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WANTED 1 intelligent educated Christian to answer some questions on faith

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posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:29 PM
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reply to post by BlackStar99
 


That didn't explain where you got that from...

Just because jesus is the base of Christianity you believe it explains how you came to that conclusion about buddhists...

Still confused





posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:30 PM
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reply to post by IkNOwSTuff
 



I see alot of religious threads on the site and alot more threads that have nothing to do with religion and yet still have posts by people preaching in them and its very rare any of it will be what I would call intelligent.


Yeah... stopped reading right there^.

Can you rephrase your post in a way that's not prejudicial and arbitrary in it's construction?



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:34 PM
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"Reall deep sigh"........... I don't know why I engage in these discussions..... I must be gluttonous for irritation.

Anyway... Here goes:

OP, I'm hoping I am either reading your post incorrectly or your not intentionally meaning to insult an entire community. I do know many very intelligent christians. The fact is, the reasons for many to believe are various...but.. we should all agree on the fact that it is a FAITH. Thus hidden in the contrived word "faith" it is understood that the belief is not held on absolute proof and certain ideas must be assumed due to the largely known fact the bible has been translated, interpolated, and manipulated thousands of times. Not to mention, the translations are being done from a few ancient languages to modern language. So I could argue til I am blue in the face about contradictions but the reality is there will never be a definitive decisions on that. What I am here to offer is the history of the council of nicea since it seems many have no idea what it was.

To the poster that said definitevly that it had to do with catholicism. Catholocism was a very minor part in the council of nicea and the subsequent councils that took place. The political/social/economic nature of the time was in peril due to the battling factions of christianity.The fact is each sect of christianity were battling mainly over the divinity of the christ. See many of the debates that take place now, were being fought over then as well. Many believed jesus was the christ, others believed it was a consciousness, others thought he had lived but died, other believed he never existed, others thought there were two jesus', and only one died on the cross.... (you see where I am going). Since no one could agree and each sect was trying to kill the other, Constantine (a pagan) decided to hold council and have a group of elders see over the teachings and finalize what they would consider cananized biblical text so that it would stop the fighting and there could be order once again. There were a few councils after this all the way up to the 8th century. With each council, things changed, either being added or subtracted (many times done so due to the current political climate of the time.....why reincarnation is no longer in the bible).

So with my rambling... keep it respectful everyone. There are many reasons why people believe and what they believe. Doesn't mean anyone is less intelligent than the other. Quite frankly, none of us have any room to say who is wrong or not because........none of us have any clue what the heck is going on here.



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:36 PM
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reply to post by UnknownPhilosopher
 


Actually reincarnation is still in the bible, though its hard to find..




posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:39 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by UnknownPhilosopher
 


Actually reincarnation is still in the bible, though its hard to find..



True. Not as openly stated and accepted as it once was tho.



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:41 PM
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reply to post by llwormwood843ll
 



Hey there thanks for replying,

IQ Im referring to is the measurement of reasoning and deduction not just book smarts. You can know feck all and still be intelligent. Likewise I know many people who know lots but are dumb as Sh!t. But its true, most (once again MOST not ALL) serious religious types average around 110 for IQ and very few (proportionately)have degrees or higher education.

1) arent you curious about the origins of the rituals you practice or how and why bible came to be?

2) jesus last words, there is no way that can be brought down to typo's or mistranslations

3)Cool

4)fair statement

5) I would like to believe thats true

What do I believe, I definately dont fit into any recognised group. I would describe myself as being spiritual as opposed to religious. I believe in reincarnation and that life is a learning experience, I believe before we go back to the universal conciousness (God) we have to experience everything over many lifetimes and when theres nothing left to learn we go back.

Its actually really hard to summarise what I believe but id be happy to answer any specific questions for you as you were good enough to do so for me



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by Lionhearte
reply to post by BlackStar99
 

This one?

How about the biggest one? That is; God is supposedly a loving God, but would send the Christian pedophile to heaven and for the Buddhist man who devoted his entire life to spreading love and peace? Straight to hell to be tortured for all of eternity...


It isn't a contradiction by any means. For starters, I'll lay out the basics of Christianity for you, it's quite simple, actually: If you believe in Jesus, and that he died so you can be forgiven of all your sins, past, present and future, then you can go to Heaven when you die.

All sins are forgivable - except one (which usually pops up as a "contradiction"), and that is, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. This isn't a contradiction so much, actually, it's basically just an obvious punishment:

To be forgiven, you must accept the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit - to reject the Holy Spirit, means you reject forgiveness - so your sin cannot be forgiven. This doesn't mean permanently though, if you later accept the Holy Spirit, it doesn't count.

Now, IF this so called Pedophile truly feels bad in his heart for what he has done, and he accepts Jesus, he IS going to heaven. However, if he just says "I'm a Christian" and continues to rape little kids, he ISN'T going to Heaven. Forgiveness is a powerful thing, us Humans have a hard time with it.


So if Christians don't 'feel bad' about their sins they don't go heaven? You realize that would only be about 2% of Christians?



Now, the Buddhist, spreading peace and love and all that, ISN'T perfect, no matter how good he is, he has committed at least one sin in his life, and that alone would keep him out of Heaven, if not for the fact he choose to reject the Holy Spirit as well - the unforgivable sin.


So you're okay worshipping a god who's sent and is sending billions of wonderful people to be tortured forever? If it turns out Christianity was the right religion, I wouldn't want to spend eternity in 'heaven' with that sociopath.

edit on 15-5-2011 by BlackStar99 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:42 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by UnknownPhilosopher
 


Actually reincarnation is still in the bible, though its hard to find..



No, it's not. Hebrews 9:27 specifically refutes the heresy of reincarnation.

"And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,"



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:44 PM
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Originally posted by IkNOwSTuff
reply to post by AdamsMurmur
 


Thanks for replying

1)true true, its reaaly surprising how many christians havent even heard of it let alone know what went on. Thjumbs up for you


2)HOLY SH!T!!!!! you actually know what your talking about

3) OK now Im suss
are you really a christian?

4) to anyone who despaired of ever finding an intelligent christian, I think we have a winner

5)Beautifully put dude!!!

Well there you go, I thought it would take alot longer but I knew Id get there in the end. So what makes you a christian as opposed to a buddhist etc it doesnt seem like you really believe in the christian dogma so how and why do you define yourself as one?


Your welcome.

I guess I would define myself as a "Gnostic Christian", which comes from the Greek word gnosis, meaning knowledge, and this seems to be what Christ actually taught to the apostles. But I don't really like the idea of labels and borders, so sometimes I just say, "I'm someone who believes in the Spirit (or the Father)." Jesus never called himself by any specific term, for example. The Christian church came about a few hundred years after he left the Earth.

The main thing to keep in mind is that the truth, that knowledge, can only be truly found from within, because it's within you that you are able to be connected to God. It was just that Jesus' words are what came to me initially, and I stuck with it and always will, but I am open to other teachings and words as well because what other faiths can teach may help to fill in any gaps. When you look at other religions, you'll see they are mostly similar, so why can't we all get along? I wasn't open to them before, I was more of a typical Christian (although I was tolerant of them for the most part and respected other religions to a certain extent), but I learned that not fully accepting others leaves room to go against the primary teaching of Christ, and that is to love others equally and "do unto others as you would have done unto you." So I try to act in that way. It's not always easy, I'm still learning myself, but it will only get easier now that I opened that door.

Indeed, as I learn more of Jesus' teachings and truly think upon them, I'm finding how similar it is to Buddhism. Even some of Jesus' hand gestures in artwork are considered mudras.
It's fascinating.
edit on 15/5/11 by AdamsMurmur because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:46 PM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by UnknownPhilosopher
 


Actually reincarnation is still in the bible, though its hard to find..



No, it's not. Hebrews 9:27 specifically refutes the heresy of reincarnation.

"And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,"



Uhm, no it doesn't say that at all....it says...

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment

It does not say Men die once........... It says once they die then its judgement time.




posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:47 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm interested in your explanation of why Jesus said John the baptist was the second coming of Elijah. Stating this multiple times to his disciples.



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:47 PM
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Originally posted by Rustami
reply to post by BlackStar99
 


there is absolutely no doubt, just like the couple of living witnesses accounts along with newspaper on the recent FTW "lights" phenomenon-


Most assuredly, I say to you, the hour is coming, and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God; and those who hear will live.

the King eternal, immortal, invisible

for an angel of the Lord descended from heaven, and came and rolled back the stone from the door, and sat on it. His countenance was like lightning, and his clothing as white as snow

but with wings

And the cherubims shall stretch forth their wings

I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.-biblegateay.com

edit on 15-5-2011 by Rustami because: (no reason given)


Sorry but I cant tell if you were sincere or sarcastic with that post, do you believe what their saying or do you think its a crock?



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:53 PM
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Originally posted by UnknownPhilosopher
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm interested in your explanation of why Jesus said John the baptist was the second coming of Elijah. Stating this multiple times to his disciples.
Aye. John the Baptist was Elijah, and it states that in Matthew 17:

11Jesus replied, “To be sure, Elijah comes and will restore all things. 12But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.” 13Then the disciples understood that he was talking to them about John the Baptist.



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:55 PM
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Originally posted by UnknownPhilosopher
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm interested in your explanation of why Jesus said John the baptist was the second coming of Elijah. Stating this multiple times to his disciples.


Can you show me where in the OT Elijah died?

Secondly, When people asked John if he was Elijah he correctly told them no. John had the same anointing as Elijah. The Elijah that was raptured in the OT will return during the tribulation and is one of the two witnesses in Israel.



posted on May, 15 2011 @ 11:56 PM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Ive stated several times throughout the thread that its my personal belief based on what Ive experienced in my dealings with any IsmISTs (group term for followers of any organised religion).

I also stated that it was MOST and not ALL christians who fit into the stupid catergory.

Something else I forgot to mention is religious nuts tend to get easily offended. IMHO the vast majority of posts that have a religious slant to them are so far removed from intelligence that your actually slightly dumber aftter reading them. But thats just my opinion and it shouldnt offend anyone especially if its not directed at anyone in particular.

Thanks for reading as much as you did but I want be changing anything

Cheers



posted on May, 16 2011 @ 12:00 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by UnknownPhilosopher
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm interested in your explanation of why Jesus said John the baptist was the second coming of Elijah. Stating this multiple times to his disciples.


Can you show me where in the OT Elijah died?

Secondly, When people asked John if he was Elijah he correctly told them no. John had the same anointing as Elijah. The Elijah that was raptured in the OT will return during the tribulation and is one of the two witnesses in Israel.


I don't see why that matters, the OT was written a long time before the NT....clearly Elijah was dead.

And would you mind posting that passage where they ask john if he is Elijah?

ty




posted on May, 16 2011 @ 12:00 AM
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reply to post by Akragon
 



Uhm, no it doesn't say that at all....it says...

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment

It does not say Men die once........... It says once they die then its judgement time.


I'm not certain if your joking or not...

That's exactly the same thing. Once a person dies they are judged.

But that's irrelevant. Do a Greek word-study on 9:27 and that's precisely what it says. All men are appointed once to die, and after this (the "this" refers to them dying) they are judged.



posted on May, 16 2011 @ 12:02 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by UnknownPhilosopher
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm interested in your explanation of why Jesus said John the baptist was the second coming of Elijah. Stating this multiple times to his disciples.


Can you show me where in the OT Elijah died?

Secondly, When people asked John if he was Elijah he correctly told them no. John had the same anointing as Elijah. The Elijah that was raptured in the OT will return during the tribulation and is one of the two witnesses in Israel.


So in other words.... Jesus was full of it. He told his disciples that didn't he?. Or.... is that the first contradiction. Uh oh.



posted on May, 16 2011 @ 12:02 AM
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reply to post by IkNOwSTuff
 




I also stated that it was MOST and not ALL christians who fit into the stupid catergory


"Catergory" is not a word. And secondly, do you even understand the word "arbitrary"?



posted on May, 16 2011 @ 12:04 AM
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reply to post by UnknownPhilosopher
 


John merely had the same anointing to herald the advent of the Messiah. Neither Jesus or John were lying.

Answer my question, when did Elijah die?



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