A personal Gun story you won't see on the news!!

Originally posted by AwakeinNM

Originally posted by emptyOmind
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

i'm glad that you and your wife are ok. personally i think carrying a gun is pretty dangerous. i understand people want to protect themselves but for one, you flipped the safety off before you had even assessed the situation.. seems like overkill. i mean you're ready to shoot/stab someone before you even know what's going on. i'm not saying they didn't have some very bad intentions but.. i'd like to offer another scenario, what if they were just hillbillies wantin to do some fishing..? you said yourself your wife attracts a lot of attention.. maybe they were going to hit on her since they didn't see you, then you show up, the one looks away because he's intimidate/scared, and the old lady's looking for a weapon (or maybe about to get some chairs or the cooler out) because you are a big dude with a motorcycle and she thinks you are about to beat up her kids/grandkids (not saying your wrong or anything just offering another view). think about cops, who head into a reported crime scene, unclip their guns, and then they hear some scuffling turn to see someone raise their hand, and then they shoot a kid. if you go around with your pistol in your pocket flippin the safety off whenever there is trouble then you will shoot someone eventually. even if you had fought those guys, it's pretty dangerous to be wrestling around with your gun off safety (i'm assuming you already had a bullet in the chamber) and your knife ready to spring open, that's a good way to shoot and/or stab yourself. and don't take it personally, i'm not trying to make enemies with a mod, but it seems to me like you are promoting this tough guy image of yourself, you shouldn't be encouraging people on this forum to carry guns.. because even if you are tough enough, safe enough, licensed enough whatever to carry a gun, that doesn't mean other people are (people are killed everyday over simple misunderstandings because somebody pulls out some weapon or equalizer). guns serve a purpose, i own a gun as well, but i don't keep it on my person.

just sayin

Anyone else think the OP is painting himself to be a "tough guy"? I didn't read that into his post whatsoever.

Guns are only dangerous when you don't know how to use them, chief. Kinda like getting on a rice rocket with no riding experience. Down you go. Snapping off the safety is smart, ESPECIALLY since he "didn't know what was going on". What if those rednecks were armed? What if they drew on him? Shootings last seconds, in most cases there is no time to think, just react. Taking the safety off could mean the difference between life and death. What if he left the safety engaged and cletus took a step forward and roundhoused him with a toad sticker into his neck while he was fumbling to get the safety off? Would want any overkill, right? Better the bad guy lives and the good guy dies. That's the outcome the anti-gun crowd likes.

I also don't see how he is promoting gun ownership. Where do you get that? Were you compelled to start carrying? Why would other people be?

Since we're making assumptions, I am assuming that you are applying all the negative gun stereotypes you hear from the MSM and apply them to hypothetical situations to support your opinion. There is nothing hypothetical about the OP's story. Why the hell do you even own a gun?

i have a gun because i got one pointed at me one time by a guy that was about to rob my house (he had already knocked the front window out when i got there and was in the process of climbing inside). so don't flame me bro. i just think its better to be safe. we can't paint any situation that involves confrontation to be a potentially deadly one, but 99 out of 100 times they aren't unless you are just out of luck which does happen. i'm also not part of the anti-gun crowd, i just said i don't think you need to carry one in your pocket.

I think the OP is a tough guy. They do exist. His story in no way "paints" him as a tough guy. Paints him smart, or aware, experienced maybe. And yes I am kissing the mods ass. jk

Most people who are into martial arts think it will help them. And it does have some value. But they are accustomed in most cases to a certain amount of decorum in sparring or competing. Real fights have no decorum what so ever. On slippery ground, those martial arts wont help much. But people who train in martial arts go into a real fight with the knowledge of decorum and clean training mats. Its a different beast.

And as to the "intentions" of the scraggly looking men in the OP's eyes? It doesnt matter what their intentions were. If they were there to help his lady, he did nothing wrong. If they were there to harm, he did nothing wrong.how do you explain instincts to someone who wasnt in the situation. How do you explain, "I just knew". Im sure his wife "knew" Im sure she tensed up.

i live in NY so i obviously dont carry. But when I get down to Florida ,I will. i applaud the Op on how he handled the situation. A "tough guy" would have shot and asked questions later.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by emptyOmind

 

if you go around with your pistol in your pocket flippin the safety off whenever there is trouble then you will shoot someone eventually. even if you had fought those guys, it's pretty dangerous to be wrestling around with your gun off safety (i'm assuming you already had a bullet in the chamber) and your knife ready to spring open, that's a good way to shoot and/or stab yourself. and don't take it personally, i'm not trying to make enemies with a mod, but it seems to me like you are promoting this tough guy image of yourself, you shouldn't be encouraging people on this forum to carry guns.. because even if you are tough enough, safe enough, licensed enough whatever to carry a gun, that doesn't mean other people are (people are killed everyday over simple misunderstandings because somebody pulls out some weapon or equalizer). guns serve a purpose, i own a gun as well, but i don't keep it on my person

No offense taken, and please don't ever worry about making an enemy of a Mod. We have opinions, and they are not always well-founded, and we take criticism pretty well, as long as it is within the terms and conditions.

To reply though, I had assessed the situation. I knew how isolated we were, I knew the truck had suddenly slowed and stopped, it didn't appear this was their intended destination. I knew I was outnumbered and isolated, and the only equalizing factors were the fact that they hadn't seen me yet, and I had a gun.

I flipped the safety off my gun, because they were close enough that when they saw me, their reaction could have been to charge instantly and I wouldn't have had time to respond. I don't always flip the safety off. I reached for my knife for the same reason, because I didn't want to be wrestling some younger guy and trying to get my gun out at the same time. If they had charged, I probably would have pulled the knife first.

The logic that I will eventually shoot someone is false. I have been carrying for 15 years, been in several struggles, and countless other tense situations like this one, and I have never once even pulled the gun out of its holster. That was kind of the whole point of this thread, LOL! If I ever do shoot anyone, you can rest assured that they deserved it and there was no other alternative.

As for encouraging other people to carry. That was the secondary point to the thread. I am encouraging people to carry a gun, but they should know that it is also a grave responsibility, it requires ample training, and patience, and restraint, and practice. I believe all people should have the right to carry a gun, and in my opinion all people should get at least a cursory training with one, even if they don't intend to own or carry it.

The last thing I wanted to do is portray a tough guy image of myself. I was afraid that would happen, and I was afraid the real point of the thread would be lost in that. I don't need to portray myself in any particular way. People who know me, already know me. People who don't know me aren't concerned with my image. I was scared that day. Truly, truly scared. I did not expect anything like that to happen, I didn't want it to happen, and it is sad that it will now rattle around in my head the next time I think about taking my wife off to some remote location.

If I am to portray myself in any particular way, please let it be that I was a very scared husband, that happened to have a gun on him, happened to control my emotions long enough to get out of the situation, had God's good graces that day, and I am lucky to be here and share the story. That is closer to the truth than any tough guy image.

point taken, thanks for not hassling me, haven't really had any experience with the mods here but you seem cool. i understand you now and i'm sorry that i judged you. however, i still think you are wrong about your reaction with the gun. what if one guy is giving you the stinkeye and the other reaches into the truck for a beer (maybe to give you to let you know that everything's cool) or something and you think 'gun!' and shoot him. you know what i'm sayin? be really careful with that

I really do not see how this is a 'gun story'. OP also mentioned he had a knife, so why could this not be a 'knife story'? You say you did not even use the gun, so what does the gun have to do with anything? You did not need the gun to act how you acted, it did not open up opportunities that were not already there. I do not see how this thread got so many flags, maybe just cause he is a mod or whatever, but really, it sounds like you just trying to show ATS what a man you are.

reply to post by molecularstranding


It sounds like he is trying to show people that just because someone carries a gun, does not mean it turns into the wild west to me.....

I haven't wanted to say anything...Steal another's thunder... other than to S&F this thread...

but for all the naysayers...
let me point out that I am the Parent of a Murdered Child...
If I was Armed that dreadful day my son might still be alive and I would have been proud to sit in a jail cell..

Peace is just a wonderful pipe dream... take it from someone who's lived the nightmare...

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by Soshh

 

I totally agree!

In all of the fights I have been in over the years, it has become clear that some guys are there just to "fight" or "spar," while other guys are there to hurt you! The "mid-sentence" part is right on point! That is how I learned to protect myself when I was a little guy. While some idiot is talking and posturing, I was jumping on him and ending the fight before it ever really got started.

The skills you can learn in martial arts and mma or boxing rings are still very useful, but one has to be careful that they don't just learn to spar, but also to fight. There is no substitute for the real thing.

Exactly. A drawn-out rant if I may. When I was about 13 I started getting into a lot of fights, so I went the martial arts route with a view to getting better at it. I took up Karate (as I’m sure a great many others in that position have) and after a few classes spent doing all sorts of useless bollocks I finally got to fight someone, or rather “spar”.

Everyone paired up and because I was new I got the head instructor (there’s some logic there somewhere I’m sure); a big black guy. He spent the first few seconds slapping me about and pushing me away and I got a bit frustrated and so I went ‘professional swimmer style’. He looked at me like I was insane and told me to cut it out. “What are you doing?!” “I’m… fighting you?” “This isn’t meant to be fighting, this is sparring”.

So that basically killed any interest that I might have had in martial arts. I’m glad that it came sooner rather than later. I then took up boxing, now this was more like it! It was brilliant fun, I loved how you didn’t have to hold back but I didn’t quite get why the fighting was intermittent. It’s not like that outside of the ring, so while it was a step closer to reality it was still pretty damn far away. I gave up on learning anything specific, joined the forces and let reality teach me instead! Mostly non-operationally (out on the piss) I’m sorry to say.

You’re definitely right when you say that martial arts and combative sports teach useful skills/attributes/biology etcetera but the training and teaching never seems to be quite there.

Even so-called “Realty Based Self Defence” systems tend to be essentially the same thing with a more “deadly” appearance; teaching various techniques stolen from military handbooks in a static environment on compliant training partners.

Of course, you can’t actually try out these “deadly” techniques, because you’d supposedly kill all of your mates! So instead you wait for the perfect time to use that super-effective punch in the throat which is allegedly the most deadly technique ever conceived, only to find that it doesn’t have any way near the desired effect. I’ve been punched in the throat on several occasions; it just pissed me off and made swallowing difficult for a few days.

It’s all just a business. You make your system look as deadly and effective as possible and avoid the very same questions that I asked my old karate instructor; “why does the fighting I see every night in [insert city] not look anything like this?” and the answer is invariably “because they weren’t very good”. Bollocks.

The guy that I quoted was recommended to me quite a few years back because of his no-BS approach to teaching and training and we've become good mates. In my opinion he’s one of the best SD instructors out there. His list of clients speaks for itself. Here is the seminar that that I was talking about, the quote is from the second vid. It’s pretty much compulsory viewing for anyone wanting to learn self defence. I won't put it in a viewing box because I've spammed the page enough already.

www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...

reply to post by TKDRL


I can almost see the merit in that, but really who thinks like that anyways? I have never met one person, even all the little kiddies throughout high school, who thinks just because you have a gun you are going to kill people when you are carrying it, every single person has enough common sense to know that. Entities like media outlets are not an indicator of public opinion. I just do not see why this would be on the news just because he did not use his gun. It would sound ridiculous, there would be nothing to report of this story. Three people came up and did nothing and drove away, man had gun but did not make it known. Theres your story.

Originally posted by molecularstranding
reply to post by TKDRL

 

I can almost see the merit in that, but really who thinks like that anyways? I have never met one person, even all the little kiddies throughout high school, who thinks just because you have a gun you are going to kill people when you are carrying it, every single person has enough common sense to know that. Entities like media outlets are not an indicator of public opinion. I just do not see why this would be on the news just because he did not use his gun. It would sound ridiculous, there would be nothing to report of this story. Three people came up and did nothing and drove away, man had gun but did not make it known. Theres your story.

I totally agree, and that was my motivation for writing the thread.

These non-stories don't belong on the news. There is nothing to them. Nobody needs to hear about them........except...

On the news, we are constantly shown skewed statistics about the dangers of guns. A few mishaps per year, out of millions of lawful guns, and it paints the whole picture negatively. There are probably 1000s of stories like mine, that don't belong on the news, but then what is there to offset the handful that are blown out of proportion by the press?

Your take on the story is exactly right. Cut down to the bare bones, three people pulled up, my wife got a little scared, I walked up the hill, they left. It doesn't belong on the news, but it needs to be told to offset the otherside of the argument that guns are dangerous. Guns are dangerous, but so are scissors. Nobody is calling for a ban on scissors, because we all know how useful they are. I was hoping to portray how useful guns are, even when they stay in their holster.

reply to post by molecularstranding


The only time you ever hear about guns in the news, is when they are used unlawfully, or some dummy went and shot someone by accident etc. If you have ever participated in any of the anti-gun threads, you will see sadly a lot of people really believe that kind of thing.

reply to post by emptyOmind


Didn't mean to flame you as much as try to educate you on why people carry guns and why the OP did what he did. If you bought a gun, it is in your best interest to get proper training and practice. If you have a gun and don't know how to operate it safely and confidently, it IS potentially dangerous - especially to yourself.

In all honesty, I don't carry unless I know I am going to be somewhere that prudence would suggest I did, only because it is hard to conceal (I have a CCW). However, it is always in my vehicle. Once I get the cabbage for something smaller to carry a little more comfortably, I will be carrying all the time.

reply to post by getreadyalready


Good thing nothing happened, but no shirt on a motorcycle? Honestly? I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous. I hate when I see people do that because it's astoundingly stupid. Even with a proper jacket you can still get seriously roughed up, but without one your as good as dead if something goes wrong.

Sorry for that and I'm very glad you and your wife are ok, but I just felt like pointing that out

EDIT: If someone else brought this up before, my apologies. Also, if you wore a jacket and I just failed to read, then you can call me an idiot

reply to post by getreadyalready


Lol for some reason, your story made me think of Chris Hansen on "To Catch a Predator". "Howdy Fellas. Why don't you have a seat right over there?" As soon as they saw you, they knew their plan was ruined, just like the pedophiles when Chris Hansen walks up.

Very well written, by the way. And glad you're both ok!

Well played.
..............

Originally posted by StruggleTogether
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

Good thing nothing happened, but no shirt on a motorcycle? Honestly? I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous. I hate when I see people do that because it's astoundingly stupid. Even with a proper jacket you can still get seriously roughed up, but without one your as good as dead if something goes wrong.

Sorry for that and I'm very glad you and your wife are ok, but I just felt like pointing that out

EDIT: If someone else brought this up before, my apologies. Also, if you wore a jacket and I just failed to read, then you can call me an idiot

edit on 12-5-2011 by StruggleTogether because: (no reason given)

LOL! No, I wasn't wearing a jacket....or a helmet.....or a shirt.

I always wear long pants and boots, and glasses. Everything else from the waist up is optional. I've been riding bikes longer than I have been carrying guns. I've had 2 real good wrecks, and a thousand dirt bike wrecks (I always wore gear on dirtbikes.) We can debate proper riding attire in another thread. It isn't that I disagree with you, I just ignore the obvious. If I were forced to ride in full gear and a helmet, I would just take the car. What would be the point in riding that way?

Some intense stories in this thread - I'm coming away feeling a bit upset, by a few of them - Hopefully this serves as a reminder that we are our own best defense, in most cases.

Do you think they were gonna try to steal the bike?

Originally posted by v1rtu0s0
Do you think they were gonna try to steal the bike?

Dude, if you saw getreadyalready's wife, you would know them dudes werent after the bike. He did what he had to do and protected his family and people need to know that it's ok to do this. We see way too many stories of BS where others hurt people just cuz they can, well we dont have to let them. Besides wether they wanted the girl or the bike who cares, they wasnt gonna get it without a fight.

Originally posted by getreadyalready

I can't believe there are highly educated and accomplished people that still think law-abiding gun owners are "dangerous." The Governor's opinion from Illinois quoted above is just appalling to me. He says lawmakers should know what the "people" think. Maybe Illinois should put it up for open ballot to the whole state? I bet the Governor would find himself in the minority opinion, and then like a good politician, I bet his opinion would change to match the more popular one.

I couldn't agree more, with one exception - I don't believe for one second that an "educated and accomplished" politician really believes that law-abiding gun owners are dangerous. There is just too much evidence to the contrary, and many, if not most of those hypocrates carry.

They're not trying to disarm law-abiding people for the sake of safety, they're doing it to keep them victims and dependent on the nanny government. They would like the Second Amendment to go away (except of course for them), and they will spend their political careers doing whatever they can to see to it that happens. In my opinion they should all be tried for treason.

Excellent story though, but I have to admit that while reading it I was hoping in the back of my mind that it was going to end with you pulling the gun and have them on the ground grovelling. The fact that when you spoke up, they just turned and walked away, instead of engaging in pleasant conversation is very telling as to what their intentions were. I'm glad it turned out the way it did and I think I learned something about handling a similar situation.

It would be interesting to hear the story from the point of view from the unsavory types that seemed to be up to no good. "We were going to ask this guy where the good fishing was but it looked like he was going to shoot us, so we left."