This Forum Should Be Closed Down !

reply to post by Bildo


YOU should know better, with your experience!!

Go to carnicom.com.

"Cliff Carnicorn" is one of the HOAX spreaders!! He has a financial interest in it.

You, of all people should realize that everything on that site is a lie.

.

When a jet turns sharply it can leave a contrail off the wingtips that dissappears almost immediately. That's condensation.

Yes. Well known phenomenon. It IS transient, because it evaporates back to vapor state quickly, due to the method of initial formation.

If it sticks around that is not a condensate.

YES it is!! (Hint: We also call those "clouds". Do you deny that clouds can "stick around"? Are clouds not condensed water? Or, in the case of CIRRUS clouds, condensed out ice crystals??)

Engine exhaust is very hot.

Yes, of course. Know what else is there???

Hot and cold mix. You get condensation.

Oversimplified, but yes. Know what else is added, to the existing moisture content of the air??

But it DOES NOT stick around for hours.

Really? Then, what is a cloud???

reply to post by Bildo


Perhaps contrails stay in the same place because multiple flights take the same route re-inforcing the same trail.

Ahh, right on cue. The KC-10 video, along with another chemtrail video that uses every debunked and explained photo there is. Even the preview pic for it, is a photo from CG testing with the water barrels.

Originally posted by Bildo
reply to post by Uncinus

 

There is such a site. Go to carnicom.com.

Do you think that everything on carnicom.com is true?

reply to post by SaberTruth


Because they don't. I'm not making up a fact about photography for the sake of saving you the time it takes to scan, the truth is that it isn't viable evidence if your argument is "the colors in this photo look different than the colors outside today." If you do a two second search on the internet, you will find many reasons for the deterioration of photographs, here is a chunk from wikipedia that lists some:

"Factors
Numerous factors can deteriorate and even destroy photographs. Some examples include:
High temperature and high relative humidity (RH)
Air pollution and dirt
Light exposure
Biological threats such as fungi and insects
Residual processing chemicals
Base and emulsion deterioration
Handling and usage
Improper storage and enclosures
Three signs of age that affect color photography are:
Dark fading occurs regardless of the procedures taken to preserve a photograph and is unavoidable. It is instigated by temperature and RH. Cyan dyes will typically fade more quickly, which will make the image appear too red in color.
Light fading occurs when materials are exposed to light, e.g. while on display. The intensity of the light source and ultraviolet (UV) rays will affect the rate of change and fade. Magenta dyes will typically fade the quickest.
Highlight staining occurs with older color photographic papers, and is a yellowing of the border and highlight areas of a photograph."

Originally posted by Adyta
If any forum should be shut down, it's the dream / prediction forum. Nobody cares that you had a dream Obama was from another planet and he is secretly pilfering this planet of it's sea salts.

It's such an absurd forum.

What good is it to completely shut down a forum? There are people that genuinely want to have a discussion in those forums, even if you don't believe what they're discussing. I always thought that was the best part of ATS. No matter how ridiculous or absurd the story, you'll probably at least find one person on here that you can actually have a proper discussion with and share your ideas.

They have a right to post their views... just as you have the right to avoid the forum altogether if its not "your thing". The problem comes from people bashing other people's views... not the forum's themselves.

Even if most, if not all, predictions don't come true, or even if we're not having chemicals sprayed on us on a daily basis, I'll vigorously defend someone's right to have and post their opinion. Who are we to say they're not allowed to talk about a subject that's dear to them?

Regardless of how ridiculous a post is, I'll read it for the simple fact that it's fascinating to me that someone actually has that point of view. If the only thing I can add to the conversation is to call them a nutjob, well, I'll swallow my pride and keep it to myself because there's absolutely nothing constructive in my doing so. Who knows, too... maybe in the end I'm the nutjob for not believing them in the first place.

It's kind of sad that it's come to this, really. I'm sure we all have some crazy views about one thing or another. It would be nice if there was a little more acceptance and less personal attacks.

reply to post by Uncinus


So if you think chemtrails are fake..then why do you visit this thread??? To try to prove people wrong to make you feel good, or to harrass people with a belief?????

Originally posted by Uncinus

Originally posted by auraelium
How can the denial wingnuts consistently deny the fact of chemtrails when it is one of the few conspiracy topics where there is actual physical proof?

There are Aliminium levels being found in mountain top snow around the globe which is containing Aluminium levels 10's of thousands and in some cases 100's of thousands of times above normal levels which should be close to zero. and also elevated barium levels. Levels of these metals are being found that are off the scale.

Do you disagree with any of the following statements?

Dirt is 7% aluminum.

The samples were taken in summer

So the snow would have dirt on it.

Hence it would have aluminum in it.

Hence the test results are meaningless

ref:
contrailscience.com...

(and if you see something wrong in the reference, please point it out)

Edit: here's the one lab report for a mountain-top sample.
contrailscience.com...

edit on 13-5-2011 by Uncinus because: (no reason given)

yes i do...

dirt is 7% alluminium?` pretty broad statement. Dirt from where? your saying all soil has 7% alluminium? i think you need to go check that out.

So snow would have dirt in it.... Yes it should have minute particles of dust and possibly some particles of alluminium. 1200 times above normal no.. im afraid not.

You argument is that there should be trace amounts of alluminium in mountain snow. but your still not explaining why these samples are 1200 times above normal.

There is to much evidence for it to be a complete hoax, I've never seen red water clouds for instance, some pretty funky water in them water barrels.

reply to post by Lost in america


for the same reason you insist they are real-- for the good of enlightenment.

reply to post by Lost in america


I debunk. It's a hobby. More details here:

metabunk.org...

reply to post by auraelium


Would it be possible to link us to an actual study? It's kind of hard to find fault with your broad interpretation of the results.

Originally posted by v0ice0freas0n
reply to post by auraelium

 

Would it be possible to link us to an actual study? It's kind of hard to find fault with your broad interpretation of the results.

I'm presuming it's this one:
contrailscience.com...

I've been interested in Chemtrails for a long time. I take pictures of them all the time. Us who have concerns and interest, and do the research shouldn't in my opinion, argue with people who don't agree. I think it is a waste of time. There will come along those who get it, spend time sharing with them. I used to get so mad trying to "prove" things to people that would argue, but ... I realized after a long time that they really weren't interested in whatever subject, like chemtrails, they were interested in arguing. I think this is a great thread! Don't shut it down over debate, just don't respond to debates that aren't sincere I saw a great video on youtube entitled,
"What in the world are they spraying" For those who are truly interested if you haven't seen it, check it out! I personally, am mostly drawn to "them" dumbing down society. Maybe so the young can rule the world?

reply to post by v0ice0freas0n


You have a belief , and I have mine.. I would love to look stupid if this is proven wrong, cause there is no poisons.... BUT... how will you feel if we are right....

This is a response to unsinus...sorry voice clicked wrong reply....

Originally posted by v0ice0freas0n
Because they don't. I'm not making up a fact about photography for the sake of saving you the time it takes to scan, the truth is that it isn't viable evidence if your argument is "the colors in this photo look different than the colors outside today." If you do a two second search on the internet, you will find many reasons for the deterioration of photographs, here is a chunk from wikipedia that lists some:

I never said your info was wrong. The point, one more time, is why the continued demands that I produce photos when they are already to be rejected. Why ask for photos when you know they won't prove anything to you? That's my point. I've said it every whichway I can think of.

reply to post by Lost in america


I certainly think you are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine. As you try and provide me with more evidence, share with me what changed your mind, it is natural for me to do the same. Somewhere in the back of my head does there lie some piece of me that fears this could be real? Of course, and how easy would it be to indulge that?

I'm waiting to see any study showing any negative effects. Not that you may have seen a contrail last to long, not that you have measured the levels and they are off, but that there has been an actual epidemiological effect in the population that you can attribute to "chemtrails." If the government is doing this, it must be effective, right? Okay, what effect has it had? Have the rates of certain diseases gone up in areas considered to be chemtrail heavy?

This is quite interesting,

There is a chemical called Strontium Barium Niobate -- this has been proven to be found in Chemtrails, also, this has been proven to be able to generate 3-D images.

Using Strontium Barium Niobate for 3-D Images

There is an Army Research Laboratory document titled "3-D Holographic Display Using Strontium Barium Niobate (1998)" which can be found at this location:

3-D Holographic Display Using Strontium Barium Niobate (1998) (handle.dtic.mil...)

Here is the abstract from that page:

An innovative technique for generating a three dimensional holographic display using strontium barium niobate (SBN) is discussed. The resultant image is a hologram that can be viewed in real time over a wide perspective or field of view (FOV). The holographic image is free from system-induced aberrations and has a uniform, high quality over the entire FOV. The enhanced image quality results from using a phase conjugate read beam generated from a second photorefractive crystal acting as a double pumped phase conjugate mirror (DPPCM). Multiple three dimensional images have been stored in the crystal via wavelength multiplexing.

What strikes me right away about this is "ARMY RESEARCH LAB ADELPHI MD" and "Defense Technical Information Center"
With this originating from the above sources, this is being researched as a Defense project...?

Using Strontium Barium Niobate in Chemtrails

The following youtube news broadcast has been removed from:
www.youtube.com...

Here are the two links to the documents shown in that news report:

Kucinich, Chemtrails and HR 2977 (contrailscience.com...)

HR 2977 (thomas.loc.gov...:H.R.2977.IH


chemtrails and holographic technology

Originally posted by auraelium

yes i do...

dirt is 7% alluminium?` pretty broad statement. Dirt from where? your saying all soil has 7% alluminium? i think you need to go check that out.

So snow would have dirt in it.... Yes it should have minute particles of dust and possibly some particles of alluminium. 1200 times above normal no.. im afraid not.

You argument is that there should be trace amounts of alluminium in mountain snow. but your still not explaining why these samples are 1200 times above normal.

Yes on average, the earths crust is around 7.5 percent Aluminum by weight. you will find it in most any soil, or dust sample.

There is no proof of anything 1200 times normal.

reply to post by SaberTruth


Ah! And now you've said it in a concise, grammatically correct manner that I can follow. Glad we're on the same page. I hope you the best of existences before the evil chemtrails kill you.