beings function.
In the Islamic Republic the rights of the religious minorities are respectfully regarded.
Interview for Austrian television, Paris, (6 November 1978), as quoted in "Democracy? I meant theocracy — The most truthful individual in recent history" by Dr. Jalal Matini,and Farhad Mafie, in The Iranian (5 August 2003)
Personal desire, age, and my health do not allow me to personally have a role in running the country after the fall of the current system.
Associated Press interview in Paris (7 November 1978); repeated on several occasions before Khomeini returned to Iran
In Iran's future Islamic system everyone can express their opinion, and the Islamic government will respond to logic with logic.
Speech (9 November 1978), as quoted in The Most Truthful Individual in Recent History" in Iranshenasi, Vol. XIV, No. 4 (Winter 2003), as translated by Farhad Mafie
In the Islamic government all people have complete freedom to have any kind of opinion.
Interview with Human Rights Watch, Paris (10 November 1978)
After the Shah's departure from Iran, I will not become a president nor accept any other leadership role. Just like before, I limit my activities only to guiding and directing the people.
Le Monde interview in Paris (9 January 1979)
And that is it. Other than the WARS - since they were wars, between the kings of canaan and Israel, the Jews have not fought any wars of expansion...Their history is quite pacific compared to Islam and their crusades in North Africa, Central Asia and India (where they killed millions)....
If i wanted, i could become a Jew through conversion. Do you believe that?
Have you read anything about Islam? do you get why i continue to bring this subject up?
Why in the first place should Israel and the Jews concede? Why should they give up Judea and Samaria, when those are the heart and soul of the land of Israel? Why cant they settle in any of their 22 states? Why cant Saudi Arabia, or Iraq, Syria, etc take them in? Israel, is NOT their land. Only 30,000 of them lived in the Jewish settled areas, first of all, but more importantly, the Hebrew Bible, the ancient, glorious backbone of western civilization ANTICIPATED what is happening today. The Arabs who lived in the interim were simply tenants. Now the original owners are back, as the Hebrew Bible SAID they would. Its not like their return was random.. it was was predicted, now they must go. Its that Simple.
However to say that he speaks for the majority of Muslims is falsehood.
Every Persian I have met has denounced Khomeini and Khameini.
The last true exansionist Muslim empire were the Ottomons. Look who else had colonies at the time.
England, France, Russia and Germany. Why aren't you stating that all white people and all Christians are violent murdering barbarians?
The more modern a society is, the less it take religion to the extreme.
There are hundreds of millions who reject democracy, womens rights, homosexual rights.. These are based in WESTERN PHILOSOPHY and NOT Islamic theology.
Why do you think there was a succesful uprising in Iran? Because there were enough religious muslims who hated the depravity - what you call 'progress' - of western values....Why would the Muslim Brotherhood be tied in the polls in Egypt for the election in september? Ask yourself that question. Mubarak whether you like him or not was a 'pro western' secrulatist. Not a religious Muslim.
How is this so hard for you to understand?
But those muslims who do not do not because it is literally an accepted Muslim belief that non-believers should not be befriended. And if you do meet their acquaintance, they will be careful with what they say around you, because simply put: youre not Muslim and you do not understand the purpose or depth of Islam.
I KNOW Settlers.. If you even knew whom some of these people were you wouldnt be able to distinguish them from ordinary american youth
To be fair, Persians who leave Iran probably hate the religious atmosphere in the country.
The greatest muslim expansion occurred between 680 CE and 1100 CE. You should look up there history and campaigns in North Africa, Armenia (which was absolutely brutal), India, and the Balkans, amongst other places