A 108 year old adored and respected Rabbi prophesies of coming Messiah..

reply to post by AshleyD


This is exactly my point, you see this in the christian view, but dont forget the prophets saw this in the Jewish View because they WERE ALL JEWISH!!!!! What ever later Christians view the Tanach they try to bridge the gap in many holes of the NT,, why do you think there are so many ver4sons of The NT.. Again i have the look at Isaiah 45:1and Ezra 1:1-2, both say anointed, and anointed to, THEY BOTH REFER TO CYRUS THE KING SAME AS DANIEL 9. You must know HEBREW to actually know what the TANACH is saying if you dont then its useless, The Qur'an does this same mistake and take Hebrew words and mistranslates them, and now they have 1.5 billion people believing in the Qur'an. I DONT EVEN KNOW WHY YOU PUT THE HEBREW VERSE IN YOUR REPLY WHEN YOU DONT EVEN TRANSLATE IT RIGHT. I RECOMMEND YOU TO LEARN HEBREW, YOU WILL VIEW THE NT AND HOW IT IS SO MISLEADING AND WAY OFF IN ITS TRANSLATIONS.... I CAN GIVE HUNDREDS OF THESE SAME MISTAKES IN THE NT,,, IF YOU WANT I'LL SHOW YOU THEM.

Originally posted by steven704

the delusion only lies in those who don't believe.

Oh please don't do that I nearly spat my beer out laughing. I can say the same thing:

the delusion only lies in those who believe.

Only 10 days to go before the first mega prediction of the messiah's coming comes crashing down. I just wonder what new date will be plucked from the ether. Oh yes of course God has already intimated no date will be forthcoming. Which is highly convenient as it allows people to make predictions forever and thus never have to face up to the truth:

There is no God

Thwack, wow just ducked a thunderbolt......ha ha.

reply to post by TikkunAlex


I'm not forgetting anything. I fully understand Jews and Christians have a difference of interpretation. Again, that is why one believes the Messiah has come and the other religion believe he is yet to come.

Christianity and Islam is at a similar impasse. They point out a prophecy in our New Testament that allegedly foretells Mohammad's coming (When Jesus says that after Him, another will come). Muslims believe that verse prophecies their 'last prophet' Mohammad.

However, Christians believe it is in reference to the Holy Spirit who came during Pentecost. So I understand what you are saying. However, I disagree. We do not interpret that as Cyrus.

Ezra and Isaiah mention Cyrus by name. Daniel does not. Cyrus was also around their time while Daniel mentions someone centuries away. And that person we believe was Jesus.

reply to post by AshleyD


Now you will see in what you just said the Hebrew words come into play, King James Version omits the definite article in Daniel 9:26, which should |read: "And after the threescore and two weeks. . . ." By treating the sixty-two weeks as a |distinct period, this verse, in the original Hebrew, shows that the sixty-two weeks |mentioned in verse 25 are correctly separated from the seven weeks by the 'atnach. |Hence, two anointed ones are spoken of in this chapter, one of whom comes after seven |weeks (Cyrus), and the other after a further period of sixty-two weeks (Alexander |Yannai).Or Alexander |The Great.

reply to post by AshleyD


The "sepets" refer to full seven-year periods. The prince of the verse is Cyrus, who gave permission to rebuild Jerusalem and the Temple. He ascended to the throne fifty-two years (seven full sepets plus 3 years) after the exile had begun. From then until the second destruction of Jerusalem was 438 years, or sixty two sepets and four years

reply to post by TikkunAlex

The "sepets" refer to full seven-year periods.

Correct. Glad we agree on something. lol

Here is where will differ and where I believe your interpretation is incorrect:

The prince of the verse is Cyrus, who gave permission to rebuild Jerusalem and the Temple. He ascended to the throne fifty-two years (seven full sepets plus 3 years) after the exile had begun. From then until the second destruction of Jerusalem was 438 years, or sixty two sepets and four years

There are three decrees mentioned in Ezra:

Ezra 1:1-4 (permission by Cyrus to build a TEMPLE- not Jerusalem)
Ezra 5:3-7 (again, about the temple only)
Ezra 7:11-16 (permission given by Artaxerxes to, again, return to Jerusalem to rebuild the TEMPLE)

Do not start with the edict by Cyrus. That is incorrect. Daniel tells the people to start with the decree to rebuilt the CITY *AND* the temple.

Where can we find such a decree?

Nehemiah 2:7-9

When you reckon Daniel's prophecy from the correct edict (not from Cyrus), you will arrive at the Christian interpretation. Which I feel is the correct one because it starts from the decree Daniel mentioned: For the temple and Jerusalem. Cyrus only appears to permit the temple.

reply to post by AshleyD


In Ezra 1:1-5 when he is told to rebuild Jerusalem, in verse 3 its says like this, "Whoever is among you of His entire people - may his G-d be with him - and let him go up to Jerusalem which is in Judah and build the Temple of YKVK, G-d of Israel - He is The G-d - which is in Jerusalem."

When Ezra rebuilt the Temple he rebuilt Jerusalem, for when it was destroyed the Spirit of G-d left Jerusalem and The Temple, It returned because when The Temple was Rebuilt Jerusalem was rebuilt with it for "HE IS THE G-D - WHICH IS IN JERUSALEM."

reply to post by AshleyD


Read Nehemiah chapter 3 you will see then rebuilding the walls of Jerusalem.

Originally posted by ReVoLuTiOn76
I have always thought that jews will go to hell since they don't believe in jesus, but this changes my mind.

Well, Jews don't believe in Hell, so they probably won't go there. If you think about it, Hell really only works if you believe in it.

reply to post by TikkunAlex


Yes, I know the temple is in Jerusalem. That is pretty common knowledge. But did you even understand the point I just posted? I'm starting to get the feeling you are shuffling the issues around to avoid the problem in your interpretation.

Daniel is very clear. He states from the decree to build the the temple and the city. That is in a passage that both you and I posted so we both understand and acknowledge what Daniel said. But you are then basing your time line off a decree to ONLY rebuild the temple. Just because the temple is in Jerusalem, does not mean the city was also permitted to be rebuilt. I can rebuild my home in the case of an earthquake but that doesn't mean I rebuilt my whole town.

If Daniel was going off just a decree to rebuild the temple, he would have said so. But he made it clear it was for the city as well.

Cyrus' edict (which you base your stance on) is incorrect. He only allowed the temple. On the other hand, Artaxerxes' edict (which I base my stance on) is correct as he allowed the temple AND the city. With that, we are given the timeline to Jesus.

Not sure where else to go from here.

You say 'Messiah' is not anywhere in Daniel 29. I show you it is.

You say Cyrus is the proper decree. I show you it is not.

You say Daniel is referring to Cyrus as the 'anointed prince' but Daniel never mentions Cyrus and it doesn't fit the time line (that is Ezra and Isaiah).

Then above you go ranting that it was translated wrong (when I show you the exact text from Hebrew- the word Messiah is there in Hebrew). Then you say the NT didn't understand because only Jews understood it (but the authors of the NT, except Luke) were all Jewish.

So I don't know what else to really tell you. You're not acknowledging any of the errors in your interpretation but then go on to attempt to shuffle attention onto another supposed problem.

I believe in the Christian interpretation because that is what all of the evidence is pointing to and I believe our conversation confirms that.

reply to post by AshleyD


Ill sum up what i was trying to say. What Daniel 9 talks about as the anointed person he is not talking about the Moshiah. If he were he would be contradicting all the other prophets that say that the Moshiah will be a king, and to bring peace in the world acknowledging that |G-d is with the jews Zacharia 8:23 in The KJV Bible: Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days [it shall come to pass], that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard [that] God [is] with you.

Jesus said himself that he did not come to bring peace but war:
(OT) Malachi 4:4-6:
4Remember ye the Law of Moses my servant, which I commanded unto him in Horeb for all Israel, with the statutes and judgments.
5Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:
6And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

(NT) Matthew 10:34-35, "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law."

Luke 12:51 Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division!

This contradicts what The ANOINTED |ONE is supposed to do.

So how can you tell me this Anointed one in Daniel 9 was Moshiah when he didn't fulfill any of the prophecies that is told by other prophets.

And don't tell me their is a Second coming because nowhere is The Tanach does it speak of 2 coming of Moshiah Ben David.

YaHuW-SHUA is our Saviors Name. YaHuW-Savior is the same thing. "Shua" is a title and YaHuW was His Name. All the ancient manuscripts show this for His Name. Not Lord or anything else.

Yehshua has the "e" as the vowel pointer for the h when we know the vowel points for H is "A".

YAH is the beginning of our Saviors Name & the begining of our Fathers Name. Remember HalleluJAH? Well there was no J beyond 500 years ago as per Websters and others and that is why we dont say JAH like as in Jawbone we say YAH.
HalleluYAH means Praise be to YAH and not sounding like jaw as in jawbone. In every language of the world it is sounded just like YAH. Supernaturally protected for YOU to know!

So therefore, if the beginning we know is YAH from YHW than at the VERY LEAST it is YaH-shua not Yeh. No E in this. it is not HalleluYEH or HalleluJEH and it is most certainly not Jehovah where HOVAH means to make mischief or to ruin in Strongs Concordance. It also is not JeSus from the word IeSus originally which meant Son(Ie) of Zeus(Sus). This because Constantine and others were Sun worshipers of Zeus and fused paganism with ancient AbraYA teachings of the YaHuWans of YaHuW our Savior. Oh yeah.. and then killed off everyone who would say these words I just posted :O

so then if it is YAH what then? well YAH- UW because the vowel pointer for W is a U. Even when we say W or "DOUBLE UU" we get that from the ancient of the vowel U pointing what we would describe as best we can as a W and this is an UU or EW sound YAH UW - Shua.

So then therefore if YHW is YAHUW our Savior/Shua than what is YHWH? It is YaH uW and because the A vowel points the H in ancient AbraYA therefore it is YaH uW and aH YaHuWaH!!!!!!!

Now you have the most powerful and greatest name above all other names! The Name that was reissued to our Savior once he left His earthly body as YaHuW-Savior or YaHuW-Shua.

This is THE GREATEST CONSPIRACY TO MANKIND, The removal of the Greatest Name of ALL names.

Oh wait I forgot, I must be a nut if I believe that anything could be a conspiracy right?

reply to post by TikkunAlex


i don't believe you actually believe what your saying is true. ESPECIALLY WHEN ONE SPEAKS LIKE THIS!!!!!!!! THEY ARE EASILY SPOTTED AS BEING SET IN THEIR STUBBORN WAYS, ONLY LISTENING TO THE UNBELIEVING PEOPLE WHO INSTRUCTED THEM IN BELIEVING LIES AND TO HATE AND NOT BELIEVE CHRIST WITH ALL THEIR MIGHT..

you've been instructed by generations of men who denied Jesus. why would anyone listen to you?
if a man is wise they would steer clear from traditional unbelieving instruction.
There is no ' Rabbi ' but One. His name is Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
He is Jesus. The One you have denied and as an individual will answer for as your own personal choice to shun Him.

reply to post by steven704


Who can save us?
Isaiah 45: 22-25
22 “Turn to me and be saved,
all you ends of the earth;
for I am God, and there is no other.
23 By myself I have sworn,
my mouth has uttered in all integrity
a word that will not be revoked:
Before me every knee will bow;
by me every tongue will swear.
24 They will say of me, ‘In the LORD alone
are deliverance and strength.’”
All who have raged against him
will come to him and be put to shame.
25 But all the descendants of Israel
will find deliverance in the LORD
and will make their boast in him.

23) " By myself I have sworn, my mouth has uttered in all integrity a word that will not be revoked "

Amen ! The Word of GOD ! Glory to Him !

>

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

Glory Glory Glory GOD Almighty !!! Awesome

It's a miracle that someone with a nose that size can live to be 108, Jeez it would make most suicidal.

People are People and we are all Spirits on a Spiritual Path.

You don't need to follow a particular religion to be a good person. There is only One Almighty God and all the Major religions believe this.

We don't need all the different interpretations of the One God - You can read a book over and over - every day but when you get to the end - if you don't understand the story and the message within - what is the point of reading the story.

You can go into a place of worship and listen to many teachings and learn many lessons - but once you walk out of that place - that is when the real lessons begin.

We all know the importance of love but how many of us show it - it is soon forgotten once we walk out of that place.

Don't do the talk - Do the walk!

Originally posted by SavedOne

Originally posted by meathed
Are you sure there is a messiah?????????
Thought not as you have no proof.
Do you have a link to prove that one such fantasy exist.
Thought not.
So when you find some proof ask me that question again. But...... you wont and you cant. So.....

Here's just one link for you, there are many out there should you choose to look:

Was Jesus a real person?

There's plenty of evidence for God and Jesus. Very, very few people argue that Jesus didn't exist, even many atheists readily acknowledge he did although they will debate His significance (most will say he existed, but was just a really great speaker and nothing more). People who believe could cite mountains of evidence including unquestionable events in our own lives that demonstrate the Lord's intervention, but it will never be enough for those who have already decided not to believe. I don't waste my time trying to convince atheists, the Bible says that God will send a strong delusion to unbelievers in the End Times:

"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."

I believe this explains why so many atheists are so steadfast in their unbelief, they've already been given over to the lie that there is no God. This is just another sign of how late the hour is.

You are dreaming.
Go read another fairy tale

reply to post by steven704


Isaiah is known for the method by which he presents many of his messages through the use of prophetic names (Isaiah 7:3, 14; 8:3). In the verse under study, the prophet expounds his message by formulating a prophetic name for Hezekiah. The words of this name form a sentence expressive of God's greatness, which will become manifest in the benefits to be bestowed upon the future king in his lifetime. Thus, the name, though borne by the king, serves, in reality, as a testimonial to God.

Hezekiah is called "a wonderful counselor" because this name is a sign, which foretells God's design for him.

The Lord of hosts has sworn, saying: "As I have thought, so shall it be, and as I have purposed, so shall it stand, that I will break Asshur in My land, and upon My mountains trample him under foot; then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulder." This is the purpose that is purposed upon the whole earth; and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations. For the Lord of hosts has purposed, and who will annul it? And His hand is stretched out, and who shall turn it back? (Isaiah 14:24-27) Be not afraid of the words that you have heard, with which the servants of the king of Assyria have blasphemed Me. Behold, I will put a spirit in him, and he shall hear a rumor, and shall return to his own land; and I will cause him to fall by the sword in his own land. (Isaiah 37:6-7)

Hezekiah is called "the mighty God" because this name is a sign that foretells God's defense of Jerusalem through the miraculous sudden mass death of Sennacherib's army.

Therefore thus says the Lord concerning the king of Assyria: He shall not come to this city, nor shoot an arrow there, neither shall he come before it with shield, nor cast a mound against it. By the way that he came, by the same shall he return, and he shall not come to this city, says the Lord. For I will defend this city to save it, for My own sake, and for My servant David's sake. (Isaiah 37:33-35) Hezekiah is called "the everlasting Father" because this name is a sign, which foretells that God will add years to his life. "Go, and say to Hezekiah: Thus says the Lord, the God of David your father: I have heard your prayer, I have seen your tears; behold, I will add to your days fifteen years" (Isaiah 38:5).

Hezekiah is called "the ruler of peace" because this name is a sign, which foretells that God would be merciful to him. Punishment for lack of faith in the Almighty will be deferred and peace granted during the last years of his rule. "Then said Hezekiah to Isaiah: 'Good is the word of the Lord which you have spoken.' He said moreover: 'If but there shall be peace and security in my days'" (Isaiah 39:8).

The fulfillment of the above-stated declarations is foretold in Isaiah 9:6, when, after the Assyrian defeat, Hezekiah's glory increased and peace reigned for the rest of his life (2 Chronicles 32:23). Archaeologists have found that there was a sudden expansion of Judean settlements in the years following the fall of the northern kingdom. This indicates that many refugees fled south, thus giving added significance to the statement "that the government may be increased."

Hezekiah's kingdom is declared to be forever, for through his efforts to cleanse the Temple ritual of idolatry, even though apostasy followed under his son Menasseh, the Davidic dynasty was once more confirmed as the only true kingly rule that God would accept over his people "from henceforth and forever." The greatness of Hezekiah lies in his setting the stage for Israel's future. Hezekiah was a true reformer. He cleansed religious worship of foreign influence, purged the palace and the Temple of images and pagan altars, and reestablished pure monotheistic religion.

In the long run Hezekiah's achievements would outlive him, leaving an everlasting, indelible impact on the history of his people. Thus, God, through Isaiah, bestows upon Hezekiah this name which honors the king by proclaiming the great things God will do for him, and, through him, for the people of Israel.

reply to post by steven704


Again your reading from corrupted book. I'll show an example What Christians do to try and fit with what the Tanach says
This verse is part of a prophecy that Isaiah relates to King Ahaz regarding the fate of the two kings threatening Judah at that time and the fate of Judah itself. In the original Hebrew, the verse says that a "young woman" will give birth, not a "virgin" which is an entirely different Hebrew word. The young woman became a virgin only when the Hebrew word was mistranslated into Greek.
This passage obviously has nothing to do with Jesus (who, if this prophecy did apply to him, should have been named Immanuel instead of Jesus).

Christian Translation: (Isaiah 7:14)
Therefore the Lord himself will give you[a] a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and[c] will call him Immanuel.

Jewish Translation: (Isaiah 7:14)
Therefore the L-rd Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and you [or, she] shall call his name Immanuel.
Hebrew: לָכֵן יִתֵּן אֲדֹנָי הוּא לָכֶם אוֹת הִנֵּה הָעַלְמָה הָרָה וְיֹלֶדֶת בֵּן וְקָרָאת שְׁמוֹ עִמָּנוּאֵל

Do you see how they try to make Immanuel a son of a virgin where nowhere in that verse does it mention a virgin but a young lady. Corruption through many years of changes of the NT. The Tanach is the word of The Lord and it will always be, it will never change. It is the first and last book of Prophecy. Prophecy ended with the destruction of the 2nd Temple. So how can there be a NT or Qur'an, without the power to Commune with The LORD? There cant until the end of days when prophecy will be restored and the Resurrection of the Holy come back.

Shema Israel Hashem Elokano, Hashem Ehad!!!!!
|Listen Israel The Lord is our G-d, The Lord iS ONE!!!!!